can you be anti-corporate but still a big sports fan?

[Whisp]

don't you feel a bit uneasy if so?

how does one justify this?

what if your favourite team was bought out by BP, would you still go to the games/watch on the teevee?

:shrugs:

[Forkboy]

1. Yes, I feel a little uneasy with it.

How do I justify it? Well, if I stopped everything in life that had corporate ties involved somehow then I'd be sitting in a darkened room with my thumb up my ass. There's simply no way to be 100% consistent in this stance in America short of living in a cave and eating moss. Sports (well, hockey and football at least) is one of the few things that I get enjoyment out of in this miserable floating rock in space. We all have our moments of hypocrisy, and this is one of mine. If someone wants to judge me over this I can live with it.

[Whisp]

4. a reasonable answer, I can dig it.

but looking a bit further into the question.

Personally, besides the huge disgusting money for all involved except the little people selling you popcorn and cleaning the sweaty assed arean seats, and the overly gushing testerones, I find the whole scream-your-head-off-for-ou- team sort of thing very close to a something that sniffs of military mentality. The black and white, the we are the good guys, etc., lots of comparisons actually.

[Forkboy]

25. I'm not that type of sports fan.

The ones you see in beer ads aren't me. I don't paint my body in team colors and wear rainbow colored wigs, I'm not distracted away from the game by a set of tits, and I don't think a city is better just because they have some hired mercenaries that won a few more games than the other city's hired mercenaries. And I like the sport more than any one team. I love to root for the Boston Bruins, but I love the game of hockey far more than I do the B's, and if they do something that was against what I feel hockey is about I'd be among the first to harp on them.

One of the things that appeals to me about sports over regular shows is that it's real and (usually) unplanned, unless you're an NBA ref. There is a ton of drama in sports, and while it may not be important it can still be exciting to watch. And besides, a football audience is little different from the audience that piled into theaters to see Avatar for the last two months. Sports is just entertainment, like books, movies or DU, and should be taken as such. That's as far as I take it at least.

As for the military aspect, I see it in football the most, and George Carlin summed up just how accurate the military/football comparison is...

In football the object is for the quarterback, also known as the field general, to be on target with his aerial assault, riddling the defense by hitting his receivers with deadly accuracy in spite of the blitz, even if he has to use a shotgun. With short bullet passes and long bombs, he marches his troops into enemy territory, balancing this aerial assault with a sustained ground attack that punches holes in the forward wall of the enemy's defensive line.

Considering how spot on that is, it's hard to expect any different from the fans. ;)

[Whisp]

45. good ole George, how I miss him. n/t

[Brickbat]

34. I agree with this answer.

[ZombieHorde]

57. "I'd be sitting in a darkened room with my thumb up my ass"

Not a bad way to spend 30 minutes, but I can understand how one could eventually get bored with that activity.

I know I give a lot of money to Sony.

[Enrique]

2. it would be difficult

i'm not sure exactly what you mean by anti-corporate, but sports is drenched in so much mindlessness, money and materialism that I can't stand very much of it.

[MedicalAdmin]

3. Yes you can.

Go and watch local teams, either pro-am or minor league or college of even high school.

I haven't watched pro sports for decades and I can't say I miss them much. Do I enjoy watching pro sports? Yes, but I no longer follow the teams and main reason is the unrelenting and overpowering commercialism associated with pro sports these days.



I know for sure that if you vote to build sports arenas using public money that will then solely benefit the pocketbook of one of the billionaire boys club then you are a corporate shill.

[Whisp]

6. my line of thought as well... so many school sports programs without proper equipment

because of budget cuts and these assholes are wallowing in millions...

[Seneca]

13. Those local teams, including schools

Rely on corporate money. Minor league teams get money from big breweries and tire companies. Ever see the infield of a minor league baseball team? Or the inner rink wall of a local hockey outfit? Some school and little league teams get money from real estate agents (99% of who are Republican donors) and local businesses - which themselves make their money selling products from large corporations.

I think Forkboy had the best answer in this thread. Although I would prefer eating tree bark with Grizzly Adams rather than have my thumb up my ass. :D

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

5. In this case, "corporate" was a euphemism for "stuff I don't like."

One of those DU posts not to be taken seriously.

[Whisp]

7. then don't.

sorry if I magnatized you here with my superhuman powers.

[Gemini Cat]

54. +1

[Initech]

8. Sports promotes tourism.

I seriously wouldn't have gone to Chicago a couple weeks ago if it weren't for the opportunity to see my Angels at a legendary stadium.

[Seneca]

9. Can anyone be anti-corporate and use the internet?

Their computer was built by a large corporation. Most, if not all, of the parts which comprise their computer were made by big corporations.

Bypassing Windows and using LINUX doesn't get one off the hook completely, either.

Their internet provider may not be a large corporation if they have a local ISP, but they are still... a corporation.

And for bigger ISP's, the cable, satellite, wireless signal, or phone line which brings them their internet access is owned by a big corporation.

They drive a car, or even a bike, built by them.

Anyone out there living a perfect, pure, holy, corporate-free life isn't online right now. They are out with Grizzly Adams in a cabin somewhere, eating tree bark.

[Whisp]

14. I'm not holy.

:rofl:

a car, well, whether you like it or not, you need it for work, for driving your mother to the doctors, for many things. Yes, you are supporting a corporation but it is not a frivolous purchase but a necessity.

I find there is something very different about MegaSports than the items you listed, Seneca.
It's that similarity to how the military brainwashes people to believe that we are the good guys. And its so male dominated, just as the military is. Same sort of language, both body and vocal. everyoone is expected to give that 110%. hahaha.

it's training.

[Swede]

21. So you are judging other people.

I understand,now.

[Whisp]

23. I am making an observation on the sports culture and how it related to the military culture.

It would be a long list if I had to name people.

it's nothing personal to anyone here nor you, don't get upset.

[Swede]

24. You probably don't care for chess,either.

nt

[Whisp]

46. I can make you a list of all the things I don't care for

but I don't think you would care for that

[Swede]

10. can you be anti-corporate but still post on the internet?

don't you feel a bit uneasy if so?

[Seneca]

15. Damn, Swede

One minute after mine. Get out of my head. :D

[Whisp]

17. not at all. I work on my computer. Its a necessity.

[trotsky]

32. There are lots and lots of jobs for which a computer is not necessary.

Why don't you get one so you can become even MORE anti-corporate and judgmental?

[Whisp]

44. you are not considering health and physical abilities are you

what do you know about me to compare what you said to my criticism about mega sports and the massive hypnotism it has on even the intelligent - on a population as a whole and how it is can be viewed as a form of propaganda.

I live a very spartan life so what I contribute through doing my work with my one and only computer at home (there are reasons why I can't work outside the home but it's frankly not up for discussion), I do not drive a car or consume the trunkloads of crap that I see my neighbours and friends hauling in and out of their houses almost every day.

Its sort of like a fast.

It seems you are not considering much other than a perceived personal insult that I stabbed you with. Sorry you took it that way.

[trotsky]

49. "what do you know about me"

Indeed. A great question that one might ask concerning your OP. Congratulations on coming very close to getting the point!

[Whisp]

64. again, I am talking about the broader social aspects of mega-sports,

and the corporations that own them and ultimately the fans being partially owned by these corporotions like we are with so many things. And as I am assuming most here are anti-big-corp, I think my opening question is a valid one.

Nice to see some honest and thoughtful answers here.
We all have a bit of hypocrisy in our makeup, its near impossible to avoid it.

If it makes you uneasy, then don't play.
:shrug:

[trotsky]

67. What you are doing is making a false dichotomy.

And clearly any discussion of "pro-corporate" positions that happen to involve something YOU do or like, makes YOU uneasy.

[asdjrocky]

11. Good question.

It's become harder and harder for me to care about something I used to be crazy about, professional sports.

The players are rich, most of them, the owners are mega-rich, and most of the people that can afford to go to the games are better off than most of the populace.

More and more this country reminds me of the old Rome.

[Tailormyst]

12. yes- You can enjoy the sport while wanting to see things change a bit.

I am a sports fan, but I prefer high school and college sports.

[notesdev]

16. Depends on the team

Who owns it and who are the sponsors?

A community-owned team is fine. If you're cheering on by a team owned by a corporation that you are protesting out the other side of your mouth, however... you got some self-examination to do.

[maxsolomon]

18. i watch the NFL sometimes

but i haven't had a Coors or a Bud in 20 years. selective amnesia.

[Whisp]

20. I used to watch a little bit of big sports when I was younger and dating.

I only watched because the boyfriend did. Ended up that I wasn't much interested in guys who were into sports.

[Bullet1987]

19. You know I think about this all of the time

I'm a big football fan, and I've noticed how so many city stadiums are named after banks and oil companies.

Baltimore Ravens (M&T Bank Stadium)
Indianapolis Colts (Lucas Oil Field/Stadium)
Denver Broncos (Invesco Field...formerly known as Mile High Stadium...named after an insurance company)

The list goes on and on.

[Whisp]

22. Thats part of the reason why these companies can get away with so much.

these sports arenas are really just bribes or an ace up the sleeve. control.

and with how absolutely nuts people go over their favourite teams they pretty well have you by the short ones in that way at least. They can take away your favourite toy.

[TheKentuckian]

26. I think the question indicates a profound misunderstanding of my stance or

a hamfisted and purposeful misrepresentation of the issue.

Thinking corporate charters should be allowed based on acceptance of community responsibility for specific functions beneficial and/or desired by the people.

That further corporations are legal constructs not living entities unto themselves. Legal constructs allowed for the pooling of capital and human resources to provide desired goods and services.

Belief that these legal constructs are to be overseen, regulated, originated, and terminated by the government as their basis to exist is the law they cannot co-opt, capture, or supersede the rightful government.

Being of mind that profits of the few do not come before the good of the many.

Not being comfortable with allowing a few to make a mockery of law and any concept of responsibility by hiding behind a legal construct.

That private profit and socialized risk is abhorrent and unsustainable.

That such a heavy obligation is on those who extract from the commons and resell to the people what was already their's for profit that if the obligations were lived up to there might be no profits to be had and the dynamics would have to be more honestly and seriously evaluated.

It's not about being against companies but about how they operate, their scope, their influence, and how they calculate profits by shoving the loses onto the public and nature among other things.

The question has no real context in the current society and seems pretty simplistic in it's logic.
Why does wanting rules, responsibility, or even in some cases a desire to nationalize certain critical industries mean you can't see a concert, watch a movie, catch a game, go to work, use the grocery, own computers, or buy blue jeans?

For most of us you'd label "anti-corporate" the issues are role and power not existence under most circumstances.

[blondeatlast]

29. What tK said (exceptionally well)..

:thumbsup:

[Whisp]

48. I meant anti-corporate as to how DUers understand and use it.

the word corporate just doesn't fly well around here, now does it.

I'm pretty sure when people here call Obama a corporate shill they aren't complimenting him.

[TheKentuckian]

65. I think the way I discussed it how many DUers use the word.

That is exactly why I call (and always did, going back to the primaries when I was a strong supporter) the President a corporatist.

It is not and has not been meant as an insult but an assessment of ideology as far as I'm concerned. I don't see anything to get insulted or bothered about.

[fishwax]

27. sure -- I don't feel particularly uneasy about it, either

That's not to say there aren't aspects of it that I would like to see changed.

[kgnu_fan]

28. why not people just DO sport in their own community, instead of watching on TV?

I think it is much more fun to PLAY sports than watching other people do them on TV. Many people watching sports on TV in "sport bar" seems to be eating a lot, drinking beer, getting fat and unhealthy, mesmerized and mind-controlled helplessly by big fat TV advertisement of big fat corporations ... Poeple could be playing some sports outside and get good exercises, get great connection with your own teammates, neighbors... no? I just do not understand sports, I guess!

[fishwax]

31. you can make connections watching sports as well

As for playing, it's not really an either or. People can (and do) go from playing sports to watching them in a sports bar (or wherever).

[Populist_Prole]

30. No. It's feeding the machine

In addition, they create apathy because sports are a distraction from important issues. "Bread & Circuses"

I've never met a sports fan that I can converse with about anything that matters. Just my experience.

[Brickbat]

36. Good thing you found DU, then.

Plenty of sports fans here who can keep up with you, I'm sure.

[Forkboy]

37. You read books or watch movies? Maybe go fishing or take a walk?

These are also mere diversions from important issues, and therefore must also create apathy. Or are diversions you like different from the ones you don't?

Your post reads like a bad pamphlet written by a 18 year old revolutionary.

[trotsky]

39. "a bad pamphlet written by a 18 year old revolutionary"

:thumbsup:

[blondeatlast]

40. You might want to just go ahead an put me on "ignore" now. You probably

won't like what I have to say about Arizona SB 1070 or why it's perceived as being racist.

[frylock]

42. you should probably get out more often..

bill bradley played in the nba, you know?

[cherokeeprogressive]

52. Using a broad brush from the back of your high horse...?

Never met a sports fan you could converse with? What are you doing here then? Surely you know that there are so many sports fans at DU that they have their own forum. Surprisingly enough, some of the most popular posters actually visit and post there.

Never met a sports fan you could converse with. Never. Ever. Not once. Bullshit.

[blondeatlast]

55. Rhodes Scholar Bill Bradley on line 1 for "Populist_Prole." nt

[Gemini Cat]

58. President Obama...

...a Chicago White Sox fan, would disagree with you. So do I.

[blondeatlast]

33. Can you be human and NOT hypocritical? I doubt even Ghandi or Mother Teresa

would ansswer yes to that.

Plus, it's not an either/or question.

[yella_dawg]

35. No.

[dana_b]

38. you know this whole anti-corporate v.s. corporatist

argument doesn't need to be so black and white. To say I was truly anti-corporatist, I'd need to build my own house using nothing but raw materials that I'd found, eat what I could grow, etc. As it is, I get up and put on my clothes made by a corporation, drive in my car made by a corporation to my job or to the corporate grocery store - well, you get the picture.

I think it is which corporations you choose to support. Trying to become educated about their practices and act accordingly.

[KamaAina]

41. It's almost that bad here in San Jose

with the MLS Earthquakes.



Yup, that's a player for my home side. :puke: Corporatism is, if anything, even more rampant in futbol than in other sports; kits from Liverpool to L.A. sport corporate logos, meanwhile, supporters at the FIFA World Cup(TM) must make do with Budweiser in place of beer due to sponsorship. But, really, Amway?!

[AsahinaKimi]

59. I kinda like their jersey...

I want one!


$69.00 for one, isn't too bad considering what I paid for 49er jersys over the years.

[KamaAina]

61. What if it were the Amway Canucks?

:shrug:

[AsahinaKimi]

62. Well...

I am not sure why Soccer teams have to wear corporate logos on the front of their jersys.. Baseball, Football, Basketball, and Hockey don't .. But I guess Soccer teams need the sponcership, still why on the Jersey? Hang the corporate logos in the stands, or some where, even on the field..

They are the San Jose Earthquakes, not the Amway Earthquakes..right?
Still, I think the Jersys are kinda cool.

When I visited Scotland one year I picked up one of these: The Glasgow Rangers


At least it has a Beer Logo!

[frylock]

43. can you be anti-corporate but still live in a dwelling?

who built the home? who supplied the material? how did the material arrive to the job site?

it's a slippery slope to be sure.

[earth mom]

47. My husband likes college sports better than pro because he hates all the b.s.

of the big leagues and all the scandals and crap that goes on.

[blondeatlast]

50. College sports?

That's a good one...

[earth mom]

51. WTF?

:wtf:

[Doctor_J]

53. Yes. David Zirin and I are two examples

There are more.

[Gemini Cat]

56. Yes, I can do two things at once.

The world would be rather bleak without baseball and other sports.

[Romulox]

60. Set aside the salaries for a moment. It often feels like advertisers pre-determine the winners.

The NBA and NHL seem to be the worst in this respect.

[ecstatic]

63. That's why I try to stay realistic in my approach to corporations

Let them be as long as they follow the law, pay their taxes, respect consumers and their workers, and are not asking for bailouts.

[Caretha]

66. Probably not