Sharron Angle: Rape, Incest Part of God’s Plan — Opposes Abortion No Matter What

[marmar]

from AlterNet:



Posted by Tana Ganeva at 10:44 am
June 29, 2010

Sharron Angle: Rape, Incest Part of God’s Plan — Opposes Abortion No Matter What


Nevada GOP Senate nominee Sharron Angle’s election strategy for the moment is fleeing reporters in order to avoid getting tricked into saying things publicly. Fortunately, Angle has already said enough crazy shit to belie spin efforts painting her as slightly less alarmingly crazy for the general election against Harry Reid.

In this January interview with conservative talk show host David Manders, Angle explains her position on abortion. As with most responsible policy making, the inspiration for Angle’s stance comes from God (clearly, the Old Testament God that’s really into incest and rape) (via Think Progress):

MANDERS: I too am pro-life, but I’m also pro-choice. Do you understand what I say when I mean that?

ANGLE: Well, I’m pro responsible choice. There’s choice to abstain, choice to use contraceptives … there’s all kinds of good choice…

MANDERS: Is there any reason at all for an abortion?

ANGLE: Not in my book.

MANDERS: So, in other words, rape and incest would not be something?

ANGLE: You know, I’m a Christian, and I believe that God has a plan and a purpose for each one of our lives and that he can intercede in all kinds of situations and we need to have a little faith in many things.

http://blogs.alternet.org/speakeasy/2010/06/29/sharon-angle-rape-incest-part-of-gods-plan/

[Brickbat]

1. I hate that kind of thinking so much. To think that rape and incest is part of God's plan is breath-

taking. Does she even listen to herself?

[SpiralHawk]

2. So, I guess it was part of God's plan for a Republicon Senator to have diaper sex?

with a hooker, in violation of his marriage vows? Am I following her logic?

Apparently so, since the Republicon Diaper Dandy is leading the the re-election polls.

Sheesh.

[MisterP]

3. heretic!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Providentialism

[texastoast]

4. Rape an incest are not part of "God's" plan

Rape and incest are the result of stupid humans being out of control of themselves and not giving a damn about the consequences of getting their cookies.

Sick bitch.

[Cleita]

5. She evidently went down the rabbit hole some time ago.

:eyes:

[moriah]

6. If her God really plans for people to be raped or be victims of incest....

... then I'm glad I don't worship her God.

[StarlightGold]

7. Yes, Sharron

YOUR book. But, you see, YOUR book is not MY book. It is not many, many other people's book. Therefore, what's in your book doesn't apply to everyone else. This is the real world. God, what a fucking piece of garbage she is...

[SunnySong]

12. It's not in her book either unless she coverted to Judiasm or something. nt

[Hekate]

22. 'Scuse me? Where is this prohibition in the Torah? There are a multiplicity of interpretations...

... for everything in Jewish sacred literature, which is far more extensive and inclusive than the small part Christians know as the Old Testament.

For instance, in a current essay well worth reading in its entirety, Rabbi Bernard Barsky writes:

>> >snip< The Jewish distinction (rooted in the original Hebrew text) between the life of the mother and the life of the child is emphasized in a striking text of the Mishnah (Ohalot 7:6):
>> "If a woman has difficulty in childbirth, the embryo within her should be dismembered limb by limb, because her life takes precedence over its life. Once its head or its greater part has emerged, it may not be touched, for we do not set aside one life for another." This text seems especially remarkable because it refers to a procedure quite like what today is called "partial-birth abortion," and which is viewed with especial horror by abortion opponents. Even if one could be sympathetic about a first-trimester abortion when the embryo is still barely formed, the killing of a full-term fetus shortly before its birth seems abominable. And yet this is precisely the gory example which the Mishnah uses to clarify its position. As long as the fetus is still enclosed within the mother, it is in some sense a "limb" of the mother, and if the hard choice must be made between the life of the mother and the life of the fetus, the life of the mother takes precedence. However highly the fetus is regarded and however fully it has formed, it does not pass the threshold where it can be regarded as a "person" with equal legal standing to the mother until its head or the greater part of its body has emerged from her womb.
>>
>> This Mishnah text makes a strong argument for the legal acceptability of abortion when it is necessary for the life of the mother, but the circumstances that will actually justify an abortion are not so clear. What is a "difficulty" in childbirth, and how great must the threat to the mother’s life be? What if the mother faces some serious physical injury because of the pregnancy or the childbirth, but her life itself is not in danger. Maimonides (12th century) seemed to strictly limit the cause for abortion to a case where the mother’s life itself was threatened, likening the fetus to a "pursuer," one whom we are justified in killing because it is actively seeking to kill someone else. But most rabbis since Maimonides have not interpreted so narrowly. Most have agreed that serious physical injury to the mother is also grounds for abortion.
>>
>> In fact, the prevailing position in halacha (Jewish law) today, though restrictive, is rather lenient. It is the position argued by former chief rabbi of Israel, Rabbi Ben Zion Uziel. He declared that abortion is permissible even for what he calls "a very thin reason," meaning that one should give broad latitude to how a woman interprets "difficulty" or "injury," or "life-threatening," and even allowing an abortion in certain circumstances of great emotional anguish where there is no physical danger to the mother. But how thin is "thin"? What about the case where the child is known to be physically or mentally defective? What about the regrets after consensual adultery? Does a woman’s shame or embarrassment at the consequences of her own actions justify the termination of a pregnancy? What about the woman whose education or career will be made difficult if she has a child to look after? Is the Jewish position simply abortion on demand? >snip<
http://www.jewishdayton.org/page.aspx?id=187158

And there is more -- as I say, worth reading.

edited to add
I especially like the last part: "...in the end, our tradition has come down strongly on the side of placing responsibility in the hands of the woman. ...Jewish law has acknowledged that in the end no one but the woman herself can make the final decision about what is "harm" or "injury" to her. ... I often like to call Judaism a religion for grown-ups, and this is another example of what that means."

Hekate

[SunnySong]

25. Well honestly I was reffering to the old testament rather than the torah proper.

These fundies tend to quote the old testment and then claim to follow Jesus (they also talk about rapture stuff that isn't in any book as far as I can tell.)

[Raksha]

26. Thank you for setting the record straight, Hekate.

Too many Christians think they know the Jewish position on abortion because they have "read the Old Testament," and read their own interpretations into it in the process. They are always so shocked when they find out that even the most conservative and restrictive Jewish view of abortion is more lenient that the fundie Christian and Roman Catholic one. That's because Judaism has NEVER taken the position that "abortion is murder." The life of the fetus has never been considered to have equal value with the life of the mother.

[MindPilot]

8. This why I believe that if there is a god...

he's a real asshole. Anyone who would worship such a god deserves all the scorn and ridicule that can possibly be heaped upon them.

[StarlightGold]

9. Yes, Sharron,

in YOUR book. But you see, YOUR book is not MY book. It is not many, many other people's book. Therefore, it doesn't apply to the rest of us. This is the real world. God, she is a piece of garbage...

[ismnotwasm]

10. God's plan was for me to have an abortion

Obviously; since it happened, it was God's plan and purpose.

I could use that logic on all kinds of interesting activities. Are we away from 'the devil made me do it' to "It was God's plan and Purpose?"

[blm]

11. So she means that God can be sued for pain and suffering, since He planned the rape and incest.

Does she want to defend this in a court of law?

[Enrique]

13. she's the chicken lady, right? n/t

[rollin74]

14. nope

she beat the chicken lady during the gop primary

[marmar]

15. I miss the chicken lady....At least her brand of crazy was kind of amusing.

This Angle person is scary in the Old Testament sense.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

17. No she makes Lady Cluck Cluck sound like Eleanor Roosevelt. nt

[Dogtown]

16. Where's the emoticon

for "tar & feathers, ridden on a rail"?

[ejpoeta]

18. it's part of his plan even though it's against his book?

isn't rape sex outside of marriage (in most cases. there is marital rape too) and incest requires sex with your family members and not married also. god is against these things, but it's in his 'plan'? these people make me so mad! can someone please explain to me exactly why these people should have ANY say over anything in MY life!!

[1776Forever]

19. My 79 year-old sister is the same way. She always says "It's in God's plan," to which I said "He

gave us a brain too to think things through. There is good and bad and we should know the difference!" It is shameful to me that some people just write things like this off as "God's plan". Please! It is God's plan that we are happy and healthy and that is in our hands and the hands of our legislators who represent us!

[femrap]

20. She knows NOTHING

of what she speaks....that's some bad Karma.

[JBoy]

21. With that logic, you don't need police. Crime is all part of god's plan.

[seabeyond]

23. at least this anti abortionist is consistent. i hate the argument it is murder but ok to murder

if incest, rape or mothers health.

i always challenge the person that gives me stipulations on when the "murder" of a fetus is ok. i tell them, then it is not a murder issue, it is a moral punishment for what is perceived as promiscuousness.

[uppityperson]

27. Rather like those who say there should be a limit on how many a woman can have

"it's ok to have one, or maybe two, but she shouldn't have more" sort of thinking. It is a moral punishment.

[Hekate]

24. Thank god my god is more merciful than hers; being female, she's bound to be...

... and she's especially not mindlessly punitive toward women.

If the Christian majority in this country doesn't take back their own religion from these senseless fanatics, they (the Christian majority) will be in as much trouble as the rest of us. For when the last heathen or pagan is burned at the stake, the fanatics will turn on everyone else who doesn't think as they (the fanatics) do.

It's happened before -- was like that for centuries in Europe. It's why the Founders of this nation erected a "wall of separation" between church and state.

Hekate

[Raksha]

28. I agree...thank the Goddess for Jewitches and all other freethinkers!

I'm not sure if you're a Jewitch or not, but I definitely am and my daughter is too.

[Hekate]

29. Heh

Goddess path married to a Jewish Buddhist. The combination has made for interesting lifelong conversations.

Nice meeting you along the path!

Hekate