GOP hopeful Herman Cain admits he refused pizza to black neighborhood

[Amerigo Vespucci]

GOP hopeful Herman Cain admits he refused pizza to black neighborhood



http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/06/13/gop-hopeful-herman-cain-admits-he-refused-pizza-to-black-neighborhood/

In a startling admission recently, Republican presidential hopeful Herman Cain, the former CEO of Godfather's Pizza, said that he would apply his experience in business to a potential job in the White House: specifically, his experience in denying pizza deliveries to a black neighborhood in Omaha, Nebraska.

Cain, who is himself black, said that because the neighborhood was violent he refused to send delivery drivers there, and that he'd apply the same logic to his foreign policy decisions.

“When I first became president of Godfather’s Pizza, there was a very dangerous part of town in the black community where I wouldn’t allow my restaurants to deliver because we had kids beat, robbed,” he reportedly said.

"And I said ‘if I won’t send my son over there, I’m not going to send someone else’s son or daughter over there.’ Last week in Omaha, Nebraska, that same neighborhood that I wouldn’t deliver in — that they are delivering in now — a Pizza Hut driver was killed."

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

1. O.K., can we NOW officially call him an Uncle Tom??!?!?! n/t

[pipi_k]

3. No.

He didn't deny pizza to the neighborhood because it was black.



He denied delivery to the neighborhood because it was violent. And just happens to be black at the same time.


I don't give a shit what color someone is. Refusing to send one's employees to an area known for violence is the sane thing to do.


You don't get points for "proving" how unracist you are by knowingly putting others' lives in danger.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

7. See my post, #6 and then let's talk n/t

[pipi_k]

37. Whatever he has said in the past...

doesn't make THIS situation racist.

I don't care if he's talked smack about every single ethnic group out there. You just do not send people into dangerous situations. Period.

Be offended if you want to over things he's said. It's your right.

But I don't think you have the right to judge someone for not wanting to put his own life, or the lives of others, in danger when he knows damned well what could happen.

[Broderick]

78. I make cashiers lock the door and use a window

after dark. Probably way overboard, but I can't live with someone getting hurt in a dangerous situation as a business owner. If something were to happen, I would take it so personal because people working for me are like my family. Sure, it hurts profits, but I sleep at night.

[bluestate10]

53. In this limited instance, I agree with you. If the neighborhood had

a pattern of robberies and beatings of people that potentially had cash on them, sending a delivery person into the neighborhood was not the right thing to do. In this limited instance, Cain was right.

Cain mostly sounds like a bozo, but if we are going to challenge his sanity, make that challenge on stronger ground.

[CreekDog]

64. It is solid ground, can you not see that he used the word "black" to describe the neighborhood?

why say it's a black neighborhood?

but i don't get the very vigorous defenses of people who say racial things, the strong fight against those people being called out for those same racial comments.

as if it is actually wrong to suggest a racial comment is suggestive of stereotyping, or used to curry favor with those who believe in stereotypes.

just seems silly to go to DU and say, no, no, no, when he said he didn't deliver to a black neighborhood, he wasn't being racist, though he said it was black, he actually meant...

:eyes:

[pipi_k]

70. What I find incredible....

The numbers of people who think they know exactly what someone else "meant" when that person said something.

No benefit of the doubt. No, "Geez...I wonder what he meant by that remark"...

Nothing but prejudgement. And condemnation.

Really...is that how people conduct their personal lives, too? Assume they "know" what someone else was thinking, or what the person meant?

sad.

[CreekDog]

75. your standard for finding a term unacceptably racial is, "I'm using the word black to offend people"

that would be an example of something you would find objectionable.

short of that, awww, you just are at a loss to find anything wrong.

so he said that he didn't deliver pizza to one black neighborhood (and used the word "black"), it's not like after saying that, he said, "and i didn't deliver it there because they were black".

if that's what you need to even criticize...will you ever be able to see racial stereotyping short of a hood and burning cross?

[pipi_k]

79. Sorry...none of that made sense to me...

so I can't respond.

[CreekDog]

85. can't explain it to you, because apparently to you, racial problems are limited to cross burnings

and kkk rallies.

give up. :eyes:

[pipi_k]

91. OK....so if person A can't explain something so person B

can understand the point, it must be person B's fault.


Well, the only thing I can say is that the point must not be all that important if it doesn't deserve clarification.

[immoderate]

127. You go, girl!

I am at least understanding your side of this conversation. I might throw in for possible clarification, that I think that Cain can use the word black to describe the neighborhood, because he is black. In his mind, the opposite of favoritism. :hide:

I don't endorse Cain more than any other Republican... My money's on Sarah! :loveya:

Edit: No offense meant with the "girl." :hi:

--imm

[CreekDog]

63. then why was it relevant to say the neighborhood was black?

i think you're apologizing for him.

if he meant to say it was a violent neighborhood, then he didn't need to say what racial community it was.

he said it. you have to ignore what he said to take your position.

[pipi_k]

65. It wasn't relevant

and I don't know why he said it, and neither do you...but that doesn't mean the decision itself is "racist".

[CreekDog]

69. you are talking about whether it's relevant to you and you can't figure out why he said it

it's not about YOU.

it was his word, his word choice and it was relevant to the point he was making.

stop apologizing for him and trying to explain it away. he said it, he owns it.

willful denial on your part suggests a refusal to consider racial comments at face value.

[pipi_k]

71. I never said it wasn't relevant TO ME

I agreed with you that the use of the adjective "black" was probably NOT relevant to the point he was trying to make.

You get that, right? I agreed with you on that.

What I said is that I don't have a mainline into his brain. And neither do you. I don't know WHY he said it. Neither do you, for that matter.

Unless you have some insider information on his innermost thoughts and feelings the rest of us peasants don't...

:shrug:

[CreekDog]

77. then you are claiming to read his mind, because you've decided that his point was not racial

you claim to not know why he used the word "black" but you have automatically excluded any racial intention.

you're playing twister.

:eyes:

[pipi_k]

87. I'm not assuming anything, actually

I'm saying that there could be things in his mind none of us knows about but that I'm not going to sit here and call him a "racist" over something I don't even know for sure.

Seems to be quite the fashion here to call people "racists" over perceived slurs.

He's a black man who said a particular black neighborhood was too dangerous for him to send his employees into.

Are you claiming that he really wants to be white? Because he feels that being black is inherently bad? That being black makes HIM inferior to whites?

Is that the message people are trying to hawk here?

[CreekDog]

88. You're giving me a harder time for criticizing his statement than you are him for saying it!

and you think you're not biased?

:banghead:

[pipi_k]

96. You bet...

Because I don't think it's right to sit and call someone else a racist when there may have been a perfectly benign reason behind his use of the word "black" to describe a particular bad neighborhood.


So if I say I don't like going into a bad WHITE neighborhood, that would make me a racist too?

[cali]

84. No. it's fucking not alright.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

102. Well, it's a free country, so I'm going to anyway because that's what he is!

[pipi_k]

105. Even though it equates with

calling him a "House ni**er"?

Really?

Because that's what an Uncle Tom is.

A servile black man.


Back in the days of slavery only the most docile black men got to work in the house. And they were indeed called "House ni**ers".

How ironic to refer to a black man that way while accusing that same black man of being a "racist".

[WatsonT]

110. What an asshole, valuing his employees lives over making more money

Let's be honest: had he sent kids in to that neighborhood and let them be attacked and killed people on here would call him an evil capitalist out to kill workers for a few extra bucks.

[democrat_patriot]

2. Why is it wrong to not deliver in a violent area?

If my kid worked for his pizza chain, I'd commend his action not to put my kid in danger.

Black neighborhood - Uncle Tom?
Hispanic/white neighborhood - racist?

Very dangerous neighborhood where pizza delivery people are targeted, robbed, beaten and killed? - ???

[pipi_k]

4. OK, you know what it is?

If it's a black Democrat who refuses to do that, it's perfectly fine.

If it's a black Republican who refuses to do it, it's "racism".


Hypocrisy. Pure and simple...

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

8. UH, WRONG!! It is equally racist and equally shameful!

I saw a lot of racism during the Democratic primaries, so don't come at me with that bullshit!

[pipi_k]

38. Oh really?

So you would have absolutely no problem whatsoever with sending your own child, for example, into an area known for being violent.

None whatsoever.

Drug dealers. Prostitutes. Pimps. Drive-by shootings. Rapes, maybe. Assaults. Murders.

La la la kids...lets all take a nice little stroll through this area because the happy little bluebirds and rainbows will protect us....

Yeah. OK.

Tell ya what. Pick out the very worst area of the worst city you can and send a young friend or relative out to walk through it. When they say they don't want to, or they're afraid, call them "racists" and push them out of the car and speed away. It'll be a great learning experience for them...

:eyes:

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

48. Actually, I would not send my kid to a violent neighborhood.

But that is NOT the point. Not all black neighborhoods are violent. THAT is the point. The fact that he injected race into this discussion is what did it for me.

You are acting willfully ignorant. You know exactly what I'm talking about.

[pipi_k]

51. And Cain never said all black neighborhoods are violent, either...

He mentioned ONE black neighborhood in Omaha, Nebraska.

Not every single black neighborhood in the country.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

52. Willful ignorance again. What he did was imply that since the neighborhood is black,

it MUST be violent. You don't have to be Einstein to understand what he's doing here.

Again, your ignorance is dumbfounding. Time to put you on ignore...

[bluestate10]

56. Put me on ignore while you are at it.

Cain should have used different phrasing, but his point about not sending drivers into a dangerous area is a justified position. Pipi was only making that point. Was Cain wrong to put black into his description? Yes, absolutely. Was Cain wrong to deny deliveries to that neighborhood? Absolutely not.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

60. I didn't disagree with the latter point. I take issue with injecting race.

Off you go to ignore!

[pipi_k]

58. Sorry, dear...

What it implies to YOU isn't what it implies to me.

But then, I don't need to go looking around every corner for proof that people I don't like are "racists".

I don't have anything to prove. I don't need to make myself feel better by exhibiting misplaced outrage over things I don't feel are racist. You know why? Because I don't think blacks are too stupid to figure it out for themselves.

They have brains.

There is nowhere in his statements where I see outright...or even a hint...that he thinks that neighborhood is violent BECAUSE it's black.

As for "ignore"...great. Go for it. If the standard for that is that someone disagree with you, then life is going to be very lonely.

[CreekDog]

90. well you won't let us have our opinions

you just want to make sure none of us complain about statements that appear to be inappropriate.

yeah, sounds fair. :eyes:

[pipi_k]

98. OOOOoooohhhhh the POWER I have!!!!!

hahahahahahahaha!!!!!

How can I stop people from having opinions?

Really. I don't give a rat's ass what someone else's opinion is. And I don't even care if people complain about things they find inappropriate.


But I'm not going to sit and say nothing when I see people throwing nasty names like "racist" at others when they might not even deserve it. And it didn't hit me till just a few minutes ago, that the epithet in reply #1..."Uncle Tom"...is just about as offensive as the word "Ni**er".

Now there's irony for ya.

A black guy talks about a bad black neighborhood, and what's the first reply?

Someone jumps in to call the guy an "Uncle Tom"... a servile black man...basically, a "House ni**er"

nice.

:eyes:

[KingFlorez]

27. Where is this black Democrat that did this?

Until one actually does it, your point is moot.

[pipi_k]

No, actually my point isn't moot

because there's enough hypocrisy alive out in the world to make my claim possible.

I've been around the block enough times to have seen it.

When people we dislike do it = bad

When people we like do it = good (or, acceptable at the very least)


I've seen it.

[KingFlorez]

40. What makes you think there would be a double standard on this?

It's pretty cut and dried as being wrong. You have no reason to say that there would be a double standard.

[pipi_k]

47. Because...

I. have. seen. it.

I didn't just jump off the turnip truck.


Double standards exist. In the world in general. And yes...even here.


I have seen groups of people allow things for people they like while attacking people they don't like for the same exact things.

[Yupster]

95. That's actually the biggest lsson I've learned from my many years

here at DU.

The most important lesson of politics is...

It depends on whose ox is being gored.

[TaupeDem]

109. Sadly one of our own did say something like this :(

"I hate to admit it, but I have reached a stage in my life that if I am walking down a dark street late at night and I see that the person behind me is white, I subconsciously feel relieved." -- Reverend Jesse Jackson

[KingFlorez]

122. Context is everything

Cain didn't say "I hate to admit it", his point was to pander to a very racist political grouping.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

6. Taken together with other comments, including his racist public announcement

sent to blacks was VERY offensive! It offended me as a black woman, and it should offend everyone!

He has also made comments about not hiring Muslims.

He *IS* an Uncle Tom and a bigot!

You take a look at this and tell me differently:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daISg1Hc0ps

[Name removed]

57. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[City Lights]

5. Is he attempting to say that he'll only send our military to places that are safe?

I'm not sure what he's trying to say when he claims he'll "apply the same logic to his foreign policy decisions." How often are foreign policy decisions necessary in non-violent places? And what is he going to do when one arises in a "violent" place...bow out?

[Brother Buzz]

16. That's my read, too

odd to say the least

[buddysmellgood]

20. I don't get it either. It makes no sense. It shows extremely poor

political judgement.

[snooper2]

24. I read from that if he thinks that it's justified enough to send his own son or daughter

versus a bullshit engagement that he wouldn't send his kids to..

Seems pretty cut and dry to me

"Cain added that if he were ever confronted with a major foreign policy decision, he'd think of it in the same manner, as if he were sending his own son or daughter."

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

28. He brought race into the discussion, which destroyed his argument.

The implication is that only black neighborhoods are dangerous. Why did he bring in race at all??!?!

[snooper2]

33. Yeah, yeah, we got that from you already...I didn't see that implication

but I wasn't looking for it either

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

36. If you don't see it without "looking for it," then I can't help you.

If you can't see why his comment is racist, or at the very least, serves to pander to the Republican base, then there's nothing else to discuss.

[snooper2]

39. mkay...

[Igel]

128. Not implied.

And it can only barely be inferred.

On edit:

After reading the interview in the Daily Caller, it sounds like he has a specific neighborhood in mind, just one not known to his interlocutor. So he gave information he had about it but probably not every bit of information he had--which strikes me as normal, from a conversation-discourse point of view. If you just edit his comments to say that there was one violent neighborhood, it lacks specificity. It becomes, somehow, a generic. Adding a detail--a name would have done it better, I think--makes it more vivid, more likely to be a real neighborhood as opposed to a mythical one.

What strikes me as odd is that he lives in Atlanta, was formerly CEO of Godfather's Pizza, and seems to have been involved at a low enough level to know which neighborhoods in which cities restaurants belonging to a nationwide chain would send drivers into.

Then again, it's not a random neighborhood. It's apparently a recurring news story in Omaha, judging from Google, and notorious enough to come to mind quickly and easily. I wonder if it's because it came up on the talk show that Wiki says he had in Atlanta.

If I wanted to drag race into it I could in a different way. He's black. His kids are black. That's part of the context, at least to the race-fixated. One would think that sending black kids into a black neighborhood would somehow be different from sending white kids into a rough black neighborhood or black kids into a rough white neighborhood.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

129. That's not the point. The point is that he injected race into this discussion

when it wasn't necessary. Many of us are arguing that he knew exactly what he was doing, and that is pandering to the base of the Republican Party which tends to be less tolerant of anyone who isn't just like them. That's the point.

[City Lights]

43. I wonder if he'd sacrifice his children for any of our current entanglements. nt

[Yupster]

97. Bring a lot of guns and other firepower

If his pizza delivery men and women traveled in tanks with heavy weapons, drones and airpower, maybe he would have sent them into that violent neighborhood.

If it was my kid going in unarmed, I'd appreciate him not sending him to violent places.

[Codeine]

9. The army isn't composed of pizza drivers.

That said, I don't disapprove of him refusing to service violent areas. Those kids shouldn't have to roll into a neighborhood where they could be killed over a deep-dish pie.

[Ian David]

10. When I worked for Cablevision of Boston, they had a rule...

... that when they sent technicians into Public Housing, it had to be before 12 PM.

The thinking was that all the troublemakers were either still asleep or still in school.

But at least they DID send technicians there.

[yawnmaster]

17. Don't see too many morning pizza deliveries, though. eom

[Ian David]

22. Very true. n/t

[pipi_k]

54. No kidding...having a rule like that...

is like a person living in NYC believing he can be safe from marauding African elephants by carrying around a talisman.

African elephants in NYC...improbable.

Pizza deliveries before people have gotten out of bed for the day...unlikely

[ecstatic]

11. The problem is--he brought race into it

Had he just said he wouldn't have them deliver to dangerous communities, that would have been perfectly fine. But no, to gain favor with racists, he made sure to include that it was a "black community." So yes, as someone else said upthread, the guy is an Uncle Tom, plain and simple.

[tkmorris]

12. Cain may be a jackass but I don't see a problem here.

A dangerous neighborhood is a dangerous neighborhood, and pizza delivery drivers are notorious targets for thieves. There are easily enough real issues to discredit this man, attempting to create controversy where none exists is not necessary.

[emilyg]

14. +1

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

19. Again, there was no reason to bring race in to this discussion. He did so

precisely to pander to the bigots in the Republican Party.

There are dangerous communities of ALL types. No one is suggesting that kids go into a dangerous or violent community. But the fact that he brought race into the discussion, as he has BEFORE, is bothersome. It is offensive. And yes, it is bigoted.

Why are DUers defending Herman Cain? Perhaps that should be the question here.

[buddysmellgood]

21. It makes me wonder if he'd be okay with sending drivers into a dangerous white neighborhood.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

23. He should not have injected race into this discussion at all. The fact that he did

says so much. He is so transparent.

[Vehl]

34. +1

He should have simply mentioned that it was a bad/violent neighborhood. He need not have brought race into this at all. The only reason for this seems to be his desire to earn some points with the Republican base.

[Skip Intro]

108. Another +1. nt

[Blasphemer]

13. So instead of usinging his influence to try to improve the quality of life in that area

He simply refused to do business there. Yes, that's a wonderful solution. I understand that delivery drivers are in a job that can put them at risk but there are many ways in which risk can be minimized. I wonder if he ever hired anyone who actually lived in this neighborhood?

[idiotgardener]

30. His responsibility is to his employees, not the neighborhood

What kind of ways to minimize risk to the drivers do you have in mind?

[JTFrog]

31. The problem with his argument is not about sending employees into violent neighborhoods.

It is the fact that he tries to equate black neighborhoods with violent neighborhoods. Do you not see a problem with his introducing race to that discussion?

[idiotgardener]

41. Do you have any suggestions on how to make the drivers safe?

I gather from this thread that he has shown some racism before. I'm not disputing that because I don't know enough about the guy to form an opinion.

But I don't think we can fault him for not wanting to send his drivers into danger. If anything, assuming his description of the neighborhood is accurate, he should be commended. I'm still curious as to what might make the drivers safer.

[JTFrog]

86. Do you have any suggestions as to why it was necessary to bring up race?

That's what I'm curious about.

[idiotgardener]

103. OK, I see we are not going to be in the same conversation.

Carry on.

[Blasphemer]

44. There is a fair bit of advice on the topic on the web

For instance: http://www.tipthepizzaguy.com/discussion/thread.php?num=14099&ip=1

Fundamentally, though, I have a problem with a businessman who has never held elective office and is running for President making such a statement to show how his approach to his business is evidence of the quality of his approach to governance when it is actually the opposite. I think business people can be community leaders (even... ahem... organizers) if they so choose and this is an example of a situation where I would imagine someone with political aspirations taking the lead on an issue that could both improve businesses, the communities that patronize them and improve business-community relations in the process. It's fine to want to protect one's employees but it also ignores a much bigger issue that people in positions of government need to be addressing.

[idiotgardener]

72. I agree on that, the example did not show what he wanted it to show.

What do you think of the list at your link? A lot are things I wouldn't have thought of. Some of them are kind of a pain though and I could see why it would be easier just to say "We don't deliver there." I know if I were a pizza driver I still wouldn't feel safe but that's just me.

[LanternWaste]

99. Actually, I think his responsibility is to the board.

Actually, I think his responsibility is to the board. Everything/anything is simply a spurious correlation, and self-validating bumper-sticker platitudes.

[WatsonT]

111. Also he did nothing to prevent 9/11 or the rwandan genocide

I mean, as the CEO of a pizza joint clearly fixing all the worlds ills are within his power, so why didn't he?

With the Rwandan genocide racism is the obvious answer. But for the WTC attacks it's more intricate than that .. .

[sixmile]

15. No wars in unfriendly countries. Check.

Now that's a foreign policy that's sure to save lives. It's called isolationism.

[think]

18. So Cain is antiwar and pro pizza? ..nt

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

25. I thought armies were sent to dangerous places *because* they were dangerous.

So where would Cain send troops instead? Canada? Sweden? Of course I agree with the general concept of not sending troops into danger unless it's necessary, but to equate decisions not to send (presumably unarmed and not driving Humvees) pizza delivery people to dangerous neighborhoods with decisions about military strategy is just stupid.

[KingFlorez]

26. For the people saying he's not racist, consider this

He had no reason to even say that it was a black neighborhood, he could have just said it was dangerous. It's clear who he is pandering too, this is nothing but dog whistle.

I've known of plenty of black people like this and they are nothing but self-hating, social climbing scum who will do anything to be accepted by people who really do not like them.

[pipi_k]

45. And for people saying he IS racist...this challenge...

drive into the very worst neighborhoods in your area.

I don't care what color they are.

If you're white, go to a violent white neighborhood.

If you're black, go to a violent black neighborhood.

Asian...Hispanic...whatever.


Drive around and then park your car and walk around with your wallet hanging out of your pocket. Because that's exactly how poor people see a pizza guy. He's got money...

I'd be willing to bet that nobody will do that.

[KingFlorez]

46. The point is he didn't have to bring race into it

That is what you are ignoring.

[pipi_k]

50. So he brought race into it...

so what?

You mean to tell me that I could say, "I really don't like my cousin Bill" and that would be OK, but if I say, "I really don't like my black cousin Bill" that would make me a racist?

That's the whole standard on which the accusation is based???

That someone mentions race?

seriously???

[KingFlorez]

55. Why would you need to mention race?

You obviously have a huge need to defend this person and his racism, but this is the wrong place to do it.

[pipi_k]

73. Uhhhh.....

Maybe I would if I had two cousins named Bill and one was white and one was black?

But that's not the point.

I find it almost laughable that including a descriptor in a sentence automatically makes one a racist.

Oh, and I'm not defending him as much as pointing out the gross stupidity rampant in the outrage over a statement when there's so much REAL racism going on in the world.

Yeah...focus on a man's use of a word (that in itself isn't even offensive!) while there are minorities in this country who can't get housing or decent food or jobs because of their race.

Every bit of outrage wasted on bullshit like this means less energy that can be focused on racism that IS real and that really matters.

I dunno. Maybe it's just easier to play "holier-than-thou" over semantics and language than to really do shit that matters.

[KingFlorez]

93. He was wrong for bringing race into it

No two ways about it.

[bluestate10]

59. Pipi. If you said that you don't like your black cousin Bill, that statement

should raise eyebrows. Cain was right about not serving a neighborhood where drivers could get injured or killed. He was not right to mention the predominant race of that neighborhood.

[pipi_k]

74. Raise eyebrows....

OK.

I can dig it.

But I wouldn't expect people to set themselves up as judge, jury, and executioner of my character because of the use of one word.


If I ever say anything strange or questionable, I expect people to ASK me what I meant. Not assume they "know" what my innermost thoughts and feelings are.

[City Lights]

66. Why don't you like your cousin Bill?

Is it because he's black? If so, that makes you a racist. If not, why mention his race? IMO, it's best to stick with the pertinent facts.

[pipi_k]

76. Again...

If I'm with people who know me and some who don't, and I mention my black cousin Bill (to differentiate him from my white cousin Bill), then the people who know me will know what I mean.

The people who don't know me might think I'm being a "racist" for mentioning Bill who is black. But they would be wrong.


By the same token, Cain may have wanted to differentiate one bad neighborhood from another in Omaha. Maybe the neighborhoods are segregated. I don't live there, so I don't know. Maybe the bad white neighborhood isn't as dangerous as the bad black neighborhood. I don't know that, either.

So what am I to gather from all this brouhaha?

That, as a white person myself, if I dare to say the phrase "bad white neighborhood", that would make me a racist?

For real?

[City Lights]

82. Now you're using your "black" cousin Bill to differentiate from your "white" cousin Bill.

Thanks for the clarification. You didn't originally mention that you had two cousins named Bill. One black; the other white. Using "black" in that situation makes sense since I now know which cousin Bill you're referring to.

I don't see what your black cousin and your white cousin have to do with Herman Cain and his pizza delivery staff though.

If there are unsafe neighborhoods in Omaha, the race of the people living there shouldn't matter. He should be against sending his drivers to any of them, and shouldn't need to specify that he wouldn't send his drivers to a dangerous black neighborhood. He should just say, "I refused to send my drivers into a dangerous neighborhood." Unless, of course, he was addressing an audience of racists. Then he'd get brownie points for mentioning that the dangerous neighborhood in question had black people living there.

[pipi_k]

100. Well like I said...

I have no idea why he said that, and neither does anyone else unless someone here has a magic window into his brain.

I've known plenty of people who have said really stupid things...not from malice, but because it was the first thing that came out of their mouths.

Once it was out, there was usually embarrassment.

Except for one of my sisters, who looks pretty normal but who has a real personality/brain disorder. She's just not always aware of what she says.


I just find it disgusting that so many people want to LABEL someone according to what comes out of his or her mouth.

[City Lights]

106. If Herman Cain has some type of personality/brain disorder,

he probably shouldn't be running for president. If Herman Cain does not have some type of personality/brain disorder, he absolutely should be held accountable for what comes out of his mouth.

[CreekDog]

125. he only mentioned black

And violent.

Not calm, white, poor, asian, Hispanic or well kept.

Just black and violent.

Now what were you mindlessly blabbering about your black and white cousins, Bill and Bill?

[JTFrog]

89. Oh it's you again.

To defend the racists at every turn.

:eyes:

It is one thing to say we don't deliver to violent neighborhoods. It's quite another to say, we don't deliver to that black neighborhood because it's violent.

And yes, there is a big difference in saying I don't like my cousin Bill and I don't like my black cousin Bill. It's right off the bat distinguishing Bill as "other". The connotation is there.

[pipi_k]

104. Some things aren't worth the trouble

People here going on and on about the word a black man used to describe a neighborhood populated by people of his own race.

Meanwhile, the really important things...blacks being denied jobs, food, medical treatment, etc.

That all falls by the wayside while people sit and nitpick over one stinking word which by itself isn't even offensive.

But that's OK. Keep focusing on the bullshit.

The people who really care about racism are out there making sure minorities are living better lives. Not worrying about what some damned fool candidate said about one lousy neighborhood in a crappy state.

Be proud!

All this bullshit arguing over a word that probably shouldn't have been used has improved the lives of SO many black people today!!!

:sarcasm:

[JTFrog]

115. Yet here you are.

Go figure.

Be Proud indeed.

[fishwax]

114. what does that matter? It still doesn't explain why it was necessary to bring race into it

:shrug:

[yawnmaster]

119. I can't determine from that statement alone, especially without any other context...

whether he is racist or not, and I think using this as an argument for him being racist, on its own is very weak.
You may use is as mild supporting evidence if you have a larger body of evidence, but on its own, I don't think so.

[ismnotwasm]

29. Hmm

I occasionally had problems getting pizza in my old Neighborhood-- White Center aka Rat city, in Seattle. I don't know about Godfather's pizza. Not very often. Now, it isn't predominantly black, very multi-ethnic, with mostly Latino and Vietnamese gangs, regular shootings, murder cop shootings, muggings, car jackings, rape, robberies; as well as assorted crack houses, prostitution, prostitution of minors-- everything we've come to expect in the run down neighborhoods that the working poor can afford to live in.

So is his problem just with BLACK neighborhoods with high levels of poverty? Or a neighborhood with a historic history of violence against pizza deliverers and he just wants to say 'black community'? Is he trying to show some kind of politically expedient, superior moral compass?

It would be interesting to see where his Deliveraters actually went in Omaha as well as other places in the country in the time frame. How consistant was he? Not very I bet

He's a manipulative fuck as well as a total asshole. He is also a wingnut. God knows what he keeps in his basement.

I moved out of White Center proper by just a few blocks, much quieter, but the principle is the same.

[justiceischeap]

32. When I delivered pizza's my boss wouldn't send us to "dangerous areas" either

It was a small mom & pop shop and what was considered dangerous areas were areas known to have a drug presence. We also didn't have those stupid caps on our cars announcing that we were carrying cash and we didn't wear a uniform. I think one of the worst things pizza shops like Domino's or Pizza Hut can do is put the toppers on their cars... it's like a blinking neon sign that screams "Rob me!"

However, I agree with other comments that said he didn't need to bring race into the discussion. Where I delivered food, there weren't a lot of black folks but there was a lot of drug dealing and gun play.

[CakeGrrl]

35. Yay, the Republicans can finally put a black face on their racial profiling.

"It's not wrong if a black guy does it too!"

Disgusting all around.

[yawnmaster]

42. IMO not the best article on which to argue. He won't deliver to dangerous neighborhoods and...

one of his measures for sending troops is whether he'd send his own son or daughter.

The analogy of not letting his kids deliver to dangerous neighborhoods, against using a measure of sending his own son/daughter into dangerous situations...okay.

There is plenty of other of his statements to argue; this is not the best to use.

edit:
On its own, at least.

[bluestate10]

62. Agree. nt

[WatsonT]

112. He'd have been deemed a monster if he sent his employees in to these neighborhoods

lose-lose for him on here.

[semillama]

49. As a former pizza driver

I applaud his record of not sending drivers into areas where their safety was in question.

I condemn any intent on his part to score right-wing credibility behind noting the unsafe area as specifically black.

[petronius]

68. Nicely put. Unless the conversation preceding the comment was about black

neighborhoods in some way, the only way I can read his mention of it that he wanted to underscore that he meant a really dangerous neighborhood, and we all know who lives there...

[Broderick]

94. +1

[fishwax]

116. +1

[BklnDem75]

61. Seems familiar...

[sofa king]

80. Thank you, BklnDem75.

Someone needed to point out that once again Dave Chappelle's comedy of yesteryear is today's politics.

http://www.comedycentral.com/videos/index.jhtml?title=clayton-bigsby&videoId=24400

[Beaverhausen]

67. Great foreign policy you got there.

anyone brave enough to venture to Freeperville to see how they are handling this?

[jberryhill]

81. Better Headline - "Cain Announces Plans To Invade Peaceful White Countries"

That was the point he was trying to make.

[City Lights]

83. LOL! nt

[joshcryer]

120. Haha, nice.

[Canuckistanian]

92. And he's committed to ending poverty in black areas that are the cause of crime.....

Right? Right?
(crickets)

[pipi_k]

107. Thank you...that more than anything

would be the thing that disgusts me. Not necessarily what a person says.

People don't always say what they really mean. Anybody who has ever been in a relationship with someone only out to get what they can get by saying "I love you" knows that.

Actions speak louder than words.

If a person doesn't want to put any effort into attempting to improve the lives of people of his own race or creed or gender or whatever, then that's a good reason to think the person is a scumdog.

[Zoeisright]

101. He's a fucking racist pig.

And his self-hatred is oozing out of every slimy pore.

[yawnmaster]

113. But did you get that from this article? eom

[Raine]

117. Disgusting and disgraceful

all I can say is at least they were spared eating that crap. :puke: Godfather Pizza is some of the worst pizza I ever had. I had it once and that was more than enough, the more I chewed the bigger it seemed to get in my mouth, YUCK. :puke:

[pipi_k]

118. So, while wondering why someone would use the term "bad black neighborhood"....

I went looking for some answers.

Omaha apparently has four main parts...African American, Hispanic, Asian, and White.

African Americans dominate some of the northern part, Hispanics dominate some of the southern part. Both sections are poor. Asians and Whites generally have a better standard of living and are located to the east and west.

Anyway, in a forum, tourists were asking people who live there what areas to avoid, for safety purposes. The replies were pretty consistent...avoid the area between ____ street to just north of ____ street. Or similar.

Also consistent were the replies that some sections were more dangerous than others...the north being generally thought of as more dangerous than the south. Nobody said Black or Hispanic. I had to find information on racial segregation in a research paper online.

So. The parts of the north (Black) of Omaha are more dangerous than parts of the south (Hispanic).

So Cain did have to differentiate between the two areas somehow. Yes, he could have said north Omaha was a place he would avoid. But that probably wouldn't have been entirely true if the whole north wasn't bad. Only parts of it. Maybe there's a good black neighborhood.

In any event, he called it bad black neighborhood. Because it's probably easier than saying,"Avoid XXX Street to just west of XYZ Avenue running down to 800 ABC Road across the tracks to Blah Blah Boulevard".

There's always some perfectly plausible reason for someone saying something that doesn't necessarily have to equal bad motives.

[City Lights]

121. The only thing he needed to say was that he refused to let his drivers deliver

to dangerous neighborhoods. The specific area isn't relevant to the point he was trying to make.

Nice try though.

[CreekDog]

124. all that research and you still don't get it

Although that is willful.

[TNLib]

123. Does this mean he's anti War I don't think he'll get the GOP nomination if he is

nt

[struggle4progress]

126. Meh. "I used to run Godfather's Pizza" ain't much as presidential qualifications.

He won't be the GOP nominee: it's safe to ignore him

[GSLevel9]

130. I dont care if it was a red, blue, green, red or black neighborhood

if it put his drivers into a dangerous neighborhood I support him denying deliveries to that area.