Alec Baldwin is a distraction....What parent has never said something to their children then regrett

[greenbriar]

???

Just Thursday, I snapped at my gifted wonderful 15 year old... partly out of frustration, partly out of fear


She goes to a high school with over 2000 students, I have to leave work to go pick her up as she doesn't qualify for transportation. She is usually at the spot we agreed upon by 3:15 it was 3:30 and she wasn't there.

I called her cell...voice mail I called her best friend...voice mail

I then called her cell back and left a message that if she wasn't at the spot in 3 minutes she was going to have to find her own way home...

I didn't know what was going on and I was getting frustraited and kind of scared...



WELL she was actually talkign to her teachers because she knew she was going to be absent on Friday and she was getting her assignments...


you don't think I felt about 2mm small??????????


IT HAPPENS>>>WE ARE NOT PERFECT

[merh]

1. thank you for this post

:hi:

[greenbriar]

2. no problem...

parenting is hard and rarely are we perfect

[mondo joe]

3. Precisely! I wish I had the audio of the worst parenting of every shithead complaining

about him. Every parent has had cringe-inducing moments they regret.

The rest are highly dysfunctional in some other way, or in extreme denial.

[sandnsea]

11. extreme denial

is a form of dysfunction, so there you go.

[uppityperson]

4. He is and thank you.

[Missy M]

5. If people weren't distracted by the swearing in the message...

they would see that he was hurt, frustrated and angry. If he had left out the swearing and the unfortunate use of the word 'pig' there would not be this furor, yet it would be the same message. I have said things to my children I regret but they made it through OK.

[ScreamingMeemie]

6. I have never called my daughter a pig. I have gotten exasperated with

her (with good reason).

The approximate text of a message I recently left on her phone.

"Boy am I glad I got you this phone so I can stay in contact with you when you never answer it..."

"It's a shame you'll be handing it over again for a week upon your return home..."

No pig, no names, but anger for sure. Therein lies the difference.

[Texasgal]

7. Exactly!

You never called your kid a pig!!!

[NastyDiaper]

28. Love your sig picture.

It looks like mist-on-moss. But I can't guess the large 'bubble' on the lower right.

[likesmountains 52]

10. No kidding..I have raised 2 teenagers and both challenged me...but I never

called either one a pig...or used such a hateful tone of voice.

[sandnsea]

12. You can make her hand over the phone

He can't. Yes kids play manipulative games with all parents, but not all parents have the opportunity to enforce rules which is what he was referring to in the phone call. So it isn't a situation with which you are familiar with at all.

[ScreamingMeemie]

16. And that doesn't give them reason. Sorry.

He could have handled that better. What you brought up has nothing to do with language. Do we all feel sometimes like lashing out with names at our kids? Yes. But we don't, and neither should he.

[sandnsea]

17. Most people get angry

I frankly think the people who say they don't are either lying or medicated. Sorry, that's my experience. Of course he could have handled it better, nobody said otherwise, but he didn't have the discipline options you described. It's only fair to recognize that.

I've seen parents play all kinds of sick games with their kids. Self-righteous go to church every Sunday parents. Calling them pig would have been a step in a better direction.

[ScreamingMeemie]

18. Yep that's me. I guess Toprol and Diovan keep me from lashing

out at my kids.

or I'm lying. Yes, I call her a b*tch actually.

As a parent, I tend to know many parents who do not treat their children in that manner. I happen to believe them because I'm one of them. Sometime when you see WannaB (my daughter) strolling around here PM her and ask her what names I call her. It stops at "What a dork you are..." when we're goofing around.

[sandnsea]

19. I'm 50. I've known NONE

who haven't lost their temper with their kids and said something rude. Even people I think I know, when their kids turn into teen-agers and talk to other kids - well then the truth comes out. Pastors, teachers, business owners, doesn't matter. They all get angry and say rude things to their kids - and sometimes other people's kids too.

But hey, whatever, the only perfect parents in the country are on DU. Got it. :eyes:

[ScreamingMeemie]

20. I'm not saying I'm perfect. I'm saying I don't call my kids names.

I'm sure there are people on other boards who don't either. I can do eyes too... Look :eyes:

It changes nothing.

[sandnsea]

21. I stand by my 50 years

Of observing all kinds of parents. Kids get yelled at and insulted by all of them, at least once a year. I'd bet there's something you've said that is more shocking to me than 'pig', that's why there's so many different kinds of people on the planet. No reason to lord it over someone about a parenting mistake, especially with such flimsy information.

[ScreamingMeemie]

22. And I stand by my 37, and my 17 of raising children.

I can still post the opinion that it is wrong, and that most people do not call their kids names. I can get exasperated without making an ass out of myself. Again, PM WannaB when you see her and ask her.

[sandnsea]

23. Right

She's going to say, oh yes, my mother is a big abusive witch of a woman - oh brother.

Not that I'm saying you are at all, I don't think that. But come on, get real.

If you've never lost your temper with your kids, you either need to apply for sainthood - or a rubberroom because you're about to blow.

:hi:

[ScreamingMeemie]

31. You misunderstand me. I lose my temper, I just don't call my kids

names. Get it? :hi:

[sandnsea]

33. Yeah

I remember comforting my son's 17 year old friend after his church-going mother told him she wished his plane had crashed she was so sick of him, and then spit in his face.

Yeah, not everybody calls their kids names.

NOT saying this is you at all. Just saying, there's worse things than being called a pig by a parent who has lost their temper.

[ScreamingMeemie]

46. sandnsea, I am so sorry you have trouble discerning exactly

what it is we're talking about here. You may think as you wish, you'll be wrong, but it will make you feel better.

Now..go write that PM. My kid's pretty honest. :hi:

[sandnsea]

47. I'm having no trouble at all

People keep saying no names were called, and then turn around and give examples of parents saying horrible things. I'm not confused. And I would never put a kid on the spot like that either. Tell me about your mother at her worse so I can go post it in order to vindicate myself - I don't think so.

[sandnsea]

29. Infant mortality

You know what, this is way more important. 42 countries have better infant mortality rates than the US. It's risen to 17 per thousand for African Americans in MS, which is worse than Ukraine, Macedonia, the Marianas even. This is what's tragic.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2817010

[ScreamingMeemie]

32. It is. But I participate in a lot of different threads.

:hi:

[Exiled in America]

37. How about listening to the perspective of a kid?

My parents were no saints. But in my entire time growing up they never - ever - called me names.

The worst thing my father ever said to me was that I was acting like an asshole. It was a shock to my system because he never swore. That's it.

So you need to get a less narrow 50 years of experience. Sorry.

[sandnsea]

42. "acting like an asshole"

pig and asshole are the same to me. And according to everybody else around here, if he did it once, he surely did it other times as well.

We don't know if this is the only time Baldwin has done something like this the same way your father only swore once.

So you've actually proved the point I was making.

[Exiled in America]

49. I remembered later that this isn't even what he said...

He said I was acting like an ass, or something like that. Not asshole.

But, I'm sorry trying to even pretend that saying someone is acting like an ass (or "asshole" for that matter - both are generally considered fairly mild and benign words) can telling someone that they are a pig are the same things is just ridiculous. And everyone knows its ridiculous.

The latter is much more of a direct attack on someone's personhood and esteem, the former is a generally socially tame way of commenting on someone's particular behavior.

No part of me was confused and thought my father thought that I was a worthless person - just that my current behavior was poor. Engaging in a kind of behavior that crosses the line into deliberately trying to inflict emotional pain on a child in anger through the use of slurs, insults, berating or other kinds of verbal degradation is the CLINICAL definition of a form of abuse.

Now, we can debate if you want whether or not Baldwin fits that. Obviously, all of us would really need more information to know for sure, but on the surface it certainly seems likely, as his comments most commonly fit the criteria I just described above.

So -- what I'm saying is this:

Does context matter? Sure. Is it black and white all the time? No. But there *IS* a difference between getting upset at ones children and crossing a line into abuse. Baldwin certainly seems to tred very close to that line.

[Goblinmonger]

38. I've called my 14 yo daughter

a "spoiled little brat." Granted it doesn't literally use the word "pig" but it is the same meaning as what baldwin was saying. And guess what? She was being a spoiled little brat and needed to have it pointed out to her.

You've seriously NEVER said something to your kid(s) that you regretted saying? That you knew was the wrong thing to say? Wow. I'm impressed.

[ScreamingMeemie]

45. I've never called them names.

I lose my temper, sure. But there's a difference in my book.

[T Wolf]

39. I wish I was a perfect parent like you who never lost their temper.

Your daughter must be the most fortunate child on the planet.

[ScreamingMeemie]

44. Ummm...where did I say I've never lost my temper?

I said (now listen up) I don't call my kids names. Big difference. :hi:

[Raine]

8. Mine

my parents never ever said any kind of thing like that to me. I know that I was often an unbearable brat and would have tried the patience of a saint but my parents never said that type of self-esteem busting type of thing to me. I guess I was very very lucky and won the parent lottery.

[midnight]

9. Yes, I agree with you on that , and how about the kids.

There is one thing that I wish I would never have said to my mom. It was so many years ago, but I still feel bad. I did not read the exact argument that is being discussed. I really don't know that I care. What I do care about is that we have homeless children in this country, and secret prisons around the world that is torturing people. Wake up.

[aikoaiko]

13. My parents never spoke to me like that -- ever. and I was no angel.

FWIW

[vankuria]

14. We all make mistakes

Fortunately for us, the whole world doesn't have to know and sit in judgement. Alec should never have called his daughter a "pig" and that tape should never have been made public. I have a strong suspicion the mother was behind the leak and unfortunately the poor kid becomes victimized by both parents.

From what I've read Alec and Kim have been in a very ugly custody battle for the last few years and he just lost it. I can't imagine what he's going through but thats still no excuse to marginalize your child like that.

[bigwillq]

15. Indeed it is.

It's none of our business anyway. It should be on TV at all nor should it be consuming DU.

[hfojvt]

24. I cannot recall making such statements

and for the ones I recall I PTF

[NastyDiaper]

25. My Dad grabbed the belt.

Degrading me as an adult? Never.

[JI7]

26. i think both Alec and Kim have issues and they are using their daughter

to get back at each other. if it's true that Kim had part in release of that tape i can't think much of her either.

whatever problems they have with each other they need to make sure their daughter isn't used in this way.

i think they both suck.

[sandnsea]

30. Dysfunctional family

in a nutshell. That's it exactly. But in the scheme of things, I'd rather family services worry about kids being punched in the face and sexually assaulted.

[hfojvt]

27. I don't think anybody could have predicted

that my daughter's voicemail would be preserved and broadcast world-wide.

[Maat]

34. I agree (n/t)!

[Exiled in America]

35. No. That's not "normal." That's called verbal abuse.

There's a difference between getting unfairly upset with your kids and maybe saying something you shouldn't then later regretting, and acting in such an irresponsible way with one's temper that its a harm to a child.

Verbal abuse is a abuse. It can be as damaging as anything physical. But it is excused and ignored far more often. This isn't an example of a "hey we all make mistakes" thing. Calling your daughter a "pig" among other things crosses that line. This is an example of where an adult needs to take responsibility for himself and get into counseling. He needs to ADDRESS his reckless and irresponsible behavior towards an impressionable child and take steps to correct this kind of abusive behavior.

And the sooner people at DU stop apologizing for his abusive comments, the better off we'll be.

[Goblinmonger]

40. I gotta starts me

an angry parent rehab. I'll make a killing, I tell ya.

[Exiled in America]

48. Please do. It would be nice to break the culture of acceptance

Getting upset is one thing. But there is a LINE to all anger. He crossed it. Many people do, and when they do, kids get hurt.

It would be nice if we could stop acting like all levels of anger toward children are ok. Some is, some isn't.

[T Wolf]

36. Of course you are right. What also gets me is that the people who are

screaming the loudest about this "Hollywierd librul" who is so mean to his children are the same ones who advocate beating children as their version of discipline.

Best to just ignore them. Alec does not need us to defend him.

[Goblinmonger]

41. Oh no you didn't!

See, you don't get the difference. When they hit their kid, it is spanking, done lovingly, and doesn't hurt he child. When Alec gets frustrated and says something he probably regretted after hanging up, he is emotionally abusing the child and ruining them for the rest of their life. It's different. Surely you can see the difference.

[T Wolf]

43. Thanks for straightening me out.

Now I understand the universe.

Or - are you just illustrating how the repuke mind (doesn't) work.

Honestly, all the folks lynching Alec on this single incident are really over the top and methinks that it is pushing one of THEIR buttons (didn't get praised enuf for not shitting their pants or something).

Especially those recommending therapy. Yes for a pattern of behavior. But certainly not for this event.