How we think about the left (fighting the last war)

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

Since WWII it has not been "legitimate" in America to be on the left.

This is because the left is primarily defined as, "that which is not legitimate."

The modern Democratic Party, the Party of FDR, is a centrist institution promising a moderate way to contain international socialism. A referee between labor and capital. (While Republicans had come to directly represent capital.)

From 1848- WWII the fate of the west was genuinely up in the air... would it become socialist or remain capitalist? FDR is widely credited (correctly or not) with preserving capitalism in the USA by compromising with socialism enough to bleed off revolution or otherwise explosive populism.

The argument for liberalism as firewall between the west and "the left" made sense when there was a real left of organized millions being contained. Being in the middle was a fairly progressive place to be because capital had all the chips so any sustainable equilibrium required making things better for labor.

But in the world of today there is no potent American left, and most American leftists are to the right of where the left used to be, even sometimes espousing 'crazy' things that were centrist decades ago.

The center of the American left is about where the center of European politics is. The left here is globally mainstream.

So the Democratic Party role of protecting America from the left is nonsensical today. In fact, liberalism, which used to be the prudent, tempered solution, is now widely defined as left!

As the left became smaller and more mainstream the ongoing need for the Democratic Party to have an excluded left to be moderate in relation became a steady drag to the right. (One of many structural factors that draw the Democratic Party to the right even as our national demographic trends suggest the opposite.)

[zipplewrath]

1. You are, of course, correct

I have to laugh about what the right wingers consider to be "lefty" or liberal. They have no clue. Even what most folks consider to be "socialist", is not. The entire American political debate is about what level of government regulation is appropriate. The FAR right argues that there is no such thing as "appropriate government regulation". The "true" far left would argue that government shouldn't regulate, they would argue that the government should directly control.

We don't even get to have that debate. Neither the "left" nor the "right" will allow it. Obama dismisses single pay out of hand, not even allowing them to participate in the debate. The GOP was in control for 12 years, but the FCC, the FAA, FDA, NIH, Dept of Ed, etc. etc. are all still there. They never even debated ending regulation of industry, they merely tried to reduce the size. Both sides reduced banking regulation, but neither side eliminated it. And there was precious little public debate about it.

One of my major frustrations is that political trends for the last 40 years have been essentially to the "right". Since the end of LBJ, the left has felt some need to "apologize" for all the progressive changes that they accomplished from FDR to LBJ. Kinda strange considering that this includes Medicare, Social Security, Food Stamps, and the Voting Rights Act. We ought to be known as the "Party of Medicare". Our slogan should be "Did you work a 40 hour week? Thank a democrat". Instead we proclaim that we've found a "thrid way" as if there was something wrong with the direction we were on. We were on a super highway to prosperity, the GOP wanted to turn around, and someone thought it would be a great idea to take the gravel road.

Third way my ass.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

2. Yes. Single payer shows it in sharpest relief

To exclude the straight-forward, simple "right answer" as being obviously too extreme to even debate said it all.

Off course we weren't going to get single-payer but the outright exclusion of "how the civilized world handles this problem" deformed the result.

[OHdem10]

3. Excellent post. I feel like challenging any Democratic Member

on the Hill to show us the so called Center.

I am a Liberal but would not be considered a Lefty.

Here is my observation.

I do believe that when the DLC, Centrists whatever
were formed they had a basically reasonable and some
might say good idea.

Over the years especially the last eight years, the
GOP have become so hard right and Tom DeLay very proudly
pointed out in his book how they were able to govern
and pull the legislators right of Center Right. Moving
toward far right.

Here is how I am using Center etc.

Take a sheet of paper and draw a line down the center
On one side of the line you have all Lefties and on
the other side of the Line you have all Righties.
There is no group know as Center. On one side you
have varying degrees Far Right Center Right and
a little right of Center. Likewise, on the Left


Pollsters will tell you that Independents divide
into two groups. Lean Democrat Lean Republican.
Because they are not committed, they can swing each
election. There is no group of Independent sitting
somewhere with their own set of ideas. They are
people who watch and see what each party has to offer.
Often they are ticket splitters. They will vote for
the Republican for one office and Democrat for another.

I maintain that Tom DeLay and GWB were able to take
country way past center to almost far right. The
DLC Centrist and Blue Dogs lost sight of the Center
and followed them over.

We have not seen the Center in this country in a long
time. Even now Obama's Policies are a little Right
of Center. He has to work with DLC Centrist Blue Dogs.

I am not being meanspirited. I just think everyone
has lost their way. The farther Right the Democratic
Party goes, we will end up digging GWB's hole deeper.

I am not asking for some Far Left Policy. I am asking
let us at least go back to the center.

Just because Republicans scream Obama turned Left--does
not make it true. To a Rock Ribbed Republican Center
right is Liberal. Look at the people they have purged.

Sure I would be most happy Center Left. God, Right now
I beg get off the Right Wing Highway and come back
to the Center. There is a difference between the
Center for the Country and Center Right. A world of
Difference.