Would you keep a known sex offender on the job once you found out

[Aerows]

I'm curious what people think on this subject.

To be clear, his girlfriend caught him attempting to have sex with her 13-year-old daughter.

He grabbed my breast on the back porch of my own home on Christmas while I was alone and smoking a cigarette. I'm not sure how far that constitutes sexual assault, but I wasn't happy about it, and he physically overpowered me for a few seconds to do it. I'm also a lesbian, and he has known it for as long as he worked there.

[William769]

1. Other.

Depends on what the job was & what the sex crime was.

[Aerows]

2. 13 year old girl

I guess I should have put that in the criteria. It's a literal situation I have now.

I originally posted it as sex, but personally, I don't believe a 13 year old can consent, so it's rape.

[William769]

7. Contact with kids, no.

Other than that yes.

[JI7]

10. how old is or was he when this happened ?

[Scuba]

11. How old was the offender? 14? 40?

[Aerows]

13. 42 at the time

[Tom Rinaldo]

15. Maybe

It's a tough situation you face, but the bottom line is he the legal system has released him and now he needs to have a way to survive in the world - it makes sense to me that he sought employment, I can't fault him for that. Now he is your employee. Has he been a good employee? Does his job involve much unsuipervised contact with the public? Are juveniles often present? Are interactions with customers short and limitied or does the job naturally provide opportunities to "hang" with customers much? Can you discuss this matter openly with him?

If he is a good employee without much contact with juvenile girls and/or you can keep an eye on him and he is open to you about the situation he is in - I probably would keep him but make it clear that you have a zero tolerance policy with him trying to socialize with adolescent girls.

[customerserviceguy]

38. Juvenile girls?

What about a sex offender who raped boys?

[Tom Rinaldo]

55. Stupid mind blip, old program surfacing... Same thing of course.

And I failed to say before that I know there is no consent between a 14 year old and an adult, we are talking about rape regardless and it must be dealt with as such - but a variable that would somewhat matter to me in my decision making would be whether the youth involved thought they were consenting to that sex or whether overt force and intimidation etc was involved in that rape.

[customerserviceguy]

60. Explanation accepted

Yes, it is tempting to think of rape in only the old-fashioned sense, when it is happening to both genders of people. In any case, someone that damned old having sex with a 14 year old has to be treated as a rapist, it's not like the high school senior getting horny over the high school freshman here.

[Tom Rinaldo]

58. Just read the latest clarification. He absolutely has to go n/t

[demwing]

29. Knowning that would have made a big difference in my answer

kind of a critical "oops"...

[Aerows]

31. Sorry about that.

I should have been more clear. It's just such an awful situation, I had to talk about it.

[demwing]

66. Hey don't sweat it, I sounded like a turkey, lol I should be the one with an apology.

In fact, I am sorry! You did nothing wrong at all, and I hope this issue resolves wih little additional drama.

[onehandle]

3. You changed the post...

So my silly joke is no longer appropriate.

[Curmudgeoness]

4. My answer is not there. I might keep them depending on the offense

since a 19 year old dating a 17 year old can end up being classified as a "sex offender". I hate the designation with such a broad definition of sex offender, and in my mind, it has lost meaning.

[HillbillyBob]

21. I knew a guy that got caught takin a pee along a lonely highway

he was listed as a sex offender.. something like that I could overlook. Children/rape no.

[Curmudgeoness]

24. They have watered down the sex offender label

with bullshit like this.

[dkf]

5. Some of those sex offenses are ridiculous.

Sending pics of yourself and getting charged for child porn is Crazy. On the other hand, luring 14 year olds is sick.

[JI7]

6. depends on the job

[HereSince1628]

8. Other: NO, I haven't power to remove her from my team in the prison laundry

[Jackpine Radical]

9. Depends on the job. I wouldn't hire a child molester for a job

that placed him in close proximity to kids of his "age of choice," I wouldn't hire a rapist to work somewhere that involves being alone with potential victims, etc.

Consider--very few sex offenders recidivate. Among the ones who do, it is often because they are placed under extreme stress due to factors such as an inability to find housing and work. To deny people decent lives is to increase the probability of their reoffending.

[Terry in Austin]

12. You callin' me a member of the owner class, Bub?

The hiring and firing would be their call, and three guesses how they'd call it!

[FLPanhandle]

14. No.

Assuming by sex offender someone who committed rape or anything with a child.

No chance.

[B-Stupid]

16. No.....

There are certain crimes that are simply unforgivable and sex crimes are on the top of that list...

[jmowreader]

17. I'm going with the "case by case basis" thing

We actually have a "registered sex offender" on the company payroll--one of the "18-year-old boyfriend sleeping with 17-year-old girlfriend" cases we all talk about here. He's a good kid. If I had my own company I'd try stealing him. (The really rich guy who owns my company is big on hiring ex-cons; our mailroom is full of them. When I got hired, I was taken to the place where the gathering machine is located and told, 'don't be alarmed, but of all the people who work in this department only four of them don't have felony records.' They generally last a year or two before someone else hires them.)

The sex with little kids people I wouldn't hire in the first place, and they're pretty easy to find out about--every state's sex offender registry is online.

[LeftyMom]

18. Gone. Now. Do not wait.

1. He raped a kid, which means he's a horrible person. Why would you want a horrible person with no morals or self-control working for you?

2. GIANT LIABILITY RISK. You know he's a sex-offender. A child rapist no less. Anything happens while he's working for you, or to somebody he meets via the job you gave him (say if he makes a friend and they have a kid, or something) you're going to get sued into oblivion.

3. Your customers know how to google too. If you don't drop him they'll drop you.

[demwing]

22. The poll didn't specify "child rapist"

just the opposite, as it gave one option as asked, and another IF it were involving a child.

[demwing]

27. My bad, just saw post #2 - says later 14 years old. Kind of a critical bit to leave out...

[HereSince1628]

25. I didn't know that all sex offenses are only against kids...

I think the details may vary by jurisdiction but I thought the core issue was violent sexual crime.

[LeftyMom]

30. Read the thread. She clarified.

The victim was 13. He was 42.

[Aerows]

37. Number 2 seals it

My family is firing him tomorrow because he is too much of a liability. I just wanted other people's views on it.

He grabbed my breast on the back porch of my own home on Christmas while I was alone and smoking a cigarette. I'm not sure how far that constitutes sexual assault, but I wasn't happy about it, and he physically overpowered me for a few seconds to do it.

[LeftyMom]

40. I'm amazed you didn't let him go then.

If somebody at my family's business grabbed me on Christmas, they'd have been applying for unemployment before the New Year.

[FLPanhandle]

47. I'm amazed she didn't call the police right then.

And the guy was back in jail before New Years.

[Aerows]

65. I should have

But I was shocked, and no one saw it. It would have been he said she said.

Trust me, it frightened me, too.

[demwing]

19. "Other"

Maybe, depending on what the person is employed to do.

Interact with the public? Sure, on the phone. Maybe, in person. Nope, if it involves children.

Sit at a desk, lonely little cube rat, crunching numbers or code all day? Yeah, why not?

[seabeyond]

20. child careworker.... ? no/ if i hired someone and was happy with them, and later found out? ya

i would keep them, in aware.

[Aerows]

45. I was the woman who he grabbed on the back porch on Christmas Day

So not only do I have substantiated evidence of grabbing women against their will and a conviction, I have him linking himself to our business.

I'm horrified. I was grabbed against my will once, but a 13 year old was raped by this guy and I'm worrying about whether or not people will continue to do business with us since this guy works here.

[seabeyond]

52. wow.. i didnt read your OP right at all. i am tired, guess that is it. all i got is "would you

keep an employee if....

and i didnt read any of the stuff in the post.

i am going to have to think about this. i thought it was, he paid his dues. would you keep him on. he has to eat and pay bills, too. if i found ANYTHING that suggested the person wasnt staying clean, then i would fire him. if i thought he was working at putting life together, i would find a way to keep him out of public, but employed. if i had been the one molested when i was 13, he wouldnt be working for or with me. and really, if he is losing business, i would let him go. if everyone knows, and he goes into someones home, i wouldnt use him. further, if i knew this man would wait on me, or i would have to interact with him, i would use someone else.

really. this is a real hard one. and i am tired. sorry i misunderstood, and didnt answer poll right

[baldguy]

23. I worked with a convicted sex offender for several years.

While the employees generally did not know of his past, the management did.

I can honestly say he behaved to me & everyone else as a normal, considerate & conscientious individual. Hard worker, in a committed relationship. And he had spent 5 years in prison for molesting young boys.

What is relevant here is the manner in which his history came out to his coworkers.

I was out of town on a business trip the day on Monday, and when I got in the office on Tuesday the boss started the day with a mass-meeting. "If anyone from the police or the media call and ask anything about Bob, say you don't know anything, and the company has no comment." At that point I looked around and noticed - no Bob. I raised my hand and asked the obvious question: "What happened to Bob?" The answer was that he was murdered that Sunday night.

He had a second job at night delivering pizzas, and he was out on a delivery to an apartment that turned out to be empty - and never returned. He was found in in the morning in his car with a bullet hole in his head and $150 in his pocket. The cops' first suspect was his partner/boyfriend (for no other reason than he was gay, apparently) but with no evidence they let him go, and to this day the murder is unsolved.

edit to add:

The thing is, we say we expect the people we send to prison - not just sex offenders, but everybody - to do their time, get "rehabilitated" (whatever that means) and obey the law once they get out. BUT - - if they aren't allowed to work, if they can't work with you, if they can't live near you, if they can't to join your church, and if they aren't allowed to participate in the community around them at any level - how the hell are they supposed to do that?.

If you don't think criminals - and sex offenders especially - can be truly rehabilitated, then why even put them in prison at all? In all fairness you should be advocating their execution.

[customerserviceguy]

39. Your last sentence works fine with me

when it comes to those who violate children.

[baldguy]

46. The govt of a free country shouldn't be able to choose to kill it's citizens.

And the guy I worked with didn't deserve to die alone in the cold with a hole in his head, no matter what he had done in the past.

[customerserviceguy]

51. I have no idea whatthe guy you worked with did

But I guess you and I part company when it comes to the death penalty.

[seabeyond]

54. this is where i have the issue, too.

The thing is, we say we expect the people we send to prison - not just sex offenders, but everybody - to do their time, get "rehabilitated" (whatever that means) and obey the law once they get out. BUT - - if they aren't allowed to work, if they can't work with you, if they can't live near you, if they can't to join your church, and if they aren't allowed to participate in the community around them at any level - how the hell are they supposed to do that?.

[Sheepshank]

26. 42 yo raping a 14 yo?

nope could not retain such a person. As said before, some things are not forgivable...and plenty of hard working people looking for jobs. Even if the company and job does not directly give this guy access to possible victims, his paycheck can continue to support a lifestyle that (again as mentioned) has high recidivism rate.

I don't know what the solution is for someone who needs to work, and has a sex offenders record...I just know that I could not work with them. If it were not within my ability to fire them, I would probably quit as soon as possible. I could not work with bile in my mouth te entire day.

[Aerows]

28. Clarification

He grabbed the breast of a woman on Christmas Day in her own home, with NO provocation. No kissing, just a hug "goodbye" for Merry Christmas, and this woman's body was grabbed.

That's on top of the sex offender revelation that at 42 he attempted intercourse with his girlfriend's 13 year old daughter.

[Dappleganger]

32. Then the answer would be no.

[demwing]

33. Cut him loose /nt

[Aerows]

41. That woman was me, and I've got to do so. N/T

[uppityperson]

34. It depends on the job. The job I'd have is working with public in healthcare, and with people

that could be easily harmed, so no. I wouldn't. I can see jobs where you could be employed though. And under supervision.

[ScreamingMeemie]

43. I am confused. He just now got in trouble for touching the breast of

a woman on Christmas day? Or is that what the sex offense was, with the added story that he attempted intercourse with the 13 year old but was never charged?

[glen123098]

35. It depends on the job and the type of sexual offense.

If it was a job that involved contact with children than hell no. If it was a manual labor job, then I would keep him. Everyone has a right to be employed. He already did his time, now its time for him to be productive citizen.

[Lex]

36. "Sex offender" is not always "Child Molester"

Various things can get you that label officially. None of them are great, but not everyone who is a sex offender is after children.

[ScreamingMeemie]

44. If you read the thread, she clarified. It was, indeed, a 13 year old

child.

[Lex]

57. But generally people use the term to mean child molester.

Just as she did in her OP, later to have to clarify.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

42. Please tell me how the breast-grabbing didn't send him back to prison. -nt

[Aerows]

48. I didn't want to report it :(

I guess I was too shamed about the whole incident. My father's first words were, "Why didn't you knock the shit out of him?"

I can't explain why I didn't, because it wasn't even a sexual situation where I could say no. I was some sort of domination situation.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

50. You're in danger.

He now knows you can be intimidated by his alpha-male-ness. He WILL attack you again. You HAVE to do something. Maybe report him to the police, maybe set up a hidden camera to film the next crap he pulls, maybe both, maybe something else that hasn't occurred to me, but YOU. HAVE. TO. DO. SOMETHING.

[uppityperson]

56. If an employee grabbed my breast, even without a previous history, he would be fired and

reported to the police. I well understand the shame you felt, even if it were him doing the shameful thing. I hope you are able to report this, or contact his parole person if there is such a thing. Sounds like he needs watching and simply letting him go isn't enough. So sorry you had to go through this. It sucks. And yes, been there, getting grabbed and feeling so ashamed.

[Aerows]

64. It was confusing

and embarrassing. I *still* don't get it. If I have to do network maintenance for the family, I have to do it on the weekends because I don't want to deal with him.

*sigh*.

[Odin2005]

49. If I had to work with a rapist monster he would likely be dead by the end of the shift.

[Penguin31]

53. In the circumstances presented, No.

Based on the circumstances described, I can't imagine keeping the guy in question on the job would be a good thing.

That said, keep in mind that the thread title is slightly loaded and that not all situations are the same.

[lumberjack_jeff]

59. I worked with a registered sex offender.

After discharging from the Navy, he was arrested for agreeing to meet "a teenage girl" he met in a chatroom.

He said later that he could tell from conversation that "she" wasn't really a teenage girl, but curiosity got the better of him.

So, I guess I'm saying that "sex offender" is not one thing.

But grabbing you is unacceptable. Send him packing.

[laconicsax]

61. Contact an employment law attorney.

I'd say fire him, but doing so may have legal consequences depending on the circumstances. Firing someone for a felony committed prior to employmen may invite a wrongful termination lawsuit depending on the statues of your state.

Play it safe, contact an employment law attorney.

[riderinthestorm]

62. Not in my business. My biz is filled with children and trust plays a crucial role

there's no way we could get away with it no matter how sympathetic I may be.

This biz is my whole life. We live here. I have a 14 yr old daughter but beyond that, our business involves many young people here on a daily basis. So no way.

Its funny but just the other day for the first time I googled the sex offenders in our area. We're rural so there were only 4 in a 5 mile radius. 3/4 were true predators like the OP. But one was a 19yr old boy who had sex with a 16 yr old girl. Sex offender for life and imho, probably guilty of no worse than a crush on a girl who he didn't recognize as underage.

Could I hire that guy? No way, even knowing the details. I just can't jeopardize my biz. Sorry. Unfair? Hell yes but as long as the sex offender registry exists, they're SOL.

[Aerows]

63. Based upon his behavior toward me

He's got to go. I refuse to do maintenance on the network there anymore until my family gets rid of him.

Thankfully, my family finally understands that he doesn't need to work there anymore if they want me to do any work there.

It's rather embarrassing, to be honest. I never even dreamed such a thing would happen to me in my own home, on Christmas Day.