Americans love government spending -- when you start to talk specifics

[babylonsister]

Americans love government spending -- when you start to talk specifics
By Greg Sargent


The new Pew poll perfectly captures the contradiction at the heart of public attitudes towards government and spending -- and suggests that Dems could have an advantage in the comming battles over these topics, provided they handle it in the right way.

The poll finds that in general, more Americans think deficit reduction is a more important priority (49 percent) than spending to help the economy recover (46 percent). But check out what happens when Americans are asked what they think about spending on specific programs:



More favor an increase in spending than a decrease on 15 of 18 issues tested in the poll. Now, these numbers aren't all that clear cut. There seems to be substantial support for holding spending steady, and in many categories, the combined total of those who want to freeze spending or decrease spending is higher than the total who want to increase it. Also, support for spending decreases has edged up.

But the overall conclusion is clear: Once you start to talk specifics, suddenly the public's aversion to government spending rapidly evaporates.

more...

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/plum-line/2011/02/the_american_people_love_gover.html

[Clio the Leo]

1. yep nt

[Possumpoint]

2. It Has Been Said

That the downfall of the Republican Form of government happens when the citizens realize that they can vote in those who will return government largeness to them. Governments going broke but listen to them scream when anyone proposed cuts.

I predict that very little will be cut till we hit the wall. As we and the corporate donors scream, politicians will continue to kick the can down the road. When it all falls off the cliff, the cuts will be disastrously deep.

[RC]

3. Not all spending cuts are equal.

Entitlement programs are needed. Tax money flowing back to the states to help them maintain and build the infrastructure is needed spending.
Social Security, Medicare, medicaid, etc, help fend off bankruptcy. Single Payer, Universal Health Care would go a long way toward bringing down the debt. Why? because Discretionary spending would go up, because the health insurance companies would not still be gouging us.
Discretionary spending creates demand. Demand creates jobs (hopefully living wage jobs).

Wars, war toys, etc., are basically wasted because those helps no one except those in the business of war. Think parasites.
Bailing out failing banks, Wall Street, etc., does nothing to fix the basic problem as we have seen.

[Possumpoint]

4. Wake Up, Read What You Posted

You are the embodiment of what I said. All spending is equal, yet in your mind it is good versus bad. You've set a decision process that equates good versus evil spending. When it comes to government that is meaningless. It's all allocations. There is so much money budgeted and decisions are made where it goes. The cross roads we are at is that spending is way out of whack with revenues. It is time to realize that all spending must be reduced. We can no longer afford all the commitments made. Cuts must be made across the board, no scared cows.

The only way to mitigate cuts is to raise taxes. With the GOP in charge in the house that isn't likely to happen.

Don't worry, I'm a deficit hawk. I believe in equality in cuts. I don't think that will happen anytime soon. I believe that our politicians will kick the can down the road for as long as they can. When things fall apart, the cuts required then will be deep indeed.

[patrice]

5. I understand why you are saying this, but it seems that your assumption is that we are going off tha

t cliff, no matter what, anyway and this is what justifies making no attempt at establishing any kind of priorities for cutting what/how much, because none of that prioritization is going to prevent going off of that cliff.

Right?

If that is the correct assumption, why not try to create some disaster capital for dealing with that cliff? Why not be strategic enough to provide, if not golden parachutes, at least enough that when some resources hit the bottom, damage it mitigated at least enough that they can help take care of the casualties and give whatever survives the fall some chance of legs to stand back up on?

Since it's all just digits anyway, why not just take a strategic stand for a pile of digits dedicated to providing what people will need to start over?

[Possumpoint]

7. When And If

We go off the cliff our money as we know it will become nearly worthless. Why do I say that? It is as the paper says, a promissory note based on the good faith of the US Government. When investors realize we will no longer be good for repayment, inflation will eat up the value at a record rate.

Disaster capital on what level? On a governmental level how do you keep the politicians hands off it? On a personal level, those with more can set aside more. Those without are screwed. The real trick is to stock up on goods, gold and silver. These will be in demand. Then if you stock up, you have to maintain it and protect it.

[patrice]

6. Isn't your assumption also that everything will fall off the cliff at the same rate & hit the

rocks below at the same momentum, so why favor one victim more than another, when in fact, that's not the case at all. Those without protection are going to fall faster and harder than anyone else, even though many of them had the least amount of power to change the "push."

[Possumpoint]

9. The Power Is To Wake Up NOW!

To see what is coming and take action to avoid it. Collapse the Empire. Reduce spending across the the board. Redirect our efforts to provide for our citizens, not to influence the world to do our bidding by bribes or force.

The going off the cliff is not inevitable except by inaction of inadequate action by our political leaders. It's up to the voters to wake up and see what's happening and take action. The corporations won't do it they're as happy as pigs in poo. The politicians don't seem to have the stones to do it.

[patrice]

10. I agree with all of that except "by our political leaders" which I bet we don't disagree over either

This is one of my objections to all of the flap about President Obama.

Right now, the WHOLE thing is about us: are we getting ourselves together, informed, committed, active, responsible? Who is? Who isn't?!! THIS is our PRIMARY responsibility and all of this flap about Obama is just jerking-off until there's actually a base that CAN deliver on one or more issues.

I've been around Greens for a long time, so I'm kind of cynical about some people's idea of what revolution is. There are also many self-justifying cop-outs, with pseudo-Libertarian leanings, amongst the younger generations and I'm NOT down with anyone who thinks it's smart to sit-this-out, wait for it to crash and burn from it's own inertia, and, then, "pick up the pieces" and build something "new". Aside from the fact that doing NOTHING for anyone but themselves will have an effect on how "the pieces fall" that could = suffering, destruction, and even death when they do come down, my other issue with that approach is that I believe in "Real Value in exchange for Real Value", so people who think they are going to be good ________________ if/when the system self-destructs, all they have to do is wait and criticize as much as possible, in order to help bring it all down and then "pick up the pieces" . . . in my value system, have not done the work that justifies their leadership in any degree, no matter how good their ideas are, in the construction of what is next.

In short, I think many of the solutions could rise out of Adam Smith's definition of Real Value. Labor is Real Value. Labor is Real Capital and when all or most other forms of more arbitrary value crash, what we need to do to start over is agree to Real Value in exchange for Real Value. Begin with Labor in exchange for Labor and anyone who is sitting on the sidelines, not assisting actively with the issues, just waiting for things to change is part of the problem, not the solution, no matter what leftie label they paste on themselves.

This are the reasons why I think it is a mistake to make what's happening tooooooooo much about Obama. There are things we need to say to one another to make certain things clear, because labels are NOT enough, they are NOT Real Value. Productive work is.

[Dawson Leery]

8. k/r