Check in here if you're pro-Obama and anti-escalation

[Ken Burch]

True loyalty to the man means opposing the choice that would destroy him.

[vaberella]

1. I can't wait to see the posts here.

I bet not many.

[KansasVoter]

2. I am pro-Obama and anti War and anti patriot act. And glad McCain isn't president!

[sandnsea]

3. He hasn't announced his strategy

How can anybody have an opinion on a strategy that hasn't been announced. That is telling in itself - especially from people who now admit they didn't even vote for him - or Kerry or Gore and probably not Clinton either.

[Ken Burch]

4. I DID vote for him. So did almost everyone here who opposes escalation

You militarists are not the arbiters of who is entitled to speak.

[Cha]

6. Quit throwing names around..she's not a militarist.

[knightinwhitesatin]

43. She is a-ok

with risking my life for no good reason. She is a-ok with sending 30,000 more Americans to kill people who had nothing to do with 9/11, she is a-ok with the thousands of upcoming Afghani and hundreds of upcoming American deaths..........if it goose steps like a militarist.............

[sandnsea]

10. Check out yesterday's threads

A surprising number of Obama bashers didn't vote for him and are finally admitting it. I know a few have told me privately that they didn't vote for him because they lived in a state where he didn't need any votes. I suspect more will tell the truth as time goes on.

Regardless, the point stands. How can anybody have an opinion about Obama's Afghanistan strategy when he hasn't announced it yet. You're already certain that he needs to be bashed, when you don't even know what the additional troops are going to do over there. Maybe they're going to build schools, you don't know.

[Fire1]

30. I don't know about anybody else but those not voting for him

have been quite transparent to me.

[jtrockville]

5. I don't think he'd have started this war.

He's left with *'s mess. I think Obama ahs carefully weighed all options and made the choice he thinks is best for all involved. I do not think he's decided to escalate for the purpose of profiteering, but I do wish he'd made a different decision.

[boomerbust]

7. I voted for him

In the primary and general because he had the balls to say he would escalate in Afghanistan, the place where the planning of the 9-11 attacks took place. And to end the war in Iraq responsibly. And apparently a majority of the American people agreed with that strategy.

[tomg]

8. I am pro-Obama (odd thing

to say), and I am strongly anti-escalation ( I am actually for immediate withdrawal). I feel it is in the country's best interests and his presidency's best interests ( and right now, despite some misgivings and many disagreements with specific policy decisions, I truly believe that our country's best long-term interests are in his presidency's success) to oppose any escalation. Should he escalate, I feel I will have to actively work against that decision.

To an extent, I have to hold myself culpable. Before the election I was far more active in the anti-war movement that I was in Democratic politics. After President Obama's elections, I let it slide. I am an anti-war, very left-leaning progressive first and a Democrat second. If I and many others stayed active and kept hitting the streets and continued to make our voices heard, who knows. He said, in essence, we had to take part and be responsible. I would alter your line in one way: true loyalty to the country means opposing the choice that would destroy it.


edit: typo

[Ken Burch]

20. I accept your alteration of that line.

Those who are opposing escalation are defending the true values of what Bruce Springsteen called "the country that is in our hearts".

[SIMPLYB1980]

9. Pro Obma and Pro escalation.

Just wanted to posts so I can follow the stupid. :evilgrin:

[BeFree]

12. So

You think we have to fight them over there?
So we don't have to fight them over here?

[SIMPLYB1980]

13. I think we have to fight them in both places.

:shrug:

[Cha]

15. All over the Planet.

[BeFree]

16. Why?

What can they possibly do to us? Seriously.

The government failed leading up to 9/11. Haven't we learned the lesson. Do you fear they will fail again?

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[BeFree]

23. Fool?

That after all the government has done and the billions spent that it is foolish to think that it was all a waste and that I must continue to live in fear?

So, you live in fear?

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[BeFree]

28. I have no fear

Except that we are making more enemies everyday by bombing them over there.

If we are talking about fools, it is those who think the MIC is gonna protect them. Did not the MIC fail us on 9/11?

Only fools would think that killing innocents in a land far, far away, is gonna do anything to keep them safe here.

[SIMPLYB1980]

29. So you say you have no fear,

and then you go on to explain what you a fearful of. :rofl:

[BeFree]

32. Got me

I am fearful. Fearful that people like you are willing to wage war and just ignore the innocent lives that become collateral damage in your warmongering activities.

Right? I should live in fear of people who express warmongering. Right?

So, if it appears you are terrorizing me, I have the right to stop you by any means necessary? Is that the world you want?

[SIMPLYB1980]

35. LoL!

:rofl: :popcorn:

[Cha]

18. I'm not in fear..I'm in reality.

The bushcheney regime failed us..PO's is trying to make sure nothing happens again.

[avaistheone1]

19. Both places? Al qaeda is in about 100 different countries. Do you want war going on everywhere

and forever? There are less than 100 Al Qaeda in Iraq if that many.

Obama's mission makes no sense at all.

[SIMPLYB1980]

26. No shit and we fight them in all of those places.

We just don't have to use our military every time because most of those countries want to get rid of their crazy people as bad as we do.

[avaistheone1]

27. If that were true why aren't they doing it?

[SIMPLYB1980]

33. Most of them deal with it internally with help from

the US and our Allies.
http://www.marinebuzz.com/2009/05/31/weekend-view-gis-visuals-of-sri-lanka%E2%80%99s-war-on-terrorism-1981-2009/

http://www.marinebuzz.com/2009/02/22/weekend-view-underwater-scooters-of-terrorists-captured-in-sri-lanka/

http://www.strategypage.com/qnd/nigeria/articles/20090828.aspx

A google search can turn up the info you want, but I bet you would just say none of the sources are good enough for you.

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&safe=off&q=terrorists+captured+2009&aq=f&aqi=&oq=&fp=6b22d27f49a5e7dd

[Ken Burch]

34. You're calling for World War III?

Great.

[SIMPLYB1980]

38. Nope but keep trying.

[Ken Burch]

39. That's what "fighting them in every country" would mean.

And such a fight would drain all our country's resources for ANY progressive gains. That money would just vanish and never be regained.
Nothing that would come of the results of such a war could outweigh that.

[boppers]

46. We're fighting child labor in every country.

We're fighting rape in every country.
We're fighting drug-running in every country.

"Fighting them in every country" doesn't necessarily mean "massive troop deployments" in every country.

[Ken Burch]

57. Fights against child labor and rape don't ever involve troops

(Also, since or economic policy is STILL globalist, are you actually SURE this country is fighting against child labor?)

[freddie mertz]

59. Not if you are still wearing those sports clothes.

Made by child-slave laborers in China or Honduras.

Free trade!

Hooray!

[boppers]

65. Please define your sense of the word "globalist" for me.

We seem to be using it in different ways.

[MISSDem]

11. I voted for Obama but if he

does not end this war, I won't again.

[MissDeeds]

41. Same here

This war cannot be confined to any region or locale. It is about an ideology that has been centuries in the making. We cannot quell an ideology through military measures. We cannot bomb these people into democracy or submission. Obama needs to end this war and bring our troops home.

[Divine Discontent]

58. DITTO. I don't vote for warmongers.

[TheKentuckian]

14. That would be me. He didn't stutter on the trail and I didn't think he was BSing

but I increasingly think this is a horrible and pretty stupid idea to throw all of this blood and money onto cold gravel for nothing more than a hope and a prayer at increased safety that admittedly may actually make things worse and will certainly cost huge sums of money that desperately need to be invested in America and her people not wasted on making dumbasses feel we're tough on terror and therefore all is well in their little worlds.

I'll be listening.

My mind isn't closed but I haven't heard a good case for keeping this game up and further doubling down yet. I'll give him room to make his pitch but I feel its likely that I'll strongly oppose any increase in footprint, continued use of what I feel to be unconstitutional forces raised by the Executive branch, or any massive investment over there. That doesn't mean I would no longer generally support the President but I'll need convincing not to actively seek funding be killed for what I see as a wasteful misadventure.

[avaistheone1]

21. I truly we wish we would just open up a hole in the earth and plow all that money into it

rather than further ignite Afghanistan. It would be cheaper and safer to do so.

[Liberation Angel]

22. me

nt

[Ken Burch]

24. Thanks. You're taking an unpopular stand here.

n/t.

[ClassWarrior]

31. Well said.

NGU.

[Ken Burch]

37. +an unimaginable number

LBJ is shaking his non-corporeal head sadly somewhere.

[tilsammans]

40. Wow, that's really well done and so spot on, but . . .

. . . I could just cry. :cry:

This is not good.

[MissDeeds]

42. Wish Obama could see this

And I wish I could k&r your post.

[freddie mertz]

36. I still support him, especially against his Repuke enemies

But I think he is making some pretty bad policy decisions of late.

The unending, deranged chorus of the "peppers" does nothing to help either.

[quakerboy]

44. I'm here

As a pacifist, it should be no surprise that I am anti war. And I am very proud of having elected Barack Obama President of the United States of America.

And I figured he was going to do this in Afghanistan. He told us so. That dosnt make it a smart idea, and my primary support was in spite of this, not because of it. It would be a survivable mistake, if everything else were going smoothly. If he can maintain his voting base.

What's our status in Iraq? Thats the one that seems to have gotten very quiet lately, and the one that was a bit surprising to me. I was hoping he would bring that to an end, but last I heard, the plan called for leaving tens of thousands of troops there indefinitely.

[Sebastian Doyle]

45. I only wish Obama would be pro-Obama himself tomorrow

He started his political career with a speech that said "I'm against DUMB wars". Now he needs to prove it, and end this one.

[cliffordu]

47. Checking in. I support the Prez in whatever he thinks needs to happen.

I hate the options in Afghanistan. I just fucking hate all of them. Just leaving seems to be the worst of the bunch.

[Ichingcarpenter]

49. Checking in and Ditto on what you wrote n/t

[cliffordu]

50. Yo!! How ya been??

[Ichingcarpenter]

52. My health is much better than it was

Working a few days/hours a week now, I couldn't do that before.

I'm getting a legal medication that helps my arthritis that I couldn't get in
the states.

[cliffordu]

53. You got out??? Where are ya???

(copenhagen ??)

[Ichingcarpenter]

54. sent you a PM....... n/t

[DonCoquixote]

48. Checking in

I will vote for him in 2012, albeit, the GOP could put in someone that was a mixture of Superman, Jesus, and Keith Olbermann, and I would not vote for them.

Yeah Yeah, Third party, until they actually do the work and get some Governors, Congessman, and Senators, they have no chance to change anything. I am sure if he was President, Nader or Kucin ich would do a lot of screaming, but if nothing else, we have learned the bully pulpit is dead, especially when against the MsM. If we want change, we need to deal with congress.

[Life Long Dem]

51. How would anyone know this war would destroy Obama?

Maybe some should be sitting in Obama's seat if they know the answers?

[ClassWarrior]

55. All we have is history as our guide...

NGU.

[ClassWarrior]

56. And let's not forget the history of the Soviets in Afghanistan as well.

NGU.

[Lindsey]

60. I'm going to hear what the man has to say. I think he's smarter

than I am and gee, he probably knows a little more about the situation than I do. I doesn't seem that some folks have really thought about what might happen if we just pulled out now. There's probably just a little bit more to the story.

[ClassWarrior]

63. I want to hear what he has to say too. I was just answering Life Long Dem's question.

I'm guessing we haven't heard all of his plan just yet.

But since you bring it up, what do you think might happen if we just pulled out now?

NGU.

[Jennicut]

61. I am very pro-Obama as many have seen from my posts here. But I strongly disagree with an escalation

I just see Afghanistan as a lost cause at this point. Its a 9 year old war. 9 years ago I had just gotten out of college. This thing has been going on a long, long time. And we are naive to think we can conquer what other countries just as powerful could not. I wonder why we are even there anymore as we seem to just be chasing the Al Queda all around at this point. However, I do think Obama did not just jump into his decision quickly and did take time to think over the consequences. But I can't help that think he will lose some of his base over this and he will never win over any Rethugs. Politically, it seems not very smart.

[Jeff In Milwaukee]

62. The escalation is one of several bad options

I don't like it, and I'm not sure I agree with it. But that being said, I can't say for sure that it's not the right answer.

Wishy-Washy enough fer ya?!

Other Option: Complete and Immediate Withdrawal. That leaves open the possibility of a resurgence of the Taliban and allows a terrorist state to exist on the border with Pakistan -- which is a card-carrying member of the Nuclear Club and not entirely stable itself. That's a pretty grim prospect.

Other Option: Phased Withdrawal. Has prety much the same drawbacks as immediate withdrawal only with a higher U.S. body count.

I don't think a surged in troops (by itself) is going to accomplish anything. There has to be political reform in Afghanistan -- we have to cultivate a stronger core of leaders who are willing to join with the rest of the world and denounce terrorism. That's going to take time, and if a surge in troops is going to quell the unrest long enough for those reforms to take root and stabilize the country, it may be a necessary evil.

[PVnRT]

64. K, too late to R

[Voltaire]

66. Count me as for Obama

And against us being stuck in any sandbox any where. End the War on SOME Terra NOW!

[Douglas Carpenter]

67. I am most certainly pro-Obama and I hope he is right - but I sincerely don't think so

That last thing in the world I would want is for the Obama Administration to stumble into a catastrophic blunder. I am old enough to remember how the Great Society died in Viet Nam and we ended up with Richard Nixon.

I still hold President Obama in very, very high regard and feel that in many ways he remains the best hope this world has for defusing some of the most insolvable tensions.

Unfortunately, on-the-ground realities of what Afghanistan is really like makes success appear to me to be highly, highly improbable.

[CBR]

68. I fall into this camp. I respect the President

immensely. I like his governing style and his Spock-like demeanor. I think he understand governing and the painstaking steps in the policy making process. He listens, he reviews alternatives etc... I do not like the decision in Afghanistan but that does not lead me to post quotes from Nazis as comparative points of reference.