Who in the World would trust Standard and Poor's?

[autorank]

Who in the World would trust Standard and Poor's?

By Michael Collins - Economic Populist

Standard and Poor's finally did it. They downgraded the credit rating of the United States from AAA to AA+. There are serious questions about the reliability of S&P. The White House pointed out that there is a $2 trillion error in the calculations used for the downgrade. Ths is of interest since the two other agencies failed to change the AAA status of the US. (See Robert Oak, Economic Populist)

Snip

They Helped Trigger the Financial Collapse

Along with Moody's, S&P abruptly burst the real estate bubble and triggered the 2008 recession. Their downgrading of mortgage backed securities followed years of the highest ratings for these risky financial products. According to a US Senate committee report:

"Although ratings downgrades for investment grade securities are supposed to be relatively infrequent, in 2007, they took place on a massive scale that was unprecedented in U.S. financial markets. Beginning in July 2007, Moody’s and S&P downgraded hundreds and then thousands of RMBS and CDO ratings, causing the rated securities to lose value and become much more difficult to sell, and leading to the subsequent collapse of the RMBS and CDO secondary markets. The massive downgrades made it clear that the original ratings were not only deeply flawed, but the U.S. mortgage market was much riskier than previously portrayed." (Author's emphasis) US Senate Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations, April 13 (p. 263)

Link: http://www.economicpopulist.org/content/who-world-would-trust-standard-and-poors

[midnight]

1. K&R

[autorank]

13. Another day, another outrage...

... go figure, S&P is indicted for fraud and caves, earlier this year, now they're taken seriously. Fraud of the type they
committed is entirely relevant to credit ratings but corporate media doesn't get it.

[Amonester]

2. Why Rn't these S&P bailed-out crooks accomplices rotting in jail yet?

:shrug:

[autorank]

10. Great question. It's my question also

I read the indictments of S&P and Moodys by now Senator but then AG Blumenthal of CT. Those kick ass. S&P groveled and said they'd
be better but IN ESSENCE, they admitted committing fraud. Now they're astride the globe giving advice. Nonsense.

But, hey, in a political system that can see Arnie get elected in California and Palin run as VP, nothing surprises us.

[tomp]

37. you mean, you don't know?

it's because obama/holden aren't prosecuting?

is there anything else you need to know?

[lonestarnot]

3. I will stomp and piss on their statements or anything they have to push.

[autorank]

11. They're not straight shooters

And they're reputation is hardly, well, reputable.

:hi:

[Sarah Ibarruri]

4. Did it ever occur to you all that institutions like S & P's are human inventions

and only imaginary, yet we're forced to accept them as if they were real and meant something, or were written in stone?

What a bunch of sh*t.

[ElboRuum]

9. No, it hadn't

Because human inventions are most definitely real. Some are even tangible.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

32. S & P is a fantasy, made up to benefit only one class: the ruling class. nt

[ElboRuum]

33. It's a reality in the financial world.

And one which we have to deal with no matter how we may feel about it. You may be precisely correct in saying that it is a fantasy, etc., but that does not change its influence on financial markets.

[Sarah Ibarruri]

36. I agree. My niece thinks she is getting married next week to Cody Simpson, the child singer

She really, honestly does believe it, too!

[lonestarnot]

5. They can't even get their shock and awe shit right.

:rofl:

[mmonk]

6. You're fast this evening.

Good work.

[autorank]

12. Told it to get off the bench and try again;)

The core of this is from an April 25 article critiquing S&P. It was relevant then and it is now. My quickness is a product
of salvaging/updating an article that I really liked but got less interest that I thought was warranted.

What gets me is - these guys were indicted for fraud by Blumenthal in CT. They groveled, said they'd never do it again, but essentially
admitted the fraud. Why isn't that news now, like corporate media new? Headline: Indicted Credit Agency Dumps on US

[indurancevile]

19. +1

[ProDem4]

7. Bush's Fault

Help me out ...

I thought it was Bush's Fault

I mean I'm sure it's the Tea Partys fault.

But now were sure it's S & P's Fault.

Im Glad were the Adults in the room.

[mmonk]

8. Deregulation. And all who made it possible and still advocate for it.

[autorank]

21. Amen

It's the commercial equivalent of Lord of the Flies. We "let the market take care of it" and look what we got!

Responsible, honest lawmaking and regulation would prevent all of this.

[Amonester]

14. I bet they said the "We R $orry" stay-out-of-jail and free to do it again

mega-paRa$ites' meme.

[Tunkamerica]

24. Seriously? That's your best attempt?

When you guys figure out spelling, punctuation, and subtlety it might work.

[scheming daemons]

28. fail

Go to AOL and get more troll practice before coming back among the big boys.

[socialist_n_TN]

39. It's ALL of those people and entities fault

They're ALL part of the global capitalist conspiracy to FUCK OVER YOU AND ME. Unless you're one of the top 2%. Are you?

[EFerrari]

15. KIck

[flamingdem]

16. +1

[Major Hogwash]

17. I tend to agree.

The one fact that stands out the most is that the debt deal was signed on Tuesday around 3 PM or so, so it makes no sense for S&P to wait until after 5 PM 3 days later to pull this kind of stunt.

[Major Hogwash]

18. To be clear, this is the kind of shit Pravda does.

They print some outlandish bullshit on Wednesday and then retract it on Saturday.
I imagine that is exactly what S&P will do tomorrow.

[autorank]

22. Moody's and Fitch didn't go there

If there is a $2 trillion math error, there are people on this board, let alone colleges etc, who will find it.

If so, S&P is in very dangerous territory. I remember clearly the national press dinner when the Obama folks trumped Trump. The
guy has barely come up for air. Same deal with S&P. The small pleasures of that sight is not enough to take away the pain of a
budget deal gone wrong, done too quickly, etc. But, ya know..,

[stevedeshazer]

20. +1

Nailed it. As usual.

;)

[autorank]

23. Steve

Who would have thought... Cheers to you!!!

[autorank]

25. It's Saturday morning and S&P is just as sketchy as last night!

spread the word - helped create the 2008 crash, lots of evidence, and indicted for fraud in Connecticut by then AG Blumenthal (now
Senator). I hope Blumenthal makes a statement because he really nailed S&P.

[mmonk]

26. Will do. In fact I'll be writing soon.

And linking some of your work if you don't mind.

[autorank]

34. Want to see it. PM me please

I will look forward to it! These characters need to be exposed.

[mmonk]

35. Will do.

I already linked to a piece of yours in something I did on August 1st here and another place.

[Spider Jerusalem]

27. Who in the world would trust the US government to honour its debts?

After the little show of political theatre by Congressional Republicans insouciantly dancing right up to the edge of default? Who would trust the ability of the US to manage deficits and thus future debts over the long term when a significant political faction is intransigent in its insistence that any adjustments to the fiscal balance must come solely from cuts and not from new revenues? (Helpful hint: "But we're America, damn it!" isn't good enough reason for trust.)

[mmonk]

29. Has the US missed a payment?

[Spider Jerusalem]

30. That's far from the only consideration here

it's not just whether the US HAS missed a payment, it's whether the US WILL miss a payment. It's whether the US at present can be counted upon to honour its obligations. With the Congressional Republicans being as they are, and having shown their willingness to play politics over the debt limit to the extent of coming within an ace of default, the honest and objective answer to that is "no, the US cannot reasonably be counted upon to honour its obligations without question" (which is what a triple-A rating signifies). If ANY OTHER country had done something similar, then all three major ratings agencies would have issues a downgrade. The arguments making this about S&P instead of the Republican Party, who really own the blame, are nothing more than the arrogance of American exceptionalism. If the US were held to a consistent standard Moody's and Fitch probably would have downgraded as well.

[mmonk]

31. Who said the Republican party wasn't involved?

Point is, S&P is an issue unless you think Robert Reich and Paul Krugman are an issue.

[autorank]

38. Kick

:kick:

[leftstreet]

40. K&R

"It seems S&P succumbed to pressure from their customers on Wall Street and the big banks"

Yep

Thanks for putting that all that info together

[blkmusclmachine]

41. The new standard is to be poor.

n/t

[hifiguy]

42. Can't imagine why anyone would trust

the utterly corrupt snakefuckers who gave a AAA seal of approval to the packages of dogshit that were mortgage backed securities. Those assholes don't have the integrity necessary to be kiddie pimps.

Good thing I am not planning to be around much longer. Seeing this country devolve into the banana republic the zillionares have dreamed of for so long is just too depressing to stick around for.