Help Me Out Here--I Believe "Birthers" Have No Legal Argument AT ALL (Even IF They're Right)

[ChoppinBroccoli]

I've been thinking about this lately, and all I ever hear out of these "Birther" whack-jobs is that President Obama wasn't born in the United States, and therefore isn't qualified to be President. OK, let's just assume for a second that this little fantasy turns out to be true. I believe they STILL have no argument that disqualifies Obama from being President.

I received a cursory education on citizenship requirements while I was in Law School, and what I learned was that not only is any person born inside the United States considered AUTOMATICALLY a U.S. citizen, but any person born IN ANOTHER COUNTRY to a PARENT who is a U.S. citizen is ALSO considered AUTOMATICALLY a U.S. citizen. Obama's mother clearly was a U.S. citizen at the time of his birth, even if she weren't on U.S. soil at the time. So why does it MATTER where he was born?

In order to get around that little pitfall, I suspect "Birthers" would argue that the Constitution only says, "a U.S. citizen born in the United States," (OK, that is kind of a sophisticated argument to impute to this group of drooling morons, so I may be giving them just a bit too much credit here, but let's roll with it). I believe that "born in the United States" was intended by the Framers to mean "no naturalized citizens," rather than, "must be born within the geographical boundaries of the U.S." And I believe that argument would prevail too, when you consider the intent of that clause.

So aren't "Birthers" really out of the water on this one? I mean, I know neither they nor their Teabagger cohorts have ever READ the Constitution, nor do they understand anything contained within it, but has this simple concept REALLY escaped them? What am I talking about? We're talking about people who fell for a forged birth certificate written in crayon, here (oh yeah, and still yammer on about a "missing" birth certificate despite the fact that Obama posted his actual birth certificate on his website in the Summer of 2008 for all to see).

[aquart]

1. "even if they're right"?

Good freaking grief.

[hlthe2b]

12. My immediate thought as well. Damn...

:eyes:

[Cleita]

2. They don't even have a rational argument let alone a

legal one. Maybe we need to find a doctor or nurse who participated at the birth in Hawaii to sign an affidavit that they witnessed said child being born to shut them up for good. But they would probably still insist that he is a Kenyan because they are certifiably crazy.

[HawkerHurricane]

8. That wouldn't work.

They would call such a person a liar and a fraud.

I have said (to birthers) that his mother was a American Citizen, therefore he is a American Citizen. They try to argue that his mother was not a American Citizen 'yet' since she was below the age of 18. Or 21. Or was below that age when he was concieved. Or that she had renouced her U.S. citizenship before his birth, which was in Kenya or Indonesia and not in Hawaii no matter what the local newspaper said.

The only evidence they would accept was that which proved thier position. No evidence that contradicted that position could possibly be true, it must be fraudulent.

[pinboy3niner]

3. Taking Birthers seriously for even one second is absurd

:wtf:

[Ganja Ninja]

4. This is like trying to debate whether the earth is flat or round.

The answer is already a known fact but some people just won't let it go because they're just ornery assholes. You can discuss this with them until you're blue in the face and you'll never shut them up.

[Winterblues]

14. If anyone has ever been to Iowa they know for a fact the Earth is flat.

:silly:

[pnwmom]

5. They've got several "answers" for that one. There's something about the age of the

mother when she gave birth, and the number of years she had been out of the country, something about the father being a British national, giving Barack UK citizenship, and something about Barack losing any citizenship he did have when he was adopted by the 2nd husband and moved to Indonesia.

It's all a crock, and each of their arguments can be refuted, but they do have "answers" (flawed as they are) that address your point.

Bottom line is, there's a valid Hawaii birth certificate, plus a newspaper blurb at the time. Barack was born in Hawaii.

[zipplewrath]

6. You're thinking

They're not. Logic isn't going to affect someone who refuses to think.

It has been pointed out numerous times to this crowd that the law is completely against them on this matter. They just invent new laws that don't really exist.

We get the "his father was british and he was born in a former british colony" so he can't be a natural born citizen. None of that is remotely true.

They claim he wasn't born to his white mother.

They claim he renounced his citizenship.

Some nut job was claiming that Hawaii A) wasn't a state at the time (not true) anb B) because of that he wasn't born "in the states".

They're nuts. Thinking, much less studying or reading, is of no affect on them.

[cliffordu]

7. IBTGD!!!

[COLGATE4]

9. Giving credibility to birther's argument on Constitutional Law

is like cross examining a box of rocks.

[Bitwit1234]

10. Just remember they don't have a leg to stand on...because

precident was set when congress voted to allow Romney's father to run for president when his parents had given up their citizenship and Romney's father was born in Mexico. And tell me now, what does that do to Romney's citizenship..if his father wasn't a citizen even tho Romney was born here how can he be a citizen, when republicans want to take the right of children born to illegal aliens away citizenship away. Maybe someone should start a bro ha ha over that.

[caledesi]

11. "birthers" don't have enough $ to view his birth cert. in Hawaii? They are crazy! nt

[dtexdem]

13. They're not right; but your argument applies to another case:

that of John McCain, born in the Panama Canal Zone.

[Cleita]

15. I always wondered about that.

I too was born in a foreign country but of American parents, one natural born in the USA and the other naturalized. Although, I always had an American passport, as I was considered a citizen at birth, I was told that I could never run for the office of President. In McCain's case since he was born on an American military base in Panama, supposedly it's considered American land like an American Embassy is, but among my peers of army brats and other kids born to ex-pats in foreign lands none of them ever thought they had a right to run for President. I mean. Really what is the law? No one seems to really know and it's all very vague. Also, another friend born at sea on a ship of American registry to American parents also was considered an American at birth, but he too was told that he could not be President. Do any immigration lawyers really know clearly what the law is? I think McCain should not be eligible to be President myself.

[Atticus]

16. "Even IF They're Right"?

GAG!!!