Maxine Waters meet the bus. "..Possibly the WORST legislation ever from this institution."

[Armstead]

"I urge Democrats not to support this bill."

[Cali_Democrat]

1. Am I not seeing what others are seeing? Why is this so bad?

I don't see serious cuts to programs like SS, Medicare and Medicaid.

Did I miss something? :shrug:

[boston bean]

3. open your eyes and you shall see the light.

They set it up so the new super congress has to deal with them and if they don't, there are automatic cuts built in.

i'm not willing to give up ss and medicare for defense cuts, are you?

[Cali_Democrat]

7. No

But I heard the automatic cuts don't impact SS, Medicare and Medicaid.

[boston bean]

18. that's cause they call em entitlements. you do know medicare and SS are now called entitlements by

the Democratic Party, not just the right wing losers.

[ClarkUSA]

24. Many programs for the poor & all entitlement benefits are exempt from current and trigger cuts.

You're correct.

[onpatrol98]

55. I thought this was the case also

Some of these are exempt

[PVnRT]

38. For now

We'll see how long it takes before the Tea Party pulls the strings and gets the GOP to change that.

[damonm]

46. I hope they DO...

...push for cutting Medicare - LOUDLY. And the closer to November 6, 2012, the better.

[Armstead]

4. Big cuts to many other important ;programs coming

This is putting government into a straightjacket and the feces is going to hit the fan when "discretionary" programs like public health, education, etc all start getting gutted.

[okieinpain]

23. they could cut billions and you wouldn't know it. n/t.

[Armstead]

30. Take those cjuts, add in a stagnant economy....

and your going to get a government mired in molasses and unable to do much of anything constructive.

Remember the 1980's?

[okieinpain]

58. yes i do, but you have to admit we're light years away from

that period in time. I'm not saying that the repugs are full of crap or president obama for that matter. I'm just saying that they could cut out a lot of stuff and most people would not even know it was gone. I'm not a conservative either, well yes I am but not a repug type of conservative. I just think it's best if the government doesn't try to do everything.

[femrap]

50. a rock thrown through

your car window....or maybe just the theft of your car might get your attention.

People are already pushed to the limit....given the inflation in food and energy.

Are you sure you're on the correct website?

And this new 'Power Structure?' A dictator and a Politburo of 12 will decide all economic and tax decisions??? My 'representative' has no say-so whatsoever?

That's a f*cking coup d'etat and completely UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

You must come from a wealthy family...but my family has deposited our money into SS and we are ENTITLED to get it back when we retire. If they want to 'means test,' fine. But I want my f*cking $ back.

[okieinpain]

59. oh here we go, if I don't think like yourself I have to leave or I

belong some where else. hell isn't that freeper thinking.

[femrap]

60. Hope

your state is in decent condition and not dependent on federal stimulus, because that is GONE. Most all state budgets have incurred HUGE cuts.

The world's reserve currency is going to topple just as the American Empire is doing.

We are living in truly historic times.

And if you're rich, I wouldn't be flaunting it.

[jeff47]

13. A) No revenue increases

B) Medicare cuts as a 'trigger' when the GOP takes hostages again. To those attempting to excuse it as "provider cuts", when those providers stop seeing Medicare patients, seniors won't be happy.

C) No revenue increases

D) The economy's crappy. Any cuts _AT ALL_ hurt the already crappy economy. The crappy economy is the only viable way the Republicans can win in 2012 and this deal cements that.

E) No revenue increases

F) The entire "super-congress" structure is horrifically terrifying to those who believe in Democracy. Should the people of a small house district in another state get to decide to cut your benefits? Or perhaps that should be handled by the representatives you elected.

G) No revenue increases

H) It demonstrates that hostage taking was very, very effective for the Tea Party. So they'll do it again.

I) No revenue increases

J) Since we're all about "austerity" and reigning in the debt, there's no prayer of any sort of jobs bill. Meaning the economy will be crappy for a long, long time. Get ready to use terms like "lost decade".

K) No revenue increases - and if you think the super-congress will add them, I've got this bridge....

[damonm]

47. Wrong on A, C, E, G, I and K.

As Deaniac83 writes at http://www.thepeoplesview.net/2011/08/paul-krugman-is-political-rookie-or-how.html:

There is another little trigger for the Republicans, but it's technically not part of the deal. It's a trigger to get serious about revenue increases. It's the Bush tax cuts. And the President is ready to use his veto pen to raise taxes on the rich if Republicans prevent the committee charged with deficit reduction from seriously delving into revenue increase. From the White House:

If the Committee does not succeed in meaningful balanced deficit reduction with revenue-raising tax reform on the most well-off by the end of 2012, the President can use his veto pen to raise nearly $1 trillion from the most well-off by vetoing any extension of the Bush high income tax cuts.

In other words, do meaningful tax reform to raise revenue and take away the tax welfare state from the ultrawealthy and multinational corporations, or the highest income brackets will go up anyway. Oops.

[truedelphi]

54. Excellent summary.

If only somewhere in there, you had mentioned "revenue increases."

My snideness aside, thank you!

[truedelphi]

51. What you are missing is this:

By January of 2013, Congress will have to revamp the "entitlements" like Social Security and MediCare, in order to have the ability to cut back the one thing we need to cut back, that is the military and defense monies. (685 billion was spent on that last year.)

And then and only then will there be any discussion of "revenue raising" - and by that it is meant, ending the Bush/Obama Tax Breaks for Big Corporations and Billionaires.

You also have to understand that what yesterday's legislation is already going to do is to cut revenue offerings to the states (there goes even more teachers, social workers, fire fighters, project managers etc) and also programs like Food Stamps and Housing vouchers will be decimated.

The Food Stamp cuts are terrible. Economists who know their stiff understand that for every dollar in Food Stamps spent inside a county, $ 1.07 is made. The grocery store gets to buy more food from suppliers, the suppliers get more food from farmers, and there are more grocery clerks needed to dispense the food.

So the actions taken yesterday will really strip a bare bones economy down to abject destruction. This will no longer be a "recession" --this will be The Mother Of All Grand Depressions.

[mkultra]

56. its like an anti-obama religion

You must be filled with anti-faith to see the anti-truth.

[treestar]

2. What does she propose instead?

[CakeGrrl]

5. +1

[Armstead]

6. Oh maybe one of the many alternatives that have been suggested and ignored

[treestar]

8. What is Maxine's proposal?

[jefferson_dem]

11. Crash.

And hyperbole.

[_ed_]

34. The Progressive Caucus

submitted a bill that saved our AAA credit rating and had real impact on the budget. It involved tax hikes for wealthy people, so of course Obama would hear none of that.

[MrMickeysMom]

52. So, the real question is...

Why would Obama hear none of that?

This question is not for you, but for all those who wanted to understand what the progressive caucus has wanted all along.

[Armstead]

14. Progressive caucus calling for 14 amendment or Clean emergency bill

But their bigger gripe -- whether they end up voting for this bill or not -- is that it was badly negotiated and should not have come to this point.

And it is not Monday Morning Quarterbacking. They have been suggesting alternatives all along.

[treestar]

17. Where has she been, and has her plan be submitted as a bill?

Why was this plan not submitted when it could still be considered?

[Armstead]

19. Like every Congressperson has to file their own bill, huh?

Why doncha just focus on the content. If you think the bill is wonderful, then just say so.

[treestar]

26. It is Maxine who claimed there is a better plan

And she is in a position to forward it, why did she not do it?

[donheld]

28. She probably favors a hefty increase in taxes from the very rich

Do you have proof she didn't propose anything?

[treestar]

40. Do you have proof she did, because your side of the debate is the one

claiming Obama is responsible for starting bills in the House.

Or that a President favoring a hefty increase in taxes for the very rich can somehow have that pass the House without the efforts of members of the House.

[Armstead]

57. A President doesn't file bills -- But he should be working with Representatives

and coordinating such introductions.

And you are denigrating the very real and frequent efforts of many House Dems to actually get things done. Too bad they had to go up against the WH as well as the GOP.

[ProSense]

9. She needs to tell that to

Pelosi

[AtomicKitten]

16. I know Nancy was apprehensive but she probably had an opportunity to review the details.

Randi Rhodes just broke down the bill on her radio show and is quite pleased with the bill.

[elocs]

10. Well Republicans were adamant that there be no new taxes or revenue, and there isn't.

It's all cuts and that's the most important thing that they wanted--no taxes, all cuts.

In the end they might not mind seeing fat cut from a bloated military budget in exchange for cutting medicare.

Damn, this was certainly some shrewd negotiating.

[Bluenorthwest]

12. Maxine is my former Representative and still she represents my

views. This legislation is abominable. A disgrace.

[robcon]

15. It's sad what Maxine has become.

n/t

[Armstead]

20. One of the more creative ways to toss simeone under the bus

[_ed_]

35. It's sad to see a real progressive thrown under the bus

for insufficient reverence of the corporate hack Obama.

[_ed_]

61. It's sad to see your more beholden to the man Obama

than to actual principle or policy.

[Ignis]

21. How long before someone accuses her of being funded by the Koch Bros.?

:puke:

[Mimosa]

22. Maxine Waters is an Obama hater!

:7

[tomp]

31. you say that like it's a bad thing. nt

[Jefferson23]

49. lol.

:hi:

and don't forget Conyers, another Obama hater.

[ClarkUSA]

25. Senator Al Franken disagrees with Maxine Waters. He voted for it and he explains why --->

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x731074

[Ikonoklast]

45. But then, Franken isnt a True Progressive ®.

A True Progessive® hates Obama.

[MrMickeysMom]

53. So this is why Senator Franken voted for it...

“Nevertheless, I will vote for this package, because defaulting would have grave economic consequences for my Minnesota constituents. The deal does protect Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid beneficiaries. And it will erase some of the uncertainty confronting businesses and the markets."

CAN ANYONE SEE WHAT DOES NOT MAKE SENSE HERE?

These two things have NEVER been connected, they are mutually exclusive from another. Historically, we raise the ceiling over and over (you heard the history by now), so why it was an "either/or" makes no sense.

The 14th Amendment ... that makes sense. It is a big "fuck you" in that game of chicken All talks about.

And LOOK AT WHO IS RATING THE UNITED STATES ON CREDIT! Are you really sure Moody's has a real opinion, since THEY were primarily the cause of the economic downturn? Where's the news on that each night?

Come on.

[donheld]

27. The Lovely Diana Degette D-CO voted NO!

[vroomvroom]

29. K&R

[NYC Liberal]

32. Worse than the Fugitive Slave Act? The Indian Removal Act?

The Kansas Nebraska Act? The Espionage Act? The Volstead Act? The Alien and Sedition Acts? The Chinese Exclusion Act?

:freak:

[Armstead]

36. If not the worst you are using a verrrrry low bar there

[NYC Liberal]

39. "Possibly the WORST legislation ever from this institution."

Seems to me there are many, many worse laws that have come out of Congress.

[Armstead]

41. Okay it was hyperbolie...But if she had said...

...one of the worst, she would not have very far off the mark.

The real point is that this iis a crappy and ultimately destructive package at a time when it will do the exact opposite of whatbis needed. And the consequences will be far ranging, on an economic, social and political level.

Your mileage may vary, but it would be more constructive to defendvthe bill, rather than knit picking deflection as way of tossing her under the bus.

[blkmusclmachine]

33. And that says a lot. DC is (mostly) oblivious.

n/t

[ProSense]

37. The "worst legislation from ever from this institution." Really?

Worse than the deal with Phil Gramm that repealed Glass-Steagall?

Worse than the Commodity Futures Modernization Act (the Enron loophole)?

Not likely.

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[slackmaster]

42. Worse than the Volstead Act???!!!???

I think not.

[Phx_Dem]

44. Really?? What an idiot.

Defense of Marriage Act
Don't Act Don't Tell
Iraq War
Bush Tax Cuts
NAFTA
Unfunded No Child Left Behind
Allowing corporates to regulate themselves on environmental dumping

[TheKentuckian]

48. The non-security discretionary budget is about 490 billion and 100 billion of that is stimulus

that isn't a part of future budgets so 1.5 trillion in cuts will be pretty damned destructive. Even if stimulus spending was part of the calculation we are talking about a 1/3 cut over ten years to things like energy, HHS, transportation, and education.

It seems gawdawful if the madness stopped right there but it doesn't.

This might not be the absolute worst bill in history but it is up there.

[tritsofme]

62. Ms. Waters must not be a big history buff. nt