What was this country's finest moment?

[mix]

I would have to say the defeat of the Axis powers in WWII.

The stakes could not have been higher for the world.



You get one choice.

[JVS]

1. Moon landing

[mix]

3. great choice nt

[tridim]

12. I'd say the entire space program..

From Gemini to Hubble, and all the other brilliant tools we're deploying to unravel the secrets of the Universe.

It's a long series of stunning human achievements.

[HEyHEY]

73. You mean the FAKE moon landing?

;)
I kid, of course.

[JVS]

81. Hoodwinking the world into believing it was a great achievement!

The hardest part was convincing the Soviets that we had done it. Fortunately we had arranged for Brezhnev to replace Krushchev, who would never have gone along.
;-)

[arbusto_baboso]

99. Absolutely. The greatest moment of not just this country, but the human species.

Gives me chills every time I think about it.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

2. I agree

That was back when there was a REAL threat to the rest of the world- and we did a proper clean up/reformation afterwards.

[rpannier]

4. The Surrender of the British in the Revolutionary War

It was the beginning of the nation
Yours is way up there on my list

[mix]

7. A great moment, no doubt, but made entirely possible by France.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Chesapeake

[rucky]

29. Great. We peaked at birth.

[Ishoutandscream2]

5. The Civil Rights movement. The mobilization of the Counter-Culture

Working to end the war and fighting discrimination.

[mix]

14. I deeply admire those events/movements as well.

:)

[EFerrari]

21. "Beyond Viet Nam"

http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/mlkatimetobreaksilence.htm

[Ishoutandscream2]

26. Thanks, my good friend

Dr. King was warned that this was a very risky stance to take. Of course, he was right and it needed to be addressed. Thanks again for the link.

[EFerrari]

28. Martin was reviled for that speech.

From nearly every quarter. What a great man he was.

[Ishoutandscream2]

32. Yes, it took guts. Dr. King knew it had to be addressed

The date of that speech always stayed with me. April 4, 1967 - on that same date the next year, he would be assassinated.

[G_j]

55. & you can listen at that link

that can be a life altering experience!
:thumbsup:

[Canuckistanian]

45. I think you've got it

It showed that ANY nation, now matter how powerful, could rise above it's petty bigotries to make an example to the world.

It was a mighty statement.

[MgtPA]

92. I agree! The majority of those civil rights workers who marched into the belly of the beast

(1964 Mississippi) were CHILDREN.

[11 Bravo]

6. I agree (but Anita Bryant catching a pie in the snot locker runs a close second.)

[branders seine]

8. Invading Iraq.

wait. that was the worst.

Bush's tax cuts.

wait. that was also really bad.



How about implementation of the WPA, giving real hope for real change to the real people?



(Actually, I agree with defeating the Axis, but this was pretty amazing too.)

[EmeraldCityGrl]

9. In my lifetime I would have said the election of Obama, but that may

have been a bit premature. In the history of the country, the period between the Great Depression
and the end of WW2. The sacrifices people made, the principles they lived their lives by and the unity
will never be matched.

[Ishoutandscream2]

18. I would have to say that would be the most incredible event

I'm 48, and I never thought in my lifetime an African-American could be elected president of the United States. I am still blown away by it.

[EFerrari]

34. Actually, I think that's right. I didn't believe this country would elect a black man or woman

in my lifetime. I'm 54 and I remember segregation.

[emilyg]

61. I'm still waiting for a woman prez.

[mix]

36. A top 5 moment for me, for sure, Obama's election. nt

[Thirtieschild]

10. You got it. WWII

[liberal N proud]

11. I concur - Defeat of the Axis Powers.

The Greatest Generation is absolutely correct, those people did what they were asked and never expected recognition or even a thank you.

[Curmudgeoness]

13. The Emancipation Proclamation. I know, it did not do much to help

the black population, but it started something huge. Ending slavery and freeing slaves was one of the most humane and anti-business acts we have ever done.

[mix]

43. It affected slaves only in the Confederate states.

Obviously, a huge number and very important, and it did start something huge that continues today, I agree.

[Art_from_Ark]

48. It was directed toward slaves in Confederate states

but since it was issued when the Confederacy was still intact, it did not free any slaves at that time.

[mix]

53. good point nt

[MajorChode]

76. It was more like the follow through on a threat

It did spell the beginning of the end of slavery as an institution, which the Civil War itself may not have done.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

104. I vote for this.

And it's a 100% American achievement, unlike WW2.

[TygrBright]

15. Signing the Treaty of Paris. n/t

[msanthrope]

16. Marian Anderson singing on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial.

"An African-American, Anderson became an important figure in the struggle for black artists to overcome racial prejudice in the United States during the mid twentieth century. In 1939, the Daughters of the American Revolution (DAR) refused permission for Anderson to sing to an integrated audience in Constitution Hall. Their race-driven refusal placed Anderson into the spotlight of the international community on a level usually only found by high profile celebrities and politicians. With the aid of President Franklin D. Roosevelt and First Lady Eleanor Roosevelt, Anderson performed a critically acclaimed open-air concert on Easter Sunday, in 1939 on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial in Washington, D.C. to a crowd of more than 75,000 people and a radio audience in the millions."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marian_Anderson

[mix]

17. I love that, thank you.

Here's a clip of her performance.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88UTjnWhAxE

[EFerrari]

33. In the non-official stuff category

Sojourner Truth lived in the village that is now Arlington and she used to hop on the segregated street car in the wrong place just to piss them off.

That has to qualify somewhere on the best moments index. :)

[Lasher]

19. Yes, winning WWII.

That, to paraphrase Churchill, was our finest hour.

[mix]

27. When communism and capitalism found common ground in a common enemy. nt

[rustydog]

20. The signing of the Declaration of Independance

But for that moment, it is possible we would still be a British Colony and any achievement obviously would have been England's claimto fame not the "Americas".

[biermeister]

22. the shot hear around the world-

without it we'd still be a colony

[MineralMan]

23. 3 Minutes 27.6 Seconds ago.

My point is that for each individual here, there is a different moment. We cannot name a single moment that is the peak. There are many moments of high achievement or importance.

[mix]

37. That's a rather subjective perspective, isn't it,

when discussing the country's history?

But I dig you, man.

[stevedeshazer]

24. The drafting of the Constitution

That was one fine moment.

The abolishment of slavery was right up there.

[valerief]

25. 13th, 15th, and 19th amendments to the Constitution were pretty cool. nt

[Art_from_Ark]

60. The 14th is pretty cool, too

unless it's applied to totally irrelevant matters such as presidential elections

[valerief]

100. Yes, the 14th, too! nt

[Historic NY]

30. WWII, man on the Moon, 1980 winter Olympics....many instances to inspire...

w/o inspiration whats the point in living.

[mix]

31. The 1980 Winter Olympics are BY FAR my favorite Olympics.

The Moon landings are also epic.

[TomClash]

35. Liberation of the Camps during and after WW II

. . . with Russian and British forces too.

[Posteritatis]

38. Torn between three, depending on my mood

In no particular order:

- Defeat of the Axis powers;
- Moon landing;
- The US' share of the work on eradicating smallpox.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

39. The resignation of Richard M. Nixon.

At the post office I worked in at the time, worked stopped and we literally danced in the aisles.

[mix]

41. I'm sure that was I great moment, but I'll take this one:

Shrubness leaving the throne for the last fucking time.

[Mika]

40. Giving Native American Indians the right to citizenship in 1948.

:sarcasm:

Ok. Too dark and pessimistic.

Let's try this....

After 188 years, finally becoming a full democracy in 1964 with the passing of the Civil Rights Act.

:sarcasm:

Ok. Not that positive.

How about....

Victory over communism in Vietnam. Oh.... wait....

How about....

Ronald Reagan and the Pope killed communism?

Nixon established trade relations with China?

The 1973 Chilean coup when the US installed Pinochet?

How about the Bay of Pigs?

Normalization of trade relations with communist Vietnam?

Multiple coups in Haiti?

Coup attempts in Venezuela?

War on Drugs chemical war on Colombia. AKA: "Plan Colombia"?

Eliminating the Glass Steagall Act?


Hard choices.

---

[dflprincess]

139. The main act was passed in 1924

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Citizenship_Act_of_1924

The text of the 1924 Indian Citizenship Act (43 U.S. Stats. At Large, Ch. 233, p. 253 (1924)) reads as follows:

BE IT ENACTED by the Senate and house of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That all non citizen Indians born within the territorial limits of the United States be, and they are hereby, declared to be citizens of the United States: Provided That the granting of such citizenship shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of any Indian to tribal or other property." Approved, June 2, 1924. June 2, 1924. SIXTY-EIGHTH CONGRESS. Sess. I. CHS. 233. 1924. See House Report No. 222, Certificates of Citizenship to Indians, 68th Congress, 1st Session, Feb. 22, 1924. Note: This statute has been codified in the United States Code at Title 8, Sec. 1401(a)(2).

But, some states still did not allow Indians to vote after this act was passed and did play other games with their citizenship. The last 2 states to extend the right to vote were Arizona (surprise!) and New Mexico and that happened in 1948.

[Spider Jerusalem]

42. The defeat of the Axis was a collective effort.

The US didn't do it alone. The British dealt the Luftwaffe a blow they never really recovered from in the Battle of Britain, and then Montgomery defeated Rommel at El Alamein; before the US was in the war in Europe. THe hardest fighting of the European theatre of conflict came on the Eastern Front, where the Soviet Army defeated the Germans at Stalingrad (which together with El Alamein, marks the turning point of the war against Germany; from that point on, the Germans were on the defensive). And in the Pacific, the British, Australians, and New Zealanders made valuable contributions to the war effort against Japan. America's finest moment? Possibly, but at the same time America couldn't have and didn't do it alone.

And we defeated the Axis with a segregated army; personally, I'd say that America's finest moment came 20 years later, with the passage of the Voting Rights Act and the Civil Rights Act, when the high ideal expressed by Jefferson in the Declaration of Independence--that all men are created equal--became a reality with equality in law as well as in theory (although there's probably a case to be made that it would have taken longer had the war against an enemy who espoused vile theories of racial superiority not driven home the inherent contradictions between the American ideal and reality).

[mix]

46. No single power could have done it alone, as you say.

The USSR could not have defeated Germany without the western Allies and visa-versa.

And given the ideological context, the fact that the capitalist world made peace, however fleeting, with the communist world makes the defeat of the Axis even more admirable.

Notice the picture in the OP. Elbe River.

[HEyHEY]

67. They didn't make peace really

It was more a situation of a common enemy than it was one of allies. In fact, some in the US command wanted to finish of the russians after Germany surrendered.

[mix]

79. agreed,

"peace" isn't the right word

[JVS]

136. "some in the US command", namely the stupid blowhard faction.

Christ that would have been a mess! The Germans who were quite worn down caused us a lot of trouble with their Ardennes offensive. The Russians would have rolled us right back off the continent. Just the logistics of sending everything needed to fight the Red Army over the atlantic would have been impossible.

[HEyHEY]

71. Canada actually even declared war on Japan before you guys did

That said, we were already at war with the Germans and so we were just able to say, "You guys are dicks too!"

[MannyGoldstein]

44. When we won WWII, and many of the German POWs...

chose to remain in the US because, even as POWs, they'd been treated better and with more respect then they'd been treated as free men at home.

http://www.fdlpl.org/davis_books/german_pow.html

Somehow, we won the war without torture and secret prisons.

This is the America I love.

[comrade snarky]

144. April 28, 1952

The day the Japanese occupation ended, just over 7 years after the war. Who in 1943 would have believed the next 60 years of US, Japanese relations if you'd told them what was going to happen? Damn few I think.
We learned the lessons of WWI and rebuilt our bitter enemies. Gives me hope for today.

Maybe not our absolute best day ever but it's in my top 5.

[BlueCheese]

47. .

Our greatest contribution to the world was probably our role in World War II. We were an indispensable part in destroying two of the most murderous regimes in modern history. Another contender is the Declaration of Independence, where we proclaimed that all people are equal, and that all governments must have the consent of the governed.

Things such as the 13th, 14th, 15th and 19th amendments, the civil rights movements, etc. were great moments in our history, but represented corrections of past mistakes, and in some cases we were behind other countries in making these changes. In terms of accomplishments that make the US unique, I'd go with the first two above.

[Ikonoklast]

49. Along with many of the good suggestions posted above, this is one of my personal favorites.

Jackie Robinson with Branch Rickey in February 1948, two men that helped bring us all closer together.

[unkachuck]

50. Brown vs. Board of Education....n/t

[L0oniX]

51. FDR creating national parks ...saving a taste of what it was for the future...

and FDR's New Deal. FDR was the best this country ever had and will ever have had. I would have said WW2 but Japan had an issue with us that remains to this day ...we are imperialist pigs ...and we didn't own Hawaii yet.

[NoNothing]

52. "Houston, Tranquility Base here."

"The Eagle has landed."

[tabasco]

54. The Marshall Plan comes to mind. n/t

[PufPuf23]

56. The finest moment had best be yet to come as a fulfillment of promise.

So far I favor equally:

1. Civil Rights
2. Once unmatched educational system
3. New Deal / Great Society
4. Marshall Plan and rebuilding of Japan post WWII

[Bonobo]

57. The music. Jazz, blues, rockabilly, dixie, bluegrass, gospel, etc.

It is the best that we have offered to history and the world.

[asdjrocky]

88. +1,000,000

See my reply right under yours.

[mix]

137. great choice nt

[asdjrocky]

58. Baseball, the Blues...

And Representative Democracy.

Played correctly, all three can be perfection.

But the first thing to really come to mind is the Moon landing.

[SunnySong]

59. George Washington refusing another term...

One of the most defining moments in Western History.

[riverdale]

62. The Marshall Plan demonstrated America at its best.

George Marshall, Secretary of State, speech at Harvard University (5th June, 1947)

It is logical that the United States should do whatever it is able to do to assist in the return of normal economic health in the world, without which there can be no political stability and no assured peace. Our policy is directed not against any country or doctrine but against hunger, poverty, desperation, and chaos. Its purpose should be the revival of a working economy in the world so as to permit the emergence of political and social conditions in which free institutions can exist.

[HEyHEY]

63. Pardon me? Uh, a shitload of other countries were involved in that

[proteus_lives]

65. It was a collective effort.

But it can be said that the U.S. kept the UK and Russia in the war.

And the defeat of Japan was primarily led by the US.

[HEyHEY]

66. Yes, that said. I take offense to the chest pounding I often hear

You guys came in late, and fresh. Meanwhile alot of very small countries were fighting their asses off and being decimated.

[proteus_lives]

70. Yeah, we came in late.....

And saved The Brits and the Russians from certain defeat and defeated the Japanese in the Pacific.

Chest pounding is rude but the truth remains, without the U.S. the allies would lost. Churchill broke open a case of champagne and said, "Victory!".

BTW, even before we entered the war, we were keeping Britain alive with supplies, ships and loans.

[HEyHEY]

72. You were also helping out the Germans at the beginning

And we would not have lost. The resolve of the commonwealth, the resistance, and the hardy russian army would have prevailed, it would have taken longer.

It's this "We won the war" crap that gets tiring. The British are just as bad, 60,000 Canadians died for their fucking country and we supplied them with materials and armory galore and they completely seem to forget it.

[proteus_lives]

83. Here's where the point gets sticky.

"The resolve of the commonwealth"

That they were cut off from. For example, if the U.S. hadn't entered the war, do you think that Japan would have left India or Australia alone? Do you think the British could have done anything to stop them around 1941?

"the resistance"

Which one?

"the hardy russian army would have prevailed, it would have taken longer."

Would they have prevailed without the millions of tons of American supplies? Or would they have collapsed after their industries couldn't feed their armies?

"The British are just as bad, 60,000 Canadians died for their fucking country"

Sorry, Europeans have always been callous about the contributions of colonial troops.

I'm not knocking the contribution of any other country. I'm just being honest about the U.S. contribution. For example. Operation Overlord would have been next to impossible without the Russians and the Eastern Front.

[LanternWaste]

114. Yes. Food and arms production were steadily increasing

"Would they have prevailed without the millions of tons of American supplies? Or would they have collapsed after their industries couldn't feed their armies?"

Yes. Domestic Food and arms production were steadily increasing after November of 41, and increasing in sufficient quantity to achieve the steady application of an overwhelming industrial base (Kennedy's Rise and Fall of the Great Powers, and Heller's Utopia in Power)

[uppityperson]

101. Thank you Canada for your large part in ending ww2, for your sacrifices and

all that. For storming the beaches at Normandy, though you do not get the publicity the usa does. Thank you.

[Spider Jerusalem]

77. Hardly

Germany would still have lost; not as quickly, perhaps, but still would have lost (the Luftwaffe lost the Battle of Britain in the first half of 1940; it wasn't until March of 1941 that the Lend-Lease Act was passed. And it was Russia that broke the back of the German Army at Stalingrad and Kharkov and a dozen other places; US aid helped but it was the Russian-designed and produced T-34 tank that won the war on the Eastern Front, along with the tremendous brutality of the fighting that saw the Soviets willing to take a kill ratio of one German for three of their men dead. You may want to brush up a bit on your history, I think.

[mix]

82. The Russian losses were staggering.

20-25 million military and civilian deaths.

I read recently that it could be more.

[proteus_lives]

84. "You may want to brush up a bit on your history, I think."

"but it was the Russian-designed and produced T-34 tank that won the war on the Eastern Front"

And Soviet soldiers drove to the front in American trucks and ate American spam. Simple truth: The Russian war machine would have ground to a halt with the millions of tons of supplies we sent them.

"the Luftwaffe lost the Battle of Britain in the first half of 1940"

A tactical victory to be sure, but how would that allow the British to invade Europe by themselves? How could the British capitalize on that victory, by themselves?

I think your grasp on history is a bit lacking.

[Spider Jerusalem]

96. The point is:

the Luftwaffe was dealt a blow it never recovered from in the Battle of Britain; the failure to neutralise the RAF meant that Hitler's planned invasion of Great Britain was called off, and he turned east instead. The war was lost for Germany on 22 June 1941; the Russians were accepting of huge casualties in a total war for victory at any price, and by the time of Stalingrad the outcome was pretty well assured. American participation was A factor in the victory over Nazi Germany, yes, it was NOT the DECISIVE factor.

[proteus_lives]

98. "yes, it was NOT the DECISIVE factor. "

I disagree.

I think it was the puzzle piece that allowed Allied victory.

The Russians would have suffered in more causalities in a one-front war, combine that with no American supplies and how long would it be before the Red armies start to collapse like the Tsarist ones did in 1917?


Yes, the RAF saved Britain, but how would they have won the war from that point on without the Americans?

[bvar22]

107. The Soviets Defeated the Germans at Stalingrad in 1943

with very, VERY little help from the US.
The inevitable German surrender was just a matter of time after that.
The US can be credited with an "assist" for destroying Germany's War Industry through bombing while the Soviets rolled up Hitler's armies on the Eastern front.

The REAL reason WHY the US landed an army at Normandy was to prevent the Soviets from claiming ALL of Europe.

Your mileage may vary.

[proteus_lives]

122. "The REAL reason"

It could also be because Stalin spent years screaming for a second front. Those successful Russian campaigns came at the cost of division after division of soldiers.

The Soviets needed the second front along with the Allied bombing campaign and the millions of tons of supplies we sent them.

[bvar22]

131. The 2nd front helped,

but the Germans were in full retreat on the Eastern Front by 1944.
Like I said above,
The US scores an "assist", primarily for the destruction of Germany's War Industry through Strategic Bombing well before Normandy.
The Germans were unable to replace Soldiers, Tanks, Fuel, Artillery, and Planes.
By 1944, The Soviets were turning them out by the thousands every month...and this WAS Soviet Built War Machinery, NOT the token Lend Lease bullshit.

You do the math.

OTOH: The US did indeed defeat the Japanese in the Pacific.

[proteus_lives]

133. Yes, by 1944.

But but 41, 42, 43.

The Soviets needed the U.S. to stay on their feet.

[LanternWaste]

112. the U.S. simply shortened that amount of time.

Soviets had already completed their successful winter counter-offensive prior to the U.S. entry into the war. At that point it was merely a matter of time before victory would be achieved; the U.S. simply shortened that amount of time.

[proteus_lives]

119. That is one interpretation of the facts.

[LanternWaste]

127. A valid interpretation as opposed to...

A valid interpretation as opposed to an invalid interpretation

[proteus_lives]

130. What you consider invalid is obviously not invalid to others.

[tabasco]

111. And the US came in and didn't get decimated but did the decimating.

Thanks for pointing that out.

[proteus_lives]

123. Casting in a negative light, why?

[HEyHEY]

138. Come late and of course that's the result

Also, many, many us troops were lost because of sending in wave after wave of men no matter how dangerous it was. Your military lost 400,000 troops in three years... "Did the decimating" you say? THat kind of bravado just causes more wars.

[proteus_lives]

142. In comparison.

U.S, lost 400,000+, Soviets lost 9 million+.

[HEyHEY]

143. I was looking at the numbers

They lost 15 per cent of their entire population. Jesus hell.

[LanternWaste]

109. But it would be wrong.

"But it can be said that the U.S. kept the UK and Russia in the war."

However it would be incorrect to say that.

[proteus_lives]

118. Ok. why?

[LanternWaste]

120. Post 12 & 114

Post 12 & 114

[proteus_lives]

125. Spam and Ford trucks.

Without them (and the second front we opened) the Soviet wouldn't have reached Berlin until 1947ish.

[LanternWaste]

126. Yet they would have inevitably reached Berlin without us being the point.

Yet they would have inevitably reached Berlin with or without us being the point, regardless of time frame.

As for spam and Ford..."victory was bought with American spam, and paid for with Soviet blood" (Soviet army saying circa 1950).

[proteus_lives]

129. Of course the Soviets said that.

They are as bad as some Americans about ignoring other countries efforts.

Someway they're bad about remember atrocities.

[mix]

80. Thus the picture at Elbe. nt

[HEyHEY]

64. As an non-american, I'd have to say.......

Declaring independence. When you threw yourselves in alliance with France and (I believe) a handful of other young democracies it showed the King that this democracy shit was spreading.

[proteus_lives]

68. Many, many moments.

Defeating the British and inspiring people around the world.

The Louisiana Purchase.

The battle of New Orleans.

The Civil War and ending slavery.

The Industrial Age.

The mass immigrations of the 19th century.

The birth of manned flight.

The New Deal.

Providing the muscle to win WWII.

The Marshall Plan.

Birthing the UN.

The Civil Rights Movement.

Moon Landing

Woodstock.

Winning the Gold in '80.

Winning the Cold War.

Birthing the Internet Age.

The election of Barack Obama.

[Touchdown]

69. Jonas Salk and his polio vaccine.

[jmondine]

74. Martin Luther King's Speech in Washington

[Senator]

75. Not even close, it WAS Nuremberg

It was done for all the world, unselfishly, for perpetuity, in true moral leadership.

Our Greatest Generation applied justice, as opposed to vengeance or even mere amnesty/forgiveness.

Until it was all recently undone and unrestored, it was the world's one shining moment when we stepped beyond barbarism as a civilization. It was what made American public opinion the court of last resort for the oppressed around the globe.

Shame on Our Lamest Generation for squandering that legacy.

--

[LastLiberal in PalmSprings]

78. Not the defeat of the Axis powers, but how we as a country pulled together

When you look at where we were as a global power before WWII (nada) and after, it is largely due to the willingness of the American people to step up and meet the challenge. My father and uncle, for example, joined thousands of young men and women in volunteering for the military the day after Pearl Harbor. On the home front, women became part of the large industrial workforce that produced the ships, airplanes, tanks, ammunition, etc. that supported those on the front line. Those who could not serve because of age or infirmity became block wardens or sold war bonds or planted victory gardens. Our industrial capacity increased exponentially (resulting the the post war military-industrial complex, unfortunately).

We did incredible things: constructed the Alaska Highway, built and ferried to the front (courtesy of the WASPS) thousands of airplanes of all types, launched hundreds of warships and transports, developed the atom bomb (for better or worse).

Yes, we and our allies worked together to defeat the Axis, but in the end it was the efforts of our entire nation pulling together that made it possible. To me, that was our country's greatest moment.

And when it was all over, we helped our former enemies rebuild...

[unhappycamper]

85. 1933 -

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51kYEMGmUtL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg

Most people will be shocked to learn that in 1933 a cabal of wealthy industrialists—in league with groups like the K.K.K. and the American Liberty League—planned to overthrow the U.S. government in a fascist coup. Their plan was to turn discontented veterans into American “brown shirts,” depose F.D.R., and stop the New Deal. They clandestinely asked Medal of Honor recipient and Marine Major General Smedley Darlington Butler to become the first American Caesar. He, though, was a true patriot and revealed the plot to journalists and to Congress. In a time when a sitting President has invoked national security to circumvent constitutional checks and balances, this episode puts the spotlight on attacks upon our democracy and the individual courage needed to repel them.

[slackmaster]

86. The completion of the first Transcontinental Railroad

[Toucano]

113. Ummm...no. That was corporate welfare.

The largess of granting public land to private industry is not exactly something I would be proud of.

Those railroad companies were notoriously bad to their workers.

It was a nail in the coffin of the Native American populations in the West.

That effects of that redistribution of wealth from the public sector to the private sector laid the framework for the Robber Barons of the 19th century.

[slackmaster]

132. Railroads also opened up the West and provided an invauable means of transportation

Economic progress would have been much, much slower without them.

[NoGOPZone]

87. Finest moment so far

Drafting of a Constitution that incorporated the ideas of Englighment political thinkers.

Finest moment in the future

When we can honestly say that notion of equal rights isn't abridged in any way by race, gender, sexual orientation, national origin, and maybe a few other categories.

[Octafish]

89. Joint Chiefs and Allen Dulles wanted USA to launch nuclear attack on USSR and JFK refused.

Had President Kennedy gone along with the JCS Chairman Gen. Lyman Lemnitzer and CIA Director Allen Dulles, who counseled "late 1963" as the optimal time for their "preemptive attack," I'd bet none of us would be alive today.

Did the U.S. Military Plan a Nuclear First Strike for 1963?

by James K. Galbraith and Heather A. Purcell
The American Prospect
Fall 1994

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TOP SECRET EYES ONLY

Notes on National Security Council Meeting July 20, 1961

General Hickey, Chairman of the Net Evaluation Subcommittee, presented the annual report of his group. General Lemnitzer stated that the assumption of this year's study was a surprise attack in late 1963, preceded by a period of heightened tensions.

After the presentation by General Hickey and by the various members of the Subcommittee, the President asked if there had ever been made an assessment of damage results to the U.S.S.R which would be incurred by a preemptive attack. General Lemnitzer stated that such studies had been made and that he would bring them over and discuss them personally with the President. In recalling General Hickey's opening statement that these studies have been made since 1957, the President asked for an appraisal of the trend in the effectiveness of the attack. General Lemnitzer replied that he would also discuss this with the President.

Since the basic assumption of this year's presentation was an attack in late 1963, the President asked about probable effects in the winter of 1962. Mr. Dulles observed that the attack would be much less effective since there would be considerably fewer missiles involved. General Lemnitzer added a word of caution about accepting the precise findings of the Committee since these findings were based upon certain assumptions which themselves might not be valid.

The President posed the question as to the period of time necessary for citizens to remain in shelters following an attack. A member of the Subcommittee replied that no specific period of time could be cited due to the variables involved, but generally speaking, a period of two weeks should be expected.

The President directed that no member in attendance at the meeting disclose even the subject of the meeting.

Declassified: June, 1993


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THIS ARTICLE FIRST APPEARED IN THE AMERICAN PROSPECT, NUMBER 19, FALL 1994, PP. 88-96. COPYRIGHT (c) 1994 BY NEW PROSPECT, INC. PERMISSION IS GRANTED TO COPY AND CIRCULATE FOR NON-COMMERCIAL PURPOSES ONLY, PROVIDED THAT THIS NOTICE ACCOMPANIES ALL COPIES MADE.


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Introduction

During the early 1960s the intercontinental ballistic missile (ICBM) introduced the world to the possibility of instant total war. Thirty years later, no nation has yet fired any nuclear missile at a real target. Orthodox history holds that a succession of defensive nuclear doctrines and strategies �� from "massive retaliation" to "mutual assured destruction" �� worked, almost seamlessly, to deter Soviet aggression against the United States and to prevent the use of nuclear weapons.

The possibility of U.S. aggression in nuclear conflict is seldom considered. And why should it be? Virtually nothing in the public record suggests that high U.S. authorities ever contemplated a first strike against the Soviet Union, except in response to a Soviet invasion of Western Europe, or that they doubted the deterrent effect of Soviet nuclear forces. The main documented exception was the Air Force Chief of Staff in the early 1960s, Curtis LeMay, a seemingly idiosyncratic case.

But beginning in 1957 the U.S. military did prepare plans for a preemptive nuclear strike against the U.S.S.R, based on our growing lead in land-based missiles, And top military and intelligence leaders presented an assessment of those plans to President John F. Kennedy in July of 1961. At that time, some high Air Force and CIA leaders apparently believed that a window of outright ballistic missile superiority, perhaps sufficient for a successful first strike, would be open in late 1963.

The document reproduced above is published here for the first time. It describes a meeting of the National Security Council on July 20, 1961. At that meeting, the document shows, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the director of the CIA, and others, presented plans for a surprise attack. They answered some questions from Kennedy about timing and effects, and promised further information. The meeting recessed under a Presidential injunction of secrecy that has not been broken until now.

CONTINUED...

http://www.maryferrell.org/wiki/index.php/Essay_-_Did_the_US_Military_Plan_a_Nuclear_First_Strike_for_1963

Thank you for a truly great thread, Mix. For the United States, the "Finest Moments" outnumber the other kinds. What We the People need to do is demand our represenatives follow the former and fix the latter. That includes dumping the warmongers.

[End Of The Road]

103. A "finest moment" for JFK, surely, but for the country?

Thank God for JFK -- the proverbial "right man in the right place at the right time."

But our own military brought us close to global thermonuclear war. Not a shining moment for me.

[Octafish]

105. You're right. I'll go with the Moon Landing, the greatest achievement, accomplished by free people.

But, gosh, there are so many to choose from -- many of these "best moment" in U.S. history are the result of Democratic-led works:

If We can beat the Great Depression, win WWII and the Cold War, and get to the Moon...

[LeftinOH]

90. Civil Rights act, 1964; we were not quite the 'land of the free' we claimed to be until then -n/t

[Blue_Tires]

91. Wright Brothers...

[Winterblues]

93. The Emancipation Proclamation

We became worthy when we freed the slaves.

[taught_me_patience]

94. "All men are created equal"

Revolutionary!

[Mudoria]

95. WWII

The Normandy landings and the numerous landings in the Pacific may have been the finest hours in the war. Men who watched thier buddies dying all around them and still kept pushing forward. The amount of courage, dedication and determination it took to do that I can't begin to imagine.

:patriot:

[closeupready]

97. Yes, storming the beaches of Normandy.

Like you, WWII was my first thought.

[uppityperson]

102. 9/11. When everyone Pulled Together to Support their Country in Times of

:sarcasm:

I don't have a "finest moment" as there are many, from Native Americans helping the euro-immigrants survive to someone rescuing a baby kitten.

[End Of The Road]

106. I was afraid there wouldn't be a sarcasm thingie... whew! nt

[LanternWaste]

108. Marshall Plan

The Marshall Plan. While the motivations were certainly not 100% humanitarian nor altruistic, the results were an absolute good in a vastly greater number of cases than not.

[Rex]

110. The ending of slavery.

[Toucano]

115. No war can be considered anyone's finest moment.

There are ugly stains the permeate all of them.

[eShirl]

116. Not sure, but I agree with your use of the past tense.

[CLANG]

117. When Kanye took the mic from Taylor Swift!

[MadBadger]

121. Disco Demolition Night

[Romulox]

124. "Mission Accomplished"

[Bluebear]

128. When the second movement of Samuel Barber's violin concerto was penned

[CanonRay]

134. The day Nixon resigned

the system worked, and I was proud of it.

[chillspike]

135. The defeat of Custer at the Little Big Horn

[WillyT]

140. The Berlin Airlift Was Pretty Cool

:shrug:

[RagAss]

141. Ali vs. Frazier I