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"David Sirota and the white Leftist version of racism" (deaniac83 at The People's View)

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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 07:18 PM
Original message
"David Sirota and the white Leftist version of racism" (deaniac83 at The People's View)
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 08:13 PM by ClarkUSA
Reprinted with permission from the author.

It's kind of funny when you think about it, but silver-pen David Sirota thinks he's got a better grip on race than the founding director of the Project on Gender, Race, and Politics in the South at Tulane University, Melissa Harris-Perry. After Professor Harris-Perry's piece in The Nation chiding white Leftist electoral racism of double standards against a black president received acclaim and attention, Sirota, a renowned fantasy-land pretend-Leftist, has decided that he was going to take on Professor Harris Perry, by being too cute by half.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-fvtfPnW8qdU/ToH6XDHyuOI/AAAAAAAACdM/8PkY2G7lT_k/s1600/sirota+racist.PNG

Sirota's argument, on the surface, is that the elite white Leftist class - who overlap with the Professional Left about 90% - is really mad at the president not out of some double standard they set for a black president, but on the basis of policy. Or as David calls it, policy betrayals. Clever. Because we have never seen the attempt to hide denial of race-privilege behind a thin veil of policy criticism ever before, right?

You are familiar with the good ol' whining points David relies on:

:redbox: The good ol' public option pony.
:bluebox: Misdirected anger at the president for saving the global economy from a depression that had to involve rescuing financial institutions (although David does not mention that the TARP is running a profit for the taxpayers).
:redbox: The idiotic idea that the president rejected Medicare drug-rate negotiation provisions in health reform when it was him that got huge price discounts (beginning at 50%) for Medicare Part D recipients. This is based on anonymous pharmaceutical industry sources (see, suddenly when it's convenient for him, Sirota assumes that the drug industry is telling the truth).
:bluebox: Bitching about the president's action in Libya - that not only were completely legal but successful.
:redbox: Breathtakingly stupid assumption that all international trade deals are "NAFTA-style."
:bluebox: Complaining about warrantless wiretapping and confusing its current form with what Bush had done, and not even mentioning that Congress definitively rewrote the rules that the government operates under in 2008. That change did not satisfy a lot of civil libertarians, but no one in their right mind can argue that it is the same as the unlimited powers Bush had claimed in 2005 and 2006.

David Sirota and other privileged white Leftists may have the luxury to bitch and moan about the public option, but the 40% of black children who live in poverty cannot wait for another decade for that debate to be completed. The children who live at or near poverty are disproportionately Hispanic and African Americans and thus disproportionate beneficiaries of president's historic expansion of SCHIP, something Sirota seems to just skip. Likewise, health reform, as it was passed, already forbids pre-existing condition discrimination against children, once again disproportionately benefiting people of color. The same health reform law that Sirota so hates for lacking a public option massively expands Medicaid, once again a program for the poor that benefits the economically downtrodden, most often overlapped with people of color.

And guess what, David Sirota? Don't think that people of color aren't noticing. The Affordable Care Act enjoys its strongest backing among communities of color, and among its most ardent fact-ignoring critics are the white pretend-Left professional chatter classes. Does David Sirota ever wonder why that is?

The thesis of white Leftist elite racism does not lie in the idea that all (or any) policy criticism of a black president is by definition racist, no matter what Sirota's fantasies are. The thesis lies, on two fronts: first, that the professional white Leftist elite class cares more about ideological hangups than they do about actually helping the needy, who are disproportionately minorities. That part of the thesis was just proven above. The second part of that thesis is the very real observation that the first African American president is not treated with the same level of respect by the white Leftist elite, nor does his accomplishments enjoy among them the same praise had those same accomplishments come from a white president. And this part of the thesis, unfortunately, is not at all difficult to prove, either.

Health Care Reform: You cannot tell me that a had a white Democratic president been able to achieve the exact same health reform (expanding coverage to 32 million additional Americans by 2014, a patients' bill of rights on steroids, free preventive care, expansion of Medicaid and community health centers), white Leftists, most likely including Sirota, wouldn't have heaped praises on him. You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who reduced drug costs under Medicare by extracting the discount, in its entirety, from the pharmaceutical industry, and closed the donut hole for seniors as well as eliminating copays for preventive care would not be given a place as a hero for Medicare by the white Leftist elite class. Instead, we get lots of whining about the public option (without one of these ho-hums ever devising a legislative strategy to actually get it passed), and worse, we get indignation the the president who has strengthened Medicare for its beneficiary should not be able to even "touch" that same program.

Wall Street Reform: You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who put in place the toughest regulatory reform of the banking and financial industries since the ones after the Great Depression (including giving regulators authority to wind down financial institutions that are a risk to the system) and created a dedicated federal agency for consumer protection, while at the same time instituting credit card reform for consumers and student loan reform would not be hailed as the second coming of FDR by the white Leftist economic elite. Instead, we hear cries about nationalizing banks.

Rescuing a moribund economy and financial system: You cannot tell me that had a white Democratic president turned around an economy bleeding nearly a million jobs a month and a financial sector (the place where they hold your average working person's retirement savings, you know) on the verge of a global collapse and make money for the taxpayer, that he wouldn't have been worshiped. You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who kept teachers, firefighters and police officers working during the worst economic storm since the Great Depression would not be hailed as a great friend of both liberal economic policy and unions. You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who single-handedly rescued the American auto industry and with it a million auto-worker jobs would not be given a hero's place by the liberal white elite. Instead, we hear how the president is a "corporatist."

Watching out for the poor and the middle class: You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president, who, for a temporary extension of the top rate tax cuts, extracted from a hostile Republican party a year's extension of unemployment benefits and the first tax relief for the working poor (the payroll tax cut), that he would not be saluted as the best friend of the poor and the unemployed and a political genius. Instead, we got indignant calls by the likes of David Sirota to abandon the middle class and the poor just to raise taxes on the rich.

Students: You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who made historic investments in students and expanded Pell grants would not be praised by liberal white elites of this country as the education president. Instead they are yelling about charter schools.

LGBT civil rights: You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who made it possible for gay and lesbian Americans to serve in our country's military openly and expanded federal hate crimes statutes to include crimes motivated by sexual orientation and gender identity would not be celebrated as a pioneer on gay and transgender civil rights. Instead, we get denial from these same people that the president had anything to do with DADT repeal at all.

Environment and fuel economy: You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who nearly doubled the nation's automobile fuel efficiency standards and for the first time in history set fuel standards for commercial vehicles would not be hailed as the white Leftist establishment as a great environmentalist (oh, and by the way, he did it all without Conrgess and with the auto industry on board). Instead, Barack Obama is branded an enemy of the environment for putting an EPA regulatory step back on its usual schedule.

Foreign policy: You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who was successfully winding down two wars would not have been welcomed as a peace candidate by the white elite liberal class. You cannot tell me a white Democratic president who set the example for multilateral action for international crises (as in Libya) would not be presented by the white Leftist elites as an internationalist. Instead, we get Sirota's buddies calling President Obama a war criminal.

Trade policy: You cannot tell me that a white Democratic president who made trade deals truly a fair game for Americans by inserting enforceable labor and environmental standards as core parts of our trade agreements would not be hailed by the white Leftist media class. Instead, we get a bunch of fearmongering about how all trade deals must be equal without any attention to the details. Sirota, by the way, is a known foreign policy racist. He is the same man who went after US economic aid to Sri Lanka, a country ravaged by decades of civil war and devastated by the tsunami in the Indian Ocean in 2004. Come to think of it, Sri Lanka is also a country of dark skinned people. Hmm. Just sayin'.

You know what else?

Elite not standing by the president when he's right: Had a white Democratic president's executive order to close Guantanamo Bay were blocked by a Democratic Congress by the means defunding such a move, the white Leftist elite class would have gone apeshit on the asses of that Congress. Had a white Democratic president's call for immigration reform went unanswered by a Democratic Congress, that Democratic Congress would have heard from the self-proclaimed protectorate of the Left. Where were you folks with the big mouths and precious little bundles of courage?

That's the problem. It's not that the white Leftist elite is thinking, "Hey, he's black, we can beat up on him!" the same way that the white conservative elite class is thinking. What's going on among the liberal white pretend-Leftists, though, is just as nefarious. It's a denial. It's a denial of race-privilege. It's the denial of this president's impressive progressive achievements by pulling out some small nitpick at every turn. It's a denial of the fact that on its face, no white Democratic president in similar position would be treated with so much disrespect from them as Barack Obama has been. Maybe they can't see it. Maybe they have a blind spot about that race privilege. But if they can't see it, it's time to open those eyes.

The problem, David Sirota, is not that the critics from the white Leftist elite media class is don't have anything to do with policy. The problem is that way too often, policy nitpicks and fights are chosen to be waged by the likes of you without doing much factual research about the policy or tempering them with the president's accomplishments against a black president that you never would have waged under a white president. The problem is that you are picking fights with a black president that you never would with a white Democratic one. The problem is not that you criticize the black president. It is that in your attacks, you refuse to add context.

The racist undertone is also present in the latent expectation that once you have elected a black president, he needs to be a magician and magically begin a utopia according to your likings. It's present in the refusal to recognize that Barack Obama has a harder job to get anything done because of the color of his skin and the institutional racism in our government, and yet he has managed to get more done in less time than any president of recent times. To ignore that reality of institutional racism is itself the denial of white-privilege. And I am going to call that denial of race-privilege what it actually is: it's racism.

The truth of liberal white elitism and racism is based on true observations, and is not much better than that from the Republicans: that the black guy, who's working day and night to keep the car from slipping back into the ditch and move forward is not pushing it hard enough or the right way, and so on and so forth.


The People's View is a great website for Obama supporters. Make sure to check out the Comments section. I didn't include the original blue links so check out the original article if you want to read through the author's sources: http://www.thepeoplesview.net/2011/09/david-sirota-and-white-leftist-version.html

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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 07:34 PM
Response to Original message
1. We need more from Obama than we needed from Clinton
Merely because our house is now burning down, rather than simply at imminent risk of burning down as it was in the Clinton years. People are going to blame and criticize leaders more when they are made miserable by a current crisis than when they are oblivious to an approaching crisis.

It doesn't matter that Obama is better than Clinton on many issues, and it wouldn't matter if Clinton himself were president. The standard is higher now simply because we are loaded with more misery and in much more desperate need than we have been in eighty years.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. On one side..
I completely agree with you jpgray...on the other side I find it an apologist position. I've said the same in defense of a lot of criticism towards the President--I don't know if it's real or if I just want to believe it. Sometimes it's definitely the latter, I think other times it's undeniable there are people who just hate the man and use the veil of criticism in order to push their meme.
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jpgray Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #3
11. Yes, you could use the desperate times as a cover for racially-motivated criticism
My only point is that the desperate times are sufficient as an explanation for the difference in standards for Obama and Clinton. Whether or not they are the explanation for some particular leftist criticism, I have no idea.

For example Sirota could launch his criticisms of Obama because he is readier with blame for a black Democratic president than a white one. That's possible. It could also be motivated by a belief that Obama blew his opportunity with majorities in both houses to solve our current horrible crises--health care, the wars, unemployment, etc. (note the belief doesn't have to be true or accurate for it to drive the behavior).

People never demanded so many ponies of Clinton, but many more people are convinced we have a choice between ponies, now, or a long slide from current disasters into greater disasters.
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-11 01:04 PM
Response to Reply #11
66. I'm not sure that I follow--who is demanding ponies....Wall Street maybe
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Whisp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. if a house is burning down, do you grab the firefighters and yell at them
or do you appreciate that they are doing what they can and help how you can.

sometimes helping how you can is simply just shutting up with the curses and name calling.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 07:42 PM
Response to Original message
2. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #2
5. I think so.
I think there are people on the left who find the White House attacks Progressives on the left (the supposed base of the President)....while on the flip side the progressive left attacks the President. And neither of them realize--they're being pitted against each other by the right.

It's a bit ouroboros in nature and been going on since the two parties were in power---it just seems more dunces are on the left. Don't get me wrong. Criticize, because it should happen. But let's also focus on the enemy here, which I feel is forgotten.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Well, Obama supporters have been saying that for the past 2.6 years, to no avail.
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 08:30 PM by ClarkUSA
I am part of "the left" who supports this President without reservation. Liberal Obama supporters make up a very big majority of the Democratic base and we will not shut up and sit down in 2012: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2015783



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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
7. Dupe ... posted here yesterday by ClarkUSA ...
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Wrong. This is not a dupe. I have never posted an OP featuring this article here or anywhere.
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 08:12 PM by ClarkUSA
You're linking to a brief reply I made in a thread. Apples and oranges.

Those of us who agree with Melissa Harris-Perry will not shut up and sit down.

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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #8
12. True, it was not an OP, you posted the same article in another thread which had many replies ...
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 08:41 PM by slipslidingaway
and many not very flattering, so post it now as an OP in GDP instead of GD.

:evilgrin:







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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:50 PM
Response to Reply #12
14. Thus, it is not a dupe. It's not exactly "the same" either. Nice try, anyway.
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 08:53 PM by ClarkUSA
:eyes:
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #14
23. And it smells no better today, for reasons discussed.
In fairness, you might have missed a few. I have to think you did.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:57 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. LOL! I would worry about you if you said anything complimentary about one of my OPs.
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 09:57 PM by ClarkUSA
<< In fairness, you might have missed a few. I have to think you did. >>

Prove it. :)
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:16 PM
Response to Reply #27
31. OK let's ask you this. In your own words, what do you think is the central point
Mr Deaniac83 is making about Sirota and his article?

You posted it. Please defend it.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:27 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. deaniac83 speaks for me. I won't jump through your hoops nor ask how high.
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 10:29 PM by ClarkUSA
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:37 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. Weak. It seems important enough to repost. in full length, so what is
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 10:47 PM by chill_wind
the main point you are trying to establish? There has to be one.

(self edit)
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Puglover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 03:36 PM
Response to Reply #32
45. He's a member here.
Why doesn't he post his own swill Clarkie? Why are you always the one peddling his loathsome crap?
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CakeGrrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #12
25. And how many times have you seen the Sirota piece OP'd and linked?
I know of at least two.
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:43 PM
Response to Reply #25
34. More than once. Not by the same person, though. n/t
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Mr Deltoid Donating Member (694 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
9. With 'supporters' like these
Who needs enemies?
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CakeGrrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:56 PM
Response to Reply #9
26. Yes, we know...
they're "hurting" the President!

:rofl:
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Mr Deltoid Donating Member (694 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 06:39 PM
Response to Reply #26
59. Yes
Because their egos are more important than the country.
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Bobbie Jo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-11 01:14 PM
Response to Reply #26
67. LOL
Not to mention, STUPID. :rofl:
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BklnDem75 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-29-11 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #9
44. Cue the Twilight Zone music
:rofl:
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:14 PM
Response to Original message
10. Deleted message
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
CakeGrrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
13. Rec'd. Truth. -nt

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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:56 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Back to zero. Again.
How predictable.
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CakeGrrl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Given the enthusiasm for Sirota's refutation of the "arrogant" MHP,
this does not surprise me.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. I guess Sirota couldn't get away with calling MHP "uppity" so "arrogant" sufficed as code.
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 09:32 PM by ClarkUSA
After all, that's how Pres. Obama has been often described by his 24/7 critics, right?

BTW, one Sirota lovefest has 110 recs. No, it doesn't surprise me, either.
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chill_wind Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:51 PM
Response to Reply #18
35. Code for racist, ClarkUSA? Is that your contention? Sirota is a racist?
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 10:52 PM by chill_wind
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griffi94 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:03 PM
Response to Original message
17. so is the position of this op
that racism is the only reason for the slip in obamas support. because i don't think that's correct.
while i'm sure that there are plenty of people who would never support him because of race, they never supported him anyway.
i think it's more about people being dissatisfied with the position we're in and some of the policy decisions.
fair or not when people think the country is going in the wrong direction they're unlikely to continue to support the president, regardless of his race.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:25 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. "only reason"? Um, no. But the author is this piece is defending Melissa Harris-Perry.
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 09:31 PM by ClarkUSA
She never said that, either. Lots of people are making it seem as if MHP was talking about ALL white liberals, but she was not. Did you read her piece?
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griffi94 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:43 PM
Response to Reply #19
22. yeah i read it
i dont entirely agree with her conclusion altho i will admit it raises an interesting point.
i think for some people the president is held to a higher standard, but i think that is a small percentage of people and it's offset, at least to some degree by people who support him regardless of what he does.

i think the main reason his support is falling is simply dissatisfaction with the direction we're going.

i also think sirota raises a valid argument that it's not race but policy dissatisfaction driving the drop in support.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Pres. Obama's support has been trending up in the last month, according to Gallup polls.
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 10:02 PM by ClarkUSA
And according to the latest CNN polls, he's doing very very well with liberals and Democrats overall:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2015783

The underlying numbers breakdown from the CNN poll questions is rather interesting, according to one very perceptive DUer:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x2015783#2015878

BTW, this paragraph is a partial answer to your original question:

The thesis of white Leftist elite racism does not lie in the idea that all (or any) policy criticism of a black president is by definition racist, no matter what Sirota's fantasies are. The thesis lies, on two fronts: first, that the professional white Leftist elite class cares more about ideological hangups than they do about actually helping the needy, who are disproportionately minorities. That part of the thesis was just proven above. The second part of that thesis is the very real observation that the first African American president is not treated with the same level of respect by the white Leftist elite, nor does his accomplishments enjoy among them the same praise had those same accomplishments come from a white president. And this part of the thesis, unfortunately, is not at all difficult to prove, either.



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griffi94 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:03 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. i never thought
that a majority of liberals or dems in general would stop supporting him. i think he's in trouble with swing voting indies.
i haven't been watching the polls because they don't matter this far out anyway.
i do think unless there's a significant tangible turn around in the next 12 months he's in trouble.

i also think his best chance is if the repubs nominate a teabagger. imho if things are more or less the same this time next year (and it's hard to see what's on the horizon to cause a major upswing) and the candidate for the repubs is somebody like romney who doesn't appear as a raving nutter to the general public obama will not be re-elected.

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wndycty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
20. K&R
:kick:
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
21. Recd...but at zero....
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 09:37 PM by FrenchieCat
That's what happens when folks are outnumbered....
That in a nutshell is the world of minorities.
That's exactly how the Wall Street protestors will be made to feel....
as well Democrats of all color will be made to feel it greatly,
if we don't cut the crap.

Possible sooner than later, the Republicans
will be the great equalizers as Ronald Reagan was once called....
and we will all be at a big fat zero like this op was made to be,
and it won't matter what motivated folks (and there are many motives),
because we will have blown our chance.

It will be more our fault too, not simply the fault of one man,
or even two or three. That's an easy excuse, but it won't change a thing.
Mark them words passionate patriots.
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rury Donating Member (629 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:13 PM
Response to Original message
29. +1trillion....K&R ClarkUSA
David Sirota is a white, limousine liberal, paternalistic racist....NOTHING ELSE!!!!!!!
I and many of my fellow African-Americans are fed up with this type who treat us with benign condescension.
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dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:14 PM
Response to Original message
30. I don't find either this piece, nor the original piece being defended, all that great
I won't answer the whole thing since it is late but to take just one part.

The good ol' public option pony.

Here was a two fold problem that the author just plain ignores. Both the public option, and the lack of a mandate, were explicit promises that Obama ran on. It is perfectly reasonable to be upset when a candidate promises one thing and then does another. It is especially rational if that was one of the positions Obama used to differentiate himself in the primaries, which he did.

:bluebox: Misdirected anger at the president for saving the global economy from a depression that had to involve rescuing financial institutions (although David does not mention that the TARP is running a profit for the taxpayers).

Without going into whether or not TARP is indeed making a profit, the problem many on the left have with TARP was the lack of any restrictions being placed on Wall Street. Now much of that is Bush's fault but there was a TARP 2 which was passed when Obama could have helped shape it to be more fair to us.


:redbox: The idiotic idea that the president rejected Medicare drug-rate negotiation provisions in health reform when it was him that got huge price discounts (beginning at 50%) for Medicare Part D recipients. This is based on anonymous pharmaceutical industry sources (see, suddenly when it's convenient for him, Sirota assumes that the drug industry is telling the truth).

It wasn't just the drug industry saying this, it was also Democratic sources on capital Hill, are they liars too.

:bluebox: Bitching about the president's action in Libya - that not only were completely legal but successful.

Successful or not, and what government we end up with there will determine that, it is still something that candidate Obama suggested he wouldn't be doing. In fairness, I actually think this was a good policy but to say that one has to be racist to find fault with it is absurd. Clinton got plenty of criticism on the left for a similar operation in Kosovo.

:redbox: Breathtakingly stupid assumption that all international trade deals are "NAFTA-style."

They are NAFTA style. None of them currently have any labor or enviromental standards in them though Obama does want to pass the standards at the same time. But in current form, it is hard to make a case for these agreements not being NAFTA like.

:bluebox: Complaining about warrantless wiretapping and confusing its current form with what Bush had done, and not even mentioning that Congress definitively rewrote the rules that the government operates under in 2008. That change did not satisfy a lot of civil libertarians, but no one in their right mind can argue that it is the same as the unlimited powers Bush had claimed in 2005 and 2006.
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RetroLounge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 10:56 PM
Response to Original message
36. unrec
the swarm = :puke:

RL
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WorseBeforeBetter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-28-11 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
37. "...the white Leftist elite class would have gone apeshit on the asses..."
Edited on Wed Sep-28-11 11:11 PM by WorseBeforeBetter
Yeah, this is someone whose opinion interests me. :eyes:
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-29-11 01:35 AM
Response to Reply #37
38. So you're going to discount the author's entire essay because of an apt 12-word urban colliquialism?
Edited on Thu Sep-29-11 01:47 AM by ClarkUSA
How precious. :silly:
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EffieBlack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-29-11 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #38
42. Any excuse will do . . .
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-29-11 07:56 AM
Response to Original message
39. Wow, this is what you've been reduced to using as a source, a form of validation
The same blog that had publisher Spandan Chakrabarti's screed about the Krugman's criticism of the debt ceiling deal email blasted out over the country by New Mexico State Director Ray Sandoval as some sort of valid defense of said debt ceiling deal.

The same poster, Deaniac83, who thinks that the Catfood Commission's ideas on Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security, including raising the age limit and switching to that travesty known as the Chained CPI, were alright and worth considering

The same poster who joins in on the RW just fine[br />
This all adds up to a serious lack of credibility for your source on this, but then again that's not surprising, a lot of your sources lack in credibility.


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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 04:09 PM
Response to Reply #39
48. Our good Centrists hold those positions b/c they are trying to help black people.
Unlike all these racist liberals we keep hearing about.
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-29-11 09:41 AM
Response to Original message
40. Thanks for this information, and thanks for the headsup about TPV.
:hi:
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frazzled Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-29-11 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
41. In total, definitive agreement
And could add a dozen more points to the argument if I had the time today.

On the other hand, this internecine fight is not going to end well. I doubt that the kind of subtle, subconscious racism driving the rabid criticism of this president (and I don't think that's the only factor involved, but it is certainly a major element) is going to be convinced of its own existence or mend the error of its ways. The argument has deep validity, but it's going to drive the offending parties away even more and make them dig their heels in further. I've seen it going on since the primaries. Hell, people (on OUR side) were already out in droves criticizing the president for all the inaugural balls, and no amount of explaining that states organize their own balls would convince them that he was not putting on airs in a time of financial crisis. Policy criticisms came before day one; appointments generated howls (many the same as Clinton's, such as Larry Summers, who was hailed as an architect of the Clinton miracle economy but vilified from day one as a Wall Street insider).

I think we need to reach the reachable and give up on the David Sirotas and the anarchist elements and the disaffected primary pouters and focus on those who are silently supportive or leaning toward support. When you do electoral politics, this is how you focus your resources. You never try to convince people who have made up their minds to vote for someone else that they are wrong and should change their minds. You contact the "plusses," the people whose support you know you can get but who sometimes need to be roused from their slumbers.

Let the others keep looking for Mr(s) Ideal/Untested candidate and utopian scheme. They're lost to the real world, and will never admit that a double-standard is what is driving them.



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EffieBlack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-29-11 01:47 PM
Response to Original message
43. Where's the outrage?
Isn't it interesting that, while some here disagree with deaniac and a handful have even personally attacked him, he hasn't attracted a fraction of the anger, accusations and flat-out hate that have been hurled at Melissa Harris-Perry - even though his post was much harsher than hers was.

Hmmmm. I wonder why the difference in reaction?
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 03:49 PM
Response to Original message
46. Sirota should just apologize and leap into the 21st Century.
Nobody is impressed with the "I'm better than you because I was born white" talk anymore.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 04:00 PM
Response to Original message
47. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
49. The author has an interesting point about elitist liberals.
Just look at their organic gardens, trips to Martha's Vinyard and high-profile corporate boardroom connections.

How these limosine liberals could ever relate to the President is beyond me.

They should act more like Centrists, Blue Dogs and DLCers, who are always doing the right thing for minorities.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 05:44 PM
Response to Reply #49
50. Your attempts to ridicule every OP that addresses the attacks on Melissa Harris-Perry are duly noted
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 05:52 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. Note that I think Liberals DESERVED being called racists just like she believes.
Liberals deserved being labeled with something as awful and degrading as being racist.

After all, they failed to support a politician and his agenda.

Does it get any more blatantly racist than that? I think not.

Meissa Harris-Perry is a TRUTH TELLER and she did not deserve to be argued with or attacked in kind for exposing the *real* reasons Liberals hate Obama.

Yes, please note this.


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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 05:55 PM
Response to Reply #52
53. That's a strawman argument. Melissa Harris-Perry never said that. Keep digging.
Edited on Fri Sep-30-11 05:56 PM by ClarkUSA
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #53
54. I agree with whatever she said, and whatever Obama says too.
Edited on Fri Sep-30-11 06:02 PM by Dr Fate
I thought she did say that it was the liberals who were being racist.

Maybe I read the wrong thing.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 06:02 PM
Response to Reply #54
55. Yawn.
:boring:
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #55
56. Hey, if you say she never said those Liberals were racist, I'll believe you.
Edited on Fri Sep-30-11 06:05 PM by Dr Fate
No need to yawn- I believe you.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 06:09 PM
Response to Reply #56
57. Why do you keep mocking Melissa Harris-Perry? Did she hit a nerve?
Edited on Fri Sep-30-11 06:10 PM by ClarkUSA
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 06:18 PM
Response to Reply #57
58. Hit a nerve? Hell no. I love it when liberals get exposed as the racists they really are.
Edited on Fri Sep-30-11 06:39 PM by Dr Fate
Unless we are now saying she never said they were racist re your strawman comment. Hey, I'm easy either way.

I'm a centrist-one that never supports a politician unless he has a 100% solid record on passing legislation concerning civil rights, helping minorities, helping the poor, giving small businesses (many black owned) all the tax cuts and subsidies etc.

For instance, all the centrist politicians you and I supported were not fooled by the right's attacks on ACORN- which is why our good centrists wanted to keep on funding it, while the racist liberals just wanted to cover their asses and move on.

Same thing with voter suppression as well. Centrists, DLCers, Blue Dogs, etc. fight tooth & nail for reform while these liberals just hate on minorities.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #58
61. Why do you say that?
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 11:36 PM
Response to Reply #61
63. B/c anyone who does not want to be called a racist is probably a racist.
it's in all the psychology books.
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 11:59 PM
Response to Reply #63
64. "it's in all the psychology books." Really? Give us some linked quotes, then.
Edited on Sat Oct-01-11 12:00 AM by ClarkUSA
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Bobbie Jo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-11 01:32 PM
Response to Reply #64
68. LOL...don't bother
Poster is just too clever by half.

Funny you should mention psychology books, though. Start with DSM-IV. :rofl:
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rug Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 05:48 PM
Response to Original message
51. "Reprinted with permission from the author."
Say hi next time you talk to him.
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Mr Deltoid Donating Member (694 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #51
60. My first reaction too
lol
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Puglover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-30-11 07:21 PM
Response to Reply #51
62. The author is a member here.
I can't imagine why he would not post his own material. And bask in the glory. Don't cha know. :rofl:
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ClarkUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-01-11 12:13 AM
Response to Reply #62
65. That's because he has his own website to occupy his spare time & friends like me to do that for him.
Edited on Sat Oct-01-11 12:19 AM by ClarkUSA
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