Tom Toles on Huntsman and the 'strong pull of the center'

[flpoljunkie]

[Demit]

1. Haha, that's great.

[Hawkowl]

2. Chasing Obama .nt

[blueclown]

3. If Huntsman were part of the center, this would be an accurate comic.

But he's not. There is this myth that is forming that Huntsman is a moderate. He isn't.

[FrenchieCat]

4. Thank you!

How naive are we supposed to be? On the one hand, folks on our side are saying that Obama is nearly a conservative, and yet Huntsman (I believe simply because he looks stereotypically like a White Person's President) is being heralded even by some on our side as being relatively moderate? Relative to what? Michelle Bachman? Talking about lowering the bar all the way to the ground!

[Drunken Irishman]

5. He was a moderate...

As moderate as one could get, I guess. It's impossible to be truly moderate in any political climate because, by most accounts, politics is divisive.

What I mean is, if you're pro-life, are you automatically conservative?

There isn't a politician whose politics is right down the middle. You're not going to find it. So when you use the term moderate, I think you're using it in the context overall - with both mainstream politics.

Huntsman, in that case, I believe is moderate. He was an advocate for fighting global warming, came out for civil unions at a time when most Republicans opposed civil unions, never really made a substantial claim about abortion while governor of Utah and was pretty down the middle on most every political issue here.

That doesn't mean he isn't Republican. That doesn't mean he doesn't share a great deal of views with Republicans - it just means, overall, he's pretty moderate.

I mean, who do we consider a moderate Democrat? Certainly not Ben Nelson, who would be considered a conservative Democrat - so maybe guys like Bill Clinton? Even then, Clinton had social views and stances that clearly put him to the left of nearly every single Republican while president.

So I don't think it's wrong to say Huntsman is a moderate. It doesn't mean they think he's a liberal or shares a great deal of the liberal vision (that'd make him a liberal Republican), it just means, in the political context of today, he's pretty moderate.

Now you could make the claim that Huntsman 2.0 is turning away from his moderate roots and there I'd agree. Supporting the Ryan budget plan is not what a moderate would do and I think he'll pull closer and closer to the right.

But as governor of my state, he was pretty moderate - which is why I think Obama picked him in the first place.

[LiberalFighter]

6. And I would say that even if one is a moderate whether Democrat or Republican

it does not mean they are moderate or centrist in regards to the public.

Personally, I believe that moderates are to the left of Democratic conservatives (Bayh, Blanche, Baucus)

[Drunken Irishman]

7. That's what is difficult about centrism...

It's tricky to define because, as I said in my original post, no one can truly be a centrist. If you are, it's solely because you're apathetic and answered with a, "I don't give a fuck..." to the question. Yet, ironically, even that can be construed as a position. If someone says, "are you for gay marriage..." and you reply with that answer, you could, whether you think it or not, be supporting such a position - since indifference, in this case, is closer to support than it is opposition (which is almost always the case).

If that makes any sense, haha!

Now is Huntsman to the left of Lincoln, Bayh and Baucus? I think on some issues, probably. On others? No.

What about Lieberman? Is Lieberman a conservative Democrat or a moderate Democrat? Lieberman might have a conservative foreign policy worldview, but he's pretty liberal on social issues, right? I'd say Lieberman is a moderate Democrat because his social stances balance with his foreign policy warmongering.

Huntsman was, up until recently I'm guessing, pretty socially moderate and, with his support of Obama's stimulus back in 2009, I can only guess he was economically moderate as well.

Now, though? Obviously he's changed his positions - so who the fuck knows.

But, like Romney, he was once a fairly moderate politician.

[center rising]

8. Lieberman is a moderate

His world view is definitely pro-Israel, but he has a strong record on civil rights and social issues.

I consider myself a moderate, but find I have no place in the Republican party. I also have to say, I find myself increasingly disaffected by the Democrats as well.