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What good are great speeches if you can't deliver on them?

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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 09:27 AM
Original message
What good are great speeches if you can't deliver on them?
Not that I think last night's speech was one of his great ones, because I don't think it was by any stretch, but of what use is it to deliver great speeches if you can't deliver with the results?

Having said that, I'm sick and tired of all the corrupt Republicans in this country who are stonewalling this administration for the sake of seeing this president fail. But I'm also getting a little tired of hearing President Obama deliver speech after speech, many of them great ones, with little or no results to show for all his wonderful rhetoric.

Republicans are to blame for the sick state this country is in today, but President Obama is to blame for not figuring out a way to put those assholes in their places. President Obama has made terrible use of his bully pulpit and has wasted 3 years trying to placate Republicans into liking him. Bully pulpit or not, he needs to start acting a lot tougher than he is right now if he ever wants to gain the respect that he deserves. Right now, respect is much more important than likeability.

"You should pass it (in regards to his jobs bill)" was so fucking weak it was almost embarrassing. It should have been "Pass this bill right NOW for the sake of this country!" spoken with passion and toughness......not "You should pass it" in the passive manner he kept expressing it last night.

President Obama needs to stop worrying about getting the Republican enemy to like him and start facing the reality that Republicans will NEVER like him, and that the only way to get the respect of those who are against him is to treat them like the shit that they are. For the rest of his term he needs to make much better use of that bully pulpit of his and start stepping on the batshit crazy Republicans with much tougher sounding rhetoric instead of being all warm and fuzzy with them. Instead of using Ronald Reagan analogies (thank god I didn't hear any last night), he needs to dump that overrated Repuke asshole and inject himself with the toughness and will of a much finer Republican president, one of the greatest this land has ever seen: Teddy Roosevelt, who knew hot to get it done despite any odds.

Obama can still become one of the great ones, but he needs to borrow Teddy's big stick starting today or he'll go down as one of the weak ones instead of one of the great ones. What a shame that would be for this country to have that happen. He needs to show Republicans that he is he is the boss and stop acting like he's their fucking babysitter. It would be much more to his advantage to have them respect him for his toughness than to have them like him for being nice to them.

What a waste of a great mind if Obama doesn't learn how to become a much tougher leader and more effective boss than he is right now. He's got one more year to learn how to get tougher, gain the respect of everyone in this country, and get his ideas implemented into reality. Obama can still go down as a great president, but he won't do it by treating Republicans as if they are only half to blame when they are 99% to blame and everyone knows it.
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Inuca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
1. PASSIVE manner? n/t
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. Well,
Edited on Fri Sep-09-11 09:37 AM by ProSense
it's creative, albeit it not based on the reality of the speech.

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Hawkowl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #1
18. Grammar is important
You "should" pass it is wishy-washy conditional language. Now, You MUST pass it now! Is much more of a firm imperative. For such a "brilliant" orator, it is quite obvious he has second rate hacks for speechwriters.

His delivery is good. His content slightly weak. The style is very weakly ineffective. Yes, it is ineffective because it hasn't brought about the desired effects in the past.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
2. How
Edited on Fri Sep-09-11 09:32 AM by ProSense
"What good are great speeches if you can't deliver on them?"

...does this fit into the call for the President to go big even if the Republicans reject it?

Bernie Sanders' response is interesting. He seems hopeful that "we can win this thing" (video)

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montanacowboy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
3. I am sick and tired of him blaming "Congress"
for everything when we ALL know it's the repukes

what is his problem with calling out the obstructionists by name?

when he says "congress" it sounds like its all the Democrats who are also stonewalling everything

I am sick and goddamn tired of being put in the same pot as the freak show crazy batshit nuts treasonous cowards that he wants to lump in with the rest of us

He won't change and the freaks will take over
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tblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. Maybe that's exactly what he means.
Do you think he's any less irked by progressives and the CBC than he is the Republicans?
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SusanaMontana41 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:18 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. You got that right, cowboy.
:hi:
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Cali_Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #3
16. Indeed. Blaming "Congress" without blaming the Republicans by name is a ridiculous strategy
Edited on Fri Sep-09-11 12:41 PM by Cali_Democrat
His advisers should be fired for that crap. There are a lot of good Dems in Congress working hard to get a Democratic agenda through and they don't need to be shit on by the President.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 12:22 AM
Response to Reply #3
44. Congress which is made up of the House and the Senate---has the House owned by Repubs.
They fuck up the system and from time to time even the Dems join them in stupidity.
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opihimoimoi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 09:35 AM
Response to Original message
4. Great speeches are often killed by Negativism....
The Populace needs more Positivity...more Optimism...

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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
6. Results don't have to be immediate
But I take it this means you are never one of the posters pounding on the idea of the bully pulpit?

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bhikkhu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:22 AM
Response to Original message
7. You miss the whole point
...from the beginning Obama has very strongly and repeatedly emphasized that the country divided fails, and the country united prospers, that we can do all things if we work together but nothing if we refuse. From the "race speech" forward, and well put in this speech, the theme has been consistent, and its application has been clear. You see it as weakness, but it is the hardest path to follow.

I tend to agree with him, but whether you agree or not, what is least likely is that he will become some different kind of person and abandon reconciliation and compromise in favor of strong-arm tactics, us-vs-them division, or "ideological purity" or whatever you want to call it.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. No. I missed nothing
The people who are missing the point are the people who think it's fine and dandy for a president to talk the talk as long as it sounds all warm and fuzzy even if they end up with little to show for the rhetoric and come up empty handed.

You can define Obama's legacy by what he says, but I'm gonna define it by what he actually accomplishes.
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bhikkhu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #8
23. So, can we agree on hoping they pas the bill?
I would hate to see Obama judged based on the abilities of the bunch of jokers and blowhards in congress...and its hard to see any other way for him to get the legislation we need passed but to put it before the people, as he did last night.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:24 PM
Response to Reply #23
30. Of course we can agree on that. n/t
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:54 AM
Response to Original message
9. "Bully Pulpit!!", "Pretty Speech!!", "Bully Pulpit!!", "Pretty Speech!!", "Bully Pulpit!!", "Pr...
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Telly Savalas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 08:49 PM
Response to Reply #9
24. The President needs to use Bully Pulpit Rays to control Congress's minds
If only he'd said "pass this plan" with a somewhat deeper voice, we could have another New Deal.
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #24
33. ROTFL...
:spray:

We knew his hardline critics would ramp up the attacks today, because the prez was getting some positive press and feedback. O.P. FAIL!


:thumbsup:
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JoePhilly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #24
51. I think you got it.
But when the "Bully Pulpit Ray" doesn't work immediately ... we'll hear screams of "just a pretty speech" from the same folks who'd been screaming "use the bully pulpit", just moments earlier.
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-12-11 12:40 PM
Response to Reply #9
59. You can't win with this crowd.
And they fail to see the cognitive dissonance of their own rhetoric...no matter what this president does, it is wrong.
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Honeycombe8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
11. He/we have to try to create jobs. Haven't posters in this forum said...
that sometimes things are worth fighting for, even though you know you're going to lose?

He's bent over backwards appeasing the other side, in order to create jobs for us. His eye is on the goal. So it will hopefully become clear to everyone, when the Republicans vote against it, just exactly what is going on, and who is obstucting what. That the Republicans don't care one bit about the suffering of unemployed and underemployed Americans.

Hopefully that will get people out to vote, and they will vote Democratic or anti-Republican for Congress, too.

Of course, a little hardball/blackmail isn't a bad thing...like it was done in the old days. You pick up the phone & tell Rep. so and so that you have proof of this and that, but you'll lose that proof, if he votes for the bill. OR...you bribe him with...remember that bridge in your county that you wanted fixed three years ago? Well, we'll make sure that bridge is part of the infrastructure jobs bill, IF you vote for it.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
13. Moving the goalposts back and forth is not anyway to criticize others....
You want this President to do the impossible,
and then, you would still be unhappy and complaining.

It is this kind of negativity that poison folks who
should be encouraged to action.

You and others here are only contributing to the cynical paralysis
that is taking over this nation, and doing nothing more.
You are not helping the people in doing this....you are only helping
the folks who play naysayers cynics in reference to our government.
They have a name; The Teabaggers.
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AtomicKitten Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. +
:fistbump:
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Bluerthanblue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #13
22. hate to say this-
because what you say is abit harsh, but I completely agree.

Constructive criticism is very rare even though it is often used as a cover for non stop negativity.

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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:06 PM
Response to Reply #13
27. Nothing in your post pertains to my OP. You pasted a post from up your sleeve that is irrelevant
to the topic of my post with hopes that your minions would hop on board and give you a +. All you did was cherry pick the couple negatives when the truth of the matter is that my post has far more negatives and bashing of Republicans than you care to admit. If you read into it any other way, then you really need to brush up on your reading skills.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:23 PM
Response to Original message
14. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
Cali_Democrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
15. If Obama doesn't do pretty much what you said, it will certainly be a wasted Presidency
It would be a tragedy and a painful political lesson. So much potential wasted...only to see somebody like Rick Perry win in 2012.
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:21 PM
Response to Reply #15
29. Be careful
Your concern might be misinterpreted by some around here as bashing the president.

:hi:
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #29
35. Not likely. The poster's "concern" has never been "misinterpreted" by me.
:rofl:
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laugle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #29
53. Nice to see
you again, mtnsnake, it's been too long..............

I have three quotes for you:

"consider the source"

" talk is cheap, it's deeds that matter"

"the buck stops with the president"

End of story.........

Best to you!
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TwilightGardener Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
17. I didn't detect passivity. I heard him tell Congress what to do in no uncertain terms.
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styersc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:48 PM
Response to Original message
20. This plan can only be successful if there is a ground swell of
support which means you have a part in this. If you (we) work hard the nation is saved. If we don't there is no chance. It's your call.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Thanks styersc....
as what you say is exactly how it will be....

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RBInMaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 08:54 PM
Response to Original message
25. It was a GREAT speech, and he painted them into one hell of a corner.
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mkultra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 09:59 PM
Response to Original message
26. Summary of op: stop giving speeches and give more speeches
Brilliant!
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:18 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. It figures you wouldn't take it kindly that I blamed Republicans for the state we're in
Why are you here?
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mkultra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #28
45. It was a red herring to distract fro your backhanded insults to obama
Try to just make sense next time.
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Ikonoklast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-12-11 01:00 PM
Response to Reply #26
60. Stop using the Bully Pulpit, now use the Bully Pulpit!
And the OP thinks there is a way Obama can 'force' Republicans to his will.


Some magical way.

Amazing.
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:47 PM
Response to Original message
31. Glad you're not my president. That is all. (nt)
:thumbsdown:
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. Just for that
I'm going to run in 2016 and win. :smoke:
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:59 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. Might as well. If Michelle Bachmann can do it, anyone can. And juding by the o.p.,
I suspect you're equal to Michelle in many many ways. ;)
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 12:02 AM
Response to Reply #36
40. Well then that makes two of us
because, judging by your spelling and writing skills, you certainly share more than a few of Michele's similarities yourself. ;)
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Tarheel_Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #40
42. I'm crushed....
:cry:
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joshcryer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 10:55 PM
Response to Original message
34. What good is a representative democratic republic if the President isn't a dictator?
:shrug:
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 11:03 PM
Response to Original message
37. Here, let me edit this OP down to its core, paragraph by paragraph:
1. Can't deliver.
2. No results.
3. Act tougher.
4. Too passive.
5. Act tougher x 2.
6. Act tougher.
7. Act tougher x 2.

Ok.
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frazzled Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 11:19 PM
Response to Reply #37
38. How about just giving it a title?
"Desperately Seeking Alpha Male"

(Alternate title: "All our problems would be solved and paradise would be achieved if he would just call the opposition shit heads")

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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-09-11 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. Desperately Seeking Dwayne Elizondo Mountain Dew Herbert Camacho
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Number23 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 12:19 AM
Response to Reply #37
41. I think your analysis is a bit too sophisticated
Personally, I think a simple would do.
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vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 12:23 AM
Response to Reply #37
46. +1. When written like that sounds very much like Cheney or some Repub meme.n/t
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 01:09 AM
Response to Reply #46
47. The human mind does MapReduce* instinctually, but we are culturally trained to long streams of data.
Hence, politicians (and political opinions) find some way of repeating the same damn idea repeatedly, in order to make it "a well thought argument"... when their actual argument is really only a very, very, VERY, simple thought. Repeated endlessly.

*Geek note: MapReduce (which is kind of a brand name, but geeks use it anyways. like "Xerox" no longer means the company) is a big concept in computer Information Retrieval right now (think: search engines, political campaigns, keywords, slogans, synonyms).

Basically, it works (and this is *highly* simplified) as follows: 1. Find words in common to ideas. 2. Group them together.

(I had written a much longer explanation, now deleted, because I'm a bit of an IR geek. It was pointless to post on DU, as most here are not IR geeks).
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-12-11 08:49 AM
Response to Reply #37
58. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator.
 
vaberella Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 12:20 AM
Response to Original message
43. Get it through your head that Repubs were voted into office by a good number of citizens.
Obama must work with them because they own the House and as such are allowed to make the laws. You know...the pesky annoyance that can make sweeping changes for the better or worse depending on who's in office? Well the American people gave them that power and Obama HAS to deal with them. There is no ignoring them or being afraid of them. They are just now a necessary part of the process. He says bipartisanship so we can get a clue. Unfortunately he has to do bipartisanship by way of the framework of the government.
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great white snark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 07:40 AM
Response to Reply #43
49. Thank you.
Like it or not they have earned representation. Hopefully the American people will figure out they don't deserve it next election.
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Bluenorthwest Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-11-11 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #49
56. a few States back east elect radical Republicans
and you guys say that means they 'own' the House and 'deserve to'. What about the States and entire regions that did not contribute a single Republican to the 2010 mix? Are we not represented? Did we not 'earn' representation, or is it voided because we elected Democrats?
You might notice that it is not typical in politics to look at a majority held by the opposition in a single chamber and declare that NO ONE ELSE gets a say, that the one chamber majority 'OWNS' the congress, and that all legislation must be made to please them, and in no way to please the bulk of the nation that did not elect Radical Republicans.
65% of the radical Republican Freshmen come from a single region of the Country. Time to deal with that.
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DCBob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 07:32 AM
Response to Original message
48. so words have no power..
history would disagree with you.
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great white snark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 08:19 AM
Response to Original message
50. What you really want is a solo Obama flash mob that includes manly noises and bodybuilding poses.
:crazy:
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-10-11 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #50
52. Oh, that would be *TOUGH*.
Like, totally!
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-11-11 07:16 AM
Response to Reply #52
54. Your posts are really deep, boppers
Edited on Sun Sep-11-11 07:18 AM by mtnsnake
and very original (snicker)
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boppers Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-12-11 04:47 AM
Response to Reply #54
57. I love how you repeat the same idea. Multiple times, multiple ways.
It's super-deep.

Maybe you should post the same thing, more?
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mtnsnake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-11-11 07:21 AM
Response to Reply #50
55. You and boppers should start a comedy routine
Maybe you could get an audition for show and tell next week, you're so clever. The kids will get a kick out of I'm sure.
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JTFrog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-12-11 01:28 PM
Response to Original message
61. "when they are 99% to blame and everyone knows it."
What good is your OP if you're asking him to repeat something "everyone knows"?

It's the rest of your comments in this thread that are really telling. :eyes:

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