Forget the right-wing family members -- how do you deal with the holidays?

[Missy Vixen]

We have our fair share of family RW wackos (including a SIL that sounds like she's been programmed by Rush, Sean and Glenn Beck,) but our biggest problem this year isn't politics. It's both of my husband's sisters. The middle sister proclaimed to both of us a few months ago (after failing to invite us to our nephews' third birthday party, and getting confronted on that fact,) that she doesn't want us "emotionally involved" with her kids. It broke my husband's heart. She and her sister are two of the most toxic shit-stirrers I've ever met in my life, and it's going to be really hard for me to bite my tongue and say nothing during this dinner, but truly, we don't have a lot of choices. We believe this may be the last holiday season for Grandma; we'd like to have some nice memories.

We'd like to see the other family members. We don't want to see either of them. Tell me -- does anyone here have this type of thing going on at their house? How do you handle it?

[ixion]

1. Fortunately, my family avoids political discussions on holidays

we try to keep everything civil, despite the varied political/religious beliefs.

[Missy Vixen]

4. It's not the political discussions that get heated

We have a Republican uncle. Grandpa is more of an independent. There was quite a discussion about Palestine in our living room last year. At the same time, it remained civil, even if the two disagreed. I'm talking about my SIL's, who seem bent on the destruction of any family activity.

I wish they'd go elsewhere. I don't think we'll get that lucky.

[proud patriot]

2. Quote

"sorry I missed your son's birthday but you know me , I was busy practicing witchcraft and becoming a lesbian ."

or something along those lines .

[Missy Vixen]

5. Proud Patriot, LOL!

We weren't invited in the first place. Again, the two of them are shit-stirrers, and only show up when they want something.

It's just harsh. I realize that we aren't alone, and we will go through this just like millions of others. I wish it wasn't this way.

[MissB]

13. Let the kid know you're sorry you couldn't make it.

Screw the parents. Bring a birthday gift for him and give it to him. Something barely wrapped.

Yes, I know you weren't invited, but the kid doesn't need to know that.

[proud patriot]

40. I know

I'm glad to have gotten a laugh though .

[timeforpeace]

3. I also prefer blaming others for the family problems. It couldn't be me.

[Missy Vixen]

6. LOL

I realize every family has a tangled history, my husband's especially. It'll be interesting to see what happens over the next week with the family members. I'm expecting some kind of preemptive strike...

[peacebird]

8. ouch! jeez - did you think somehow that THAT cold nasty response was helpful?

Cold. Harsh. Definitely not nice....

[sudopod]

10. I also prefer dropping into people's OPs

and being a thinly-veiled jackass.

[tabasco]

37. No, it's probably you.

It's usually the reich-wing idiots who can't keep their fucking mouths shut.

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. My older brother... he is turning increasingly

into a fundy (a Jewish one, but a fundy nonetheless)

Last year at passover he started going over how those who are not like him are gonna burn in hell.

SO I told him, you know bro... you just condemned your sisters to something that does not even exist in traditional Jewish belief... NICE GOING there bro! So when did they pull out the Christian Hell and put it in the theology? Cute for the group of fundies you go with.

Well, God took us out of Egypt! He went back.

Look I won't 'splain to you just how this didn't happen (archeology and all that), and you will stop pushing this. We came for a nice family event with parents. So control your need to control others!

He shut up for the rest of the evening... if he had not... I would have brought Mahrer Religoously to max volume on the Ipod. This year I need to go take care of parents... so I guess I will take the latest dawkins book just for him as in a leave me the fuck alone message... or just the history book or two on how the Biblical story was written by ahem... men...

My way is simple... it is respect. He tries to impose, yes I confront... he does not... I leave him alone... he thinks I am deluded... well it is mutual. There is more but this is the cliff's notes on this "relationship." And I think we all have them.

[gateley]

9. Focus on the members of the family you do care about, just zero in on them

and let your good feelings flow. You gotta try to put the hurt and anger out of your consciousness for just this one night -- it'll ruin it for you and those you care about will be able to pick up on it.

Do you think one (or both) of the sisters will say/do anything?

[Missy Vixen]

15. gateley, I'll take your advice.

We'll make a backup plan before we go (leave if it gets nasty or heated,) and do our best.

>Do you think one (or both) of the sisters will say/do anything?<

I'd bet our house on it. You're right, though: It starts with me and my attitude.

[gateley]

27. If they do say something, maybe just say something like we're sorry/hurt you

feel that way, but now probably isn't the time to talk about it. Just something that doesn't let her/them get INTO it.

Just keep in mind this isn't about your family and them, it's about the bigger family and may be the last one you'll be having with a grandparent. You can always get into it later with those whacks, but you don't want your memories of this gathering to be dominated by the negativity of the sister situation.

Good luck! You can do it! Just for one night! :pals:

[imdjh]

38. It's your husband's job to police his sisters. Oh , and since you have grandma on hand, let her last

..... words be to the sisters: stop being such bitches.

OK, so what's the elephant in the room? Did you take their brother from a successful law career and turn him into a scented candle maker in Vermont?

[Missy Vixen]

43. OMG, I'm over here laughing!

imdjh, :rofl:

>Did you take their brother from a successful law career and turn him into a scented candle maker in Vermont?<

He had the temerity to get married before either of them did.

His second crime: When we met, his younger sister lived with him, and he paid all the bills. Younger sister was over 21 at the time, had a job, and could support herself. She just didn't want to. God forbid he actually get a life. Guess what happened when we got married? (Oh, yeah: Little sister loves to tell anyone who will listen about being a Republican, but you saw that one coming, didn't you? Maybe we should introduce her to some of the F*eepers.)

I'm still laughing over the "successful law career to a scented candle maker".

[FarLeftFist]

11. The Holiday season is all about letting the shit hit the fan.

There's nothing more American than a dysfunctional Holiday feast. I say don't hold back, let the accusations fly and when everything seems like it's about to become anarchy everyone should turn around and ask granny's advice. She will then speak wise words that will make all of your arguments seem petty and nonsensical and Holiday cheer will be had for all. Grandma gets to save the day.

As far as the political side I spent my whole childhood listening to Liberals argue with Progressives. Peacefully.

[Ishoutandscream2]

56. "There's nothing more American than a dysfunctional Holiday feast."

Absolutely, postively, one of the most brilliant things I've read. You really nailed it.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

12. Alcohol.

Put the fun in dysfunctional.

If you can't join them, beat them.

[Missy Vixen]

18. Okay, I had to laugh!

MY family preferred to face the holidays in a state of complete inebriation. It's always weird to go to someone else's house for the holidays and realize that the entire contents of the refrigerator aren't mixers. ;-)

[Dorian Gray]

50. Or this!

[pdxmom]

14. I relate to what you're saying. We have family members of different

political persuasions, but that isn't generally the problem. It's other baggage that is out there. For the sake of my parents, I tell myself over and over that I am a bigger person and I do everything in my power to not roil the waters. If I feel it starting to get to me, I go outside and take a quick walk. I just keep trying to concentrate on my elderly parents and bite my tongue. It's totally against my nature and the entire family knows that I am the one with the strongest personality that will fight back if tweaked, but over the past several years, as my mom and dad have gotten older and frailer, I've decided in my own mind that all the hurt and bitterness over things isn't worth the pain it would cause my parents to air it at a holiday meal. If something comes up, I file it away and bring it up in a phone call or email later.

[Mari333]

16. I hate them.

I fake my way thru the whole thing.
I have good reasons.

[jobycom]

17. Use the holidays to build what bridges you can and enjoy everyone for who they are.

Use the time to get closer to your sisters-in-law, maybe reconcile. If you can't, at least make the effort. Find common ground. It may have wonderful, glorious benefits down the road. It may amount to nothing, but at least years from now you won't regret not trying. And I'm not saying you haven't tried, I'm just saying that you can never try enough. You never want him to one day wonder if he should have tried harder. Try now, so you know for sure. It all spins apart and away faster than you realize. Take the time now to give it your best shot. Approach the gathering with loe and charity, instead of fear and trepidation. You'll have more fun that way.

And if you want to look at it this way, what could bother them more than having no reason to be mad at you and having to accept that it's all their fault? :)

[Ernesto]

19. YOU MAKE TOO MUCH SENSE!

Thanks!

[jobycom]

20. Ooops, I left out the part about the machette and the kerosene.

[Ernesto]

24. Well I still have the beer

and the POT!

[PJPhreak]

28. I need some pot,

Seems like a commodity thats rarer than moon rocks lately!

[Missy Vixen]

25. Can you imagine the revenues from pay-per-view?

I'm thinking Jerry Springer should pick five families at random around the country and make a Thanksgiving Day special. Extra credit if he happens to select any member of the Bush family or the Boehners. (Imagine the magic, huh?)

;-)

[Missy Vixen]

23. I feel so badly for my husband

I'm not going to post all the particulars, but I talked this over with Grandma a couple of months ago. She knows what happened. She tried to intervene, only to get the same faceful we got. (It takes some balls to pick a fight with an 83-year-old woman.) I asked her if she would be okay if I was pleasant and cordial to them; she said "Yes," and then said, "I'm not sure this will ever be solved."

So, I have my marching orders from Grandma. :woohoo:

Thank you so much for your kind words. I will take them to heart, and I hope you have a wonderful Thanksgiving with those you love.

[EFerrari]

39. Exposing yourself to toxic shit stirrers is not virtuous.

it's just bad for your blood pressure. Approaching emotionally abusive people with love and charity is a really bad idea. There's another one about playing on the freeway and then there's the one about not buying bridges.

[jobycom]

41. Ah. Sorry, didn't know that. Thanks for filling me in.

I will now advise people to seek conflict with their families.

[EFerrari]

53. Recognizing toxic shit stirrers is not seeking conflict

but dealing with the conflict that is already there and preparing to launch at you.

[jobycom]

54. Sounds like you're advocating shit stirring. nt

[kevinbgoode]

21. I choose to spend the holidays alone. . .

. . .which isn't depressing at all. I developed that habit years ago when I had a partner who would announce he was flying home for the holidays and I would be left alone, working up until the eve or sometimes on the holiday itself. At the time, I lived 1000 miles from the rest of the family anyway, so developed those days as a "day of peace" and indulged myself as much as possible.

We don't have many right wingnuts in my family - one borderline case, but he is usually quickly silenced. Since I call my parents 2-3 times a week, I feel like I'm in good touch with the family, yet don't want to spend forced time with anyone. I know that might sound a bit cold, but I don't feel that way - given the inevitable issues in a large family between siblings, broken marriages, etc., it hardly makes sense to turn a day of relaxation into a bad time. Sure, it's nice to see people, but I live close enough (within a couple hours drive) now that I can be visited. Of course, I'm always the one who calls everyone anyway. . .if I didn't, I wouldn't hear from anyone unless they needed something.

The SIL's - if they cared about your family - should vow to either shut up their memorized radio talking points, or recuse themselves from family gatherings. Or just fix them a plate, put in a recording of a Rush rant, and sit them in a kitchen corner - or worse, at the kid's table. I don't think I'd put up with their crap for more than a couple of sentences. They should only need to be told once that their talking points aren't going to convince anyone of anything and that most people think they are certifiably loopy.

[GoCubsGo]

22. I spend the holidays with my cats.

Mostly, that's because I only get to the parents' house about once a year, and I prefer to go in the summer. It spares my dad from having to deal with holiday traffic while fetching me at the airport. (It was his idea, and I'm fine with it.) That being said, the only right-wing whacko in my family is my mom's brother. He knows to keep his mouth shut, as my dad will tear him a new one each time he spouts his stupidity. My mom's sister once pointed out to him that their dad would be disgusted with him if he ever heard the shit that came out of his son's mouth. Grandpa was an FDR Democrat, who survived the Depression working for the CCC. He WOULD be disgusted to know his son was a rethug nutjob.

[StarfarerBill]

26. With only cousins still alive with whom I don't get along...

...I'll be without close family for the holidays, though I may get together with a couple of local friends, if we can plan it.

[PJPhreak]

29. My MIL is the worst,

Overbearing,Self-centered,Egomaniac,All-About-My-Money/Things,Conceited,I'm ALWAYS Right/You are ALWAYS wrong,How big is the luggage rack gonna need to be on my Hearse...Well Make It BIGGER kinda person.


I Dread Holidays.

I promised my girlfriend of 27 years that I would be nice for the sake of the rest of the family,so i bite my tongue ...Tho there are times I wish that I could wrap her in Duct Tape and just set her in the corner.

[Sedona]

30. watch this the day before the gathering

http://www.netflix.com/Movie/Home_for_the_Holidays/60020974?strackid=1d04c84b9dad2501_0_srl&strkid=705505805_0_0&trkid=222336


edited to add.....have sense of humor



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nxzkr60qxu4

[Kievan Rus]

31. Thank God most of my family is liberals. The ones that aren't are libertarians...

and you can actually rationally debate with them.

[barb162]

32. Did she say why she doesn't want emotionally involvement

with her kids.

[Missy Vixen]

42. Again, some of the stuff isn't fit for a public forum

but I will give the short version.

My husband and both sisters were removed from their home when my husband was 12 due to abuse and neglect. All three children went to foster care. My husband's uncle and his partner took him in shortly afterwards; he is the only one out of all three to have a somewhat normal life.

My sister in law -- the one who doesn't want him to have "emotional involvement" with her children -- still blames him for the fact he "didn't do enough" to help them. I'm not sure what a 12-year-old could have done. I understand that there are two sides to every story, but I have never met anyone in my life (prior to meeting his sisters,) that rival the two of them for selfishness, narcissism, projection, and just plain nastiness. He bent over backwards to maintain a relationship with both of them. The middle sister stirs it, and the younger one runs to us, does whatever she needs to do to involve us, then runs back to her to stir things up even further. It's a sick little game.

We are happy to own whatever it was we did (Let me see here: Was it the time she called our house after not talking to us for a year and asked to borrow $10,000 without any kind of repayment schedule? How about the time he drove to California and back on his own dime to bring her home from school for the holidays? I could continue, but let's face it, it's not worth it,) and we will abide by her wishes. I will tell her at another time, though, that we're taking her "emotional involvement" seriously. We won't be around her kids. At all. We won't be helping them financially, sending gifts, or doing any of the other things an aunt and uncle do.

I know that there are other people in the world whose family situations are even more fucked up than this is. My husband, though -- yeah, he's not perfect. At the same time, he is the kindest, most patient person I have ever known. He's still atoning for something that happened over thirty years ago. It's interesting to me that she is still extracting her pound of flesh. Frankly, I feel sorry for her husband.

[DU GrovelBot]

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[barb162]

34. With one side of the family there are a few characters I can't handle

and no matter how much I try to avoid them at these parties, they manage to snoop, bother, etc. They are the most ignorant, toxic people. The best thing to do is avoid toxic jerks but when they seem to be attracted to you like glue, it's very difficult.

[msanthrope]

35. Kill them with kindness.....

Practice saying non-defensive, polite, yet meaningless phrases to whatever they say. Don't defend, explain, or otherwise waste your time attempting to 'win'.

"I'm sorry you feel that way."
"That must be difficult."
"That's unfortunate."

Make sure you keep a shit-eating smile on your face, snuggle with your hubby, and be kind to your kid and everyone else.

Have a plan to leave if things get crazy. Consider seeing Grandma on Christmas Eve, or another time. There are 12 days of Christmas, afterall.

This is how I deal with some of my toxic inlaws. It drives them nuts, but makes me look rather good to other family members.

[Missy Vixen]

44. I love the word "unfortunate"

There really isn't a comeback. At all. Even better, as you said, the best revenge is a good life.

Here's to many happy years for you and your husband, and the hope your scary inlaws decide to join mine and colonize Mars or something. ;-)

[REP]

36. I stay in CA and call my Mom and bro; husband calls his parents

It's just better. The in-laws are rightwingish and my family is liberal but ... drama-prone. I'd love to see my brother and SIL, though.

[Blue For You]

45. We kicked Thanksgiving and Christmas out of our lives years ago.

Therefore, we don't have to deal with family members and the mania that goes along with these two holidays. One of the great perks of atheism. :)

In your situation, I'd suggest you contact all parties involved and agree to a truce.

[old mark]

46. I love the holidays, and our relatives live far away, so we seldom get to see any of them.

The really hatefully biggoted ones we never see at all.

I love the holidays - yes, even christmas - and I don't let political BS interrupt my pleasure.

mark

[Codeine]

47. I chose my "family."

The only family I acknowledge are my friends with whom I share a mutual love and respect.

[NuttyFluffers]

48. love the ones that love you back. be cordial to the rest and cool to the nasty.

why make the effort to love or be pleasant to those who want to make you miserable. don't give them that power. if you have to ignore them to stay civil while you are at the family event, so be it. anyone asks you why, explain that you are trying to enjoy your time with the people you love -- giving the love back that you receive, if you will.

here's another good one: it takes two to start an argument. someone screaming in your face, walk away. yawn and walk away if you have to. lay your boundary that you will not have an argument and walk. say, "i'm not having an argument with you" if you have to. maintain zero engagement with the hysterical member of the party. they want attention, don't give it to them.

remember, this day is about you loving the ones that love you back. anything that gets in the way of that can and should be dismissed.

[Dorian Gray]

49. Yes... I have similar situations

a batshit crazy mother in law and a sister in law who is an alcoholic and drug abuser.

I handle the crazy by not offering up much to say, keeping a smile on my face, and when engaged in conversation (which isn't often), to try to stay pleasant and positive. Luckily we spend only a few hours on Christmas Eve with the in-laws and we spend Christmas Day with my family, which is a lot less draining and painful. But, warts and all, they are family and we try to keep it as pleasant as possible.

[Are_grits_groceries]

51. I am alone and stay well away from the lot of them.

I have faced this for years. My family would gather in Raleigh. The first part of the day would be fine. People would open presents, and then then dinner would be served. After everybody had wound down from eating, the fun began.

Years ago, they would praise their leader, Overlord Helms. I would enter the fray which always spiced things up. After my Mama passed, I didn't go again. It was useless to argue with them then although I tried. As the discourse has gone downhill, they are even nuttier and more irrational. My blood pressure won't take it, and it makes me miserable.

I have a cousin who is a pedophile. For the sake of his mother who is the sweetest person on Earth, they tolerate him at the gatherings. They keep a sharp eye on him, but he isn't persona non grata. I am. Irony abounds.

[DailyGrind51]

52. "..a lot of help from Jack Daniels."

[sweetpotato]

55. Don't fall for emotional blackmail

“It broke my husband's heart. She and her sister are two of the most toxic shit-stirrers I've ever met in my life”

Then WHY would you want to spend your precious holiday time with them? They don’t sound very nice at all.


”we don't have a lot of choices”

You ALWAYS have choices, you may not like all the choices, but you have them.


”We believe this may be the last holiday season for Grandma”

You know what? It may be YOUR last holiday season, or your husband’s last holiday season. Why would you want to spend your last holiday biting your tongue and saying nothing at dinner? The “last holiday season” for an elderly relative thing is emotional blackmail. Who says you have to visit Grandma ONLY on the day of the holiday? Can’t you visit her and make nice memories on some other day? Then they might actually BE nice memories, instead of having them tainted by toxic sisters. Wouldn’t grandma enjoy a visit with just the two of you, away from all the confusion of a big holiday?

This is how I handle this mess with my family. I don’t spend time with people who don’t like me. I see the family members I want to see and leave the rest alone. Makes us all happier and takes a lot of stress out of the holidays.