You will never see a Reconciliation Bill

[ThomWV]

If the house goes first on the Senate Bill you will never, as long as you live, see a Reconciliation bill that addresses its shortcomings pass. I do not care what promises are made by who, it will not happen. Bet on it.

It is the height of absurdity to first pass a flawed bill promising to fix it soon thereafter. Pass a good bill first, and there is no need for that mythical soon thereafter.

[Ozymanithrax]

1. 1 problem...

Both house and Senate must pass a bill. The House moves more quickly than the Senate.

Why play a waiting game?

[ThomWV]

3. Passing good legislation rather than bad is not playing a waiting game.

And maybe thats the real problem, this is all just a big game to the politicians.

[Ozymanithrax]

34. Passing any health care legislation will be an enormous boon to Americans.

Pass the bill.
Sign the bill.
Go to work making it better.

[jeanpalmer]

37. The time to make it better is now

They're starting from scratch with regard to the uninsured, unemcumbered by a costly inefficient private insurance system. It's the ideal time to create the best system -- a single payer system. Instead, they've adopted the costly inefficient system, and are trying to unload it on us. If they opt for a bad system with a Democratic President and large majorities in Congress, when they have a clear path to single payer, what will ever motivate them to reconsider the original good solution they had available to them but passed up?

[VPStoltz]

39. Because the Senate can not be trusted - even the members of the same Party.

[Nite Owl]

2. I doubt it too

Even if they promise publicly to do a fix of some sort in reconciliation there will be those few who will find some reason that they can't back it when it comes down to a vote.

[xchrom]

4. Recommend

[QC]

5. Bill Clinton was going to fix NAFTA.

That was fifteen years ago.

[Better Believe It]

6. Be patient. They are working on it.

[QC]

13. Yeah, they don't have a magic wand. n/t

[closeupready]

27. You just wait - you are gonna wake up one day and NAFTA will have fixed ITSELF!

And you'll be like, "What a freaking genius that guy was!!!!" :sarcasm:

[QC]

35. Just wait! It will all come together suddenly, when no one is expecting it! n/t

[flyarm]

7. and how are those "fixes" working for everyone?? notttt...eom

[karynnj]

28. Very premature and very predictable from you

[flyarm]

33. and your reply is also predictable. ..and ..well lets just leave it at that..

I was replying to the NAFTA fixes..is that too premature for you? Have we not waited long enough for them? How long is long enough before NAFTA fixes can be spoken of????? 25 years????? what??????

Please do tell me how I am supposed to post to make you happy?? Is there a book with special postings I should follow???????

eom

[laughingliberal]

8. There you go! I hope the House holds firm

Pelosi is not stupid and she knows these promises of future 'fixes' are worthless. That said, I fully expect the White House is strong arming the doo doo out of her right now. Let's all write and let her know we appreciate her efforts to stand up for us.

[progressoid]

9. I think we're keeping our powder dry.

Or playing chess or something. :eyes:

[subterranean]

10. They should pass the reconciliation changes first.

Then pass the Senate bill in the House. Then Obama signs both. Problem solved.

[Better Believe It]

11. Hoyer: House will go first on health bill

Hoyer: House will go first on health bill and

House Democrats Will Pass Senate Healthcare Bill On Mere Promise Of Reconciliation "Fixes"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7813267

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7810185&mesg_id=7810185

[Better Believe It]

12. The House may cave in to the health insurance industry and Big Pharma lobbyists

Will House progressives stick to their guns and vote against the Senate bill?

Or will they totally capitulate to the Senate and corporate interests?

That's the big question.

[tritsofme]

14. From a procedural standpoint, the House must go first.

There simply isn't a way around this.

[FrenchieCat]

23. Yep. Can't pass reconciliation "fixes" on a bill that isn't law.

So For some here, they really do think there is a magic wand to be used, when there isn't.

[Better Believe It]

29. Kind of misleading. Here's why.

Before the House votes for the Senate bill they can demand that the Senate:

1. Prepare and release the exact legislative language of all the "fixes" that will be proposed in a Senate reconciliation bill.

2. Ask for a ruling from the Senate parliamentarian of what if any of the "fixes" of a proposed Senate reconciliation bill would not be in compliance with Senate budget reconciliation rules.

3. Have at least 51 Senators publicly pledge to vote in favor of the complete reconciliation package.

I would think those should be the minimum demands of the House leadership.

Will they make those and perhaps other demands on the Senate before they bring the Senate bill before the House for a vote or will they just "trust" the Senate to perhaps adopt via reconciliation some unspecified House proposals some time in the future?

[Change Happens]

15. You and others keep making the same mistake, not sure why this is so hard to understand: Bills have

been passed already, both houses of congress are done "passing bills."

What we are talking about in reconciliation is the fixes ONLY!!!

We will (or won't anytime soon) fix some things using reconciliation, and the way I see it, we don't even have to tackle the fixes anytime soon...Example: we can pass something fixing the Nelson deal now, Monday, June, or 2011, really does not matter.

The one fix and/or item(s) I would like to see done first are:

1) Take away the antitrust exemption
2) Pass the President's newly added item allowing the govt. to control insurance rates

Both of the above do not have to be done as part of the reconciliation and/or the current bill.

[Dogmudgeon]

16. What s/he said

:thumbsup:

So many people get enraged by stuff they don't even pay attention to.

--d!

[ThomWV]

17. Well, continue - state the obvious, neither chamber has passed the other's Bill

It doesn't mean shit that the house and senate have both passed bills. Will the Senate consider the house bill? Why not?

[Change Happens]

18. You never know, stay tuned...

If the Bennet letter keeps getting more signatures from liberal senators, they might just do that, one vote and boom!!! Senate liberals pass the house bill with 51 votes.

Voila!!!

We will have to live with the Stupid Stupak language - until we fix it.

[Scarsdale Vibe]

21. The Senate isn't considering the House bill because they'd need 102% of the caucus to vote for it.

Whereas Pelosi merely needs to round up 85% of the Democratic House membership. But don't let mathematical and political impossibilities dissuade you from considering Senate passage of the House bill a viable course of action.

[FrenchieCat]

24. You ask a question; Will the Senate consider the house bill? Why not?

That would put us back to needing 60 votes, and we don't have them; that's why.

If the House passes the Senate bill, then we have a bill ready to sign.
The reconciliation fixes must come after the Senate bill is made "the" bill by law.

Pres. Obama is going to be calling for an "Up or down" vote.....meaning reconciliation,
as up or down means majority wins, i.e., 51 votes.

[ipaint]

19. It's a con.

The last in a long series of bait and switch tactics regarding health ins. reform. Anyone who trusts the senate to improve on a piss poor bill that rewards ins. companies with pots of mandated cash has a screw loose.

[SlingBlade]

20. You forgot to add, With a Public Option that includes Single Payer.

Remember WHO is in charge. Don't buy into the Good Cop.Bad Cop Republicans made me do it bull shit

Let 'em know this before they pull the trigger and kill our party.

[Greyhound]

26. There it is, right there, "before they pull the trigger and kill our party" n/t

[Oregone]

22. Another bait and switch

[ThomWV]

25. Exactly - they are saying, Take this turd now, and we'll put sugar on it for you later. Yeah, right

[Better Believe It]

30. Because the Senate can't be trusted here's what the House needs to do

Before the House votes for the Senate bill they should demand that the Senate:

1. Prepare and release the exact legislative language of all the "fixes" that will be proposed in a Senate reconciliation bill.

2. Ask for a ruling from the Senate parliamentarian of what if any of the "fixes" of a proposed Senate reconciliation bill would not be in compliance with Senate budget reconciliation rules.

3. Have at least 51 Senators publicly pledge to vote in favor of the complete reconciliation package.

I would think those should be the minimum demands of the House leadership.

Will they make those and perhaps other demands on the Senate before they bring the Senate bill before the House for a vote or will they just "trust" the Senate to perhaps adopt via reconciliation some unspecified House proposals some time in the future?

[AlinPA]

31. You will never see a Reconciliation Bill period- with Harry Reid as "leader".

[Better Believe It]

32. And I have serious doubts that President Obama wants a reconciliation bill

But, he hopes the mere promise of one might enable Pelosi and Rahm Emanuel to round up enough votes in the House to pass the Senate bill.

They are counting on liberals/progressives to fold.

Let's hope they don't.

[t0dd]

38. It's not just liberals that have to fold--conservative Dems too.

Even if all liberals vote for it, they'd still be short. The House bill passed 220-215. John Murtha, Robert Wexler, and Neil Abercrombie were "yes" votes that are now gone. Joseph Cao is against the Senate bill. That means it is already 216-216. On top of that, Stupak and his gang won't vote for the abortion language in the Senate bill, so you lose another few there (~ 4-5). Finally, Grijalva has said he won't vote for it (and some other progressives won't, including Kucinich and Massa that originally voted against the House bill).

Therefore, the only way to pass it is for enough conservative Democrats that voted AGAINST the House bill to switch their votes, and after what happened in MA, I just don't see that happening. Even though a lot of people would like to give Orahma a 'W', they aren't interested in ending their careers by voting for the Senate monstrosity.

[applegrove]

36. I don't care how they get it done...just get it done.

[jeanpalmer]

40. It will be just one more act of dishonesty

This whole process has been dishonest. There's the 2013 start date and the budget numbers don't add up. And then the adoption of one of the worst systems available to them, and trying to pass it off as reform. The product should be declared a scheme to defraud the public.