Boston Mayor Thomas Menino: "I will not tolerate civil disobedience in the city of Boston"

[Better Believe It]

More than 100 arrested at Occupy Boston protest site
by Ros Krasny
October 11, 2011

Tensions boiled over in the early hours of Tuesday in downtown Boston, where police arrested about 100 protesters after the Occupy Boston group expanded its footprint and was told by authorities to backtrack.

Protesters said late on Monday that police had given participants an ultimatum to return to their small original encampment by nightfall or be moved along. But it was not until after 1 a.m. ET Tuesday when hundreds of Boston and Transit police officers, some in riot gear, moved in on the group, handcuffing protesters and tearing down tents.

"At 1:30 this morning hundreds of police in full riot gear brutally attacked Occupy Boston," the group said in a news release, adding that authorities "made no distinction between protesters, medics, or legal observers."

"Civil disobedience will not be tolerated," Boston Mayor Thomas Menino told the local Fox News affiliate in an interview early Tuesday.

Read the full article at:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/11/us-wallstreet-protests-boston-idUSTRE79A0P320111011


-------------------------------------------



Mayor Menino on Occupy Boston arrests
October 11, 2011

"I simplify with their issues, some of those issues we really have to look at in America, but when it comes to civil disobedience I will not tolerate civil disobedience in the city of Boston," Mayor Menino said.


NO CIVIL DISOBEDIENCE BOSTON?
11:48 am Oct 11, 2011

Really Mayor, no civil disobedience will be tolerated in Boston? Does he need a history lesson? All I can say is thank God that Menino wasn't mayor in 1773 during the boston tea party otherwise we'd be flying union jacks over here. Civil Disobedience is sometimes the only way to get a point across. As long as the protesters stay peaceful more power to them.

[TygrBright]

1. Dude, you blew it.

Now you're looking like a cat trying to cover a mess on a tile floor. Blew it again.

If you can get our Beloved Oligarchs to pay you $100 a blow job, maybe you can retire in comfort.

amusedly,
Bright

[Demeter]

64. He's just asking for uncivil disobedience

and I hope he gets his ass sued off, instead. Because his is a man who thinks with his back pocket.

[Poll_Blind]

2. Fugazi. nt

PB

[newspeak]

20. he's just making sure

there won't be any more of those terrorist tea parties. Must protect the virginia company, east india company for the monarchy--oh, different time.

[Ship of Fools]

3. Does anyone else get the feeling that he thinks *civil disobedience* is against the law?

[Lance_Boyle]

25. civil disobedience often involves breaking the law

I'm pretty hard pressed to think of any civil disobedience that does not break a law - that's what it's designed to do. :shrug:

[Ship of Fools]

28. Oops -- of course. I guess I was likening it to just general protest. Still, though ...

he sounds like a prick.

[trueblue2007]

60. THE MAYOR IS A PRICK. PIG, CREEP, CROOK ... SHOULD BE IMPEACHED

[Maraya1969]

74. If enough protest he won't have the means to arrest them all. He

certainly can't call in the federal guards for his city when protestations are happening in all the other cities. I say if your going to pick a city to protest in......

[FarCenter]

29. Its disobedience by civil society, as opposed to insubordination or mutiny

Which would apply to disobedience to the law by police or military personnel.

[Lance_Boyle]

32. No, it's disobedience against civil statute.

Disobedience against civil law, as opposed to criminal law. The term is not intended to serve as a distinction between civilians (which all police except MPs are, BTW) and military personnel.

[FarCenter]

33. That doesn't make sense, because you wouldn't be arrested for that

Actually, after doing some research, it appears that "civil disobedience" is an undefineable term.

[EdMaven]

37. According to some posters here it seems to mean protest that remains civil & causes no one any

inconvenience.

:)

[Lance_Boyle]

39. sure

just like the Civil War. ;-)

[Lance_Boyle]

38. Yes you absolutely can and will be arrested for civil violations.

They do not bear criminal penalties but are enforced by police and involve a trip to court to have your case heard. Best example might be enforcement of speed limit laws. Getting pulled and ticketed for 5 over is not a criminal matter, but it is a police matter. Failure to pay child support - also a civil matter handled by the criminal justice system. Or illegally overstaying a legit visa - this is a civil matter enforced by ICE.

The definition of civil disobedience is disobedience against civil statute.

[tblue37]

48. Read Henry David Thoreau's classic essay on civil disobedience, which

was the model for Ghandi's protest movement, and then for MLK's, which was modeled on both handi's movement and like Ghandi's. based also on Thoreau's essay: "On the Duty of Civil Disobedience":
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/71/71-h/71-h.htm

Thoreau made the point that when one practices civil disobedience, one must be prepared to suffer the legal penalties attached to the law(s) one breaks. In fact, Thoreau's civil disobedience--refusing to pay poll taxes levied for the Mexican war, which he opposed--led to his being jailed for refusing to pay 6 years' worth of delinquent poll taxes.

Here is a definition, from the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy (http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/civil-disobedience/):

On the most widely accepted account of civil disobedience, famously defended by John Rawls (1971), civil disobedience is a public, non-violent and conscientious breach of law undertaken with the aim of bringing about a change in laws or government policies. On this account, the persons who practice civil disobedience are willing to accept the legal consequences of their actions, as this shows their fidelity to the rule of law <emphasis added>.

[TheMadMonk]

63. Civil disobedience is conflict which de-escalates rather than escalates.

From the viewpoint of the combatant "picking the fight".

It's a declaration that I will keep biting your toes until you stop kicking me in the teeth.

[KamaAina]

4. Transit police?

Were the Occupiers inside the nearby Government Center station (the infamous Scollay Square station from "The Ballad of the M.T.A.")? If not, :wtf: were transit police doing?

[southshore]

45. Better equipped than the military.

The Transit Police in Boston have more war fighting gear that the 82nd Airborne. It's fucking ridiculous.

[Better Believe It]

5. ""I simplify with their issues" Wonderful to hear from da mayor.

[Bobbie Jo]

6. Also Posted

Here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=439&topic_id=2096806&mesg_id=2096806

Pg 1 GD

[Ikonoklast]

7. Ohhhhh....Dude. You screwed the pooch on this one.

Opened mouth, inserted both feet, legs, and half your ass.

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. Well mayor thanks for your portrayal

Of the Boston elite of the 1774... How good did that end mayor?

[grasswire]

9. unbelieveable, that

Is he an ignoramus?

[LynneSin]

10. This is what I don't' get. There are peaceful OWS protesters but unfortunately there are assholes to...

I was at the NYC protest on Sunday night and never had I seen a more organized group. They were all staying within the park and even talked about having quiet hours as to not disturb the people who live in the neighborhood who are sleeping at night. I thought it was neat how they had signs over the flowers asking people not to step or sleep on them. Not sure how long that protest has been going on but those mums looked about 100% nicer than the dead mums growing in my porch.

As I walked around the protest area I saw cops everywhere but they just seemed to be minding their own business and not bothering anyone. Heck I smelled some 'interesting' smells and the cops did nothing to stop it. I also listened to the general assembly of the OWS group - they were discussing the rules for their protest and debating ammendments to their cause.

I've done protests now for about 10 years and I've always found that even though the vast majority of protesters are non-violent and even law-abiding, there are always a few who take things too far. Do you think anyone is going to want to support the OWS if they come across violent and attacking police officers? Maybe it's me but there seemed to be a bit of symmetry between the protesters and NYC. They are given ample space to do their protesting during daytime hours plus they can make all the noise they want. At night the request is that they keep it down for the neighbors and stay at the spot designated for their protest.

[kenfrequed]

72. What is it

What it is your responding to here. Are you saying that the Boston Protest was excessively noisy? Or are you saying that because the mayor called it civil disobedience it was somehow excessively noisy? I am just not clear what you are responding to.

[Hissyspit]

77. Lynne, at what time of the day is the general assembly?

[Fire Walk With Me]

11. It's not your damn city. Understand, monkey boy?

[Chipper Chat]

12. So the Tea Party rallies in Boston were OK and tolerated?

WARNING: Sarah Palin photo
http://www.thebostonchannel.com/r-slideshow/23146586/detail.html
HIGH-POX-RACY FO' SHO'

[WilliamPitt]

13. "I simplify with their issues"

Ow. My brain.

[FirstLight]

17. ya, i was wondering about that

thinking the reporter may be from another country and used the wrong word?




:rofl:

[sweetloukillbot]

19. He actually said sympathize. n/t

Watch the video at NECN.com - unfortunately the OP didn't provide a link...

[Better Believe It]

35. Here is the link.

The reporters apparently got it wrong. BBI



Mayor Menino on Occupy Boston arrests
October 11, 2011

Boston Mayor Tom Menino is speaking out, in the wake of 100 arrests made at the Occupy Boston movement.

Mayor Menino called in to "The Morning Show" to discuss the chaotic situation.

"I simplify with their issues, some of those issues we really have to look at in America, but when it comes to civil disobedience I will not tolerate civil disobedience in the city of Boston," Mayor Menino said.

Watch the attached video to hear more of what the mayor had to say about the protests.

http://www.necn.com/10/11/11/Mayor-Menino-on-Occupy-Boston-arrests/landing_newengland.html?blockID=575486&feedID=8505

[Flatulo]

59. Poor Tom can really torture a phrase...

Public speaking is not his strong suit, but his heart is usually in the right place.

[tavalon]

66. Not this time

in either aspect.

[Blue Owl]

14. For example, physically abusing those who fought for our freedom?

Ooops.

[devilgrrl]

15. Who is this bozo?

eom

[CurtEastPoint]

16. Sadly, he's a Democrat. n/t

[devilgrrl]

26. Frightenly typical of today's Democrats.

:crazy:

[blm]

36. he hasn't acted like a Democrat in years

.

[SoCalNative]

18. Time to show him

what REAL civil disobedience is.

Start heating up the tar and plucking the feathers.

[Bake]

40. Maybe get a rail ... to ride him out of town on.

:hi:

Bake

[geardaddy]

21. In his case, D stands for Douche.

[TBF]

22. This fucker needs to be voted out. nt

[Taverner]

23. Because Henry David Thoreau was such a violent and dangerous character (NT)

[intheflow]

56. As were MLK and Ghandi.

:eyes:

[Ignis]

61. +1

[Worship Money]

24. Too bad. You can't stop it.

You're also digging yourself deeper by sending fascist cops to trample people, beat up war vets and trash American flags...moron.

[Historic NY]

27. With a Mayor like him we'd still be singing "God Save the King"...

[malthaussen]

30. I'm Beginning to Think

... that to be a politician absolutely requires an undeveloped sense of irony.

-- mal

[ProfessorGAC]

31. Uh, Tom! You Have To

If it isn't violent, it's a constitutional right. Anything he does to stop it will be an unlawful order.
GAC

[tblue37]

50. No. Peaceful assembly to petition for the redress of grievances

is a constituional right. Disobeying the law in the process (which is what civil disobedience entails) is not a constitutional right. But TPTB have deliberately established laws intended to make the exercise of that particular constitutional right virtually impossible, so it is pretty much inevitable that anyone attempting to exercise that right of assembly and petition will end up violating some law and thus have to accept the punishment that goes along with doing so, as that is also part of civil disobedience. The point of civil disobedience is to call attention to one's grievance and thus to get the populace on one's side, so they will then pressure the government to redress that grievance. That outcome is actually being made more likely by the way the cops are rousting the protesters.

[ProfessorGAC]

81. Sorry, But Don't Agree

The jurisprudence doesn't support that. I know that is how it reads literally. But, plenty of jurists aren't stict interpretors. (I love that term, btw. If you doing it strictly, you don't need to interpret. Sort of like preachers who tell you what the bible means while they're saying it's the literal word of god.)

The right to assembly has been well established as not requiring a prior permit if done solely on public property.

That even happened during the civil rights movement in the 60's. Not so much in the south, but it sure was the case up here in the north.

Cops tried to stop it, but courts issued injunctions preventing the authorities from stopping a peaceful assembly on the streets.

Even if they're interfering with normal access, doing so without making an effort to "make things worse" have had judges allow it.

Check out the whole issue in the 1968 court records of the convention in Chicago. Until they started actively messing with people, the judges refused to do anything, and told Daley he couldn't stop them. Daley provoked them, they took the bait and all hell broke loose. But, for the first 4 days the courts told the cops to leave it alone.

I lived in the Chicago area, and i'm well old enough to remember what happened. Because of that i did a lot of reading on it. When i was taking my law classes in business school, i made that one of my papers.

The right isn't held as strictly as you suggest.

[nichomachus]

34. Mumbles Menino is an idiot -- and part of the problem

[eppur_se_muova]

41. I'm sure he meant to say "bring it on" ...

but this will have the same effect.

[lunatica]

42. The aspiring dick-tator has spoken

[lame54]

43. The Boston Tea Party was a felony

[southshore]

44. GET OFF MY LAWN!!!

Typical Mumbles BS. What a loser.

[quaker bill]

46. The point of civil disobedience is to disobey

The goal is to be intolerable and get arrested for it.

[SomethingFishy]

47. LMFAO.. The home of the Boston Tea Party

will not tolerate civil disobedience... Talk about loony-as-fuckistan. That's where we live now. It's not America it's Loony-As-Fuckistan.

[Harmony Blue]

58. Hillarious

but also a sad commentary how far into the abyss they want to drag our society into.

[Hissyspit]

76. "Loony-As-Fuckistan"

I think we should memorize that.

[fascisthunter]

49. oh Menino... yes will have to

[RagAss]

51. Mayor Fatass Mumbles...read a Fucking History Book !

[usregimechange]

52. That quote isn't in the article anymore, i.e. mayor on Civil disobedience???

[Raksha]

53. No, but there's a screenshot of it:

[DeSwiss]

54. "I will not tolerate civil disobedience in the city of Boston"

''White collar bankster criminals however may feel free to donate BIG $$$ to my campaign and you're free to break any pesky law that you wish!''

K&R

[tavalon]

55. Did he stamp his widdle feet, too, really, really hard!

Idiot.

[Roland99]

57. Article in the OP has been edited?? There's no mention of that quote now.

[Ignis]

62. I guess this DINO is begging for some UNcivil disobedience, then.

Challenge accepted!

[tavalon]

65. Those who have had their history lessons are astounded by the irony

But we elect dumb these days, and a reasonable understanding of history isn't required, if certainly assumed, and wrongly so, in this case.

[Supply Side Jesus]

67. Recall? Recall? anyone...

gosh, to live in Boston....

[Heywood J]

68. What else to expect from Mayor Fumbles McStupid?

He obviously failed history class.

BANNED IN BOSTON!

[NinetySix]

69. "I will not tolerate civil disobedience in the city of Boston."

There IS precedent for your position, Mr. Mayor....

[MrsBrady]

70. It doesn't matter if he wants to tolerate it or not.

He doesn't get to decide when the people decide to participate in civil disobedience.

That's why it's called 'civil disobedience'. :eyes:

[realFedUp]

71. Injustice won't be tolerated

Let's just get to the heart of the matter. People are fed up with the injustice
and unfair legal system in this country. We just watched a whole
decade, even longer, of criminals not being prosecuted but
actually rewarded.

Thank God for the protests. We weren't getting anywhere with our
politicians or laws.

[Festivito]

73. Blind to his own hatred of America. /nt

[eallen]

75. I wonder if he will remove the Thoreau statue at Walden Pond?

Likely, Boston has several other public tributes to Thoreau.

:hippie:

[Tuesday Afternoon]

78. was he wearing a redcoat when he said it?

never mind answering. rhetorical.

[Pacifist Patriot]

79. LOL! That's what the British thought too.

[pauldp]

80. Is he one of those "re-enactment" guys?

[Dover]

82. Oh, the tragedy and irony!! Thoreau is the state's native son and author of Civil Disobedience?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Disobedience_(Thoreau)

[Crowman1979]

83. Hopefully people there will not tolerate Thomas Menino being the Mayor of Boston.

[saras]

84. Our goals are more important than a single tactic. Civil disobedience isn't the only moral option.

[caseymoz]

85. "I simplify with their plight . . . ?" Is that the real quote?

If so, it might not be a gaffe, but an excuse. Maybe his IQ is approaching zero when faced with this country's real issues.