Wall St. protest descending into chaos.

[FarLeftFist]

ALSO PLEASE DU THIS POLL:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2011/09/24/2011-09-24_nasty_wall_streetfight_protesters_cuffed_peppersprayed_during_inequality_march.html

[StandingInLeftField]

1. Live video feed of Union Square at link

http://anonops.blogspot.com/

[FarLeftFist]

2. Thank You. These are just a few examples of the agony these non-violent protesters are facing.

[FedUp_Queer]

133. The Banksters and Cops are Cowards.

I work down here on Broad Street...30 Broad Street and see the steel barricades protecting the bastards. These people (the wall streeters and cops) are such cowards. All those barricades for a bunch of unarmed protesters. I'd love to see torches and pitchforks and a big bonfire right in from of the world's largest toilet (the stock exchange).

[Joe Shlabotnik]

83. for what its worth

WH petition passed the 5000 mark in no time. I'm sure more signatures wouldn't hurt though.


https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions/!/petition/recognize-men-and-women-who-are-occupying-wall-street/tX0ZX8Z7

[beac]

139. Thanks for the link and

WELCOME to DU! :hi:

[FrenchieCat]

3. The media is doing what it always does......

and until we address them, the media, as being the issue,
we will continue to get what we get.

[Jackpine Radical]

9. The media bias is a symptom of Capitalism

and a Corporate State that has no interest in the public good.

The game was given away a long time ago.

[dotymed]

114. Sadly,

just a few months ago, President Obama, as a gesture of appeasement to the r/w, had ALL traces of THE FAIRNESS DOCTRINE, completely expunged from the FCC "rule-book." That was a perverse, history re-writing action that is reminiscent of the book,1984, by George Orwell.

THE FAIRNESS DOCTRINE was in effect from 1942 until Reagan had it cast aside in the mid '80's. It was the ONLY FCC guideline that guaranteed Americans truth in media and much more.

President Obama, in response to the growing "worry by the r/w" that it might be reinstated, had ALL mention of the Fairness Doctrine removed from the FCC "rule-book." History has been re-written. Only a handful of historians and people who

were cognizant (IE..,adults) of the media prior to Reagan's "selling of the truth" will even be aware that there was a time in America where propaganda was illegal and citizens had the "right" to be unbiasedly informed.

This is old (months) news, but I just became aware of this. I knew that he had promised this to the r/w, but I did not know that he had actually done it.

[SammyWinstonJack]

128. WOW! How, very progressive of him.

:silly:

[The Doctor.]

137. I actually looked at the Fairness Doctrine issue. I used to think it was a big deal too.

But it's not. I've read the rationale and looked at the actual function of TFD, it had a use years ago, but became obsolete in the last couple decades. TFD never 'guaranteed truth in media', it imposed 'balance' only on terrestrial communications over the airwaves. It hardly makes sense to keep it in force when so much more media is transmitted by cable, satellite, wireless networks, and the internet. It did make sense when it was instated, and also when Reagan hobbled it as a rightwing strategy. But unless we start talking about some kind of universal imposition of parity on everything (forget about how impossible it would be to enforce), then keeping only radio and local tv subject to TFD would in fact be the opposite of 'fair'.

Given that the RW was all ginned up over the idea that Obama might 'bring back the Fairness Doctrine' in an effort to 'stifle free speech', any global doctrine would be seen as some kind of tyrannical move. Instead, Obama pulled that particular fire out from under the pot. That was a fairly good move given the realities.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

141. good points. Plus,

what if some impact of the "fairness doctrine" comes back to bite us? Its application could/would/should be very troublesome.

[Jackpine Radical]

153. I had a vague sense that this was true, and appreciate

your clear articulation of the issue.

[The Doctor.]

154. Given that I'm on 7 hours of sleep in the last two days,

'clear articulation' is quite a compliment. Even more appreciated is that it came from you. :thumbsup:

I think that even the various 'operatives' are finding few footholds for flaming (say that 5 times fast) on this issue because of how Obama acted on it.

Still not happy with him, but I still have faith. I'm not someone who puts faith in something without a damn good reason. The more I see, the more I recognize the imperative and the plan.

[dotymed]

129. I did not realize

:bounce: the poll is in the OP...please vote

[SpiralHawk]

29. + 1,000

We must become our own media.

The corporate crapola media (R) does not serve the public good.

[FrenchieCat]

66. Here....

Some answers....
http://www.democratsforprogress.com/2011/09/25/what-the-media-is-doing-to-the-wall-st-protest-is-what-they-are-paid-to-do/

[StarsInHerHair]

68. we have a Censored Media, just like Fiji

[Desertrose]

134. You're absolutely right...WE must become our own media!

The only way it will ever work.




:loveya:

[FarLeftFist]

4. The media isn't showing the full story, the situation is dire and escalating.

I live here in NYC and are amazed at the violent force the police are now using. It's as if they've received orders from the super-wealthy. Possibly even a payoff.

[StandingInLeftField]

7. I hate the way the M$M (what few of them are there) are spinning

this as "Protest turns violent!" as if it were the protesters provoking the police, when video evidence cleary shows otherwise.

[StarsInHerHair]

67. I hope the nypd gets brutal cutbacks then, it suits them

[FarLeftFist]

5. The National Lawyers Guild says over 100 arrests have been made so far.

[sabrina 1]

58. There were violent arrests on Wednesday also.

More than 18 airc up to Saturday. So they are probably counting them also.

[tcaudilllg]

105. My advice: get them out of jail; pay their defenses; and get them back out there

But I've said it once and I'll say it again: you need more people. More people than there are police, if you catch my drift. ;)

[dkf]

6. Funny how public workers aka the Police turn from good guys into bad guys instantly.

Are the protestors really being arrested for no violation whatsoever?

[AngkorWot]

8. Presumably the standard refusal to disperse, unlawful assembly type violations...

The usual reasons protesters are arrested. You know, part of the deal of civil disobedience is accepting the consequences of that civil disobedience.

[Jackpine Radical]

10. Emerson: "Henry, what are you doing in jail?"

Thoreau: "Ralph, what are you doing out of jail?"

[coalition_unwilling]

56. Before Operation Shocking and Awful commenced and in its

buildup, I attended a coffeehouse teach-in where Ron Kovic was a featured speaker. After the program had finished, I asked Kovic whether he felt it was time for those of us opposed to go to jail to express our opposition (as I was seriously considering it). Kovic said, no, the need was for people on the outside to build the anti-war movement. I figured Kovic knew way better than I what was at stake, so I took his advice and have taken it to this day.

Not saying your post is wrong or incorrect, just that there are valid reasons to stay unincarcerated.

[defendandprotect]

88. Interesting ... and as I reflect on this ... and corporate-press blocking coverage ....

what I see is a heavy toll being placed on protesters -- including physically

and emotionally -- in every way --


I'd rather see the movement get advice from AA's and Human Rights groups on old

ideas and new ideas for protests --


They announced the protest -- as they are required to do -- and their access to

Wall Street was cut off before they even got there --


Afaics -- the only people suffering are the protesters!


I'd really much rather see a movement that works on awakening the public rather

than this method --


Don't like to say this because the devotion and belief and energy involved in this

is something I respect -- and I do wish they success.

[StandingInLeftField]

12. Accepting brutality to further a cause is one thing.

But to do that, one needs exposure to a broad audience, which in this case is obviously not happening. There is a concerted effort among the M$M to ignore this occupation until violence erupts, then spin that for all its worth. Pathetic...this is how America treats peaceful protesters.

[AngkorWot]

15. Is there any actual brutality?

Or is it just more of the "don't tase me, bro" "brutality?"

[Dragonfli]

20. You don't think tasing absent a threat of violence isn't brutality? Do you

do parties? I can get 10 bucks a head from local baggers that will tase you for fun, seeing as how it's not brutal or anything it should be an easy way for you to make a few hundred.

[dotymed]

115. Thank you Dragonfli n/t

[emcguffie]

23. There's lots of video of what I would call violence against protestors.

Two young women, doing nothing but looking on, maced quite deliberately.

A young man, in a red t-shirt, first pushed by a cop. He backs up, holds his hands up, and seems to say something. The cop (another one of those supervisor cops in a white shirt) grabs him violently and throws him to the ground.

The guy who was arrested did not seem to be doing anything whatsoever.

It looks like there are certain policemen, in white shirts, who are quite deliberately trying to provoke trouble. One of them has been nicknamed "Supervisor mace and run."

[polly7]

27. Did you see anything in any of the videos that told you these people

deserved to be thrown to the ground, dragged or maced? I'm really curious, because I've been searching and haven't found anything.

[RaleighNCDUer]

85. You did not see the pictures of the young women who had been maced

in the OP?

That little blonde, she looked REAL dangerous.

[October]

118. Woah, you don't think that "Don't tase me, Bro" was butal???

You might want to rethink that.

[defendandprotect]

89. Agree ... and imo, we have been very reluctant to say ....

that this way has been blocked and we need to find new ways --

There is no right to free assembly when police brutalize those assemblying!

And we all know that -- !!

[lunatica]

11. Is brutality OK with you over minor violations?

If you protest peacefully albeit loudly would it be all right if the police maced you in the face and threw you to the ground and arrested you?

[dkf]

17. If you do not resist when being arrested, then no, but if you do resist then stronger measures are

Needed.

Having to subdue someone is no picnic for the police either.

[The Traveler]

36. I have seen

way too many clips of NYPD cops jumping on a protester who has just standing there to buy that. If that was resistance, a cop's life is easy.

These guys are obeying orders. They deserve no applause for that in this case ... but they are just obeying orders. So ... who is giving those orders?

Trav

[defendandprotect]

91. +1 --

[ZombieHorde]

48. NYPD pens up peaceful protesters—all women—and then maces them

http://markcrispinmiller.com/2011/09/nypd-pens-up-peaceful-protesters%E2%80%94all-women%E2%80%94and-then-maces-them/

Do you think these women were resisting the police?

[defendandprotect]

92. Free Assembly isn't being penned in ....

or being maced --

The message from corporations and police is much stronger than the message

going out to the public -- i.e., protesters are being defeated from the first go around.


It's heartbreaking to see this energy and caring and devotion met with brutality --

I'd rather see this energy put into a movement to get the rest of the public on the side

of the protesters -- and movements based more on intellectual and united actions --


Am I alone in feeling this way -- ?

[a simple pattern]

120. You're right, we shouldn't fight them.

The police are just too strong and brutal! The public isn't on the protesters' side anyway, they should just all quietly go home.

[defendandprotect]

123. Rather, I think the public is on the protesters' side ....

though presume you meant that as sarcasm ---

I'm all for the fight against elites --

Just think maybe some thought should be given to doing it a little differently --

[lunasun]

122. a bunch of unarmed women are their target = misogynistic cowards

[adigal]

136. I can't tell who sprayed them...this will backfire on the NYPD

Ridiculous, spraying women just standing there. A definite abuse of power.

Having seen that, we have to remember what the African-Americans went through in the south: dogs, firehoses, real, violent beatings. And they stayed peaceful through it all.

As a nation, we have a real long history of beating and even killing protestors. It is part of the risk when we protest.

[Name removed]

60. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[dkf]

65. Well when you ask why your friend is on crutches and he says he got injured subduing

Some guy who was resisting arrest then you think a little bit more about these things.

[JoeyT]

79. "Having to subdue someone is no picnic for the police either."

Hahahahaha!

Oh. You were serious.

Yeah, that's why they're becoming more and more militarized and more and more willing to use force over petty shit. Because it's soooo hard on them. Let's all shed a tear for our jackbooted friends and their misery.

[defendandprotect]

93. +1 -- days of police as public servants are over . . . they're corporate militia now -- !!!

[Jackpine Radical]

113. That's what they mostly always have been.

Cops (& firemen) exist primarily to protect the interests of the rich.

Think Haymarket Square, for example.

[defendandprotect]

121. True -- sadly --

:hi:

[RaleighNCDUer]

86. Hey, you're not paying attention to the thread here.

Your job is to defend the super rich, not the cops.

Careful, or they won't send you your pay.

[tcaudilllg]

107. I disagree. The aim is to capture the NYSE, over all.

You don't do that by being orderly.

[October]

119. Yeah, those cops were really struggling with throwing those skinny kids to the ground.

Are you kidding me?

[rhett o rick]

145. IMO he is only trying to stir up trouble. nm

[KansDem]

140. Perhaps someone could declare a "citizen's arrest" of the brutal cop

Then if the cop resists a "citizen's arrest" for assault and battery, then dozens of other citizens could descend on the one cop and take him into custody.

Might work both ways, you know...

[Aerows]

156. Pepper spraying someone in the face

unprovoked, however, most definitely is police brutality. There have also been reports of innocent bystanders - people not even there to protest - getting rough-housed and arrested. Call me silly, but I think police officers should have proof that you've actually done something wrong before arresting you.

"Resisting arrest" as your only crime pretty much guarantees that anyone can be snatched right off the street and locked up for no reason.

[Warren Stupidity]

31. the right of the people to peaceably assemble

quaint, I know.

What isn't funny is the support here given to the suppression of that right, the routine suppression of that right.

[DrunkenBoat]

54. Really, it's surprising to see posters acting like people have no right to assemble &

deserve to be attacked if they stand on that right.

I weep for the Democratic Party.

[Joe Fields]

84. So do I, and this is a disgusting party.

So many democrats have been completely brainwashed by what they see on tv and read in the newspapers.

This isn't the democratic party I grew up with.

[RaleighNCDUer]

87. I think it's a mistake to assume a person is a Democrat

just because he or she is posting on DU.

We have some very experienced trolls here who are careful to never quite step over the line and get tombstoned.

[defendandprotect]

94. Anyone still watching TV or reading newspapers hasn't a clue ...

The same families and corporations who gave us Hitler/Nazis have control

of our press --

Same for Congress --

"Our Congress is under the control of oil and coal industries" -- Al Gore/Rolling Stone


Picked this up from another DU poster ...


"The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth

of a private power to the point where it becomes stronger than their

democratic State itself.

That, in its essence, is Fascism -- ownership of government by an individual,

by a group or by any controlling private power."

President Franklin Roosevelt

[ZombieHorde]

35. You are confusing labels with reality, which is actually extremely common. nt

[patrick t. cakes]

50. watch the live stream

they've done nothing but exercise free speach

[TBF]

61. More support for the police. At least you're consistent. nt

[Rex]

90. No it is the white collars instigating chaos in the crowd.

Evidently they like The Man better then The People. Funny how you just group all cops together like they are ALL good. :eyes:

Par for the course with you.

[Modern_Matthew]

117. Give me a fucking break. Just because they're public workers doesn't mean anything...

Some people here want to give any halfwit with a public position free reign to be complete assholes. I believe in firing people like that on the spot. Any unjust arrest should be followed up with armed kidnapping charges.

[readmoreoften]

146. Criticism of the police is hardly criticism of "public workers"

Police are a particular brand of "public workers" who have the ability to bash the heads of working class protestors or to be in solidarity with them (as some were in Wisconsin). It's like saying that the CIA are "public workers" who need support when they're performing renditions on farmers in Uzbek.

Anyone who asks this question has obviously no real experience protesting and hasn't followed protest events since 2001. NYPD has been charged with brutal crimes against protestors in the past decade.

[Lorien]

150. Funny how authoritarians are so predictable. nt

[Aleric]

151. Yes, as are Legal Observers who are not part of the protest

Police have arrested National Lawyers Guild legal observers who are there as observers. So, yes, they are being arrested for no violation whatsoever.

[pinboy3niner]

13. The poll is close--52/48 in favor of protesters

52% Yes, the police were excessive and violent.

48% No, the NYPD did what it had to do.

[saras]

42. And you have to subtract the 20% or so that say yes to any and all violence...

[UnrepentantLiberal]

98. It's now 54 to 46 saying the police used excessive violence.

[lunasun]

126. POLL IS NOT CLOSED -9/26/11

[pinboy3niner]

155. 'Closed' and 'close' are not the same. :)

[FirstLight]

14. this is disturbing

...and frustrating to watch ...especially being here on the west coast and not able to help. :(

[juajen]

18. Interesting comment. How would you help. Not being sarcastic,

but think we should be talking about ways to help. I don't think I feel the same way about our men in blue that are scattered all over America.

[FirstLight]

62. I will repost as an OP i think...

I emailed the sf and NY movements, suggesting that we somehow set up 'sponsorships' between those actually there and those of us who want to be...individual support, because the energy of supporting someone and a cause are a big part of the push. we know this by watching the shifts humanity has created on a quantum level by having solidarity with eachother.

[Rareandfirsts]

16. Thank you Jackpine Radical for that brilliant reminder.

Thumbs up my friend.

[toddaa]

19. I believe it's illegal to hold an incoherent protest

The First Amendment clearly states that all free speech must be specific. You can't just ramble on about a whole bunch of grievances and not expect to be pepper sprayed, bludgeoned and locked up. Our founding fathers were very clear on that point.

To help those of you not versed in Constitutional matters, here's a little example that will clear things up:

Constitutionally Protected Speech - The government is taking my money and giving it to brown people.
Not Protected Speech - Wall Street has too much power and free Bradley Manning.

See the difference?

[Smarmie Doofus]

24. No. nt

[starroute]

26. So racist bullshit is free speech but complaining about abuses of power is not?

I think you need to go back and read the First Amendment a few more times.

[toddaa]

30. Reading the First Amendment?

How quaint.

[DrunkenBoat]

55. I think your sarcasm meter needs fine-tuning.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

103. That was exactly the poster's point.

Constitutionally Protected Speech - The government is taking my money and giving it to brown people. Teabaggers
Not Protected Speech - Wall Street has too much power and free Bradley Manning. OWS

When was the last time you saw a teabagger maced?

[julian09]

143. Tea Party likes to disrupt free speech

they won't be maced because they are armed and have Crotch money protecting them for bought cops.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

152. Disagree.

They won't be maced because they're complicit.

[nadinbrzezinski]

28. You read a different first amendment

<<Back | Table of Contents | Next>>

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


Tell me where coherent is in there, explicit or implied.

[Warren Stupidity]

32. sarcasm impaired?

I think the post was clearly intended to be humorous.

[nadinbrzezinski]

34. Given the number of law and order types

Yes

[Warren Stupidity]

45. well there is that.

There is another internet rule that claims that no matter how absurd such a post is, somebody else holds the same position in all seriousness. And we certainly see that on display here every time there is a protest, or a police outrage of any sort.

[toddaa]

39. I bet you go to magic shows and ruin it for everyone

Stop telling them how its done.

[Warren Stupidity]

44. I think you only get a limited number of victims before the mercy rule sets in.

[toddaa]

33. That's the 30 day trial version

You need to purchase the commercially licensed version. I bet your one of those "free as in freedom" commies, who thinks that people have rights and all that other nonsense.

This is America. Freedom isn't free.

[starroute]

38. Okay, implied sarcasm emoticon -- I apologize for snarking

Just been dealing lately with too many trolls who say these things and actually mean them.

[toddaa]

41. The sarcasm tag just ruins the joke

I remember when a troll was someone who posted something completely absurd, just to see how many snags it got. Bonus points for getting someone to agree with you.

Consider yourself snagged.

[Shandris]

43. Read this sentence again.

You can't just ramble on about a whole bunch of grievances and not expect to be pepper sprayed, bludgeoned and locked up.

You can't just ramble on about a whole bunch of grievances and not expect to be pepper sprayed, bludgeoned and locked up.

You can't just ramble on about a whole bunch of grievances and not expect to be pepper sprayed, bludgeoned and locked up.

You can't just ramble on about a whole bunch of grievances and not expect to be pepper sprayed, bludgeoned and locked up.

You can't just ramble on about a whole bunch of grievances and not expect to be pepper sprayed, bludgeoned and locked up.

I think I have discovered the problem. THIS kind of shit is actually BELIEVED by people. And worse...ACCEPTED!

:nuke:

[toddaa]

53. It's the same shit you heard in '99 Seattle and '08 Minneapolis

The people complaining are propping up a rotting corpse and expecting no one to notice the stench of death.

[MichiganVote]

70. WTF is an "incoherent" speech? The "founding fathers" DID NOT create the revolutionary war.

The people did.

[coalition_unwilling]

76. Brilliant satire (or is it?). Wish I could rec your post. It does

seem as if some people on this board have a problem with satire and irony. Maybe that's a sign that your satire is even more effective.

[Go2Peace]

96. It's not satire if it actually represents a true condition

The reason folks are having a hard time catching the intent is because there are *many* people in this country right now that would say something like that and actually mean it......

[tcaudilllg]

108. Welcome to my ignore list, vile extremist!

[readmoreoften]

147. Rivals for single, silliest post on DU this year. If you consider capitalism as the root reason

for Wall Street running our military and political policy, and Bradley Manning as a victim of our military and political policy, then it makes perfect sense to attack both Wall Street and Bradley Manning supporters.

It is incoherent to ramble about the government taking all your money and giving it to brown people, because the government does no such thing. It is combining an anti-government and anti-tax argument with a racist argument, which the Tea Party does not do "coherently".

Furthermore, even if your silly premise were true, your argument that incoherence should result in the expectation of police brutality is not only illogical, it perfectly reflects fascist ideology.

So is this it now? Promotion of open fascist positions are now acceptable on DU?

[Smarmie Doofus]

21. Done. Still 52-48% good guys at 2:15 est. NT

[truthwillout777]

22. K&R

Thank you for posting this!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

25. "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." Gandhi

[starroute]

37. It seems that by being bloodied, they've gained more credibility

The media -- at least locally -- have started covering the protests because of the police violence. (What we used to call a "police riot" back in the day -- a term that needs to be revived.)

According to tweets this morning, some of the media stayed in Liberty Park overnight, which may be why the police didn't move in.

Most of those arrested were released as quickly as the police could process them, which is not typical and also seems to be a result of the growing media attention.

And several of those released have said that many of the ordinary "blue collar" cops expressed sympathy with what they were doing, and that it was their superiors -- the guys in the white shirts -- who were responsible for initiating the brutality.

Others have spoken about the joyous sense of solidarity as they were being hauled off in the police van.

In addition, members of the "professional left" like Chris Hedges and Medea Benjamin have started showing up today and have been interviewed on the livestream. (I have ambivalent feelings about that, but I'll be generous and assume they were just waiting for the new kids to prove their bona fides and aren't trying to rip off their karma.)

So all in all, far from descending into chaos, it seems as though the protest has reached a new stage of self-awareness, self-assurance, and public credibility.

[tama]

47. Yep

And when the white collar repression professionals start making warning examples of the blue collar public servants who refuse to obey orders against their fellow citizens, things will get interesting. Hope we get through this without turning into Libya or Syria.

[Admiral Loinpresser]

64. I noticed this too!

The superior officers (white shirts, not blue) yesterday were the ones macing women. On day one it was a white-shirted thug who roghly tossed an unresisting protestor so that he landed on his face. Disgusting. The legacy of Bush and 9/11 continues.

[ZombieHorde]

40. While the elites drink chamagne and laugh and laugh and laugh...

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message1652158/pg1

[Fire Walk With Me]

46. Yep. Stealin' that link, BTW :)

[NYC_SKP]

49. K/R

[JackRiddler]

51. I'm sure you're sympathetic but your headline is factual malpractice...

The police state cracked down on a peaceful protest -- in brutal and illegitimate, but planned and orderly, predictable fashion. The protest itself did not "descend into chaos." It was assaulted.

[lunasun]

125. exactly 'chaos' delivers the image of the protest losing civil control not the cops

[Ikonoklast]

52. Here's hoping the police unions remember this when the wealthy come for THEM.

It is already happening in places like Wisconsin and Ohio, and, yes, it's the wealthy that have stolen their pension funds and want the police to take cuts in pay so the wealthy can pay even less in taxes.


The police will one day understand that those protesters are also protesting for them.

[sabrina 1]

57. Who caused the chaos?

Poll Results

Thank you for voting.

Do you think the NYPD cracked down too hard on Wall Street protesters?

Yes, the police were excessive and violent. 54%

No, the NYPD did what it had to do. 46%

[AzDar]

59. K&R

:grr:

[ecstatic]

63. A few weeks back, I saw a media person suggesting that people riot on Wall Street

but I can't remember who it was!

[RagAss]

69. Kicked and recced.

[Rex]

71. The M$M gets paid to keep the wealthest Americans protected

no matter how bad things get, while keeping the working poor down under the thumb of the govt. THAT is their job, not to report news or help the American people. The M$M is just another branch of the govt.

[unkachuck]

72. done...on the poll: Yes 54% No 46%....n/t

[Joe Shlabotnik]

73. panicked 'powers that be' will be ruthless

if the protests ever gain real coverage and garner popular support: Expect the Internet to mysteriously go down. We're more in this together than some want to believe.

[LatteLibertine]

75. It's sad

because the powers that be could not be oppressive without willing >flunkies<.

[WHEN CRABS ROAR]

81. Could this be what the rulers are afraid of?

http://occupytogether.org/

Welcome to DU

[tcaudilllg]

110. They are vile monsters inside.

Just as in Libya... Egypt... they must be exposed.

But word to the wise: wear a vest. ;)

[tcaudilllg]

111. I recommend setting sights on the NYC government.

[McCamy Taylor]

74. This is how you get noticed. Or, young women could go topless. Street theater sells newspapers.

[MrMickeysMom]

77. I agree with Olbermann... it's a piece of shit newspaper...

... But, I DU'd the poll anyway.

Those who agree they used excessive force are 56% at this point.

[DirkGently]

78. The chaos looked to be on the cops' part. Pulling people through the barricade; knee on the neck.

[Jakes Progress]

80. Fat Cats are getting scared.

Sending in the goons. Think union busts of the past. Think Watts. They know it's coming. But they won't let go of their greedy nickels no matter.

[newspeak]

144. yes, during the depression

laborers took over the building sitting in and the cops and pinkerton worked for the owners, FDR sent in the national guard to protect the protesters. Of course, that was then and this is now.

[crim son]

82. K&R.

The poll could use a little help.

[JVS]

95. Pigs

[SammyWinstonJack]

130. +1000!

:thumbsup:

[Enthusiast]

97. Kicked and recommended! nt

[Monarda]

99. Arrests in New York

I was told by a public defender of my acquaintance that if you are arrested in New York, it is routine to spend two days in jail awaiting arraignment. People are being arrested under the stop-and-frisk laws for offenses such as trespassing (visiting neighbors). Such frivolous arrests can cost people their jobs. These types of arrests have gone up 300 percent under Bloomberg. Maybe now that large numbers of middle-class people are being arrested, attention will be drawn to this unconstitutional situation.

[tcaudilllg]

109. Never trust a man with a lot of money, no matter his professed creed.

[6000eliot]

100. Are they kidding with that headline and picture?

[diddlysquat]

101. Done!!

[rosesaylavee]

102. Yes/53% and No/47%

Do you think the NYPD cracked down too hard on Wall Street protesters?

Yes, the police were excessive and violent. 53%
No, the NYPD did what it had to do. 47%

[Javaman]

104. So the cops create chaos, but corralling and macing the peaceful protests...

yet, the fucking daily news uses the catch all phrase of "protests descending into chaos".

if you ever needed a better example of just how right wing media manipulates the masses, I can't think of one.

agent provocateurs, thug tactics by the cops, kneeling down before their corporate masters and the degrading of the peoples voice in this nation. Welcome to the new reality, it's a lot like the old one, just more painful, less respectful and a hell of a lot more hateful.

[veness]

106. 51 / 49 ....

Yes, the police were excessive and violent. 51%
No, the NYPD did what it had to do. 49%

[SammyWinstonJack]

131. Who are these 49% ? Bet they also think waterboarding isn't torture and is necessary

:silly:

[Zorra]

142. They are conservatives. The same fools that voted for Bush. nt

[MoonRiver]

112. Amazing how close it is.

x(

[backscatter712]

132. That's what happens when the media is rigged.

They can get teabaggers to freep the polls, and if all else fails, they just invent the numbers.

[Modern_Matthew]

116. There should be no difference of opinion here.

All the cynics here are useless to any real change.

[Doctor_J]

124. When the first robber is dragged away, we'll have chaos

until then it's just normal police-state fascism.

[SammyWinstonJack]

127. Those cops, their families must be so proud of them.

:silly:

So what are our soldiers fighting and dying for now? Repugs claim our troops are fighting for our freedoms.


Must be just Wall St. freedoms, not us 'lesser' peoples' freedoms.

[Bozita]

135. 52-48

[gateley]

138. Pretty even - 52% cops too harsh; 48% doing their job. nt

[katty]

148. this is what it takes...my older sister did it at Berkeley in the 1960's

and alot more to come-look back on all the riots, civil rights police abuse, war protests from mid-1960's to early 1970's--it wasn't all love-ins, rock concerts, dope, peace and love-it was alot of protesting work & the corruption is so pervasive in this country it will take even more work now.

[Name removed]

149. Deleted message

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