"An Implement Of Freedom---semiautomatic M1911 handgun the official Utah State Firearm"

[kpete]

01.26.11 - 11:52 AM
An Implement Of Freedom

by Abby Zimet

Displaying an admirable sense of timing and priority, Utah lawmakers have endorsed a bill declaring the semiautomatic M1911 handgun the official Utah State Firearm, thus becoming the first state to adopt as their symbol, not just a gun, but the weapon of choice for many random mass killings. Only two Democratic legislators opposed the move to add a gun to a list of state symbols that include a state folk dance, cooking pot, tree and hymn.

"It's an implement of freedom that has defended America for 100 years... This firearm is Utah." - GOP Rep. Carl Wimmer, who sponsored the bill.

http://www.commondreams.org/further/2011/01/26-0

[slackmaster]

1. "...the weapon of choice for many random mass killings"?!?!?

That's a crock of shit. 1911 pistols, and .45 caliber pistols in general, are rarely used in crimes. They're too bulky to be easily concealed, and too expensive for the taste of most criminals.

http://prisonpolicy.org/scans/bjs/guic.pdf

[pipoman]

3. Yep

can one even be bought for less than $700 or so?

[Statistical]

28. One of the largest, most expensive, lowest capacity, and high recoil handguns

Hits all the mass shooter "must have list".

Seriously though why must the gun grabbers be so completely uninformed. I mean not marginally uninformed but over the top absolutely nothing they say is factual.

"Heat seeking bullets"
"AWB banned machineguns"
"Plastic guns that can't be detected"
"Barrel Shroud is that thing that goes up"
"The heavy, low capacity, hard to conceal, and very expensive M1911 is the weapon of choice for mass killings"

I mean the list goes on and on.

[CreekDog]

29. because we don't fetishize guns so much that we can describe them

as if we dream about them day and night.

word to the wise.

[pipoman]

38. That doesn't explain why the need to embelish, to the point of absurdity,

the description every time. I mean I know little about cars, thus I don't make attributions to cars off the top of my head, I simply state the facts when speaking of them. I am old enough to know that if I don't know about something I shouldn't open my mouth and stick my leg in it, especially when addressing others who do know what they are talking about. Further, could there be a connection between ignorance of the subject, and irrational fear of that which they are ignorant of?

[Statistical]

39. We aren't talking about minor errors.

We are talking about the world is round vs world is flat errors.

When a politicians claims there are heat seeking bullets and they need to ban them that is inexcusable. Basic research is a requirement for effective legislative action. A single phone call to a qualified source (including ATF) could have prevented many of the blatant false claims made by gun grabbing politicians.

[pipoman]

2. Jeez

I am all for concealed carry and RKBA, but an official state firearm? Is this really necessary and prudent?

BTW, I want to see the stats on the 1911 being "the weapon of choice for many random mass killings". Which mass killings would that be I wonder.

[deaniac21]

15. Since most 1911 are 7 or 8 + 1 magazine capacity, they are

pretty low on the mass killer list. They usually have 16 to 20 9mm mags.

[damntexdem]

4. An impediment to freedom, indeed.

What loonies!

[TheMightyFavog]

22. The M1911 was the U.S. Military sidearm from 1911 to the early 80s

Perhaps that's their rationale.

When you think about it, damn near three-quarters of a century in service? Wow. That's longetivity.

[Ganja Ninja]

5. Whatever floats their fucking boat.

I have to wonder if some gun manufacturer(s) aren't conspiring with them so they could sell commemorative editions of the gun at 3 times the normal price. Coming soon an official Texas gun and an official Arizona gun and on and on

[Bragi]

6. New slogan too? -- "Scared people need guns" /nt

[petronius]

41. That wouldn't make sense. I wouldn't say the scared people

need guns, but if they bothered to learn a little bit about guns and gun owners they wouldn't be quite so timid. Then, they could make an informed choice for themselves about whether or not to keep a firearm...

[tularetom]

7. The weapon of choice for Pike Bishop & the Wild Bunch

[arcane1]

8. When has this type of gun "defended America"?

:shrug:

[rfranklin]

9. I think it was when we invaded Honduras in 1912...

The inspiration for the term "Banana Republic," the status of which is rapidly being assumed by the USA itself.

[arcane1]

11. Ah yes, my great-grandmother told the tale....

of the thousands of Honduran hordes amassed at our southern border, ready to cross over, when we defended ourselves with semiautomatic M1911's and chased them all the way back to where they came from :)

[pipoman]

10. It has been, and was developed for, carried by

US military officers from 1912 (iirc) through 1990?

[provis99]

13. so what the heck does that have to do with Utah?

Utah definitely is the least American part of America.

[slackmaster]

19. Read up on John Moses Browning, one of Utah's favorite sons

Information is your friend.

[pipoman]

37. Now see there

I learned something. I wasn't aware. Maybe this makes a little more sense to me too...:hi:

[Lurks Often]

12. It has pretty much been in continuous service with either the

military and police since it was initially manufactured.

[Gaedel]

30. Not police

Very few police forces used the M1911 or 1911A1. Police forces in the US traditionally carried .38 revolvers and later .357 magnum revolvers. They only switched to the auto pistols when the bad guys began to outgun them with 14 and 16 round autos. The police forces largely switched to 9mm Glocks or similar auto pistols.

Since the military switched over to the 9mm Beretta, the M1911 and M1911A1 have primarily been purchased by target shooters (in national match grade) or by collectors and enthusiasts. Unless they are loot from a robbery, I do not think you will find too many of the .45 autos in da hood.

I carried the M1911A1 through two tours in Nam and it was a reliable, durable weapon easy to clean and keep clean.

[slackmaster]

31. Besides Officer Malloy on Adam-12, I've seen a few real police officers carrying them

One was a woman that I met at a gun store. I said "That's a pretty hefty sidearm to carry all day."

She replied "It's my hammer."

[Gaedel]

33. For an auto pistol

Police prefer a double action auto over the single action 1911 and its clones.

They also want more than seven rounds in the magazine.

[Lurks Often]

36. Not entirely correct

And this is in answer to post 30 as well

While many of the major, large police departments use to issue the revolver as their standard duty handgun, the 1911 has been used in law enforcement for decades, the Texas Rangers adopted the gun, SWAT teams around the country have used them and smaller local law enforcement agencies have used it. It wasn't until the 1980's and later did widespread use of the double action auto become common in law enforcement.

[virginia mountainman]

16. When my grandfather carried one in World War II...

I now own his 1911...I will hand it down to my children someday, as it was handed down to me..

No matter WHAT any future law says...

[slackmaster]

18. World War II

It's also been used in other conflicts in which US interests were not so directly threatened.

[dmallind]

20. standard military officer sidearm for 60+years, including WW2, Korea etc

Whether you count that as defending America or not is up to you, since technically the nation as a nation has not been defended since the war of 1812.

[slackmaster]

21. There were attacks on US soil during World War II, other tthan the bombing of Pearl Harbor

Read about the Aleutian Islands Campaign for starters.

[TheMightyFavog]

23. And World War I...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Tom_explosion

[slackmaster]

24. I'm not sure how I made it almost 53 years without knowing about that one, but I did

Thanks!

[TheMightyFavog]

26. I only learned about it from watching History Detectives a few years back...

http://www.pbs.org/opb/historydetectives/investigations/607_blacktomshell.html

[dmallind]

25. My apologies - I was thinking of the mainland only. NT

[TheWraith]

27. There were also Japanese attempts to bomb the western US, and shelling attacks from subs.

The Japanese launched hundreds of "fire balloons," hydrogen balloons carrying either anti-personnel or incendiary bombs, against the US mainland from subs. Most of them are still unaccounted for out there somewhere.

[petronius]

40. IIRC, many of the balloons were launched from Japan itself, relying on the

upper level westerlies to get them across the Pacific. I didn't know they launched them from subs as well, but it makes sense...

[Travelman]

32. And, if you want to get technical about it,

the Philippines, since they were a US protectorate when the Japanese invaded during WWII.

I'll admit that's a bit of a stretch from Nazis invading Virginia or whatever, but we'd be pretty pissed today if someone invaded Puerto Rico, and the Philippines weren't much different then, status-wise.

[slackmaster]

34. Nazis actually did invade the US, if you count espionage

Duquesne Spy Ring.

[Travelman]

35. True.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

14. No! Stop! If you make disapproving faces at that news article, SARAH PALIN WILL BE PRESIDENT!

:sarcasm:

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

17. I had to carry one once. But, it sure as hell wasn't to defend freedom.

I had to escort some poor sod to the brig who had righteously taken a swing at a gunny sergeant. He got a BCD and 18 months. When we got in the jeep I unloaded it in front of him in case he wanted to make a run for the fence. The driver even slowed down to about 5 MPH so he wouldn't get hurt and we both did a lot of looking the other way but the kid decided to face the Brig Goons.