12 shot at Fresno house party

[Newsjock]

Source: Fresno Bee

The crowds of teenagers and young adults converged early Saturday morning on the small central Fresno home, drawn to a party announced by cell phone text message.

The home had hosted other loud, late-night gatherings of young people, neighbors said. But this time, with 60 to 80 people inside the East Clay Avenue house, violence erupted when at least two young men pulled out guns and began shooting, police said.

The apparent cause: a dispute between rival gangs of spray-painting "taggers."

The shots wounded eight men, three teenage boys and a woman, police Chief Jerry Dyer said.

The incident was noteworthy for the "staggering" number of victims -- the most wounded in a single shooting incident in Fresno in recent memory, Dyer said. Nineteen shots were fired, hitting seven people in their legs and four in their arms and hands. The injured woman was shot several times in her torso.

Read more: http://www.fresnobee.com/406/story/1728170.html

[Le Taz Hot]

1. Tragically, gangs infest all cities

but thanks so much for pointing out Fresno specifically. :eyes:

Here:

No Drones Protest in Fresno Saturday Nov. 28

Code Pink will be stopping in Fresno Saturday at the Air National Guard and
Lemoore Navel Air Station. Details at www.nodrones.com or www.bayareacodepink.org.

Another VERY active group:

http://www.peacefresno.org/

[cali]

2. huh? it was a news item. Fresno was where this happened

the OP is hardly picking on Fresno.

[Le Taz Hot]

4. Then the OP should have put it in the California

forum along with the rest of the Central Valley farmer haters. And funny how Fresno is ONLY news when shit goes down, NEVER anything positive.

[NYC_SKP]

5. I feel your pain, but I think it's the association with Free Republic that makes it harder.

I'm in Stockton, you know, armpit of the valley- yada yada yada...

We're in this together.

:pals:

[Le Taz Hot]

26. Which is really silly.

One would think that ONLY Fresno residents are members of FR. If it weren't for his WORLDWIDE fans, RimRod or RoughShod or whatever the hell his name is would be just another chickenhawk typing hate speech from his mother's basement.

Thanks for the shout out. :hi:

[cali]

6. So post something positive about Fresno.

I didn't know there were Central Valley farmer haters, and I didn't see this as post as an expression of hate.

[MineralMan]

8. GMTA. I'm sure there are positive stories every day in the

Fresno Bee. It's not my favorite place on the planet, but I have nothing particular against it. I used to pass through Fresno several times a year. It has its good points, I'm sure.

[Le Taz Hot]

28. I used to make the attempt in the California forum

but the geographic elitists didn't seem to be interested in THOSE stories and they sunk to the bottom on a regular basis. Besides, I DID post links to the Code Pink action and the Peace Fresno organization. However, post something negative about Fresno? Just watch the pile on.

[MineralMan]

30. This was, in no way, a generally negative post about Fresno.

It was a story about a mass shooting that happened to occur in that city. The OP said nothing general about Fresno at all. Mass shootings are national news. It is that simple.

[Le Taz Hot]

33. Except that the poster has a history of posting

negative stories about Fresno and he/she doesn't even live here. I have to ask myself why that is? It would be like me making negative post after negative post about, say, St. Louis (totally random pick).

[MineralMan]

55. Really? I've never even noticed the OP before this post.

So, I'd have no way to know...unless I searched to find everything the poster posted. That would be kinda like stalking though, so I wouldn't do that.

[Le Taz Hot]

60. Oh, Christ.

Yeah, I'm stalking him/her. :eyes: NO, the poster posts in the California forum pretty regularly.

I'm SOOOOOO done here. And one more <flush>

[spinbaby]

61. Here's something positive about Fresno

It was the inspiration for Carol Burnett's brilliant miniseries, Fresno.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nTQRtppImo

[MineralMan]

7. I suggest, then, that you post positive stories about Fresno.

The same thing you said could be said for any city. Good news is seldom national news. This kind of shooting story is national news, whether it happens in Fresno or Columbus, OH. Nobody's trashing your city, in particular.

Fresno is also the home of Free Republic, yet we don't blame the city for the website.

If you want to post uplifting stories about your city, or if you want to "be true to your school," the Post icon is always available.

[Le Taz Hot]

31. "Fresno is also the home of Free Republic,

yet we don't blame the city for the website." Ah, but too many do EXACTLY that. There is actually a post somewhere in the California forum in which a long-time Fresno basher claims that the reason Fresno is so backwards is because of all the Oakies and Arkies. I mean, honest-to-goddess, what the HELL do you say to that?

Look, there really is a larger issue here and that is geographical elitism. Despite Fresno's size, we have a rural mindset and identify far more with say, Mendota, than we EVER will with San Francisco. We do things differently here than they do in L.A. and S.F. Different doesn't mean better or worse, it just means different and the sooner we understand and CELEBRATE those differences, the sooner we'll be able to work together to address that which ails us. THAT is the larger issue.

[MineralMan]

52. Yeah, OK. How did the Fresno area vote in 2008?

Since I left California, I don't pay much attention to it.

[MineralMan]

54. Got the results from Fresno County

BARACK OBAMA DEM 136706 49.99%
JOHN MCCAIN REP 131015 47.91%

So, folks, you see, Fresno County voted for Obama.

[NutmegYankee]

10. We post bad news from every place in the country in GD. Why is California special?

[MineralMan]

11. Someone's just "being true to their school."

Over in the California forum, though, someone other than the complainant regularly posts positive stories from Fresno.

In this case, a shooting involving 12 injured sorta makes the grade as national news, I think. A Code Pink rally probably doesn't.

[Le Taz Hot]

36. I wasn't talking about California,

I was talking about Fresno specifically and I think I've offered up enough posts on this thread for you to get the gist of what I'm getting at. As for California, well, we ARE special! :hide: :evilgrin:

[NutmegYankee]

43. A shooting involving twelve people seems to be national news worthy

It's not picking on any one place.

As for the other stuff - hey, think of all of the stereotypes heaped on New England and then realize that I live right in the middle of the "Swamp Yankee" region. Not so wealthy or elite here...

[MineralMan]

14. Yah...all mass shooting stories should only be posted in the

appropriate state forum. That's the ticket...

[KittyWampus]

57. Then how about posting those positive Fresno stories YOURSELF instead of complaining

about someone posting simple facts?

[nadinbrzezinski]

59. 12 people shot does make national news

and sadly, not Fresno, US News, if it bleeds it leads.

Stories about the new speed bumps hardly will make the paper.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

21. The gang problem in Fresno is well known

even above and beyond other cities. The Bulldogs are one of the largest gangs in California, centered in Fresno.

[MineralMan]

23. What!?! The Fresno State Football team is a gang?

Who knew? Did they do this shooting? Geez! I'm just as shocked as can be. The NCAA should pull the school's eligibility, doncha think?

[spiritual_gunfighter]

27. They named their gang after the school

and even wear their colors and gear.

[cowcommander]

35. Just another day in Fresno

Sadly, gang shootings like this are a daily occurence, it has one of the worst unemployement levels in the whole state, even before the economic crash. Only thing unusual than this is more people got shot than usual.

[Le Taz Hot]

39. How long have you lived here?

Thought so.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

41. I served on a gang task force

in Aurora IL and Fresno was one of our case studies. So I might know a little something about the rampant gang activity in Fresno. It is well known.

[Le Taz Hot]

42. Yes, because one can learn

EVERYTHING they ever need to know about a city by ONE case study examined from 2000 miles away. Mkay.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

45. We didnt use Fresno as a case study

because there was NO gang problem there. Thank you for being completely dense.

[Le Taz Hot]

46. I'm not the one claiming

"Just another day in Fresno" from reading ONE case study from 2,000 miles away. I'll ignore your "dense" comment.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

47. I am not the one claiming "just another day in Fresno" either

maybe you should try reading before you claim I said something I didnt say. So I guess I was right about you being dense.

[Le Taz Hot]

48. Well, shit!

My apologies, I accused you falsely. I would think being able to recognize and acknowledge one's mistakes would make one the opposite of dense, but, whatever.

Have a nice day and <flush>.

[Le Taz Hot]

38. "Even above and beyond other cities."

I await anxiously the proof of your claim.

[ensho]

3. guns and alcohol are so much fun

helped by lack of education

[villager]

9. the gun apologists un-rec'd this already?

:shrug:

[The Straight Story]

12. Probably a gang apologist - since gangs kill people, guns don't (nt)

[MineralMan]

13. Well, until the shooters shot, they have a God-given right to

bear arms, you see. Now, they'll be felons, so they lose that right, although some argue that they should get it back as soon as they get out of prison.

But, gang members have the right to bear arms. Just ask over in the gungeon. They'll explain it to ya!

[The Straight Story]

15. But they don't have the right to shoot, so you think them losing a right to carry will affect them?

:shrug:

[MineralMan]

18. Well, natch. It would be against the law for them to carry, then.

No doubt, the nice gang-bangers will follow the appropriate laws. Even now, those gangs only allow members who don't have a felony conviction to carry firearms, I'm certain.

Perhaps you miss the tongue-in-cheek tone of my previous post, eh?

[slackmaster]

32. How do you know that the shooters were legally entitled to own guns and to carry them concealed?

It's likely that neither condition was true. It's almost impossible to get a concealed weapons permit in most of California, and definitely not possible for someone under age 21 (who is also ineligible to buy a handgun at all here).

...Now, they'll be felons, so they lose that right...

Are you sure they don't already have felony records?

[aikoaiko]

49. IF they were legally carrying weapons, and that's a big if, then yes they can bear arms, vote, not

be incarcerated without due process, etc, etc, etc. Do you have a problem with that? This is how a free country works. Simple association is not enough to deprive people of their rights.

But like I said its a big IF that they were carry legally. And if they weren't, then their guns can be taken away with a little due process.

[ensho]

16. gangs would have to work harder to kill people if they didn't have guns

killing by gun is quick and easy.

[MineralMan]

17. Apparently not all that easy, since I don't think any of

the 12 in this story died. In the hands of most, firearms are often non-lethal weapons.

[TheWraith]

19. Gangs will never not have guns.

Ask the UK and Mexico, both of which have extremely strict gun laws.

[MineralMan]

22. Yah...there's just no point in trying to disarm them, then.

Besides, until they're convicted felons, they have a God-given right to carry. We can't be taking firearms away from gang members. That'd be un-constimatushunal. We should always wait until they use those firearms to commit a felony before taking their firearms. Otherwise, doncha see, it's a slippery slope. Slippery as snot on a doorknob.

When they come for the gang-bangers' guns, the guns of law-abiding freepers'll be next. Yeah. That's how it works. Gotta protect the rights of all gang members not convicted of felonies to carry.

[TheWraith]

24. Strawman arguments contribute so much to a debate, don't you think? nt

[MineralMan]

25. Oh, you bet. So, do gang members who have not been

convicted of felonies have the right to bear arms? Your answer, please...

[Irreverend IX]

53. Are you proposing a change to existing firearms law?

If so, what?

[The Straight Story]

20. You have trade offs in life - some, very few, will use guns in such a way

to prevent it from happening again, lock em up and keep them there. Clear out the jails of drug offenders while we are at it.

[MineralMan]

29. Ah, but the thing is that most members of gangs

have no felony convictions. So, they have every right to bear arms. There's a dilemma there, doncha think?

How do you disarm them if they have no felony convictions?

[proud2BlibKansan]

34. How old are they?

Most of the gang bangers here are teenagers. They don't have a right to bear arms.

[slackmaster]

37. I doubt that very many spray-painting taggers are over 21

Which is the minimum age to buy a handgun and to obtain a concealed-carry permit in California.

[Hangingon]

44. Most taggers around here are teenagers.

A few are adults. On the other hand, the local TV station runs a most wanted gang bangers segment and it is amazing how many of these are in their 30's. Most carry illegally.

[The Straight Story]

58. You don't, why would you?

If they have not broken the law then they should be able to carry.

[Hangingon]

40. SO< THey go to bombs. Those are pretty easy.

[proteus_lives]

51. Not that easy. 19 shots and no deaths.

Holding a gun doesn't turn you into Rambo.

[villager]

50. and gangs with guns kill even more!

Not a helluva lot of drive-by Ninja starrings here in L.A...

[B Calm]

56. Shooting at Ft. Hood an act of terror, but 12 shot at Fresno House Party,

not. . .

As far as I'm concerned the Ft Hood incident was just another workplace shooting. Too bad the cons had to spin it. . .