Up until mid 2008 DU was like Woodstock, now it reminds me of Altamont

[Saboburns]

I don't know how else to explain it, but it wasn't always this mean, this judgmental.

I learned a lot reading DU the past 8 years, and it helped change my life.

DU used to be a special place, a singular place, now it's like so many other places.

Sigh.

Happy Thanksgiving.

[Withywindle]

1. Flames, pizza - it's just a post away! n/t

[WillyT]

7. ROFLMAO !!! - DUzy Worthy !!!

:rofl::yourock::rofl:

:hi:

[Withywindle]

26. Thank you so much!

Can you hear Merry Clayton belting it out? I must admit, now I can. It's stuck in my head, in fact.

:hippie:

:hi:

[leftstreet]

24. omg that's funny

:spray:

[Withywindle]

27. DU drama queen soundtrack!

But Oh God I love that song! (I was born in '69. I was named after a song on the Kinks album that came out in '68.)

[bluestateguy]

2. Funny how the sixties just seemed to end right there at Altamont in December 1969.

nt

[Blue_In_AK]

31. I was there.

It was a bummer.

[BlueCaliDem]

3. I agree. eom

[RKP5637]

4. I often see snarky comments IMO for people who supposedly have a common cause...

[tblue]

5. Yep. Some people reply with cuss words right off the bat.

Or they say, slightly more politely, "You're ignorant so shut up and be grateful." Some here try to intimidate or gang up on others. I don't engage with mean posters, but I really do not like this vibe on DU.

[roguevalley]

15. man, you must be sleeping during the last several election cycles.

Deaniacs, Clintonistas, Obama-ites. It was third world war all the time. This stuff is much tamer. Truly. :)

[tblue]

21. Maybe so. I was not settled on any particular candidate for the longest time.

So maybe I just didn't notice the food fight.

I feel like there's a bit of a civil war going on here sometimes.

[roguevalley]

22. There does sometimes. That is the difference between us and them.

we try and figure out what we want and feel and it looks like a riot once in a while. :-D

[tblue]

30. I love your doggie!!!

Do you like mine?

[roguevalley]

32. your dog is so awesome, I just took it and put its picture in the file I

keep of fabulous doggies I see on the internet. Is there nothing funnier than a boston bull dog smiling? My dog is Tippy, a feminine little male dachshund that could sit up, climb into your lap and hug you with both his arms and kick the other five dachshunds butts if they bothered him. I love doggies. Yours is awesome.

[gaspee]

6. There are a lot of people here

Who do *not* have Democratic (big D) ideals. There are a lot of people here who are what I would consider moderate republicans in their viewpoints who really have no business calling themselves Democrats. Problem is that the republicans are so bat shit insane now that where are these moderate republicans supposed to go.

You're not the only one who has noticed it. Not by a long shot.

[RKP5637]

19. +1, n/t

[RandomKoolzip]

8. What?! You've GOT to be fucking kidding.

DU was ALWAYS a den of rabid wolverines itching for confrontation. Always. I know this because I've been here since 2003 and every three months THIS EXACT same message (like the one in the OP) appears, only with different dates and times. "Oh, up until the 2004 primaries, this place used to be great, yadda yadda yadda," "Ever since Dean dropped out, DU has become nastier," etc. DU is running EXACTLY the same plot as it always has, only the actors in the cast have changed.

[tkmorris]

16. I don't think so actually

You are right, a post like this is pretty much a monthly occurrence and has been for years now. That doesn't make them false though. Furthermore I think it was right around the 2004 primaries where things really went to hell fast and stayed that way even after the primaries ended. The primaries caused divisions between various factions of DU to become sharper and better defined, while at the same time some moderation decisions were made that allowed a certain amount of emotive content in posts that had been verboten prior. I'm not saying that was a bad call by Skinner et al mind you, stricter moderation would have resulted in some massive bannings, but the fact is that once the door had been opened it was tough to close again.

That wasn't the only factor of course. In the first year or two of DU's existence there were far fewer posters here or even aware of the place. Those that did post here were the hardcore nucleus of online Leftists in the main. As it grew however it attracted more and more posters who aren't quite as idealistic in their politics, or as dedicated to expressing them.

It's a common thing, almost inevitable. Every great forum or website starts with a hardcore following that is relatively small but VERY much into whatever the site's raison d'etre is. As the site's popularity grows it becomes larger but it's followers tend to include more followers, band-wagon jumpers, and bored internet surfers. It's just a way of online life.

[QC]

9. This place was never Rainbow Brite's Happy Meadow, not even back in 2001,

when I joined, but the mishandling of the last primary did damage from which this community may never recover.

[pecwae]

10. Not enough +'s or digits available for agreement. nt

[QC]

11. Thanks!

The worst thing about it is, those people who destroyed the place now have two years and gold stars and thousands of posts under their belts. They are now the establishment.

[SoCalDem]

13. Until the first primary season, we all had ONE common foe

once we started lining up on "sides" within DU, "some people" never quit keeping score, and holding grudges.

After 2004, we could al least take comfort from the fact that we still needed to hang together since *² go himself "re-elected", and we had 4 more miserable years to go, but now that Obama's in the white house, the ones who were "against" him in the primaries, seem to be unable to get past it, and are constantly looking for ways to "prove" that their choice woould have been better.

[depakid]

12. Wait until next Thanksgiving

The Dems have until about next August to turn things around and start enacting effectual policy that solves problems for ordinary to SEE for themselves.

Otherwise, we may well be looking at Speaker Boehner.

[HughMoran]

14. This time seems more personal

In the past, the fights usually revolved around which Dem to support (primary, etc.) - but the "enemy" was ultimately the Republicans. Now that Dems (I was going to say "we", but many here don't seem to consider themselves Democrats any more) are in control, it's time to cut out some of the Blue Dogs who want to kill the Democratic agenda. OK, I think we can all agree on that. The bone of contention here is that there are a vast number of people who feel it is their sworn duty to reprimand anybody who supports the President using harsh & insulting terms (like "cheerleader" and "zombie" etc.). I don't know why I should feel like I'm walking on eggshells when I see a post supporting President Obama. Is the general consensus that Obama is an evil lying mass murderer? This is what I'm readin here every day. Tell me how this is not different that other times. I can't think of a time where I've felt less welcome here. Why should I feel unwelcome supporting Democrats here? Was the charter changed recently while I wasn't looking?

[gleaner]

17. Maybe there was a DU in ..

alternate reality which was all roses and puffs of perfume, but it was no place I've ever been. I posted here at two different times due to an interruption by illness, but I never saw what is described in your post.

People were always contentions, irascible and strong minded. They did not hesitate about how they expressed themselves. While I was here before the flame shooter was should Hillary Clinton run for president, why not?, who likes Hillary, who doesn't and so on. All liberally laced with profanity.

This same topic keeps coming up in subsequent threads. Decrying the present, hankering for an ephemeral past and generally trashing what is. Maybe they are putting mind altering substances in the turkeys this year. Who knows?

If you are comparing to Altamont, though, be precise. The Rolling Stones thinking that they were dealing with people who were like the more passive Hells Angels of England, instead hired the less passive Hells Angels of the US to be the security force at their free concert. It went wrong from the beginning. "Security" provided the onlookers with harassment, beatings, and insulted the performers. Finally they stabbed and killed a young black man for talking to a white girl. Is that what you are comparing DU to? Some of us are the victims, some the Hells Angels, some the performers who had been off the streets a little too long to have enough common sense to avoid a bad situation.

I don't think Altamont ended the 60s. Try Kent State and Richard Nixon. That's more like it.

[RKP5637]

20. For me, Kent State and Richard Nixon ended it all... n/t

[The Straight Story]

18. It has always been about people questioning their government, still is

Not much has changed except the players in government.

[Quantess]

23. Does this mean the Rolling Stones will play for us?

[Sebastian Doyle]

25. Of course. It wouldn't be Altamont without the Stones.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yayclsjIW38

[Bucky]

29. If you follow this analogy through, it means the Mods are the Hell's Angels

Of course the Angels added a little more élan to the way they tombstoned disruptors.

[Bucky]

28. Were you even remember the primaries here?

How quickly we forget how ugly things were back in the good ol' days. The Clinton-Obama feud was positively toxic--and even then wasn't as bad as it got in late '03-04 when the Dean, Kerry, and Clark people were going at it.

Anyway, this is what winning is like: our side finally got to quit griping and now has the responsibility of leading, including cleaning up the Bush messes. It was bound to get less fun.