Ok on the road to the F WORD

[nadinbrzezinski]

Suppresion of civil rights. Check
Warrantless wire tappings. Check
Free speech zones. Check.....
Long list to follow

Black boot thugs supressing rights.... Check

Now that we have cops doing what they are doing and courts subverted can I finally use the F word without the word Alarmist comming out? Or do we have to wait for things to ratchet even further?

[redqueen]

1. People have been saying not to use the F word for years.

I wonder what it is exactly that they think we should be waiting for before doing so.

IMO we've been there for a while now.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. I know. And we crossed lines in the last 24 hours

That be unbelievable a few....weeks ago

[a simple pattern]

3. K&R

[KansDem]

4. When "phooey" and "schucks" just aren't enough...

And in this day and age, there are ample opportunities and reasons to use it...

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. I mean the other f word, fascism.

[KansDem]

7. oops

:blush:

[HereSince1628]

10. These things are typical of totalitarian and authoritarian states.

Fascism is just one of the possible forms these states could take.

Because of the power of the rich to influence government, rather than the power of the government to bundle (fascismo) together the efforts of industry, labor and government I don't think we've got fascism (but hey who really makes the rules about these things?). I also don't think we've got falangism, or phalangism which is basically fascism by committee and which has been in 3rd world 'republics' often corrupted by big money from outside sources (American corporations).

My own sense is that we are headed into a period where we have government of, for, and by the rich. This is a mostly natural evolution of the influence of money/power including legitimate lobbying and illegitimate corruption and influence peddling.

This is much like the state of things in Russia 800 years ago, just before the wealthy boyare emerged and used their wealth to gain decision making power of a Duma. At present these decisions are mostly going on behind the scenes...but the Kochs have definitely gone public.

Will they be joined by other great families and force modifications onto the Constitution? We will have to watch.

[nadinbrzezinski]

11. I know but citizens united is quite special

If anything this is quite the dictablanda.

[HereSince1628]

15. Yes, well 'ORDER' must be preserved so

we will be told we have rights which seem grand but which in reality are very restricted.

Hundreds of millions of Americans have bought into the game, learned the rules, and generally don't trust change...

Unfortunately, for them, there is a cycle of wealth concentration and re-distribution. We are currently moving toward a zenith of wealth concentration. It will take an indeterminate amount of time to get to a point where those hundreds of millions would rather have change than a punishing status quo.

Although several Mexican states and the Greek people as a whole seem close to being there, few other populations seem to have a majority ready to undertake a restructuring and redistribution peacefully or by force.

[MineralMan]

6. I'm not entirely sure you know what that word means...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism

[nadinbrzezinski]

12. Nope, question answered

I am still an alarmist....

I guess I need to wait for the camps to be recognizable to some.

[Taverner]

8. Definitely on the road...been there since 1980

[Lint Head]

9. Why does fascism have to do major damage to society before anything is done?

The frog is boiling.

[gratuitous]

13. Oops, did we temporarily go too far?

Gee whiz, you guys put up with stolen elections, black box ballot results, extra-judicial executions of very bad persons, war crimes, crimes against humanity, and indefinite detentions. You're finally gonna get all bent out of shape because the cops pushed a few dirty fucking hippies around? All right, we'll let 'em go back to squatting if it'll shut you up. Can we continue looting the Treasury under the guise of free market neoliberal economic policies? Or did I say too much?

Ignore those last couple of questions. Please and thank you.

[nadinbrzezinski]

14. And that list of yours is not complete either.

[gratuitous]

17. Oh yeah

It wasn't meant as a comprehensive list by any means.

[Zorra]

16. A fascist by any other name is still a fascist...

"The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism - ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power."

-Franklin D. Roosevelt

"Mom, are we there yet?"

[Vincardog]

18. WE are there and we need to take our country back. If we don't we can just stew in our shit and die

[ZombieHorde]

19. I don't think we should use the word because I believe it will obscure what is happening.

If an extremely loaded term is used, even if properly used, the debate will be about vocabulary.

[Earth_First]

20. Fu*ked?

Been there for some time...

[lonestarnot]

21. www.November17.org

Their stupid move only made it grow! Far from fucked.