In Sweden, the Men Can Have It All

[Liberal_in_LA]

In Sweden, the Men Can Have It All

By KATRIN BENNHOLD
Published: June 9, 2010

From trendy central Stockholm to this village in the rugged forest south of the Arctic Circle, 85 percent of Swedish fathers take parental leave. Those who don’t face questions from family, friends and colleagues. As other countries still tinker with maternity leave and women’s rights, Sweden may be a glimpse of the future.

In this land of Viking lore, men are at the heart of the gender-equality debate. The ponytailed center-right finance minister calls himself a feminist, ads for cleaning products rarely feature women as homemakers, and preschools vet books for gender stereotypes in animal characters. For nearly four decades, governments of all political hues have legislated to give women equal rights at work — and men equal rights at home.

Swedish mothers still take more time off with children — almost four times as much. And some who thought they wanted their men to help raise baby now find themselves coveting more time at home.

But laws reserving at least two months of the generously paid, 13-month parental leave exclusively for fathers — a quota that could well double after the September election — have set off profound social change.

Companies have come to expect employees to take leave irrespective of gender, and not to penalize fathers at promotion time. Women’s paychecks are benefiting and the shift in fathers’ roles is perceived as playing a part in lower divorce rates and increasing joint custody of children. :wow: :wow: :wow: :wow: :wow:

In perhaps the most striking example of social engineering, a new definition of masculinity is emerging.

“Many men no longer want to be identified just by their jobs,” said Bengt Westerberg, who long opposed quotas but as deputy prime minister phased in a first month of paternity leave in 1995. “Many women now expect their husbands to take at least some time off with the children

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/10/world/europe/10iht-sweden.html?src=me&ref=homepage

[Chulanowa]

1. "In this land of Viking lore..." - actually a pretty appropriate mention

The Scandanavian peoples during the viking age (and beyond, I'm sure) were very much "family-oriented." Our popular culture image of them is based off most of our ancestors having been the victims of Viking raids, and so don't tend to show the Viking-as-Family-Man. Care of children was very equally distributed, women had the run of the household, corporal punishment of children was scant (Well... By the standards of the time) and abusive families were often broken up by others in the village. Exile was a common punishment for reglar violence against your family, and abandonment of them was regarded as the absolute least manly thing a guy could do.

[femrap]

17. Now look what our

'culture' has decided to push....single motherhood, males w/ little responsibility for children...not even financial. Rapists aren't punished (ie years and years of rape kits sitting on shelves). Men are encouraged to spend hours watching sports...(ie f*cking NASCAR is on for 6 hours straight) on the weekends.

Our MSM brainwashes and manipulates our 'cultural norms.'

64% of males think it's OK for a woman to have a child out of wedlock. (On CBS news last week)....up from 50% a few years ago.

WASF.

[Chulanowa]

18. That last point is actually a "question with no answer"

if you answer "it's okay for a woman to have a child out of wedlock" then apparently you're an asshole.
if you answer "it's NOT okay for a woman to have a child out of wedlock" then apparently you're STILL an asshole.

Seriously, would you prefer 75 percent of men saying that women HAVE to be married before htey have kids?

[femrap]

22. I'm just wondering why

a woman of limited means would want a child today.

I grew up with a single mother...it was not easy. She had to take my father to court every six months to get the $10/week child support.

Do women have the children because they're 'supposed to?' Is it really something that they feel compelled to do...be a mother?

I interpret it as males not wanting to be fathers...to be responsible for their offspring.

The single mothers I see today are having a very rough time. In fact, their children are in day care most of the time while they work one or two jobs.

I guess it's all in how one spins it. I wonder if the survey asked women how they felt about being single mothers.

During my younger years, none of my friends ever considered having a child...it was the worse thing that could happen. We all wanted to get out in the world, have adventures, travel, have fun. It's very different today.

[Chulanowa]

30. A better question to pose to the guys is this:

If your partner becomes pregnant, do you owe responsibility for the child?

And if I recall, yes, the survey did ask it of women, and most said it was okay for a woman to have a child outside of marriage.

[femrap]

32. If the survey did

ask this, it was not reported on the CBS evening news.

I don't know why you assume that I'm opposed to you or your views. I'm not. But go ahead and assume what you want of me. I'm really tired of defending my Feminist views.

I did my part for the planet and didn't reproduce, and I consider it a good decision. Go ahead and attack me for that. You seem to need an adversary for some reason.

:wtf:

[Chulanowa]

33. Say what?

I'm not attacking you.

:wtf: right back at you, lady.

[femrap]

35. Believe me....

I'm no 'lady.'

I'm sorry if I misconstrued your tone...but I felt I had to defend myself regarding a bunch of 'what ifs,' and I'm so tired of being placed in that situation especially when it concerns women's rights and Feminism.

Here read this:

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100612/NEWS05/6120330/Remarks-on-social-issues-ignite-firestorm?source=pn_s

Sickening that men feel entitled to not only rape us but force us to carry the fetus to term.

btw, I cringe when I'm referred to as a 'girl' or a 'lady.' What's wrong with saying the word, 'woman?' The term, 'men' is used all the time....rarely 'gentleman.'

I believe words matter.

Are we square?

[Chulanowa]

37. I don't know about other men...

But I personally don't feel entitled to rape. In fact, I'm rather strongly disinclined towards the act. One might even safely say I find it abhorrent and disgusting. Yes, I have a penis and two testicles, but I have no particular urge to introduce them to women who don't want to meet them. The same goes for men who don't want to meet them; I'm an equal-opportunity non-rapist.

So. I'm not exactly sure what you're getting on here about, but quite frankly, I've had my fill of accepted bigotry towards unpopular races here on DU, I don't need to put up with some chunk of sexist shit calling me a rapist by virtue of my chromosomes, too.

So, have a nice evening, and remember; words matter.

[femrap]

38. FYI

males can't be raped. They are sodomized.

Every damn time the discussion is about rape, males seem to take it so personally....as if they have in fact raped someone. What a damn hullabaloo there is...how incensed they become. How dare a woman discuss rape with me???

I'm a good guy. Why don't you go spew your incensed attitude at some of the dudes who laugh at rape jokes or who talk about getting women drunk so they can take advantage of them?

Any bad words about the patriarchy and the dudes get all defensive.

I no longer am reading your unenlightened words. As John Lennon said: Woman is the nigger of the world.

Sexism....the last 'ism.'

[Chulanowa]

44. You're a real peice of work

If you are an example of enlightenment, then I'm hanging up the next time Buddha gives me a call.

[Fumesucker]

41. And soap operas are on for hours straight every damn day..

I don't watch any sports, in fact I don't even own a TV but you are sure cherry picking the TV schedule, there are hours of TV that is primarily for women on every single day.

[femrap]

46. So all women like

the same TV shows? I'm supposed to watch Lifetime everyday. Many women watch NASCAR...I don't know why, but they do. And you think men don't watch soaps?

You're a sexist fumesucker, ain't ya? Boys watch and do this. Girls watch and do that. Wow...it's just like in the '50's.

[Fumesucker]

47. So all men like NASCAR?

And no women like NASCAR?

If I'm a sexist then you are just as big a one..

[femrap]

48. I think it's only

men in the south. :evilgrin:

Something with the circle motion is rather hypnotic and the fumes are tantalizingly sweet...but you know that. You suck fumes.

I guess you could count the male to female ratio of NASCAR drivers, but that would entail math and I hear those gas fumes kill brain cells that never return.

ETA: Wait a second...guess those brain cells are few and far between because in my previous post I wrote:

"Many women watch NASCAR...I don't know why, but they do."

You better cut down on those fumes, sucker.

[Fumesucker]

49. Those are financial fumes I'm sucking..

Hence the nom de net..

NASCAR is popular nationwide.

And many men watch soap operas.. I don't know why, but they do.

[LeftyMom]

42. Because it is okay to have a child "out of wedlock"*

Children deserve involved parents, which doesn't require that those parents remain romantically involved with each other or that said partnership be licensed by the state.

*did I fall asleep and wake up in the fifties? Jesus.

[Withywindle]

2. Go Sweden.

Now, if only....

[treestar]

3. That's great!

[dflprincess]

4. This is just the kind of dangerous things socialism can lead to

Thank God our politicians will protect us from this evil. :sarcasm:

No wonder our embassy in Stockholm is constantly beseiged by Swedes begging us to save them their socialist hell hole - oh wait, they're not.

[CTyankee]

6. Back in the days of "boat people" trying to get to the US from Haiti,

I remember taunting my RW brother in law when he'd talk about the evils of socialized medicine. I'd say to him "Right. Notice how many Swedish boat people are coming to the U.S. for their health care!" boy, did that make him mad!

[ismnotwasm]

26. LOL

Good one:thumbsup:

[Warpy]

5. Dunno why your jaw dropped at the lower divorce rates

The main reason I divorced is to lower my workload, something shared by many of my divorced friends who simply had enough of having a fully grown male be another dependent child, incapable of functioning beyond mowing the lawn once a week, griping all the way.

Women have been pulling their weight in the workforce for over 40 years now. It's time for men to pull their weight at home.

If they don't, we will leave them.

Sweden seems to have chosen mental and public health over the masculine phobia of blurring gender roles. It looks like everyone will win as the society becomes healthy and more stable.

[Urban Prairie]

16. I will pit my housework abilities vs any woman.

Obviously I am in the minority as far as males who can do any household chore and do all of them well, but ironically I married a woman who has a disdain for doing them, although she does do them more than adequately when she "feels" like it, which unfortunately for me, isn't very often...:-(

[noamnety]

21. eek

I actually checked your profile to see if my husband had gotten an account here behind my back.

[alittlelark]

34. LOL!

[femrap]

19. As a kid I remember watching

my aunts working their butts while their husbands just sat around. I decided then I wasn't gonna deal with that crap.

[Chicago dyke]

40. right there with you, honey

my ex was incredibly lazy about housework and expected me to do it all. and at the same time, he expected things to be completely clean, all the time. divorce was a blessing for me. and coming out, but never mind that.

i currently care for my father. he's old and partially blind and needs help in daily living. but he's not dead, and he's not totally chairbound. but ask him to put a dish in the washing machine, or sort his own clothes? good god you'd think he was under an air attack. it really pisses me off, for all i know i can't "teach an old dog new tricks."

Scandinavia is a paradise compared to this country. i want to live there so bad. i'm half Finnish, so if things get too rough over here, i may just try for citizenship.

[Liberal_in_LA]

45. my jaw dropped at the 1st part of the paragraph (employers expecting men to take maternity leave)

not the divorce part.

[Hawkowl]

7. Socialists!!!!

That is why I like to refer to myself as a Democratic Socialist.

[Echo In Light]

8. K/R

[JHB]

9. I guess there's a new meaning to "Stockholm Syndrome"...

Good. Too many people here have the old one, and most of them vore Republican.

[Heidi]

10. No wonder the Viking kittens are so confident and well adjusted.

http://users.wolfcrews.com/toys/vikings/

[madrchsod]

11. i wish sweden had a right to return....

i have the name of the church my direct relatives were married in..

[lumberjack_jeff]

12. K&R

“Sometimes politicians have to be ahead of public opinion,” she said, noting how controversial the initial daddy month was and how broadly it is now simply expected.

The least enthusiastic, in fact, are often mothers. In a 2003 survey by the Social Insurance Agency, the most commonly cited reason for not taking more paternity leave, after finances, was mother’s preference, said Ann-Zofie Duvander, a sociologist at Stockholm University who worked at the agency at the time.

Ann-Marie Prhat of the TCO employee federation said she had been determined to share the parental leave with her husband. After many discussions, “we practically signed a contract — six months for me and six months for him.”

Five months into the leave, she was enjoying her son. Could she stay home a couple of months longer, she asked her husband? “In the end,” she said, “I negotiated one extra month.”

Eight in 10 fathers now take a third of the total 13 months of leave — and 9 percent of fathers take 40 percent of the total or more — up from 4 percent a decade ago.

[cliffordu]

13. how do I immigrate???

[Chulanowa]

20. First, you need to learn to speak Swedish

I recommend you watch lots of Muppet Show reruns



Bork bork bork!

[The Straight Story]

29. So...do people need to learn english to come here?

;)

[Chulanowa]

31. I don't see why they would

Most Americans barely speak it, after all

[Taitertots]

27. Just go over there and start a life

Then complain how inhumane they are being when they send you back.

[femrap]

14. I wish everyone would read this

article to see how the Tax System can change behavior. (ie...dad doesn't do child care and then less is available to the family).

I bet these kids grow up to be more happy than those children in the US.

And if Germany can do it, any country could do it.

The last thing this planet needs is macho men.

Thanks for posting.

[Blue_Tires]

15. ttt

[JackDragna]

23. Don't they realize how un-American this is?

I want Sweden invaded. I want their men taught that careers are the only thing that matters and their women made to work three days after giving birth. That's what made this con-tree of ours so grate!

[Liberal_in_LA]

36. lol n/t

[Darth_Kitten]

24. Oh my God(dess), is feminism, gasp, WORKING?

Take THAT, patriarchy...... :)

[Laelth]

25. Is the United States backwards, or what?

If only we could learn from others.

:shrug:

:dem:

-Laelth

[Lithos]

28. To hell with Sweden

Making us look bad...

Seriously... Very cool...

L-

[uponit7771]

39. "ads for cleaning products rarely feature women as homemakers"

AMEN!!!

I know some manly men that can REALLY care for a house, not a woman's touch by no stretch but I wouldn't mind their input in my house

[LeftishBrit]

43. Excellent! The Scandinavian countries are light years ahead of the rest of us in many ways

[stevedeshazer]

50. Once I had a very smart Swedish woman as my boss.

She told me that money is like manure. If you pile it up, it stinks. If you spread it around, things grow.

She was right.