"UPDATE: Democratic Senators Out-Of-State"

[eleny]

Wisconsin...- UPDATE: Democratic Senators are not showing up at today's session in order to prevent a quorum call.

- Sources tell NBC15 News the Senators are out-of-state.

- Meanwhile, Democratic Assembly members are wearing orange t-shirts as a show of support.

http://www.nbc15.com/home/headlines/115726144.html

[SDuderstadt]

1. Way cool!

On Wisconsin!

[blondeatlast]

2. It's grand to feel such pride in being a Democrat again! YES!

SOLIDARITY!

[WolverineDG]

3. LOL! They're pulling a Killer D!!

Remember how the Texas Democratic State Reps just *disappeared* one day a few years ago?

:evilgrin:

Good luck to them! Perhaps the Governor should look for them in Norman Ardmore, Oklahoma?

:rofl:

dg

ps. thanks for the correction :)

[eleny]

5. I remember when it happened in Texas

But who got the Dems back? Was it the FBI who located them? I think some other entity brought them back. A DUer said it was the Texas Rangers who went to Oklahoma to bring them back. But I can't recall the exact details.

[annabanana]

9. I think they TRIED to use DHS. . but DHS said no. . n/t

[eleny]

20. Thanks, anna! That's what first came to mind but I wondered if the FBI got involved

I think it was DHS, too. Thanks for jogging the memory.

[WolverineDG]

28. Yes, they did try to get DHS involved

they thought they were all going by plane, but only Eddie Lucio was flown out of Austin.

dg

[Lasher]

29. On October 6, 2004, the House Ethics Committee unanimously admonished Tom DeLay on two counts

The first count stated that DeLay "created the appearance that donors were being provided with special access to Representative DeLay regarding the then-pending energy legislation."

The second count said that DeLay "used federal resources in a political issue" by asking the Federal Aviation Administration and Justice Department to help track Texas legislators during the battle over Texas redistricting. At the time of the latter admonishment, the House Ethics committee deferred action on another count related to fundraising while that matter was subject to state criminal action. That state investigation eventually led to the felony indictment on September 28, 2005.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_DeLay_campaign_finance_trial

[suffragette]

42. FBI said no, but they did use DHS to track plane

http://www.thenation.com/blog/homeland-security-tracks-democrats

DeLay's dream was not to be, however. When Texas House Speaker Tom Craddick, DeLay's man in Austin, asked the Federal Bureau of Investigation or the US Marshall Service to do the GOP's bidding, the offical response was "no." US Department of Justice spokesman Jorge Martinez told reporters that responsibility for tracking down the legislators "falls squarely within the purview of state authority, and it would not warrant investigation by federal authorities."

But, according to the Fort Worth Star-Telegram, the federal Air and Marine Interdiction Division did get involved in the investigation. The division, a combination of old Customs Department agencies that now operates under the jurisdiction of the Bush Administration's Homeland Security Department, has long used its California facility to monitor efforts to illegally enter the United States via the skies or waterways. The Star-Telegram reports that, after the Texas Democratic legislators went missing early this week, "The agency got a call, it's unclear exactly from when or from whom, to locate a certain Piper Turbo-Prop aircraft."

The Air and Marine Interdiction and Coordination Center in Riverside reportedly tracked the aircraft in question -- which belongs to former House Speaker Pete Laney, one of the departed Democrats -- to Ardmore, Oklahoma.

When questioned, Republican Tom Craddick admitted that the information about the plane's location was critical to solving the mystery of where the Democrats had disappeared to. "We called someone and they said they were going to track it," Craddick said of the plane. "That's how we found them."

[WolverineDG]

26. I thought they came back on their own

I doubt OK let the Rangers in to hustle the Dems back to Austin. I do recall the Senators pulled their own stunt & went to New Mexico. When Perry demanded New Mexico force them out, the governor basically told him to pound sand.

If you ever get a chance to hear Richard Raymond talk about how that was arranged, do so. It's fascinating.

Cool trivia tidbit: As the bus taking them to Norman was leaving Austin & while everyone at the State Capital was running around like chickens without a head looking for the Dems, the bus driver popped a video into the machine----a new release called "Catch Me If You Can."

:rofl:

dg

[eleny]

31. LOL!!!

Love these history lessons. They were fun times at DU, too.

[Lasher]

39. They did.

The Texas Constitution calls for the 32-member Texas Senate — 31 Senators and the Lt. Governor — to have a quorum of two-thirds of its members present in order to conduct a vote, which means that the absence of 11 members can prevent the Senate from voting. Eleven Democrats left the state to avoid being forced return to the Senate by Texas Rangers, going to Oklahoma and New Mexico and out of reach of Texas authorities. After successfully preventing a quorum for an entire 30-day special session of the legislature, Senator John Whitmire left New Mexico and returned to Texas. The remaining ten Senate Democrats (often referred to as the “Texas Eleven Minus One” following Whitmire's departure), stayed in Albuquerque for several more days, but returned to Austin and the Texas Senate after Whitmire's presence on the Senate floor created the quorum needed for the Senate to meet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_Eleven

[Horse with no Name]

27. Look what I found while trying to find the answer

http://www.ou.edu/special/albertctr/extensions/fall2004/Gaddie.html

[eleny]

34. That's great! I remember that as a great time at DU, too :-D

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Ok that means Holder will have to either go round them

the Ds in Texas, or just sit tight... ironically that ball is now in DC as well.

[SDuderstadt]

6. Are you talking about Eric Holder?

What does Holder have to do with this?

[Lifelong Protester]

11. I think it means our state troopers in Wisconsin can't cross over

(I can only assume to Illinois) to nab these courageous dems just because they didn't 'show up to work'. That would have to be a part of a federal 'manhunt' or some such.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. Exactly, state cops don't have jurisdiction outside state borders

unless there is a hot pursuit agreements

[SDuderstadt]

41. There are zero grounds for...

federal involvement. I don't believe they have broken any law.

[eleny]

He has authority over the FBI....

And the FBI was the agency who located the absentee Texas legislators who did this very same thing during W's administration.

[nadinbrzezinski]

15. Why I said that now the ball is in feddie land

we will soon know what Holder is made off

[SDuderstadt]

23. Why would it involve the Feds?

I'd love to hear your reasoning for this.

[SDuderstadt]

19. I don't see how it's a...

federal issue. I also don't recall the FBI tracking down the Texas legislators, but I could be wrong.

[eleny]

24. The Wisconsin Dems have crossed state lines so people are saying it's a Federal issue...

That's what happened in Texas when those Dem legislators walked out. That was during W's administration.

So it's plausible that similar will happen in Wisconsin. How in the world can Wisconsin law enforcement cross state lines?

[SDuderstadt]

36. I don't care what people are saying...

that doesn't make it a federal issue, period.

[SDuderstadt]

32. I think you're confused...

Tom DeLay did say that he advocated using the FBI to hunt them down because they fled over the issue of redistricting, but I don't believe the FBI intervened.

In the Wisconsin case, there's even less grounds for a "federal issue", despite the nonsense MB is spreading.

[eleny]

35. You're right about that! Horse With No Name found the history of the Texas events...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x438862#439081

[eleny]

8. A friend and I were emailing and I thought - This is now Obama's test

Because the Texas D's were located in Oklahoma by the FBI.

But who was it who brought them back to Texas? Was it the Texas Rangers as another DUer pointed out today? I can't recall who it was. Could the Rangers cross state lines?

[nadinbrzezinski]

17. IF there are pursuit agreements, or special circumstances

It is Holder's test now

[SDuderstadt]

44. It is not...

"Holder's test".

There is ZERO federal issue here. Thanks for the serial misinformation.

[SDuderstadt]

38. As usual...

NB does not know what she is talking about:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_Eleven?wasRedirected=true

[sasha031]

7. I thought the police were supporting the Unions?

Police Search for Missing Wis. Democrats

http://www.wdio.com/article/stories/S1978852.shtml?cat=10349

[eleny]

10. Scabs

[Lifelong Protester]

14. police, yes, state troopers no. they all are exempt from this horrible

bill, but the police and firefighters (also exempt) have come out for the workers.

[sasha031]

25. if their was ever a need for solidarity, that time is now

[RufusTFirefly]

16. Do we know that the police are supporting the unions?

I'd heard the firefighters definitely were, but hadn't read about the police.

[Lifelong Protester]

37. Here is one link:

http://www.mppoainfo.com /

[RufusTFirefly]

45. Thanks for the confirmation, LP!

Love that they're distributing donuts by the way.

[Xenotime]

12. Fuck yea! Way to stick it to them!!

[yourout]

18. A week in Canada might be in order for them.

Good luck getting them there.

[nadinbrzezinski]

21. If they cross international borders

then getting them back becomes night impossible... you need to issue an international warrant, FOR WHAT? and hold extradition hearings,

[LynneSin]

22. Remember when Texas State Democrats did this - we sent them all Pizza

I'd do the same for Wisconsin's dems too

[eleny]

30. Love your DU history refreshers!

Including the "evil duer" heart, too. B-)

[Erose999]

33. Willie Nelson sent the TX Dems case a whiskey, lol.

[Earth_First]

40. Is 'out of state' a proceedural definition or are they really not physically IN Wisconsin?

I know this seems like a silly question...

[annabanana]

43. really not physically IN Wisconsin!

We know where they are.. north and east and south somewhat. .

[ljm2002]

46. Our own "Orange Revolution"???

Time to start figuring out the state colors for the other states across the U.S., this could get interesting.