A bag of cats on the way to the river

[nadinbrzezinski]

will be more unified and with single purpose than we are.

Look folks, we have very nasty personal attacks even against education by centrists.

And of course some of us progressives will answer in kind.

You know what? We were unified over KO. It WAS a taste of that power we have as a people. Granted, MOST causes will take at times a life time to achieve. But we wil continue to fight each other. Why? The country IS THAT DAMN DIVIDED, and truly what sells in my neck of the woods don't in Texas, for example. It really don't... and this is not just a divide between democrats and republicans. this is futizing around the edges. These are different countries... with different cultures and different attitudes.

I really cannot wait for the end of Empire, I really cannot...

[Taverner]

1. I kind of agree

San Francisco, USA and Vancouver, Canada have more in common than San Francisco and, say Atlanta, USA.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. Absolutely, I spent about a month

in February in Cleveland OH. Now when you go in as a tourist you don't notice this. But it was in interesting ways, attitudes shall we say, that you could tell. I love my brother, but he does live in what to me was a foreign country.

That is when that theory got sort of tested. The other thing is all those factories are just shells...

[Ozymanithrax]

3. Well, I'm a liberal not a progressive...

because I still don't know what the modern progressive movement stands for.

I can wait for the ugliness that precedes and follows the collapse of empire. But it won't be my choice. History stops for no man.

After the ass whupping in 2008, Republicans went through a period of turmoil. I am hoping that this is our turmoil. But it looks more like a circular firring squad.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. I am actually a social democrat

alas most people don't know what that is...

And to the firing squad, pass the ammo, will ya?

[nofurylike]

5. if only the same intensity of reaction had been directed, raged!, at

people's own sens and reps over unacceptable policies and upcoming votes, ah?

including their repuke sens and reps.

we show up for our stars, though. shows we are capable.

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. STOP... it is not with elected officials where this is

it is with MOVEMENT politics. As much as we might critique the racist Tea hadits, they got it well (and they are well financed) but they got it.

The MOVEMENT started way back in '72... stop thinking Congress will do what you want to do until we form a CONTINUING movement. It will take a lifetime.

[Jakes Progress]

7. Easier to blame Congress.

That's how the tea-party does it. Even members of Congress attack Congress when they are running for office.

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. BUT they are part of a movement

a movement that has control of the media, your school boards et al.

Jesus, is it this damn complex? The only way to get anything done in this country IS through movement politics.

[Jakes Progress]

14. Whoa. You are being agreed with.

Jesus, is it necessary to make this so damn complex?

[nofurylike]

9. "STOP"? whoa. aye aye. nt

[laughingliberal]

10. Too late for me. My lifetimes almost over. nm

[nadinbrzezinski]

11. I'm half way there too

but the New Deal did not come from the good will of FDR... as much as we want to tell ourselves this...

It came FROM MOVEMENT politics, starting actually in the 1880s.

[treestar]

12. The KO bit is easy

That's what you come together over? Not a very serious or worthy cause. The rest require a lot more than a couple of days.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. SHHH it is called a beginning

I am fully aware this is MOVEMENT POLITICS...

But hey whatever...

Let's continue doing exactly what we are doing, since well shit. we know it works so well...

:sarcasm:

That said on a grim note the fall of empire cannot come soon enough...