Why do men who commit suicide so often take out their families along with themselves?

[Stinky The Clown]

Today's plane crasher did it.

It is a not in the least uncommon back story to suicides.

Why is this?

I find it incredibly sad.

And angering.

[upi402]

1. more women do it, but many leave themselves living n/t

[treestar]

2. That there is no one left to take care of their family

And they are killing themselves. Not rational, but that's the idea.

Taking strangers along - that shows a hatred of society and a desire to strike out in the process.

[Stinky The Clown]

4. Is that surmise or fact?

Not challenging you. Asking the question honestly.

If surmise, it makes sense. Given the basic fucked upidness of a suicide.

[AllentownJake]

7. Depends on the killer

The guy who shot up the Texas University in the 60s killed his wife and mother to spare them the indignity of having been known as being close to them according to his suicide note.

I don't think this guy wanted to harm his wife or step daughter, I think he burned down the house as a single flare of who he was for when he crashed the plane. That and if he owed the IRS taxes, the house might have been soon property of the government and he was just destroying it.

[treestar]

9. The studies on family annihilators

It was something to that effect.

Googled and the first three articles are interesting:

http://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C1RNCN_enUS335US341&aq=0&oq=%22family+anni&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=family+annihilator

[Stinky The Clown]

11. Thanks for that!

[AllentownJake]

3. He didn't kill his wife or step daughter

He set fire to the house. This was different than other cases I've read about, usually they are shot or stabbed before the rampage.

Women routinely kill their children prior to suicide attempts.

Generally speaking, with women who survive the suicide attempt, it is to spare the children from not having someone to take care of them.

[redqueen]

5. "Women routinely kill their children prior to suicide attempts."

:wtf:

As for the rest, you're right... he burned the house down yes, but he didn't tie them up inside first or anything like that.

[AllentownJake]

8. I've read just as many stories

of women killing their children prior to trying to kill themselves or killing themselves as I have men.

Difference between men and women, women tend to not kill their spouses as often unless there is abuse, simply from the reading of news reports of these things.

[Kitty Herder]

17. Facts may be useful here.

To quote from a USDOJ website: "Cases in which women kill their male partners, their children and themselves are extremely rare and thus gain even more widespread media coverage."
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/nij/topics/crime/intimate-partner-violence/murder-suicide.htm

You remember them because they get more media attention, not because they happen very often.

More info:

"Medical studies estimate that between 1,000 and 1,500 deaths per year in the
United States are the result of murder-suicide. This VPC analysis reveals that, in the first half of 2005, there were 591 murder-suicide deaths, of which 264 were suicides and 327 were homicides. Using these figures, more than 10 murder-suicide events occur in the United States each week. Of the 264 suicides, 248 were male and 16 were female. Of the 327 homicides, 255 victims were female and 72 victims were male. Included in the homicide victims were 47 children and teens less than 18 years of age." http://www.vpc.org/studies/amroul2006.pdf

Got that? Six percent (16 of 264) of the suicides (the killers)were women. So Stinky's use of the word men was correct.

[Fumesucker]

6. Men are twice as likely to commit suicide after a divorce as women..

In many ways we really are the weaker sex.

http://www.articlesbase.com/divorce-articles/why-are-men-more-likely-to-commit-suicide-after-divorce-383186.html

According to recent studies, men are two and a half times more likely to commit suicide after divorce as compared to women. These studies have put an end to the famous mistaken belief that women suffer more after divorce.

Women have long been termed as emotional beings by their male counterparts. In fact, it is common for men to ridicule and even feel frustrated about the emotional quotient displayed by women. However, truth is, it is this emotional quotient that helps women cope with divorce far more easily than men. Women tend to make friendships on a far deeper emotional level than men do. These friendships help women deal with their feelings during and after the divorce process because women are able to talk to their friends about their concerns and problems.

Men, on the other hand, tend to form friendships wherein they can get to “hang out” with their friends but not talk about their deep inner feelings. Since men are not able to voice out their bitterness and hurt felt during the divorce, they tend to feel a void in their lives. In fact, it is common for men to seclude themselves from their friends because they do not even know how to have fun with their friends when their minds weigh so heavily with emotional baggage related to divorce.

Men tend to feel more shattered than women after the divorce because in most of the divorce cases involving children, the custody of the children is awarded to the mother. Therefore, all of a sudden, men find themselves to be a mere visitor in their child’s life, which can be a very tough emotion to deal with.

[seabeyond]

23. thank you fume. there are so many, too many societal conditions of both genders that are just false

i cannot believe we allow ourselves to live in these illusions so readily, without acknowledging.

another thing, in divorce i find interesting.

when women decide they are done in a relationship, they are done. they have thought it out, planned, then execute

men tend to try to start a fight so a woman will walk.

i read that once. not having ever participated in a break up, i dont know. but i found that interesting. sounds like the woman is already emotionally secure when she walks.

[EFerrari]

10. Maybe because they can't imagine their families living without them.

It's just all part of the suicide.

[onestepforward]

12. I think that "control" issues are at least one factor.

I don't know by how much. It is incredibly sad.

[Confusious]

13. I was going to post that

Usually when it happens, "controlling" comes along with it.

[onestepforward]

20. I think so too.

I also think that it begins with the feelings of one's life being out-of-control.

[JI7]

14. they probably consider the woman and kids their property they don't want others to take

[EFerrari]

18. Or more simply, a part of themselves.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

15. When did he take out his family?

[Bill McBlueState]

16. how often?

I need to know how often this happens before I start guessing about why.

[Kitty Herder]

19. I found some stats, but they're a bit old.

"Medical studies estimate that between 1,000 and 1,500 deaths per year in the
United States are the result of murder-suicide. This VPC analysis reveals that, in the first half of 2005, there were 591 murder-suicide deaths, of which 264 were suicides and 327 were homicides. Using these figures, more than 10 murder-suicide events occur in the United States each week. Of the 264 suicides, 248 were male and 16 were female. Of the 327 homicides, 255 victims were female and 72 victims were male. Included in the homicide victims were 47 children and teens less than 18 years of age." http://www.vpc.org/studies/amroul2006.pdf

[Bill McBlueState]

21. interesting.

Here I see that there were 33,300 suides in the US in 2006, and further down that page, I see that 80% were men. This means about 26,600 men committed suicide in the US in 2006.

Your post says 248 men committed murder-suicide in 2005. So we can estimate that 248/26,600 = a little less than 1% of male suicides were murder-suicides.

For women, 16 of 6660 suicides, or one quarter of one percent, were murder-suicides.

The question the OP posed is interesting, but I'm also curious why the suicide rate (murder-suicide or otherwise) is four times greater for men.

[Kitty Herder]

24. I've always wondered that myself.

The explanation most often given is that men are more likely to shoot themselves, which usually succeeds. Women are more likely to overdose on pills, which fails more often than not. Women attempt suicide more often than men do.

[seabeyond]

22. psychologically men tend to striking out, women tend to striking within

i haev seen it shift with women though over last decade or so.