Government *is* good and can work efficiently

[Go2Peace]

We have all heard it... When we have a very serious issue like the corporate takeover of our health options, you talk to a lot of the population and you hear it again and again..

"but I don't want the government to control it, the government can't run anything right"

That has been a very powerful, but untruthful meme that the right wing has successfully implanted into the population. Heck, we even see it on this board. This "meme" has the capacity to destroy many good and right efforts to bring things back around and we need to counter head on at every opportunity.

We really need to wrestle this meme away from the Republicans. Sure we have serious problems, but government *can* represent people much better than we see it currently, and it *IS* ultimately the answer and the way to solve a number of social issues. Governments are running all over the world that actually represent the people, and do it fairly well. The institution of Government is still solid and the best way to represent "community" and the will of the people, and run facets of the public resources that cannot run properly under market conditions, or alternatively to regulate them when they can but need help.

What people see is not "government", but bad ideology and destructive people trying to ruin government.

We don't need to stop entrusting the government. What we have to do is stop letting *bad* people destroy our government and rebuild *better* government. In a way it is a testament to how necessary and important government is to large societies that it is still effective in many arenas, despite the onslaught by those who would attempt to destroy it.

No, our problems are not "Government". Government is a solid institution and the best method of representing community in large cultures. And we still do well to entrust it with the public good. It is the *only* option.

I would like to suggest that we start to counter this meme. When someone tells you that "government is bad" or that it "can't do anything right". Please, lets get our "messaging" together.

The next time someone expressed the "government is bad", make sure to tell them that "government is not the problem". Government can work extremely well if it is not undermined by those who profit from it's destruction.

[FSogol]

1. K & R Government is not the problem, Republicans are. n/t

[hansont]

17. exactly! +1

[Oregone]

2. The US government cannot even wage war efficiently

Ive met piles of dog feces Id rather copulate with

[Go2Peace]

5. Yes, it is a mess

But do you agree, it is not "government" that is causing this mess, but the ideological tampering and abuse of our instututions. This has been purposeful since the republicans first said they wanted to "drown" government in a bathtup. It is no wonder it is floundering.

I guess my point is we can't give up on it, in fact I think history shows we have no choice, either we eventually regain control of it and make it reform, or somebody else will eventually. It is impossible *not* to have government. And government is necessary and often the only vehicle to resolve some human issues.

[Oregone]

7. No, I dont agree. The structure of the US Government, that experiment in democracy, encourages abuse

First past the post 2 party system, paired with non-proportional representation in the Senate, can lead to disaster, including civil war (which it already has once).

Government may not be "the problem", but the US Government is, down to its core structure. Its the perfect framework for corruption to fester, just as a fallen apple is the perfect place to find rot.

[Go2Peace]

8. I don't think you understood the OP, we are not in disagreement

but what will you replace it with? Libertarianism just means tyranny. Don't be fooled. If you want to live in a semi-libertarian society move to moscow and try it on for size.

That may actually look a little inviting these days compare to what we have going on, but I will take the goverment in European countries any day over libertarianism.

My point is not that our current government is good. But that the instutution of government in itself is not a bad thing, and you cannot avoid government alltogether. We have no choice but to have "government". Government is simply the mechanism that immitates "community" in populations to large to have the latter. We have bad "community" in washington. But we still MUST have "community".

[Oregone]

11. Id replace it with a parliamentary system with instant run-off voting

Government isn't bad, no, but the US government sucks right down to its structure, and most everything it touches turns to shit. Arguing for government intervention is great, but when you are asking the US Government to intervene, don't hold your breathe that they wont exaberate the situation in order to siphon public funds to their buddies and please their Pastors

[Go2Peace]

18. My point is about the Republican talking point. We will never get to a parlament if everyone

has no trust in government. We will slowly slip further to facism. One step at a time.

But I do agree, parlaments are superior to two party systems.

[The2ndWheel]

14. Which is as arbitrary as anything else

"Government is simply the mechanism that immitates "community" in populations to large to have the latter."

Is it that the population is too large to have the latter, or is it that the population needs to be kept large in order for the government to retain and increase the power that it has? The concept of America as a nation is as arbitrary as the directions on a map. We don't have to have America. However, enough people believe it to be real, so it becomes real. Just like money.

[Go2Peace]

19. How are you going to decide issues in groups of a million people

You are being a bit ideolistic. I understand, but you have to have multiple levels of "community". And ultimately, all government is just an extension of community (when run well), just a way for us to all work out things and help each other.

How do you propose representing "community" in a population of 1 million or more? You aren't going to be able to go door to door?

Anything you suggest will be a form of government.

[Obamanaut]

3. Maybe with the exception of congress. nt

[Go2Peace]

6. But I would not consider corporate representation "government"

The problem is not "government", the problem is badly run and badly represented government. The solution is not to avoid government, the solution is to get it back into the hands of the people.

Allowing people to further lose confidence in government as an "institution" and failing to make the distinction that the problem is not the institution itself, just paves the way for tyranny.

We *will* have a government one way or the other, the question is just who will control it and what will it provide.

[The2ndWheel]

4. The government is what corporations aspire to be

A monopoly. With access to, in the case of the US, over 300 million people.

[Go2Peace]

9. So is DU filled with anarchists?

And why would anyone unrec this? I thought it was only Republicans that wanted to "drown" the government in a bathtub.

Believe me, I feel the same as others here, I am just not naive enough to think that countries can have justice and a middle class without a strong government. It just needs to be owned by the people. We have no other alternative. If we don't have democracy we have tyranny, I agree with the founders on that.

[apnu]

10. I have always thought the same thing, of the statement in the OP's subject...

... but the implementation of "Government" hasn't worked out to well. There are deep and serious problems within our "government" and they need to be addressed. IMO, this is mostly related to "government" not attracting the best and brightest our society has to offer. If good people were working in all the levels (from the POTUS, down to the person at the DMV counter) then "Government" would run very well.

I used "government" in quotes because I'm referring to state and local governments as well as the federal level.

[Go2Peace]

13. I agree, though I think it is even deeper

We have the same problems in all our institutions. Authoritarian managers get promoted, then we get institutions that are authoritarian at all levels.

But back to the OP, I think that we cannot throw the "baby out with the bathwater". Buying into the meme and losing confidence in government as "an instutution" just gives the corporatists what they want. It is a catch 22.

[apnu]

16. Yeah, government can be fixed, and fixed fairly simply.

It takes willpower, something the corporate world seeks to remove from the people. Turn the people into sheeple and they'll stay home, and happily rut and consume while the corps get to run the show.

Our job is to keep people awake and alert. An active, educated, population is the nightmare of authoritarians.

[Go2Peace]

20. good point

[anonymous171]

12. The Government shoud represent the will of the people. If it does, then it is good. nt

Provided that the will of the people does not violate anyone's civil rights.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

15. Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one.

- Thomas Paine

The best we can hope for is that the citizenry will have enough of a voice to control it.