"Pot has no medical value" - really? As a Med Marijuana Patient allow me to retort

[Taverner]

I have damaged discs in my lower vertebrae. L4 and L5 to be exact. When it first happened, I couldn't get out of bed, or move a muscle. The docs gave me some vicodin and sent me on my way. The vicodin worked, but just barely, and there was one hell of a price to pay (it stops working after a while, rebound pain, addiction, makes you an asshole, etc)

Then I got a prescription for Marijuana. IN short, it works. It does not kill all the pain, but its a hell of a lot more effective than NSAIDs.

While seeing the doc to get my prescription I met many other patients. Folks with HIV, Cancer, as well as folks with pinched nerves, and other body damage.

Now, of course, many of you may say "just go get the operation and fix it you junkie!" Well, the operation takes me out of commission for 9 months (something I cannot afford) and only has a 50% success rate. Those odds just aren't worth it.

Add to the fact that the worst thing I've done, or saw anyone do because of pot, was eat the entire pint of Ben and Jerry's in one sitting. Yeah, that's one hell of a moral handicap!

So before you folks judge, I propose you try empathy for a moment. Yeah, empathy, that ability to see oneself walk in someone else's shoes - the last thing any conservative would want you to do.

Oh and let me add that unlike Vicodin or any other Opiate, Pot has NEVER killed anyone, and it is impossible to truly overdose.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

1. My story to a T, except for the

prescription pot part.

Vitamin Vicodin makes you goofy, not pain free. It's just that you don't really care.

[Warpy]

2. These "what does it cure?" threads are hilarious

I don't think anyone in the medical community takes the "studies" that are full of weasel words like "suggests" or "may" very seriously.

No one in the scientific community expects the whole plant to be particularly curative. What it does do is increase patient comfort so that standard medical treatment has a better chance of working. Patients on chronic opioids have been able to reduce their dosages when pot has been added, and pot has been a useful addition to chemotherapy and HIV treatment when patient starvation is a greater risk than death from the original illness.

It's medical use is adjunctive, not curative.

As for your own situation, have you had a trial of Ultram? That stuff has worked beautifully for me, decent pain control without the foggy buzz of opiates. It doesn't work for everyone. I'm just glad it's working for me.

[Taverner]

3. Tramadol stops working after a time too

[Warpy]

15. I've kept the dose really low

so it's still working for me.

That just means I accept being in pain for part of the day and especially at night.

I just use it to function part time.

[nashville_brook]

9. wondering -- do you know what it is that Tramadol does? it works really well for me,

and it's terrifying to think it might stop working for me. i've tried to find a decent description of what it's actually doing, but have turned up nothing. supposedly it mimics an opiate, but I don't understand how that works.

if i lived in an MMJ state, i'd definitely use that as an adjunctive...an after hours kind of thing. i can't think straight on MJ. great for creativity, tho.

[Warpy]

14. It does hit those opiate receptors and slow pain transmission

It also has a very mild SSRI effect.

It shares a lot of the side effects of opiates including respiratory depression at high doses. However, it doesn't give the euphoria that opiates do, a euphoria that anybody who has to take them for a long time generally finds irritating.

[nashville_brook]

29. opiate don't feel euphoric to me -- more hyper and dizzy. irritating for sure.

it feels damn good not to be in pain, though.

[Warpy]

32. Pain patients generally don't get high

and yes, the effects are irritating as hell.

I noticed the same thing with surgical patients. The first couple of days, they'd take as much as they could. By the third day, they never wanted to see the stuff again.

[winyanstaz]

35. I cant take chemicals pain pills..they make me dizzy and nauseas..

and don't hardly touch the pain either...sheesh..they just make it worse.

*edited for speellin....:P

[anigbrowl]

24. Wikipedia's description is as good as any

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tramadol

It doesn't mimic an opioid, it is an opioid. But that's a broad class of drugs. If you can't understand the page above, then you're probably better off with a first-year biology textbook from the library just to get a basic overview.

[Fly by night]

27. Here are some non-weasel words about the anti-cancer properties of cannabis

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-armentano/if-pot-prevented-cancer-y_b_261157.html


Writing in the August issue of the journal Cancer Prevention Research, investigators from Rhode Island's Brown University, along with researchers at Boston University, Louisiana State University, and the University of Minnesota reported that lifetime marijuana use is associated with a "significantly reduced risk" of head and neck squamous cell carcinoma.

Authors reported, "after adjusting for potential confounders (including smoking and alcohol drinking), 10 to 20 years of marijuana use was associated with a significantly reduced risk of head and neck squamous cell carcinoma (HNDCC)."

Perhaps even more notably, subjects who smoked marijuana and consumed alcohol and tobacco (two known high risk factors for head and neck cancers) also experienced a reduced risk of cancer, the study found.

"Our study suggests that moderate marijuana use is associated with reduced risk of HNSCC," investigators concluded. "This association was consistent across different measures of marijuana use (marijuana use status, duration, and frequency of use)....Further, we observed that marijuana use modified the interaction between alcohol and cigarette smoking, resulting in a decreased HNSCC risk among moderate smokers and light drinkers, and attenuated risk among the heaviest smokers and drinkers."

This isn't the first time that U.S. investigators have documented an inverse association between pot use and cancer. A separate 2006 population case-control study, funded by the U.S. National Institutes of Health and conducted by the University of California at Los Angeles, also reported that lifetime use of cannabis was not positively associated with cancers of the lung or aerodigestive tract, and further noted that certain moderate users of the drug experienced a reduced cancer risk compared to non-using controls.

Predictably, the federal government's goal when green-lighting the UCLA study was to conclusively establish just the opposite result, as explained recently by its lead researcher Dr. Donald Tashkin.

In an interview with the McClatchy newspaper chain in June, Dr. Tashkin admitted that he expected his study would find that pot was associated with "increased health effects." Instead, he summarized, "What we found instead was no association (between marijuana smoking and cancer) and even a suggestion of some protective effect."

Tashkin added, "t this point, I'd be in favor of (marijuana) legalization. I wouldn't encourage anybody to smoke any substances. But I don't think it should be stigmatized as an illegal substance. Tobacco smoking causes far more harm. And in terms of an intoxicant, alcohol causes far more harm (than marijuana)."

[Cleita]

4. I've seen it do good with our cancer patients.

It doesn't cure cancer but it makes the chemotherapy more tolerable. It reduces the nausea and helps them regain an appetite. Many of our patients also complain about the side effects of the pain killers that they are on and MM has very few.

[tridim]

11. It doesn't cure cancer, but studies show that it does indeed shrink tumors.

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/12088.php

[the other one]

22. whats the difference between curing cancer and shrinking tumors?

If it shrinks a tumor to nothing, then it DOES cure cancer.

And if it does cure cancer then it will NEVER be legal.

[tridim]

26. Just being careful with semantics

Obviously any substance that shrinks tumors needs to be studied as a potential cure. The studies need to be FUNDED as well. Removing Cannabis from schedule I would be step one.

[laughingliberal]

30. Anything that can shrink a glioblastoma is worthy of huge research funding

This is one of the most deadly tumors out there. The study referred to in your link was actually done in 2000. Funny, we haven't heard much about it.

Another funny thing, there was a study done by a university in the United States back during the days of Nixon. When it showed the antitumor activity, it was shut down immediately. The researchers in Madrid have made reference to it in some articles I have read but the university escapes me at the moment (I'm old, lol).

[tridim]

31. Tumors are extremely profitable.

And profit trumps progress.

[laughingliberal]

34. Oh, absolutely!

As an oncology nurse from 1982 to 1997, I see how it could be a battle to fund research which would shut down the profits made off selling all that poison to the public.

[notadmblnd]

5. I've been trying to get my mother to try it

She is constantly on edge. Her husband is OCD and it drives her nuts. They do nothing but fight and bicker and both refuse to take any prescribed medicine. They both refuse to take either xanax or any kind of pain pill. I think pot would go a long way in mellowing her out and giving her a way to cope with his OCD. Both are in their mid to late 60's, so I know it's a battle.

[Aramchek]

6. get her some pot food

that's where it's at for people who won't make the leap to smoking

[intheflow]

19. I agree, the edibles is the way to go.

My roommate is an mmj patient, and his wife bakes pot treats for him all the time, also makes him pot tea which she steeps with decaf herbal teas and pot milk. Here's her kitchen bible:

The Cannabis Cookbook

[Taverner]

7. It could help, but start with VERY small doses at first

What many smokers consider "half of a high" is very relaxing for most people

[Swamp Rat]

8. k&r

[liberal_at_heart]

10. Some people are just prejudice

No matter how many people who have been helped by it testify to it there will always be people who think that anyone who uses it for medical reasons or recreational reasons is nothing more than a lazy, dumb pot smoker looking to get high. Don't let them bother you. Thank you for your story.

[nashville_brook]

12. don't worry about the anti-mmj turkeys too much. whatever works for you is what you need to do.

i have damaged L3 and L4 -- some of the most incredible pain i can imagine when it was acute. now it's chronic: achey with bouts of sharp, debilitating pain. Tramadol works for me -- what Warpy said. but i'm sure it prolly doesn't work for everyone. it's been a lifechanger for me, though.

[jwirr]

13. My grandson was having real big problems with anger management

issues. It was so bad that he hid in his bedroom for fear he would kill someone. He has been using pot to help him relax and sleep and the anger management problems are gone. I think there are more things than just pain that it helps. He did not have medical coverage and this was the best he could do. Now I would not want him to try other drugs that may have worse side effects.

Anyone have experience with it helping with the pain from fibromyalgia?

[Irishonly]

21. It helps with pain

Docs can't decide if I have fibromyalgia or not. I do have a serious case of neuropathy and I eat MM nightly. My favorite are suckers and one sucker lasts two days for me. My PCP is shocked. I was on my way to a wheelchair a year ago and now the chair is sitting and gathering dust.

My husband uses the vaporizer and it's done great things for his PTSD, bipolar and anxiety. He gets mean on any anti anything and most pain medications make him crazy.

We are one of the few couples that have been honest with our PCP and he is slowly changing his mind. From seventeen pills per evening, I am now down to six.

[Canuckistanian]

16. K&R

[kestrel91316]

17. In 1979 my dad was dying of lung cancer and was on chemo. His

MILITARY physician advised him to smoke a little weed to help with the nausea. My dad bought some from the kid nextdoor, and smoked to alleviate his side effects and help his appetite. IT WORKED. He eventually died of his disease, but he never had to deal with severe side effects from chemo. Heck, he didn't even lose his hair.

[mike_c]

18. I smoke pot every day and I'm a better person for it....

I use cannabis for a variety of reasons, but one of the most important-- in my life-- is stress relief. It's more effective than SSRIs and anti-anxiety meds put together, and non-addictive as well. It has made a tremendous difference in my life. What's not to like?

[1]

20. as a medical alcohol and nicotine patient, i concur...

[truedelphi]

23. Nine years ago, I found a medical journal citation showing the promise that MM

Holds.

Yes even almost ten years back there was evidence that medical Marijuana had benefit.

Examine the wording of The Neurology Review's April 2000 article and press release: "Dexanabinol, a proprietary cannabinoid, significantly reduced the functional and pathologic brain defects in a recent study of animals with experimental autoimmune encephalomyelitis, the most widely used animal model of multiple sclerosis, according to Pharmos Corporation."

"Dexanabinol, which is a synthetic cannabinoid, lacks the psychotropic effect of natural cannabis. It inhibits neuroinflammation and blocks cell-death cascades, which are also characteristic of stroke, Parkinson's disease, and neuropathic pain. The recent preclinical study was reported in the Journal of Neuroimmunology."

So there you have it. Though our government insists on keeping marijuana illegal, the major corporations (Can you say "Political Campaign Fund Donors, boys and girls?") are now patenting various cannibinoid structures inside THC. We can't allow you as a multiple sclerosis patient to grow your own. In fact, We the Government will tell You the Patient that marijuana has absolutely no medicinal value. Until our campaign contributers have the patent nailed down, and then you may purchase your daily does for $ 20 bucks a pop.

[Greyhound]

38. Exactly. n/t

[mdmc]

25. thanks for the OP

peace and low stress

[eppur_se_muova]

28. "no medical value" = rich white people can get better stuff.

Only proles benefit from MJ, so smack it down.

[marlakay]

33. Pot wasn't available when I had my back problems

10 yrs ago. At least not legally. Nor did I think of it I was in too much pain. I couldn't take most of the drugs because of the side effects like nightmares and feeling dizzy.

I did get a operation that worked and took my pain away. Had a great female surgeon. I had a herniated disk that burst L5 S1 area. I couldn't walk for months and the pain was so bad I wanted to die.

I lived in CA at the time and if pot was available legally then I would have tried it.

From the times in my life I have smoked pot all it did was mellow me out and relax me like valium.

[OnceUponTimeOnTheNet]

36. Perhaps I should have tried Pot when my neck went out 7 years ago.

I wound up being referred to a Chiropractor. After xrays, she thought my C1 Atlas was broken. After assuring her, no, I've not been in accident, nor fallen off a ladder, my husband is good to me, she retook the xrays. These showed no breakage, I guess. She proceeded to adjust me, with much trepidation. Didn't help. Loaded on Vicodin and Flexerall? I left.

The next year was not much fun for me. The only thing that helped with pain was Excedrin. Vicodin did jack crap for me. Forget the Flexerall too. How did I fix it? By accident, I had to walk some distance with old fashioned heavy metal Milk jugs in each hand. Pulled me back into alignment.

If it goes again, I'm trying pot for the pain.

[Greyhound]

37. Chiropractic is wonderful for these kinds of injuries/conditions, but finding a good Chiropractor

is harder than finding hundred dollar bills in the street.

[Taverner]

39. The problem with Chiropractory is that it is based on pseudoscince...

Yet many Chiropractors are very good therapeutic masseuses...

So while the whole idea of 'cracking your bones' to heal you is flawed, the therapeutic massages they give you pre and post are not...

[Greyhound]

40. Well I'm living pain free with full motion of my neck because I didn't

take "the only option" offered by the allopathic doctors of fusing 3 cervical vertebrae and found a Chiropractor. It took about 8 weeks 30 years ago and, aside from being careful with working my traps, there's been no further problems.

[Taverner]

41. Good. Any way to get pain free is valuable in my opinon

:thumbsup:

[OnceUponTimeOnTheNet]

48. I'm glad you found a good Chiropractor and had great results, mine was pretty young

and nervous. She really thought my neck was broken after the first xrays.
mind, I couldn't turn my head either way, or look up or down. Felt like my head was gonna pop off if leaning over. I'm happy to have found the cure in some old metal milk jugs, and it's a cheap cure to boot!!

[Greyhound]

49. Yeah, mine was one of the "Michigan Five" that went to jail in the 50s

for offending the AMA by challenging their monopoly. Now that insurance companies pay for chiropractic treatment I find most of today's practitioners are just in it for the money.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

42. I Truly Believe Most Cannabis Users Are Self Medicators

I think that most people who use cannabis are self-medicating. Many use it as an anti-depressant that is both safer and healthier than those produced by Big Pharma; young women medicate (often unconsciously) for menstrual pain in their early twenties and learn cannabis can indeed be good medicine; it is the best and safest pain reliever available.

My home state is one of 15 where prescription drugs kill more people than traffic accidents every year: this fact alone is enough to make me an ardent and enthusiastic supporter or medical marijuana. The recently confirmed fact that cannabinoids can inhibit tumor growth only add to the long list of postive effects of the plant.

[Le Taz Hot]

43. K & R

I've smoked regularly for 35+ years. I think the poster above is correct in that many of us smoke it to self medicate. I find that it mellows my combative ass out, greatly reduces my hyper-depressive episodes (these used to be DEVASTATING when I was a teenager, before I became a regular smoker) and generally just keeps my mood pretty even (bi-polar).

Yeah, big pharma probably has their medications along with a page-and-a-half full of side effects for each one. Screw that. As far as I can tell, there are no side effects from pot. If there were, I think I would have found them by now. Besides, I like being able to produce my own meds.

For those that understand, no explanation is necessary. For those that don't, no explanation will suffice.

[Sunnyshine]

44. Absolutely agree that it is a viable alternative for pain management and many other uses. Also,

I had a laminectomy (disc fusion L4-L5) when I was 25- nearly 15 years ago. The outcome of this surgery depends on several factors- age, health, skill of neuro-surgeon, severity of damage, etc. My disc was ruptured and completely destroyed. Before my surgery, I often suffered with temporary paralysis and was crippled to the point I could not walk or stand straight. Lost too much weight and was depressed nearly a year- way too young and happy to experience such a debilitating condition.

Since my surgery and I have never had one problem. Not even a hint of back pain. It might ache a little every once in a while, esp. after being on my feet all day. Have had 3 kids since then and still pain free. Just can't stand taking pills- especially pain pills. Ibuprofen is the only thing that I use for pains or headaches. So, yes, I used marijuana and self-medicated throughout the treatment, for it was truly my only relief the entire time.

Feel for ya Taverner and hope your relief comes soon. :hi:

[MrMickeysMom]

45. Let me weigh in with one more observation-

I have it on good authority that the libido is... much enhanced... m-kay?

Hey, that's a quick and dirty way to get out of a depression, or de-stress, or feel better when you're not nauseated from cancer drugs anymore.

Viva el libido!

[juno jones]

46. I self medicate and have for years.

I had ghastly depressions as a teenager. I didn't like psychtropics because they made me feel tired and out of it all the time. Tardic dyskenisia didn't sound really scrummy either. I started smokiing pot at 17 and the depression dissipated fairly quickly after.

And as I age, I find it helps with that too.

[Froward69]

47. And an inversion Table

worked for me and my damaged disks. Well and a Bong hit or three. I would take a toke and get on the inversion table and hang upside down, or actually at a steep angle just before bed. I stretch out my back the pain is gone! I then get sleepy very fast. Although my back is not healed, the inversion therapy gets me through the next day.

I was originally prescribed MJ for Depression. I then found it is a better (physical and emotional) pain killer than opiates.

[slay]

50. It helps with SO many things - the real crime is that it's illegal

not the fact that people use it. The government needs to fix this ASAP - people who have all kinds of medical issues could be getting the help they need RIGHT NOW! K&R!

[Echo In Light]

53. +1

[glitch]

51. I was mildly pro-marijuana until my mom got pancreatic cancer. Now I am vehemently pro-marijuana.

and I DESPISE the assholes who prevent suffering people from finding the relief it provides.

Thank you for telling your story. :hug:

[alfredo]

52. It takes your mind off your pain, lowers anxiety that makes pain worse.