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kpete Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-11 05:16 PM
Original message
A View of "Privilege" from a Straight White Guy
SAT SEP 03, 2011 AT 01:43 PM PDT
A View of "Privilege" from a Straight White Guy
bytwigg

......................

In many walks of life, from politics to simple local gatherings, the term "White Privilege" is a dog whistle. It is a clarion call for all those dis-affected folk, on both sides, to vent their spleens on each other. I see it on websites, I hear it in bars. It is there in the churches too .....

It just isn't true that the 30% of black people in your small town prefer their own churches to the 1st Baptist Church. They are simply made to feel unwelcome at the 1st Baptist by those who believe that they "prefer their own churches".

.... It is those attitudes, springing from generations of suspicion and mistrust and fostered by a political leadership that is craven, and deeply racist that perpetuates these myths.

I am a white guy. I am straight and because of that I never have to fear that I will be denied anything because of who I am. That is what we all need to take on board because until we do, until we accept the truth of it, then the disadvantages will continue.

the rest:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/09/03/1013100/-A-View-of-Privilege-from-a-Straight-White-Guy?via=siderec
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-11 05:25 PM
Response to Original message
1. K&R. nt
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my2sense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-11 06:08 PM
Response to Original message
2. K & R
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-11 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
3. Another crappy piece on "white privilege"...
Though the article is really just about privilege, period.

And it engages in grand falsehoods to back its own conclusions.

"No white person was ever denied an opportunity simply because they were white."

Yes, there are white males out there who have been denied something only because they are "white". Affirmative action, for one, does this, but there is also just regular discrimination that occurs. And yes, white men are steryotyped and even discriminated against. Yes, I realize that there is a power differential and this doesn't happen often, but it does happen, and to deny it is rather silly to try and to fit a simple narrative of privilege. I mean, to say that no "insert giant group" has EVER been denied something is rather disingenuous.

I think it's simple enough to say that white heterosexual males, everything else being equal, have the most privileged race/sexual orientation/gender combo in the United States as a whole. I don't "admit" it, I know it as a fact. But the whole point of these articles is usally lost rather easily.

Everyone has privileges, some more than others, but everyone is not likely to consider the privileges they do have. That is what needs to be addressed. Most people, whatever color, gender, or sexual orientation, rarely, if ever think about their own privileges. I think most everyone is more likely to notice other's privileges when they themselves are disadvantaged, no doubt about that.

Also, the author applies the term "privilege" in pretty odd ways. For example, he talks about how women are generally labeled negatively while men are labeled positively by society for being promiscuous. His evidence that this attitude is widespread and staying strong? The internet. Is it a privilege to be seen as "more manly" if you have lots of sexual partners? Not really, unless your goal is to look manly to a part of the population that thinks that way.

Another example of male privilege, not having to worry about what you wear being commented on. And if you want people to comment on what you wear? Well, I guess you are a sick puppy, and certainly aren't receiving any sort of privilege, since, you know, no people like that exist. Do I think it is stupid that women celebrity's clothes are commented on by some media? I don't care about clothes much, or celebrities, so I guess, but most of the people interested in it and driving it are women anyways, so it's hard to see where this is a clear "privilege" that always cuts one way.

"If you are a man you will never know what it feels like to have to hide your sexual behaviour, or be considered to be "dirty" or rejected if you do not. Only women understand that."

No, I personally know of many straight men that hide their sexual behavior, because guess what, there are people out there who think men who have lots of promiscuous sex are not good people. Shocking, I know! And the worst part of the article, right here:

"If, however, you refuse to recognise that you are privileged, even when your colleagues and fellow citizens are patiently explaining it to you, then that is your fault. You do not have the luxury of denying other people their experiences."

Ah, but that is exactly what the author has already done, many times in his article! Hilarious! Not only denying others of their experiences, but proclaiming that such experiences don't exist! Ever! Wow.

Telling people what they can or cannot say to "minorities", yeah, that's the ticket. When what is needed is understanding and communication, you know, a dialogue, let's make this dialouge a lecture, and if you got a question? You better keep it to yourself. This kind of attitude is just fucking stupid. After all, "minorities" are always right about privilege, or at least you should assume they are, just because, you know, everyone interprets the world perfectly from their experiences.
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southmost Donating Member (528 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-11 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
4. I am confused by the habitual dittohead memes
from post #3,

not sure whats going on there
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-11 08:43 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. Ad hominem attack...
You understand what's going on. You don't want to respond to a post that you disagree with (either because you're too lazy or some other reason), so you attack the poster as a "dittohead". In other words, you're being rude.
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southmost Donating Member (528 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-11 12:06 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. no you are being rude
I never attacked you personally , just your message

you personally attacked me the messenger because your disagreed with my opinion about your post even belonging on a progressive site

big difference, and yes your post is frequently found on freeper sites,

if the shoe fits, well ... anyways.. you're already wearing them
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MellowDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-11 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. Uhh... nice try
you didn't respond, you just made nasty inferences. I'm not naive.

If you don't agree with a post, for whatever reason, try to address the content rather than attack the character of the poster with nasty inferences, and then try to cowardly back away from your rudeness.

To me, it just seems you are throwing a tantrum because you can't address the content. You have brought nothing at all to this dicussion besides personal attacks.
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southmost Donating Member (528 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-11 05:59 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. not in the mood to feed trolls thank you
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Hosnon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-11 08:48 PM
Response to Original message
6. Excellent article so far, but I disagree already with this:
"If you are a man you will never know what it feels like to have to hide your sexual behaviour, or be considered to be "dirty" or rejected if you do not. Only women understand that."

Gay men, particularly bottoms, understand.
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lumberjack_jeff Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-11 09:53 PM
Response to Original message
7. "I never have to fear that I will be denied anything because of who I am"
This is simply false. If it were true we wouldn't be worrying about the future of affirmative action and social programs for women.

The question is whether denying things to those who were born white and male is appropriate in the broader context. Arguably, racism and homophobia justify proactive measures to promote the greater good. Those proactive measures will unavoidably benefit one group over another.

Unrec.

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Zax2me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-11 06:31 PM
Response to Original message
11. Agree on topic but church example is WAY off.
snip- It just isn't true that the 30% of black people in your small town prefer their own churches to the 1st Baptist Church. They are simply made to feel unwelcome at the 1st Baptist by those who believe that they "prefer their own churches".

Don't know where author got this information. But it does not reflect my personal experience.
The 'black' churches around here have no interest in joining the local 'first baptist' or 'white' church, at least not from fear of being turned away or feeling unwelcome. We do have several Sundays a year where all the local churches worship together. Outside, weather permitting. On other occasions (construction/power outages) either or has gathered here and there together.
The only thing right about this is saying that the 30% just isn't true - that is correct.
It's closer to 100% prefer their own churches. Some have less than 30 members and could easily be swallowed up by another black church 500 yards up the road. Yet no one complains or suggests they should combine. Everyone is happy where they are.
There simply is NO animosity from one to another. White or black.
So where the hell did this misinformation - most likely speculation - come from?
This sounds as if it were written by someone who hasn't walked inside a church in 20 years, if ever.
That's okay, just don't start telling the world how this one lives when I know you don't have a clue what you are talking about.
It renders the entire article as a little more than patronizing and self-righteous.
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