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The Northerner (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:21 PM Original message |
U.S. Constitution debt option "not available" |
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villager (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:23 PM Response to Original message |
1. confrontation with the far-right "not available?" |
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Renew Deal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:26 PM Response to Reply #1 |
35. Can you please give me your legal reasoning for your constitutional solution? |
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villager (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:54 PM Response to Reply #35 |
40. "How Obama Could Go it Alone" -- link below. I'm interested in their reasoning for "why not?" |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:24 PM Response to Original message |
2. Translation: "we'd rather withhold SS checks". n/t |
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gateley (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:39 PM Response to Reply #2 |
10. Yes, that's exactly what Obama gleefully wants to do. |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:41 PM Response to Reply #10 |
11. Hate old people? Not all of 'em. He thinks Alan Simpson is okay. n/t |
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gateley (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:46 PM Response to Reply #11 |
18. I am vehemently opposed to your stance on this, but I have |
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Renew Deal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:27 PM Response to Reply #2 |
36. That's as dumb as it gets. |
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Cleita (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:25 PM Response to Original message |
3. Really? President Bill Clinton seems to think otherwise. |
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gateley (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:38 PM Response to Reply #3 |
9. But we can't use Clinton as our definitive final authority. He's a former |
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Cleita (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:50 PM Response to Reply #9 |
21. Maybe we should write Keith Olbermann and ask him |
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gateley (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 03:08 PM Response to Reply #21 |
41. I actually found a link to a vid of Turley on with KO -- here's |
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DURHAM D (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:57 PM Response to Reply #9 |
31. Clinton taught constitutional law for three years. |
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gateley (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 03:22 PM Response to Reply #31 |
42. Obama taught constitutional law for twelve years, but I wouldn't |
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DURHAM D (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 03:48 PM Response to Reply #42 |
43. No. |
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DURHAM D (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:44 PM Response to Reply #3 |
15. I think the problem is Obama's own history on the debt ceiling. |
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Cleita (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:51 PM Response to Reply #15 |
22. Always calculating his losses isn't he? |
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Renew Deal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:28 PM Response to Reply #3 |
37. And Obama's Harvard Law professor disagrees (Larry Tribe) |
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Romulox (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:25 PM Response to Original message |
4. It's a dumb argument, guys. The 14th Amendment does not transfer the power of the purse to the Prez |
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DJ13 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:31 PM Response to Reply #4 |
6. The money was already authorized by Congress in the budget |
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Romulox (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:33 PM Response to Reply #6 |
7. But the argument is that the 14th Amendment gives the Prez. special power vis a vis debt |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:45 PM Response to Reply #7 |
17. No, it acknowledges that congress does not have the authority to strategically default. n/t |
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Romulox (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:49 PM Response to Reply #17 |
20. Absolutely it does. nt |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:51 PM Response to Reply #20 |
23. Is there an exception in the 14th amendment that I missed? An asterisk? |
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Romulox (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:54 PM Response to Reply #23 |
27. No, you're just skipping about five logical steps. |
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Shrek (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:54 PM Response to Reply #23 |
28. Who is "questioning" the validity of existing debt? |
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former9thward (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:54 PM Response to Reply #23 |
29. Obligations and debt are very different. |
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Renew Deal (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:30 PM Response to Reply #23 |
38. Here's some legal reasoning |
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Shrek (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:34 PM Response to Reply #6 |
8. Then he could just as easily raise taxes, right? |
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DJ13 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:06 PM Response to Reply #8 |
33. No, he is merely authorized to meet obligations passed by Congress |
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Shrek (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:25 PM Response to Reply #33 |
34. Why is it that only debt can be used to meet those obligations? |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:44 PM Response to Reply #4 |
14. The purse is the budget. |
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Romulox (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:47 PM Response to Reply #14 |
19. The President doesn't have the power to "decide whether to honor the budget" |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:53 PM Response to Reply #19 |
26. In event of a default, and in the absence of an executive order to the treasury to issue debt, |
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Romulox (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:57 PM Response to Reply #26 |
30. Arguably, the 14th Amendment would control the President's priorities, |
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Shrek (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:34 PM Response to Reply #30 |
39. +1 |
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Poll_Blind (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:25 PM Response to Original message |
5. Good. I know some people do think this is the easy way out or at least... |
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girl gone mad (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:44 PM Response to Reply #5 |
13. We don't need creditors, actually. |
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kenny blankenship (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:42 PM Response to Original message |
12. Way to box yourself in, idiot. |
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dmallind (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:44 PM Response to Original message |
16. The confuaion here is because people assume "default" = not paying current debt |
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Romulox (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:51 PM Response to Reply #16 |
25. Precisely. Some are purposefully conflating *new borrowing* with existing debt, as well. |
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dawg (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 01:51 PM Response to Original message |
24. Carney may be right. |
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Buns_of_Fire (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 02:03 PM Response to Original message |
32. I've read that he can't use it BEFORE the 2nd, but he COULD use it in an emergency... |
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Proles (229 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue Jul-26-11 04:24 PM Response to Original message |
44. I wish President Obama |
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