This may get locked, I hope it doesn't.. But here goes...

[Peacetrain]

I have only officially been a part of this site for a couple of years.. I do not have the long history many have here.

I was part of another political site for almost 13 years.. since 1997 actually.. and the site morphed so much because those of us who were there at the very beginning, had a hard time with people who came in later.

Part of the problem was just time itself. Issues morph and change and what is front and center changes with time.

People who came in later were more keyed into the issues front page of the days they joined the site.

They wanted to talk about things that were impacting them in the here and now, and those of us who had been there longer, and had fought a different fight at a different time, were feeling as if we were being pushed aside by this aggressive group of people.

They of course formed their own core, as we had ours.. and then given time..a couple of years, and and election cycle found new people coming on board..and the second group was feeling the loss of community that the old group felt initially.

All I know for sure is, that the three different groups were much more alike than unalike, but there is a sense of loss as these kinds of movements seem to change the discussion.

Of course we were a MUCH MUCH smaller community than DU.. and it affected us harder because there were no other venues to wait out a new group folding in and becoming part of the older group.

That is the genius of a place like this.. its big, and time brings us together.

Here is the really funny part.. when the third big wave of new people joined the group..the second wave joined hands with the old farts from the first group.

It was almost like "here come the newbiesinto our group" close ranks. It really was kind of funny when you step back and view it.

I may have only been here officially two years, and certainly am not part of the core who have been here forever.. but I am finding my home here. I hope that I can be accepted for who I am in the long run.. not as an intruder

Likewise, I hope that I have the sensitivity to see that I am a late comer to an established online community, because it was a hard battle fought for them in establishing this arena..

[sufrommich]

1. In this internet age, people are taking discussion forums

way too seriously.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Xithras]

15. Sort of..

Political soapboxing has a long history both in the U.S. and Europe, and people used to gather in town squares and parks to debate politics on a regular basis. The online forum is simply an extension of that old tradition.

People take it too seriously when they start to believe that it really matters, or that the opinions expressed represent anyone beyond those participating. Just as with prior forms of open political discussion, you only hear the opinions of those present. Just as with prior forms of open political discussion, the real power brokers generally ignore them, if they've ever heard of them at all.

[Orrex]

30. (Incidentally, when I posted that, I was 100% kidding)

I hoped that it would be obvious enough, but I didn't see any of the posts that might have followed it.

Sorry about that!

[sufrommich]

57. I missed the whole deleted sub thread. Must have been a

doozy.

[Orrex]

63. My post was a hyper-histrionic over-the-top reaction to your call for civility

Complete with capital letters.

I thought that it was self-evidently in jest, but perhaps I stepped on someone's toes without realizing it.

[bigwillq]

37. Yup

that's a problem with so many here.

[ScreamingMeemie]

66. +eleventy billion.

[WeekendWarrior]

73. I couldn't agree more. nt

[Orrex]

2. All posts on DU except those by you and me are generated by chatbots

I hope that this helps to bring everything into focus.

[wtmusic]

14. Nice, Orrexbot! You sound almost human. nt

[Riftaxe]

35. I will have to take your word for that

Unfortunately that poster said something so anti-human, he made my ignore list on first day or two.

And i save my ignores for people like Aryan nations members, KKK, and other like minded ignorant group.

I am hardly an opponent to dissident opinions to our party, but some people are just to vile.

[Orrex]

51. .

[L0oniX]

60. +1 ...ignored is also in my ignored dungeon.

[Orrex]

75. .

[RaleighNCDUer]

23. I am NOT a chatbot bot bot bot bot bot bot bot bot >>>>>>>.............

[Ignis]

45. Why do you say they are generated by chatbots?

Are they always generated by chatbots?

Would you like it if they were not generated by chatbots?

:D

And here's a Java version of ELIZA if you want to keep playing:
http://www.chayden.net/eliza/Eliza.html

[Dappleganger]

3. Your posts are so enjoyable.

Thanks for the extra plug of positivity!

:hi:

[havocmom]

4. Not as much geezers v newbies

as it is people taking Obama up on his invitation/insistance to MAKE HIM DO THE RIGHT THINGS and those who attack us for being unDEMS

[dionysus]

40. well, yes, and no. there's a bunch of folks here who have pretty much branded obama, the admin, and

all it's supporters RWers, DLCers, and fake dems, even republicans. that type of argument cuts both ways. that kind of crap isn't "holding feet to the fire" you know. it's playing the "i'm more liberal than thou" card.

[havocmom]

46. guess we will just disagree as I do not accept your talking points

as an accurate defination of myself and many others I know who will continue to express dissent when they feel the administration is making mistakes. Has nothing to do with labels or cards. Has to do with principles and critical thought, free thought, not group think

[ultracase24]

47. Just curious and a question.

If a person went on a conservative message board and said they were pro-choice, loved single payer, and wanted to see military funding slashed, and then called themselves conservative, would anybody on the board believe them?

This is just a general question.

[ShortnFiery]

6. Other "the moderators rule," there is no hierarchical structure here. Is there?

We all fit in by contributing our opinions and experience to whatever thread chooses to draw our interests.

I don't understand the notion of "fitting in?"

As long as we are polite and do not breech the rules, any human being is welcome to stay.

[Javaman]

22. Well, there are the DU overlords...

A small group of people who are picked semi-annually, ever other year, who meet in dark smoke filled rooms discussing the course in which DU must take (topic-wise) for the next few years. They are sworn to secrecy and are banned from the group and from DU if any of the groups secrets are revealed.

Beyond that, we are just a fun group of folks chatting here that are all equals!

Oh no, someones coming for me! I've said to much!!! Oh god, I don't want to leave!!!

Remember me! Tell my loved ones that I....

[dionysus]

41. you just had to go too far this time, didn't you? sad...

;)

[RaleighNCDUer]

24. ...any human being is welcome to stay.

But what about the rest of us?

You with your parochial human-centric prejudices, THAT's a fine display of progressivism!

[CaliforniaPeggy]

7. This is a very good analysis.

You have seen how things work, and why, and it sure as hell is happening here.

I hope we can continue to work together, and help people become part of the whole group here on DU.

[Oregone]

17. I agree. I am happy they talked about their long experience with 4Chan

If those guys can work out their problems, Im sure we can too

[Major Hogwash]

27. OMG! Her born on date is July 1992!

And that's just the beer in her fridge!

LOL

"My secret name is . . ."

That's too funny.

[Vinnie From Indy]

8. Locking

Too wordy!

Just teasin' - Welcome to DU!

Sound argument and rational thought usually smooth over the newbyness factor I've found. Cheers!

:)

[ShortnFiery]

9. ...

FLAME BAIT! :evilgrin:

[Liberal_in_LA]

42. double lock! First one didn't take

:toast:

[UndertheOcean]

10. OH , THE DRAMA !!!

[Orrex]

12. I don't want to tell you how to live your life or anything, but...

I think it would be funnier if it were the DRRAMA LLAMA.

[NoPasaran]

21. My sister was bitten by a llama

[Dappleganger]

31. My friend who raises llamas

We were shearing, she on one side w/manual shears and I on the other steadying the backside, her husband supposedly holding the halter on one llama steady. Husband wasn't paying attention, llama got upset for unknown llama reasons and used her head to come under and punch my friend in the jaw. She went flying backwards on her ass several feet, bleeding from her lip which required stitches.

It hurt BAD...my friend is a retired pediatrician, tough as nails but easy-going, never shows any sadness or crying for her herself. But she cried as I've never seen before or since then, we all laughed about it later. Stupid llama!

[madinmaryland]

49. Do llamas spit like alpacas do?

[Hubert Flottz]

69. My homework was eaten by a Yak!

[AllentownJake]

11. I'm loved by all

and therefore have no clue what you are talking about.

:rofl:

[Oregone]

13. Deleted message

[HughMoran]

20. Deleted Submessage

[madinmaryland]

48. Deleted micromessage.

[HughMoran]

50. Deleted Nanomessage

:P

[madinmaryland]

54. Deleted Picomessage

:D

[HughMoran]

59. Deleted Femtomessage

:P

[HughMoran]

64. Deleted Attomessage

[HughMoran]

65. Deleted Zeptomessage

[HughMoran]

74. Deleted Yoctomessage

This is the end.

[Javaman]

16. you said movement. nt

[socialist_n_TN]

18. I'm new to DU too

and for the same reason as you. An old political board shut down and my brother turned me on to this one. Although I had some dustups (on the old board, not here....yet:)) I've had remarkably few comparatively speaking. I think that that's because I TRY to disagree w/o being disagreeable. I DO try to respect the opinion of even people who disagree with me.

Hell, it's just cyberspace, not anything important. :) It's a place to learn and hone arguments. Some people put more stock in it than it deserves, ergo they're more emotionally invested and as a consequence, more prickly.

I guess the cliquishness is just something that humans are prone to. I don't worry too much about it. I can learn from bomb throwers, effete snobs as well as ignoramusses. :) And that's what these types of forums are for for me. Learning.

[mmonk]

19. I see no reason this should be locked or anything.

There will always be revolving discussions and changing circumstances

peace

[jotsy]

25. Coming up on my first anniversary as a DUer.

An entertaining education it has been.

[hunter]

26. Is DU a "community?"

I think it's more like the road closure programs in San Francisco -- a nice street to dance on.

[Major Hogwash]

29. We supported a former community organizer for President, didn't we?

The Republicans only supported a former alcoholic, so I think we're ahead of the game.

LoL

[snooper2]

28. It's just a message board...

Shouldn't consume your life :)

[guitar man]

36. +1000

:applause:

[bigwillq]

39. Exactly.

:thumbsup: Many here take it way too seriously. Love the posts when posters say they "need to take a break" Seriously, if one needs to take a break from a message board, then maybe they need to reconsider why they come to one. If one needs to take a break, one has a problem. Those posts make me LOL! :rofl:

[ScreamingMeemie]

68. Plus we look like asses when we come back.

Trust me. :hi:

[bigwillq]

70. ha ha

:rofl: :) :hi: :hug:

[dionysus]

43. hey, it's hard to find this many political junkies in one place in real life!

[Jennicut]

53. OMG, that is the truth. My husband so does not know

about financial reform, or the important primaries for the House, or what Tories and Lib Dems are doing in England. But I can find it all right here...on good old DU. I love my DU and am not giving it up.

[annabanana]

72. (a major part of the irrefutable charm of the place, IMHO).. . .

Our here in the "real world" people often don't have the damnedest idea wtf I'm talking about..

[revolution breeze]

56. You are so very right

It is a message board, a tool I have found and use daily. I read the boards (don't respond much unless it something I am passionate about or feel I can contribute) , then take the ideas, thoughts, and, most importantly, INFORMATION I glean from this site into my actual community. I discuss threads I read here when I go to the bus stop with daughter, over coffee with friends, and with co-workers. You would be surprised how many of us lurk to get ideas to discuss around the water cooler each day. And how often that discussion has lead to action (letters to the editor, telephone calls to our Senators and Representatives, rallies, contacting the media, etc.).

[spiritual_gunfighter]

61. Says the person with over 7000 posts n/t

[X_Digger]

32. Here's my theory on online specialized communities..

Obviously, all of this doesn't apply to DU, but there are some points that ring a bell in here. I noticed this behavior on usenet, back in the days of BBSs and FidoNet, early 'computer clubs', even special interest groups about the saltwater aquarium hobby.

A small group of really enthusiastic people get together and form a community. They all participate a lot up front, sharing information and insight. Everyone's happy.

They do such a good job of promoting themselves, or word gets around, or their interest becomes popular, something- and an influx of newbies comes in. Some are newbies to the interest, others are just newbies to this community. Some of the same questions get asked, and the same information gets shared. They pretty much share a lot of the same viewpoints.

The first and second waves of newbies are integrated into the one happy collective until some unidentified critical mass is reached. Rules are formed, incorporation happens, meeting minutes are taken, structure is applied. This group constitutes the 'old timers' revision 1.

Newbies after this point are in another class- those that remember the time before 'X event' and those that came after. (I see many of these stratifications occur based on different events.) Add a few waves of newbies and you get to what I call the 'link' stage. When newbies ask questions that have already been discussed, the tendency is to post a link to the old discussion and summarize into a pithy statement (e.g., "Config.sys loads device drivers and autoexec.bat loads TSRs.")

Usually sometime in the 'link' stage, the old timers are almost outnumbered by the newbies (from all waves after rev 1.) This causes a bit of a panic. The core goals and earlier discussions are re-posted, discussed, and re-affirmed.

Toward the end of the 'link' stage, the balance tips. The core of active participants becomes a different group, either through attrition or sheer numbers / popularity. This often goes unnoticed. {cue foreboding music}

The next stage is the 'Search next time, but here's the link' stage. Regular posters have threads or links bookmarked so that they can quickly dole them out to any question tangentially related to the link. Posts get stickied, etc., and the presentation to these answers is accompanied by 'search next time' or 'check the archives..'.

As the community starts to age, folks' patience with the same questions starts to wear thin. Tempers flare, and newbies beware. The 'old-timers' commiserate on the cluelessness of the newbies, and reminisce about the 'good old days', further entrenching the 'Us vs. Them' mentality.

Should the "newbies" (newbies from the old-timers' perspective) actually start taking an active role in the direction of the community, the PTB (powers that be) start a protectionist clatter. They promote those that share their views to positions of power, while ignoring or even restricting those that don't share their opinions.

Eventually, the "newbies" who all share a similar (but different from the PTB) viewpoint either take over or leave to form a new group. Those left behind are the most patient, or the stubbornest, cranky ones. God help any newbie asking a question that could be found by using the search feature. Often, the only response to common questions is 'use the search' or 'google it' or 'check the archives'. Eventually it winds down to a core set of users, and newbies land elsewhere.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

[The Straight Story]

33. Glad to have you here, it can be rough going at times - but always fun and great folks here

Reminds me of when I was a kid and did not like sauerkraut, now that I am older I have finally acquired a taste for it :rofl:

Met many good people here and folks seem to put up with my wild rantings at times, which helps me personally through a lot of crap that has went on.

[Riftaxe]

34. As a long time lurker

Who just recently registered, I would have to say this time around that the more zealous people have stayed around a bit longer after the primaries. In 2004 things calmed down quite rapidly, this evolution they seem to have remained fairly active.

Over the years i have also seen many long time thoughtful posters buy the granite pizza during a fit of pique while interacting with some of the new blood; and that is always a bit disappointing and diminishes the overall quality of the board a bit.

These days even the lounge is crawling with people sadly lacking in humor or social skills (proof that GD is a virulent entity?) :evilfrown:

[Crystal Clarity]

62. That happened to me (sort of)

I was here from May 2001 to Jan or Feb. 2006. I won't go into it any further other then to say that the whole TS process was very unpleasant... So much so that I stayed away from even lurking until about 3 months ago.

So many things have changed and very few of the folks I used to know are still here. Out of curiosity I've done searches on some of them. Most seem to just be MIA or infrequent posters. But I've also found a surprising number of TS's. People I would have never thought would cause a problem.

Oh well, time marches on....

[dionysus]

38. yay. great post train!

:thumbsup:

[kgnu_fan]

44. Very sensitive post, thank you

[lonestarnot]

52. I'm glad you're here, and I like your name.

:hi:

[chillspike]

55. New Rule: We're Liberals. We don't ostracize

Okay? Let's leave the cynical social competitive bull shit to the Right Wing.

Okay, everyone?

[Gold Metal Flake]

58. "intruder" "PeaceTRAIN" sig pix of train

The overt male sexual imagery in your post is very unprogressive. (Paranoid, finger-shaking screed follows)

[ScreamingMeemie]

67. There is a front door and a back door. People come, people go.

You get sucked in. You realize (for me it was a couple of years) that it's really just an internet message board and (I would bet) fully 95% of the people here aren't behaving as they would in real life. So, there you have it.

I used to put a lot of time and energy into this, and then it became just not worth obsessing over. Especially when internet masks slip. :hi:

[bigwillq]

71. Good post.

I was one of those who took it seriously for a time, until DU jumped the shark. Gay purge, several long timers being banned while others, who were just as guilty, were not, admins posting personal PMs...that's when I no longer took this place seriously.

I still think it's, perhaps, the best political message board out there, in both content and format. There is still a wealth of information to absorb, and there are still some decent folks left. But the days of taking this place seriously are long gone for me.