'We Americans are all immigrants – we must stop the old turning on the new'

[Bluebear]

A woman describes her feelings as she starts a campaign to stop Arizona's new anti-immigration law.....

Angelica Salas, 39, is travelling to Phoenix, Arizona, today along with 50 people from her campaign, the Coalition for Humane Immigrant Rights of Los Angeles, to challenge the new anti-immigration law.

"We're still going to demonstrate because this is just a preliminary injunction to the new law, it's not a defeat of the law as such. We want everybody to fully understand that the threat has not gone away.

"We've been here before. Through this country's history we have done wrong by people who were believed not to be American citizens. Yet the thing about America is that everybody here is an immigrant, and we must stop repeating the pattern.

"I came to America from Mexico when I was five, crossing the border with my sister to join my parents who were undocumented workers. My father worked as a groom at the race track, in laundries and as a roofer. My mother was in the garment industry.

"We were lucky – we managed to use a one-off amnesty to gain legalisation in 1980 before Ronald Reagan shut off the opportunity in 1986.

"When people ask me what all these undocumented immigrants are doing in this country, I reply: 'We are working for you, making this country great. We are looking after your children, making your houses beautiful, tending your gardens, so that you can thrive and raise your families. We are working for you.'"

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/jul/28/arizona-campaign-immigration-law

[LostInAnomie]

1. I'm against the Arizona law to prevent Hispanic citizens from being harrassed by police...

... not because I care about illegal immigrants. As far as I'm concerned, they are illegally here and should leave, and the businesses that hire them should be fined out of existence.

[Ernesto]

11. Sheriff Arpaio? Hmmmmmm.

Sounds like a foreigner's name to me.

[Booster]

13. Amen to that. I'm very mixed on this situation. I do not condone

both the illegals and the businesses that hire them breaking our laws. To me they are both criminals and should be prosecuted. Having said that, I really don't think this fight is being fought fairly, and they are NEVER going to go after the criminals that do the hiring because they give all of the politicians money in ways we don't even know about. In my opinion, we can't pick and choose which laws we will stand by while ignoring others and that's exactly what's happening here.

[marmar]

2. Glad she got a forum.....in the British press.

The U.S. media only cares about the Teabag perspective.

[Romulox]

3. I'm not an immigrant, and neither were my great-grandparents.

I may become an emigrant someday, but I am not an immigrant. 4th generation, white trash. :hi:

[Romulox]

4. Also, I don't have a nanny, housekeeper, or gardener.

Those are things that only the very wealthy have in the US. Saying that you are "tending my garden" tends to be an insult to the majority who have no stoop labor. :hi:

[Bluebear]

8. What an odd thing to get all insulted about. Sorry she hurt your feelings though!

[Romulox]

9. It's not odd at all; it's just that the media (and perhaps you?) are tone-deaf as to issues of class

She many tend the gardens of the rich, but most of us are not rich. So her entire argument falls flat.

[Hello_Kitty]

12. Actually a lot of middle class people here use undocumented labor for domestic chores

Makes them feel all affluent and special. Meanwhile, their teenage and young adult kids loll around the house all day because they're too precious to do housework or yard work or get a real job.

[pitohui]

17. oh brother the old "they do the job americans won't do" canard

what "real job" is left for a kid to get when the undocumented guy is doing the lawn work for nothing??? i don't call it "lolling around" if a kid at least expects min. wage for his efforts

i don't know what "middle class" people you know who can afford to hire undocumented labor to do their chores, maybe "middle class" people who are actually earning $200K a year and are in fact WEALTHY people who pretend they care fuck all abt the real working/middle class

the undocumented person who does lawn work, construction work, etc. is doing real damage to our communities, because there are only so many jobs to go around, and when someone is willing to work off the books for a wage that an american can't live on, that is very harmful to our communities

i thought unemployment was highest among young black teens, i don't think they're "lolling around" telling their mexican butler to fetch them another corona, i think they're being (intentionally) destroyed by a systematic process of denying them real jobs -- part of that systematic process involves the long term republican policies of turning a blind eye to illegal immigration and undocumented workers

liberals who fall for this scam are just pathetic, a scab is still a scab, a pig wearing lipstick is still a pig

[Hello_Kitty]

19. ITA with you re: "jobs Americans won't do" being a canard

But I'm specifically talking about the children of middle and upper middle class people in Arizona (I personally know several) who live at home and have no chores and they and their parents think they are too good for service jobs. These families are creating the demand for landscapers and housekeepers (which are not a large percentage of the undocumented workforce). And most of them make far less than $200K a year. It's just that it's so cheap to hire someone to clean the house or mow the lawn and it's easier than getting the kid to do it. This is a different situation than what you rightly point out about unemployment among young working class adults.

I am NOT a liberal falling for the scam. I totally get that employers use undocumented workers to drive down wages and working conditions.

[Riftaxe]

26. a fairly shocking claim,

surely you can back that up? I know of one family that has an au pair from Spain (part time while she attends college here) and that family is certainly not middle class.

[Hello_Kitty]

27. I have a good friend who probably makes $60K a year, tops

Uses a housekeeper and a landscaper while his 21 year old son (who as far as I know has never cleaned his own bedroom or bathroom) does nothing but attend a few community college classes. When I told my friend that the convenience store near me was hiring at a pretty good hourly wage my friend told me he wanted "better things" for his son. That's just one example.

I live here in AZ and I can tell you that hiring undocumented people to do domestic chores is commonplace and it's not only rich people doing it. That said, I'm NOT making a generalization about American workers or immigration from my local observations.

[Bluebear]

24. (and perhaps you?) - - - Yeah, that was necessary.

Conversation over unfortunately.

[EFerrari]

28. Just about everyone in the middle class neighborhood I lived in

in SoCal had gardeners and house cleaners. There was nothing special about that neighborhood and no wealthy people lived there.

[nadinbrzezinski]

30. Do you go to a restaurant from time to time?

Guess who washes the dishes?

Just saying.

You eat tomatoes, or strawberries? See here, who picks them up.

You may not DIRECTLY hire these folks, but... like all other immigrants, that includes your great, great great... who DID come to this country... do the bottom jobs.

That is just a historic reality.

The only people who can say what you typed, and mean it, are those who came across from Asia oh way back when, and the descendants of the Clovis People. Aka Native Americans, Amerindians or other names you may use. Yes son, I am digging deep in History.

[Political_Junkie]

5. "We Americans are all immigrants"

Yes!
"Let's go road block trippin' in the middle of the night
Up in Gainesville town
There'll be blue lights flashin' down the long dirt road
When they ask us to step out
They say, "We be looking for illegal immigrants
Can we check your car?"
I say, "You know it's funny I think we were on the same boat
Back in 1694."
And I said, oo la-la-la-la-la, shame on you..." - Indigo Girls

[provis99]

6. did that lady just admit she was an illegal immigrant?

Don't let the door hit ya on the way out, Salas.

[Name removed]

7. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[DevonRex]

10. NO, she did NOT. From the article:

"We were lucky – we managed to use a one-off amnesty to gain legalisation in 1980 before Ronald Reagan shut off the opportunity in 1986."

This woman was brought here at the age of 5, through no fault of her own. Do you think she had a choice at that age. Still, she became a legal immigrant in 1980.

[Bluebear]

25. But reading the article wouldn't let him say "Don't let the door hit ya on the way out, Salas."

Disgusting.

[DevonRex]

33. Disgusting is right.

:hug: Bluebear.

[Curmudgeoness]

14. Unless you are full-blooded Native American, you ARE an immigrant.

Legal or illegal, the point is that this country has always used and abused the newest immigrants. I could go on and on about this issue, and how Arizona is (intentionally or unintentionally) targetting ever person of Hispanic origin, or anyone else who would look like they are (Native American, Italian, Greek, etc.). How would you like to have to carry your birth certificate around with you whenever you go to the grocery store? Because this is what will happen to the legal Hispanics.

What we need is a fairer immigration policy, and one that allows for easier access with work visas. Years ago, you did not have as many families coming through the deserts, you had young men who came to work and return to their families in Mexico. When you make it too hard to come for work, that is when you end up with the whole family coming together.

[JCMach1]

15. Even Native Americans at one point drug themselves to this continent

for the same reasons people still come... opportunity.

The conservative immigrants (i.e. freakin' repugs and teabarfers) in this country need to chill the fuck out already.

[JCMach1]

Even Native Americans at one point drug themselves to this continent

for the same reasons people still come... opportunity.

The conservative immigrants (i.e. freakin' repugs and teabarfers) in this country need to chill the fuck out already.

[JCMach1]

16. Even Native Americans at one point drug themselves to this continent

for the same reasons people still come... opportunity.

The conservative immigrants (i.e. freakin' repugs and teabarfers) in this country need to chill the fuck out already.

[LostInAnomie]

18. Why do we want to make it easier for companies to import cheap labor again?

It's not like there is a severe lack of actual citizens that need jobs already here.

The Arizona law needs to be destroyed because it will allow the harassment of legal citizens. That doesn't mean we need to make it easier for more people to cross the border.

[Curmudgeoness]

20. You will never ever stop people from coming across the border.

Well, unless the US gets into worse shape than Mexico. To allow them to come legally, you will at least be able to know who is here, how many are here, collect taxes, etc.

And if it is not illegal Mexicans, it will be some other group that will keep wages down. There will not be a time when the rich do not find a way to get wages as low as possible. When in history has the wealthy not exploited some group?

[LostInAnomie]

21. Fine the businesses that hire illegal immigrants out of business and they will stop coming.

Take away the jobs and they won't show up.

Just because the rich have historically always exploited some group doesn't mean we need to provide them an express lane for doing so.

[Curmudgeoness]

22. True, but don't hold your breath on fines, or laws without loopholes. nt

[blondeatlast]

23. You need to address this with the Mr/s. Best Western, Hilton, Sheraton, Princess,

Titlist, Nike, Ping, etc. You might also take it up with the snowbirds who invade my beautiful state every October.

Guess how Arizona makes its money--and who sweats it out on the greens, in the laundries, and the bus area?

[EFerrari]

29. Immigration was flat even before the crash when jobs started drying up.

But you're right. The same struggle gets replayed over and over although, undocumented immigrants pay into our economy in all kinds of ways. Our system has figured out how to strip them of their resources pretty efficiently.

[Curmudgeoness]

31. Our system has figured out how to strip us all of our resources.

But thank you for saying this. I hate when that same old bs comes out about how illegals contribute nothing to our country, pay no taxes.

[lumberjack_jeff]

35. Because we're racist if we don't give them your job. n/t

[Lance_Boyle]

32. Illegal Aliens are NOT 'immigrants.'

I wish DUers and the media would cease this deliberate muddying of the waters. Immigrants are people who come to the US legally and stay. Illegal aliens are here illegally and are basically just biding their time awaiting deportation.

[lumberjack_jeff]

34. +1

[Bluebear]

37. I wish I could lose those stubborn 15 pounds.

[uncommon]

36. I don't believe in immigration laws...

No joke. Human beings need to stop forcing each other into boxes.