Question - About this Tea Party Mantra that 45% of people in the US pay no taxes

[paparush]

Do they understand that the vast majority of that number make so little income that they are not required to file?

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/206.html

Are they concerned at all about the multi-national corps, who basically run the country, which pay no tax?

[SocialistLez]

1. I think they do understand

so many people make so little income they aren't required to file.

I don't think they're all that concerned about all the corporations that don't pay taxes.
We can't tax the rich remember? Or else we won't have ANY job growth if we tax the rich.:crazy:

[fascisthunter]

2. you know what... fuck the GOP... we know they are behind all of this

weasels

[Captain Hilts]

3. INCOME taxes. These folks pay payroll and sales taxes. nt

[trotsky]

8. And property (directly or indirectly) and excise and all sorts of taxes.

Intellectual honesty has never been a requirement for a conservative.

[Captain Hilts]

9. Indeed!

[rurallib]

10. and social security and medicare taxes (which are federal)

[trotsky]

12. Those are what are known as "payroll taxes."

If you are on someone's payroll, you pay them. They also have the infamous "caps" where you are only taxed up to a certain amount of income. Those people with large salaries pay a vanishingly small portion of their income on SS and Medicare taxes.

[walldude]

4. Well considering that they are carrying two signs..

One says "Taxes Unfair" and the other says "50% of Americans are Freeloaders" I'd say they have no idea what they are talking about, what they are protesting, or how the tax system works.

[jmowreader]

5. Let's talk about that little mantra for a second

If 45 percent of people in the United States pay no taxes (at this point some DUers are getting ready to start screaming "but what about sales tax and property tax?!" Let's talk about that too...if you're making so little you're eligible for refundable credits you most likely either rent or live in some sort of subsidized housing hence no property taxes, and the refundable credit absorbs your sales tax...so yes, if you're that poor you probably DON'T pay any taxes), and the tea party people are supposed to come from a cross-section of America, then it's safe to assume 45 percent of Tea Party members don't pay taxes either.

[BeFree]

13. Eh?

""...you most likely either rent or live in some sort of subsidized housing hence no property taxes...""

A renter pays property taxes via the rent. Indeed, property taxes from rental properties are usually higher than homesteads. Renters actually generate the revenue to pay property taxes.

But the part about how 45% of TBers don't pay fed income taxes is dead on.

[jmowreader]

16. I was thinking more of taxes you pay directly

Also remember: you as the property owner can deduct from your income tax the property taxes on your rental properties. So let's play with this for a minute:

GI Joe is married to GI Elizabeth, and their first duty station in 1991 was Fort Lewis. They bought a home and were able to deduct their interest and property taxes.

When they moved to Fort Riley in 1997, they listed their Fort Lewis home with a rental agent, and bought a home in Manhattan, Kansas. Now they can deduct the taxes they pay on the Ft. Lewis house--PLUS they can deduct insurance payments as a business expense, which they couldn't do when they were living in it. They have to report the rent payments as income, but then again they had to report the money they used to pay the mortgage when they lived in the house as income so it's no skin off their backs. They can also deduct repairs, which they couldn't do as the residents of the property. Plus I think you can deduct agency fees--if you're paying Johnson Realty $50 a month to collect your rent and look at the house once in a while to be sure the tenant hasn't set up a meth lab in the garage, you can deduct it as an ordinary and necessary expense.

Now here's the real kicker: Rental property is business property, correct? This puts it on Schedule C, not Schedule A. They can deduct the insurance on the place on line 15, the mortgage interest on line 16a and the taxes on line 23. they can put the rental agency fees on line 10, any travel to Fort Lewis they have to do on line 24a, if they're paying utilities (not likely unless they evict the last tenant and pay to keep the lights on so the AC can run) they can go on line 25. This they can do without regard to their standard deduction, because as long as that place is being rented out it's a business venture. Same deal when they move to Fort Gordon and rent the Fort Riley property out because the last one worked so well.

As far as your personal residence goes, the only way you can deduct your property taxes and interest payments is if your total itemizable expenses break the $11,400 standard deduction.

So...who's paying the property tax for a renter? Most of it is paid by the IRS.

[BeFree]

17. Yes, well

The revenue generated to pay the tax comes from the tenant.

Tenants earn money and they pay for the taxes. The deduction from the owners income taxes is a percentage of their income. The higher the tax bracket the higher the percentage.

The IRS enforces the more money you have the more you can have.

[jmowreader]

19. Yes, well...

By the time the owner deducts the taxes on the property, the interest paid, any fees to the realty company, etc., etc., etc., the reduction in income taxes associated with all these business expenses probably covers the tax bill.

The tenant gives the property owner money to pay property taxes to the state, and then the federal government gives the property owner money to replace that which was sent in. So I still say ultimately, the IRS pays the property taxes. Think of the tenant's payment as sort of mezzanine taxpaying.

[JerseygirlCT]

6. Well it's all their own damned fault!

Real Americans would make enough to pay taxes so they can complain about it!

[Statistical]

7. Please don't repeat that lie.

45% of Americans pay not FEDERAL INCOME tax that isn't the same thing as paying no TAXES.

Who gives a flying crap is 45%, 60%, 99.9999999% of people pay none of one particular tax. If we eliminated income tax and replaced it with say a federal VAT (not saying we should) then 0% of Americans would pay no INCOME tax however they would all still pay taxes.

Federal Income taxes are only 25% of all taxes in this country.

The only metric that matters is TOTAL TAXATION
Total Tax Burden on individual = Payroll taxes + Federal Income + State Income Tax + Sales Taxes + Excise Taxes + Tarriffs

Even talking about "just income taxes" is playing into the Right Wing meme. Anytime someone brings up income taxes knock it down as a useless metric.

[BeFree]

14. Minimum wagers

Those making the minimum and below don't pay fed income taxes. Their income is so low it is not federally taxed. OMG!!

Our economic problem comes when the money spent goes overseas and the tax on those overseas laborers is collected overseas. Buy American and the taxes on that labor stays in America and lowers our debt.

[paparush]

15. Thanks, Stats...this is just the kind of well organized reply I was looking for

to better educate myself when confronted Tea Party Madness Syndrome (DSM V- Pending)

[rurallib]

11. Be sure to remind them that Exxon is among that group

But their profits were only $4B or so.

[SmileyRose]

18. I told my local teabagger to quit her job

Poor people don't pay any taxes and have the idyllic life of unprotected sex all day in the back seat of their leather appointed Caddy. For fun they have plenty of time to go playing at the park with the kids - eating a picnic of lobster and watercress. And if they have so much as a hangnail they can get right in, no waiting, to the best emergency room in the world, and order an MRI and double abortions (just for the fun of it) all FREE!

If those lazy ass teabaggers would get off their butts and quit their jobs, they too could live so carefree. Really, every conservative in America, ESPECIALLY the politicians, should quit their jobs immediately and refuse to ever go to work at any paying job ever again. Their lives would just be SO much better.