Looking for help responding to a right wing hit piece

[liberal N proud]

I am looking for a real witty response to this email I received from my asshole right wing and poor brother.

These are possibly the 5 best sentences you'll ever read:


1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.

2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.

3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.

4.. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.

5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work, because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.

Can you think of a reason for not sharing this?

Neither could I......

This both gives me time to respond without just off the cuff sending it back and a little help from our inspired minds.

You know I will respond all when I respond, so everyone can see the responses, so it isn't going back to just one asshole.

Here is something to contemplate, my brother was doing quite well until working in the airline industry, nice house, boat 2 cars, SUV and an off-road vehicle, seasons tickets to the St. Louis Rams and Cardinals before that. He pretty much lost everything after the airlines no longer needed him, his wife, all but one car, boat camper and house. He now lives in a mobile home with his live in girlfriend who like him works for minimum wage with no benefits.

And he sends shit like this. :shrug:

[MineralMan]

1. Bumper sticker political philosophy.

He doesn't understand it, so you can't counter it.

[jtown1123]

2. Nothing witty, but they have to realize, wealthy people got there because of us

the system afforded them wealth. The worker bees and lowly employees built their empire. What on earth do they do that deserves such lavish compensation? Are they curing cancer? Didn't think so. You can't get wealthy in a magical bubble that somehow exempts you from paying your fair share of taxes. I'll try to think of something witty later...

[EFerrari]

3. That's a great argument against trickle down economics

and tax breaks for the 1% while the rest of us carry everything. :)

[C_U_L8R]

4. all completely false arguments

how about ...
-roads you can drive on (and safe airways and waterways too)
-food that won't kill you
-defenses to protect the country
-savings you can retire on

thats what you pay for.

[liberal N proud]

14. Thanks

[Wait Wut]

5. Some idiot posted this in our local paper today.

Brainwashed morons.

Cute little talking points are disproved by facts. Sadly, the type of person that would forward something like this has no interest in facts. They take too damned long to read and the numbers are confusing.

So...just add:

6. You can't fix stupid, or argue against it.


Follow up with links to things he'll never read disproving each and every point. Hell, you could send him a link to a new Disney attraction and he probably wouldn't know the difference.


Edit: Sorry. This is your brother, after all. Be sure to tell him you love him despite his political handicap.

[immoderate]

20. Good analysis. And your point #6 is unassailable.

And what can you do by saying it?

--imm

[louslobbs]

21. Great and funny post, thanks

Lou

[LaydeeBug]

6. Ok, at a glance

The so-called "job creators" in this nation pillaged our safety net under the auspices of actually creating jobs. The only place they created jobs was in INDIA, so perhaps they should seek tax relief there. it's time We The People invest OUR tax dollars into businesses that actually create JOBS instead of blame.

You can't ask a person to pull themselves up by the bootstraps when they are God Damned BAREFOOT.

The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. Really? Are you daft? You can't be stupid enough to believe this, since the top one percent enjoys loopholes that you and I do not enjoy.

You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it? Que up the stupid train again, and somebody ask the imbecile who wrote this to tell you what a dividend is. We The People are the shareholders in America, stupid.

When there are four people for every one position out there, you, your mother, your father, your pastor and all the teabagging conglomerate from sea to shining sea have a lot of nerve to try and say that half the people have any idea where their next meal is coming from because stupid assholes like you fall for stupid shit like this.


********************************

I just lose my temper too much

[louslobbs]

22. I disagree, I've read your posts and in this political atmosphere, you lose it just the right amount

Lou

[spedtr90]

7. It's like a manifesto of selfishness

A revised #4:

A nation cannot multiply wealth by handing it to those who hoard it.

[spedtr90]

9. some help in a previous du post

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1457089

[liberal N proud]

13. Great responses over there too

Thanks

[liberal N proud]

16. Good one

[louis-t]

8. Ayn Rand much?

Sounds like he took those lines out of one of her books. All repugs have are cute sayings.

[Blue Meany]

10. I agree with number 2, which is why I think we have do something

about the rich and the Wall-Street vultures, who siphon of our wealth without working for it. As for #5, I would say that it is less than 10% plant to live off the work of others; while half would like to work at a living wage.

Tell him he's got the right idea but the wrong enemies.

[proud patriot]

11. here's my point by point response

1)you can't expect this country to prosper with out a strong middle class demanding products and services.

2)I agree , I'm tired of the super rich paying a smaller % in taxes What makes them think they are Entitled to only have to pay 15% while I pay closer to 30% .

3)Why do corporations feel entitled to pay ZERO taxes and receive my tax dollars as a refund while they make Billions in Profits. Redistributing the Wealth of the Middle class to the wealthy who pay lower taxes than we do is Class warfare and reduces DEMAND for products leading to higher unemployment rates.

4)Wealth multiplies and Millionaires get to pay the lowest taxes the wealthy have had in 50 yrs. Plus the peasants of the lower classes will pay off all the Bills the wealthy have incurred anyway.

5)Bail the wealthy out again when they crash the economy and then give them lower taxes so they can create more Jobs for the Chinese. Destroy workers rights so the middle class is further harmed and demand for product falls more increasing deficits and unemployment.

What makes any American think the Wealthy have the best interest of the middle class and lower class at heart is Delusional.

[louslobbs]

15. Wow, I should have read your post before posting mine, clear, to the point and factual. Thanks

Lou

[proud patriot]

28. Thanks for the Compliment Lou

:hi:

[louslobbs]

31. I calz'em as I seez'em my friend and you are very welcome. n/t

Lou

[liberal N proud]

17. Great

Thanks

[proud patriot]

29. You are most Welcome

Keep up the good fight

[louslobbs]

12. These are possibly the 5 most ridiculous and brainless sentences you'll ever read

These are possibly the 5 best brainless Republican fortune cookie like sentences you'll ever read:LOL


1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.

Answer: You cannot have a bought and paid for legislature who does the bidding of the wealthy and the corporations, who distribute the wealth to the top with policy lobbied for by the wealthy that continues to take from the poor while giving tax breaks to the rich and powerful. The poor cannot prosper when jobs are shipped out of the country because the rich corporate owners don't want to pay fair wages and benefits, the poor cannot prosper when the corporations move their headquarters outside of the USA and do not pay their fair share of taxes, the poor cannot prosper when they pay into Social Security all of their life, but the corporate government wants to steal this "earned" benefit from them, the poor cannot prosper when the average Republican uses bumper sticker sentences, and is too dumb to understand what they just copied to send to their brother as some kind of reality based fact.

Don't piss on our leg and tell us it's raining. Do some research, read and learn before you send out writings that make you look stupid to anyone who uses critical thinking skills when you obviously cannot. These "sentences" are part of the dumbing down of America and it looks like another one took the bait.


2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.

Answer: Please give examples of how and when this could occur. When was the last time you received nothing for the work you did because another received without working? What a crock of shit!

3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. First off, have you ever read the constitution?

Answer: So, should the government not tax everyone fairly in order to take in revenues to provide safe roads and bridges, safe food and water, safe health care and medications, institute and have the money to enforce policy that regulates the banks and wall street so they cannot repeat their crimes of the past? The problem is not that the government takes in taxes to provide for a safe nation, (including an over budgeted military machine) the problem is that the government is rigged and you refuse to see it. The government is no longer of the people, but of the rich, powerful and of the corporations, these are the one's who have stolen the nations wealth with the help from those they have purchased within "our," their government. Their bought and paid for Republicans (and Democrats as well), have unfairly burdened the majority to give unneeded tax cut bonuses to the few at the top, the ones they refer to as the "job creators," well, where are all of the jobs then? Why are we talking about cutting deficits that Republican policy created, but not talking about the economy and jobs as the most important issue of the day? Because the corporate government has decided that this is the issue that can finally get them Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. If everyone paid their fair share, there would be less burden on the majority and less profit for those at the top, but that's not the way the corporate masters want it and their bought and paid for government sides with where the money is and not with the will of the people, the majority. If government didn't provide tax loopholes for the wealthy to not pay their fair share in taxes, then the deficit would be lower, if the corporations didn't do their main business overseas to avoid paying taxes here, then again, the deficit would be lower, if the corporations and the wealthy didn't get tax cuts (free money) that is then added on to the deficit for all of us to pay, then the deficit would be lower, if the Republicans paid for their wars, then the deficit would be lower, if the Republicans paid for their prescription drug act, the deficit would be lower....... and there would be more for everyone and not just those at the top. Sorry to say, but this one sounds like you got it out of a fortune cookie.

If the government did its job for the people, instead of the corporations and the wealthy, then the government would be doing what the constitution instructs them to do. When a government of, for and by the people perishes from the earth and a corporate government takes hold, we no longer live in a democracy.


4.. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.

You also cannot steal from the majority to give to the already wealthy at the top and not continue to divide an angry and already divided nation. You also cannot start wars and not pay for them and just add that on to the deficit or pass drug programs without paying for them, added on to the deficit and give continued tax breaks to those at the top, added on to the deficit without the deficit increasing and this is exactly what the Republicans and their corporate masters have been doing. Confucius say, you cannot multiply wealth by dividing it lol. Please get some new material sir.

5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work, because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.

The beginning of the end of any nation comes when those at the top steal everything from the majority with help from their bought and paid for government. When the government no longer works for the people, but works for the corporations who have bought their votes and makes policy that only helps those at the top while taking from and putting in place austerity measures for the majority at the bottom, then that my friend, is the beginning of the end of any nation.

Can you think of a reason for not sharing this?

Neither could I......Answer: Those who cannot think clearly, or think for themselves, cannot think of reason.

The only ones who could not think of a reason for sharing these fortune cookie like comments, are those who do not, or cannot think for themselves. These types use talking points and FOX/GOP propaganda to do their thinking for them and some even combine their interpretation of the Bible when spouting their gibberish. All of the preceding "alleged" comments/questions are nothing less than fortune cookie mum bo jumbo. I do have a real question for you though that you probably cannot find an answer for:

1. Name one good thing the Republicans have done for this nation and its people in the last 30 years? And please provide backup for your answer. I will assume that you have no more words of wisdom for the world if you cannot complete this simple task....... Just one good thing the Republicans have done for this country that has helped or benefited everyone in this nation?

Lou

[liberal N proud]

18. Like it

[louslobbs]

19. Thank you my friend

Lou

[drpepper67]

23. I believe what is being referred to here

"2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.

Answer: Please give examples of how and when this could occur. When was the last time you received nothing for the work you did because another received without working? What a crock of shit!"

I believe what's being referred to here is when someone works and then pays taxes.

That person get less money than they would have it they didn't have to pay taxes.

And then that tax money is used to give to someone else who didn't work for it.

Although I could be wrong.

[louslobbs]

25. If someone worked for years and paid into the system and had taxes taken out all of the years they

worked................. let's say a person works for 30yrs paying into the system and then gets a pink slip and can't find a job for 2yrs or more in a bad economy created by the Republicans and their corporate backers, (bankers and wall street) just to name a few. Now, this person who worked for thirty years and paid into the system, has taken back from the system for the past 2 years because there is not job available for them, not because they did anything wrong, but because the "system" the corporate ruled government, screwed them over. Is it your opinion, that this person, who has paid into the system for 30yrs paying taxes, (including but not limited to Social Security taxes), but now cannot find a job for the past 2yrs and is receiving unemployment, is a someone who "receives without working" Is this person on the "dole," "lazy," taking something that they have not earned?

We are all supposed to pay our fair share of taxes for the greater good of "our" nation to keep us safe and provide ourselves with a safe infrastructure and to provide us with less financial burden as we get older and can no longer work like (Social Security) "the earned benefit" that the Republicans want us to refer to as "an entitlement." When did all this bullshit start about others working and paying taxes, paying for those who "didn't work?" It's a great piece of brainwashing that many fall for, and it's really sad. Those who believe this garbage, are the ones who vote against their best interests and can't even see that they're doing it.

Actually, I think you might be right, this is what that ridiculous psycho babble was trying to say, and it's just another piece of propaganda pushed forward by the corporate media trying to pit us against each other, a rock in the bushes so to speak so we look over here, instead of over there where the corporate government and the rich don't want us to look while they're stealing the country blind. The dumber the population, the better it is for those who want to control the population. What a sad and sick country the corporations and their bought and paid for government have turned this nation into, and what a sad commentary on a population who is so distracted, uneducated and dumbed down that many cannot see where we are headed if it is not stopped.
Lou

[drpepper67]

27. I hate to admit it but

I am related to someone who's never been gainfully employed.

She has "anger problems". So when she got a job and her boss told her what to do it made her mad. She never lasted more than a week or two before getting fired or "something happening" so she would quit.

After a few years of this, she found out she could get disability. That was about 15 years ago. Now her daughter is doing the exact same thing.

[louslobbs]

30. That's very sad, but you did not answer my question. In the scenario I presented, is that person a

"lazy, on the dole, sucking on the government teet, needs to pull themselves up by their bootstraps, doesn't want to work for theirs, government blood suckers? I understand about people who have the problems that you relate about one of your relatives, but I'd appreciate an answer to the question I presented you with. Please don't answer again, with a story about people who don't fit the scenario I presented, I know that they exist, I feel for them, but that is not what I was asking. Thanks,
Lou

[drpepper67]

32. Sure.

If you've paid in for 30 years you deserve to use what you've earned and paid for.

Even if you haven't worked very long and something happens to you and you become disabled, there is nothing wrong with using the system put in place as insurance for everyone.

Now what do you think of people like my relatives who play the system?

[louslobbs]

33. I don't know enough about them other than what you have alleged. Does the family suffer from mental

illness, are their alleged disabilities being faked or are they documented by a physician, are your relatives "playing the system" (based on here say), or do you know for a fact that this true?

If in fact, your relatives are physically and mentally sound (according to a physician), and they just never wanted to work, I'd say they could be playing "the system," and that would be unfair, shameful and could be illegal (like taking workers comp for years and then that person is caught on tape faking the injury), but if they suffer from any form of mental illness or physical disability that prohibits them from working and being able to function around people out in society, where their "anger issues" might pose a danger to others, then I would leave that decision up to the professionals, to doctors, and to those whos job it is to determine whether or not someone is entitled to disability benefits under the rules and laws that apply.

I don't appreciate anyone committing fraud or stealing from the system anymore than anyone else does who respects the rule of law and just plain old doing what is right.

Thank you for your answer, I really appreciated your response.
Lou

[Shandris]

24. Ooh. I like a challenge.

1. You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity, by legislating the wealth out of prosperity.

Tax Policy is hardly an equation-like legislation. In fact, little legislation involves a 'balancing' act. However, one can examine all portions of a policy of legislation. Inherent in this one are a couple of salient points. First, 'prosperity' is not a defined term. Nor is 'poor' or 'wealth'. So instead we must view what the point is MEANT to be talking about: tax policy, which is contribution of income to the national government. If 'prosperity', then, is to be attained by the sum of the contributions, it is inherent that those with more wealth must contribute proportionately more. In other words, this point is not only NOT CORRECT...it is not correct from either direction of viewing. It is better reworded as 'You cannot create a policy that provides prosperity by expecting more contribution from the poor than from the wealthy'. Once properly reworded, we find the statement correct and the proper policy initiative is to increase the number -- and scale -- of tax brackets.

2. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving.

This statement is false for a couple of reasons, not the least of which is that neither party is actually 'receiving' anything. Given that barter long ago passed away as a system of national economy, the only thing of 'value' is the interpretive 'value' of each person's contribution to society, moderated by the amount of others with this same skill, minus the contributions that make the continued flow of this stable currency possible. Since the one who is contributing is beholden of skills with substantial 'value', it is only correct to note that the flow of some largesse must be made to those deprived of the opportunity to attain these same skills by virtue of providence and property. However, this flow of largesse is neither total nor complete, thus proving this statement to be false in it's entirety.

3. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else.

This is an application of a fundamental rhetorical principle known as 'weasel words'; the use of improper, but similar, wording meant to encourage an emotionally-charged response. Specifically, the word is 'taken'. Since the government does not 'take' from an individual, but is contributed towards by the individual and his tacit agreement of government through citizenship, it follows that the proper sentence is 'The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first recieve from somebody else'. While this is true...it also axiomatic and has no practical value as a point of contention.

4.. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.

This is demonstrably false. If one individual has every last piece of currency, there is no way for the currency to grow. If that currency is split among many, and the fundamental accrual of interest applied, then the amount of money begins to grow. Not only is this statement incorrect, it is diametrically opposed to the truth. One cannot multiply money by hoarding it; wealth can ONLY be multiplied by dividing it.

5. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work, because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that is the beginning of the end of any nation.

This is another statement that sounds good in principle to an uneducated mind, but falls apart upon any casual examination. Excluding the fact that it completely ignores those who can NOT work by dint of disability, age, or lack of employment need, it relies on the fundamental assumption that this mythical upper 'half' feel that it does no good to work. However, if a single one of these individuals were to examine the amount of monetary flow through the government to each of those in the mythical lower 'half' who 'do nothing', they would see that the majority of money remains with them. In other words, if they are deprived of all reason to work, and the others are given everything, then there should be a net gain/loss of none, also known as 'Zero Sum Distribution'. However, since the amount of monetary wealth concentrated in the upper 'half' remains exponentially higher than that in the lower 'half', this statement is demonstrably false.

Tell your conservative friend that if this is the height of his beliefs...he needs to find a new peddler of ideas.

[louslobbs]

26. Excellent post Shandris.

Lou

[Angry Dragon]

34. Tell him to not come knocking on your door when things get really bad

you would not want him to get something for nothing