A quick reminder to all repeating what a giant success HCR was. We had the votes for a public option

[no limit]

But Obama along with democratic leaders in the house and senate simply did not want it.

Remember how just about every liberal kept insisting that they should pass healthcare reform using reconciliation and how the white house along with washington media kept insisting that such a move would be absolutely insane and you would have to be a mental midget to even suggest such a thing? Well then Scott Brown got elected and suddenly reconciliation was the only way to pass a healthcare reform bill. And as a result that's what they did, but they still chose to not include a public option.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/11/the-public-options-last-s_n_495383.html

Asked about adding a public option through reconciliation when passing the 2011 budget, Senate Budget Committee Chairman Kent Conrad (D-N.D.) didn't want to talk about it.

How convenient, he didn't want to talk about it. Neither did Obama.

[xchrom]

1. recommend

[Octafish]

2. That's where Wall Street came in.

Dr. Ezekiel Emanuel, Rahm's brother, tapped for White House health care policy advisor spot.

[Oceansaway]

3. K&R...n/t

[Autumn]

4. That's why we have insurance finance reform.

Which does not help heath care in any way. K/R

[Myrina]

6. I wouldn't even call it 'insurance finance reform' ...

... more like the 'Insurance Guaranteed Profitability Legislation' because it doesn't touch much with regard to how insurance companies actually have to operate, except to deliver more premium payers to them ...

[Autumn]

8. I call it 'insurance finance reform' . Obama called it that.

I think that was the last time I saw him speak the truth.

[Badfish]

5. "we had the votes"

I don't think so.

I would need to see the list , and if you are gonna post a list that includes Max Baucus then don't waste your time.

Actually anybody feel free to post the list.

[no limit]

9. We had 50 votes for a public option. The article I posted gives you a list.

[Badfish]

10. 50 doesn't break the filibuster

You know better than that.

50 votes doesn't mean you 'had the votes'

[no limit]

13. There is no filibuster when using reconciliation

you should know better than that.

[ClassWarrior]

27. Oh snap.

NGU.

[Hello_Kitty]

14. I guess you don't know better. eom

[Marr]

7. Yep. It was clear that they were maneuvering the public option into a ditch long before that, but

the reconciliation vote really should've removed any remaining doubt from any remaining doubters.

We need to get rid of the corporate lobbyists in our own party's leadership. That needs to be goal #1, as it does us no good at all to fight for majorities when the party itself is infested with these sorts.

[Badfish]

11. Yep..

theres Max.

Max voted against the PO a few times.

To claim he would vote for it is absurd.

[Freddie Stubbs]

12. The problem with reconciliation is that the program would expire in 10 years

That is why the Bush tax cuts were set to expire this year, because they were passed using reconciliation.

[no limit]

15. Is that really true? I thought they did that to not add to the deficit

which is a rule.

And if it is true after 10 years and millions of people using a public option no politician would be crazy enough not to extend it.

[Badfish]

17. Yes, Thats true.

Now tell me how you pass the PO with 50 votes ? ..and that number includes hacks like Max who voted against the PO twice in HIS OWN COMMITTEE.

The votes were not there , period.

[no limit]

18. I don't think it's true, you have a source?

I am trying to find anything about this kind of rule and am coming up short. The only thing I can find, as I said above, is that they made the tax cuts 10 years so that it wouldn't violate the Byrd rule which requires that reconciliation not add to the deficit. But by all means I'm willing to be corrected if you have a source for where this rule is spelled out.

As far as the votes go...

The votes are listed in the article I posted, they were there. If we truly didn't have 50 votes in a senate that had 58 democrats and 2 independents that caucus with the democrats then what the hell is even the point any more? Why would anyone in their right mind ever vote for a democrat if such a thing were true?

But lucky for us it's not true, the democrats are not that incompetent. and if Obama wanted it he could have easily gotten 50 senators out of the 60 he had to pick from (especially when 40 of them signed a petition that they wanted it).

[uponit7771]

21. It's true, like Gitmo it wasn't Obama who wasn't pushing it it was conservative dems in the senate..

...who were pushing back against the PO.

Also, I don't believe for a second conservatives wont defund PO in 10 yrs...they voted to keep tax breaks for Big Oil while they were making record profits and voted against extending SCHIP for children.

They're horrible, dems are less horrible.

[no limit]

22. Can you give me a link that spells out this 10 year rule?

[ClassWarrior]

30. Of course they can't. Look at how they tried to lie to you about the filibuster upthread.

NGU.

[Badfish]

23. The entire debate about the 'bush tax cuts'

was because they were about to expire because they were passed under reconciliation.

[no limit]

31. Look at post 24. Seems to imply that you just made this rule up.

or at the very least weren't very honest about it

[ClassWarrior]

35. The 10-year limit was included to get enough votes for reconciliation.

It was a bargaining tactic.

Next time, please know what you're talking about before you go around scolding DUers. If there is a next time.

NGU.

[sabrina 1]

46. And they got extended, so what's the point about

a PO, a far more popular issue than tax cuts for the wealthy?

After ten years of people having a choice and with fixes along the way, there is no way Republicans could win an election by threatening to change it.

They could have had the votes, they didn't want them. We know that, I don't know why there is even any discussion about it. The game was so obvious. Bought and paid for by Big Business as is everything in this country.

[Badfish]

29. "The votes are listed in the article I posted, they were there."

Then why did Max vote against it TWICE in his own committee ?

If his vote was there , then why was he voting against it ?

He had a chance to show his support for the PO , and went against it.

[no limit]

32. Max said he supported a public option. But even if he didn't he is just one vote

Obama had 10 more to pick from (40 already promised they would support it). Cancel out Liebermann that leaves him with 8. Which of those 8 do you think would have killed the most important bill of Obama's first term becauses of a public option.

[ClassWarrior]

38. (psssssttt... Sometimes Democrats change their minds...)

Perhaps not so much at the other sites you visit.

NGU.

[uponit7771]

19. You talk to a conservative lately? They're ill informated at best

[no limit]

34. Apparently they aren't the only ones

[ClassWarrior]

44. .

[jtrockville]

24. COBRA: Consolidated Omnibus Budget RECONCILIATION Act

COBRA was passed in 1985. Has the continuation of health insurance part of the 1985 COBRA expired?

[no limit]

26. Thank you, I had a feeling it was bullshit.

[jtrockville]

37. Bush's tax cuts were set to expire for other reasons.

Probably because everyone knew they were unsustainable.

IMO they should have been set to expire in 10 years OR the first year when the budget exceeded revenues. War spending should be included in the budget.

Wanna bet we'd NOT have gone to war if rich folks had to pay for it?

[Ignis]

45. And after 10 years of a PO, you think Americans would stand for a reversion?

[Hello_Kitty]

16. Shhh. It was a Signature Accomplishment and The Most Progressive Legislation Evar.

:sarcasm:

[jtuck004]

20. +1 n/t

[uponit7771]

25. Yeah, we should rid ourselves of it and not vote and stuff....that'll show em /sarcasm

[no limit]

28. Yeah, blindly supporting them no matter what they do is far more rational

good thing the adults are here to put us in our place.

[Hello_Kitty]

43. Um, no. The leader of the Democratic Party failed to inspire the voters in 2010.

The dirty fucking hippie professional left voted like we always do and many of us worked our hearts out trying to get our local candidates elected. We got "shellacked" because of the incompetence at the top.

[Poboy]

33. Gibbs accused us of needing drug tests over this!

Of wanting 'world peace'!

This administration HATES us, and works AGAINST us at every turn.

[no limit]

36. Yeah.

I was hoping that with the guy that wants to drug test us along with the guy that thinks we are all fucking retarded gone things would change. But they aren't going to, this is an Obama problem, not a staff problem. I just feel like so many of us were scammed in early 2008. Can't believe I fought for this guy (then again the alternatives weren't that much better, Clinton was even more conservative and Edwards, well we saw how that worked out).

[ClassWarrior]

39. Look at the serious errors in fact in the posts throughout this thread.

And all from people who disagree with your OP. Interesting. Kinda undermines that credibility of that argument, doesn't it?

NGU.

[no limit]

41. Yup, kind of ironic.

What pisses me off the most is once corrected these people disappear as if they never said anything here.

[grahamhgreen]

40. There was also the option to simply expand Medicare.

[no limit]

42. Yup, what was the lenght of that total bill? A couple of pages?

And just about every american would have easily understood the concept.