Second hand smoke and smoker's rights. Yeah, I'm the asshole here.

[graywarrior]

I attended a tenant board meeting tonight. The hall was packed. One of the tenants decides to grab a smoke at the back door leaving it open so he can hear what's going on at the meeting. Smoke drifts in and BAM I feel the beginnings of a migraine. So I get up and politely ask the guy to close the door and he gets all pissed off because I'm TRAMPLING ON HIS RIGHTS! I'm DISCRIMINATORY! The meeting ends and the guy is all attitude now, chest puffed up, stomping around like he had his right to live taken away, when I got my right to breathe taken from me. Fuck that! ! ! ! ! ! ! !!

Meanwhile, the beginnings of a migraine are now forming into a full blown one. That means...no homework gets done tonight. Nothing gets done tonight because I'M THE ASSHOLE who doesn't want to put up with second hand smoke.


Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!


:mad:

:smoke:

:nuke:

:rant:

[graywarrior]

1. Yeah, go ahead and fucking unrec.

I don't care.

[Bjorn Against]

11. I'll give you a rec

It bothers me to no end to hear smokers try to claim that they have the right to smoke anywhere they please. If people want to smoke outdoors in a low traffic area or in their own homes I have no problem with it, but have some respect for people who don't want to breathe smoke.

[phasma ex machina]

159. +1 you can bum another rec off of me ...

[NRaleighLiberal]

12. quite the rec/unrec tug of war going on!

[graywarrior]

13. I should add AA meetings to the topic.

DU would explode.

[liberalhistorian]

70. I gladly rec'd and wish I could

do so again.

I remember when my son's father and his girlfriend, now wife, refused to stop smoking when he visited, even though he had respiratory difficulties and was very sensitive to smoke. He'd get sick whenever he'd visit. But they didn't care at all. They even yelled at him for complaining about the smoking or bringing it up at all. I had my attorney put a stop to that shit pronto.

[wordpix]

77. I'm with you 100% - when I was 4 y.o., I told my parents to stay away with their cigarettes

I can't stand the smell of the smoke and it makes my sinuses plug up.

[Froward69]

82. Ill give you an un-rec

For not freeing the Duck.
I mean it. 35 to 34...:P

[Violet_Crumble]

116. I don't care either. Which is why I've come to talk about my Daniel Pipes OP being unrecced!

I really don't care, but why can't people leave a detailed explanation, including return email addy, as to why they've taken it upon themselves to try to destroy my psyche by unreccing an OP that took me at least ten seconds to post? It's a good thing I don't care that they've gone and unrecced the OP I posted, because otherwise I'd get really upset and really have a lot to say about it and then I wouldn't have the time to turn up in this thread and build a sense of comradeship with another poster that doesn't care that people unrec the thread they started. Like, did they unrec my thread because they don't like Daniel Pipes or is there something about my avatar they don't like? If I cared, I could stay awake for hours tossing and turning and trying to work this vexing issue out. So, people. If you don't care about the mental devastation you cause by the frivolous use of the unrec function (or as we people who don't care like to call it - *the button of destruction*), continue to unrec this thread and my own humble thread containing an article by that bastion of tolerance and socialist thought, Mr Daniel Pipes. If I cared I would burst into tears right now as I see the 100th unrec hit my own thread, but we're made of sterner stuff than that and we Really Truly Don't Care!!! ;)

[johncoby2]

2. People who smoke stink

I used to stink.
17 years ago.

Oh...wait...I need a shower....

[TicketyBoo]

107. I always wonder

why smokers bother with a shower. Nobody can smell anything but the smoke, anyway.

Why bother with deodorant or cologne? The smoke is all anyone can smell.

[raccoon]

119. Lots of them reek. nt

[Javaman]

123. the worst is the smell of smoke combined with some god awful perfume.

:puke:

like the perfume will hide the smell of smoke. :crazy:

[raccoon]

127. Oh, yeah, I've run into some of those in my work. nt

[Kalyke]

136. Lots of people reek.

Has nothing to do with smoke.

God, you people are as judgmental as Republicans.

[Lisa0825]

3. I hear ya.

I hate smoking... it killed both my parents, and it's just plain smelly and gross. And now that I have developed a chronic eye condition, it aggravates that too.

[graywarrior]

5. Thing is, I smoked and defended my right to do it but that was 30 years ago

I don't care if people smoke, just don't do it in a crowded room where people have oxygen tanks attached to their fucking wheelchairs or I'm there.

[Lisa0825]

14. I do care if people I care about smoke. I dread the thought of watching another

person hack their lungs out or go through chemo from cancer of a preventable cause.

I hate that it is going to take time off of their lives, as well as quality of life.... and for many it will.... sure I know someone's aunt Edna who lived to 120 and never coughed once, but it has been proven by decades of medical research to contribute to many health conditions from lung, oral, and bladder cancers to COPD to name a few.

This is not fiction, folks. And if you smokers out there have people who actually love you, I hope you will think about sparing them the pain of watching you IN PAIN.

[liberalhistorian]

71. What I REALLY hate is seeing pregnant women

smoking when they damn well know better, also parents of young children smoking around them, even if they have health problems. That should be considered child abuse/endangerment, frankly.

[roguevalley]

104. my grandpa died of lung cancer and when my grandma would

visit him in the ward at the hospital, there were people there smoking through tracheotomies. I have ZERO tolerance for smoking.

[Owl]

15. +1

[Dreamer Tatum]

4. I'm with you on this one.

I have an immediate physical reaction to cigarette smoke: extreme headache.

Funny how cig smokers would sooner die than have people smell their farts for ten minutes, but they have no idea that I'd rather smell farts than their cigarette smoke.

[graywarrior]

7. LOL, the guy behind me was farting all through the meeting.

That I can live with.

[RKP5637]

65. Good thing the smoker didn't light up next the guy farting with all the gas floating around! LOL

:rofl:

[slay]

102. I'm with ya on this as well

and i'm a pot smoker - but i am always considerate of others about it. cig smokers seem to often not be. also, with pot smoke it's not real dried out so the smell dissipates pretty quickly. oh and i like the smell of weed - hate the smell of cigs. still - comes down to consideration and i don't think we should have to suffer the smell of those burning cancer sticks just cause some jerkoff has a tobacco addiction.

[JitterbugPerfume]

129. at least they didn't light the farts!

I quit going to an old friends house because everyone there smokes and I can't breathe and my eyes swell up ! She is oblivious to why I no longer visit , and oblivious to why she has had several cancers.

sad , huh?

[pipi_k]

31. According to

George Carlin, our own farts "smell OK"

"Say...that's fairly decent!"


hahahaha

that having been said, I'd much rather smell my own farts than someone else's. But even someone else's farts smell way better than cigarette smoke...

:7

[liberalhistorian]

72. That's because most smokers are desensitized to smoke

and don't smell it on them or around them the way nonsmokers do. I remember when I quit smoking finally, I couldn't believe how much everything smelled; my car, my clothes, my apartment, even my hair. I was really disgusted with myself.

[LakeSamish706]

6. I agree with you, second hand smoke is not only very irratating to many people...

It is downright dangerous to our health, and if there is no smoking in then thats just the way it is.

[havocmom]

232. A childhood filled with 2nd hand smoke left me with bad lungs

That's why I carry a fire extinguisher now :evilgrin:

Hey, if they wanna put smoke in my lungs (which makes me violently ill and gasping for air) I figure I can dust them with some propelled baking soda.

[NRaleighLiberal]

8. I am with you. plus I feel that after the first few cigarettes, smoking is no

longer a choice for smokers - it is that powerful an addiction. so any arguments they make on smoking be their right - well, it is their right (or, their addiction) - but we are born non-smokers, so the line is drawn when their smoke impedes on my clean air.

Plus most smokers are incredible litter bugs - where do they think those butts that are tossed out car windows or on sidewalks end up? do they magically vanish?

[liberalhistorian]

73. My ex-fiance of over twenty years ago

(he's dead now, I just recently discovered) used to do that with cigs, drove me batshit crazy. We both smoked at the time, but I'd always use the car ashtray when we were driving. He'd simply open up the window and throw them out. We'd always argue over it 'cause I couldn't understand why he didn't just use the fucking ashtray, that's what it was there for.

[Kalyke]

137. New cars don't has ashtrays anymore.

People don't have much of a choice.

[high density]

9. Cigarette smoke is a migraine trigger for me too, though I usually need multiple triggers to get one

Good luck getting through it. I seem to be averaging about one migraine a year and I don't wish them on anybody. Maybe you can dump some vomit on his door tomorrow? I think that's your right.

[graywarrior]

10. His dog just died so everyone is walking on eggshells around him.

Fuck that shit.

[LakeSamish706]

16. The dog probably died from second hand smoke. n/t

[graywarrior]

22. Probably hacked himself to death, poor little thing.

[TheCowsCameHome]

18. He probably made the dog sick, too.

Screw him. He couldn't go a freakin' hour without firing-up?

Too bad about him.

You were right.

[Toasterlad]

149. LOL! Not Only Is He a Filthy, Dirty Smoker, But Now He's a Dog Murderer!

You non-smoking facists are a scream.

[joeybee12]

164. Second hand smoke kills...it's not healthy for animals to be around it...

...sorry if facts bother you.

[Toasterlad]

165. Got the Dog's Autopsy Report? Perhaps You Should Get the "Facts" Before You Get On Your Soapbox.

You'll look pretty silly if the dog got hit by a car. Since the OP makes no mention of how the dog died...

[joeybee12]

170. No, you look silly, friend, I was talking in general about second hand smoke

and its effects...you look silly trying to say it's not a health issues.

[Toasterlad]

182. Not Saying That At All.

I'm just saying that the people implying that the dog died due to the man's smoke are indulging their knee-jerk reactionary bias against smokers.

I was a smoker for around 20 years. I always tried to be considerate of other people's airspace: I'd never smoke in someone else's home, even if they said I could. I never smoked in a restaurant, even if seated in the smoking section, while people were smoking. I always went outside to smoke pretty much anywhere except a bar. And yet I STILL got shit from non-smoking assholes who felt free to lecture me about not just THEIR health but MINE, and accuse me of violating their rights, no matter how far away I was, or how reasonable I was being.

I have never met anyone more obnoxious than anti-smoking zealouts in my life. For sheer malice, virulent non-smokers are worse than Republicans, worse than evangelical christians, worse than anybody for self-righteousness and pure rudeness.

Yes, there are rude smokers out there. But in my experience both as a smoker and as an EX-smoker, the non-smoking nazis have them beat by a long shot.

[Chulanowa]

185. Fascists?

I do not think that word means what you think it means

[Toasterlad]

196. "a political philosophy that stands for...and social regimentation, and forcible suppression...

...of opposition." - Merriam Webster

Yeah, it means what I think it means.

[Chulanowa]

238. Did you know that you can pare down the New testament until it says "Eat at Joe's" too? it's uncanny

Main Entry: fas·cism
Pronunciation: \ˈfa-ˌshi-zəm also ˈfa-ˌsi-\
Function: noun
Etymology: Italian fascismo, from fascio bundle, fasces, group, from Latin fascis bundle & fasces fasces
Date: 1921

1 often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition
2 : a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control <early instances of army fascism and brutality — J. W. Aldridge>

— fas·cist \-shist also -sist\ noun or adjective often capitalized

— fas·cis·tic \fa-ˈshis-tik also -ˈsis-\ adjective often capitalized

— fas·cis·ti·cal·ly \-ti-k(ə-)lē\ adverb often capitalized

It's still not the word you're looking for. The word (well, words) you're looking for is "people who disagree with me". THough idiots often mistake such people for fascists, they're not the same thing.

[Toasterlad]

244. I'm Sorry...I Wasn't Aware You Had a Learning Disability.

I'll stop picking on you now.

[TheCowsCameHome]

210. Smoke your scorched lungs out for all I care. I really couldn't care less.

Just keep it away from me.

[struggle4progress]

17. I smoke. And I think other people have an absolute right not to be subjected to my smoke

[NC_Nurse]

19. I agree. I know many asthma sufferers for whom smoke is a trigger too. Fuck

the bullshit, it's not a "right" to make another sick.

[AndyA]

20. Smokers should go out of their way to make sure their smoke doesn't bother anyone else.

It's deadly. They should know that if they've been paying attention.

Smokers shouldn't throw their used butts all over the place, but many do judging from the amount I see all over the place.

Smokers smell bad. Period.

I know several people who are severely allergic to cigarette smoke, and the reaction can happen pretty fast.

A lot of smokers bring this on themselves through their lack of respect for others.

[Canuckistanian]

28. Tobacco smoke is absolutely toxic to some people

Even the traces left on clothing can trigger a reaction.

And smoke billowing into a public room is definitely a no-no.

I'm not an anti-smoking nazi, but I've seen first hand what even a trace of cigarette smoke can do.

It's definitely NOT something to be "blown off".

[BlueMTexpat]

115. That has been my own situation ... residual traces of cigarette smoke in curtains or furniture

are absolutely toxic if I am exposed for more than a few minutes. It can take days to get over a reaction.

[csziggy]

179. What is frustrating is even in states with a no public places law

The smokers will stand around the entrance to the space and smoke, so everyone have to walk through the toxic cloud of the second hand smoke. Florida has a liquor law that does not allow open containers within so many feet of a place that sells liquor - why not a similar law keeping smokers at least some distance from building entrances.

I used to be able to hold my breath as I walked through the cloud of smoke to get in a building. With my bad knees, I can't walk fast enough to hold my breath long enough so I suffer more asthma attacks as a result.

[TheKentuckian]

249. Too bad. You're ilk shouldn't run us out of every building in the world

even those owned and operated by smokers with smokers as clientèle on the bogus basis of not hurting a potential worker who doesn't smoke that can carry their ass to another workplace if they don't like it.

Zero compromise on the issue leaves little choice for smokers but to huddle like bums at locations they are funding and offend the sensitive as they pass by. You people could not accept fair warning or segregation so suck it up.

[tblue]

21. Bet he's a Republican, too.

[TheCowsCameHome]

23. They're always blowing smoke anyway..........

[proud2BlibKansan]

117. Cause no Democrats smoke

:eyes:

[demmiblue]

24. And THAT is the straight story!

Migraines are the devil. Hopefully you get over it soon.

:hug:

[K8-EEE]

25. When I smoked I ALWAYS ASKED before lighting up!

I mean ALWAYS. Jesus whatever happened to "Mind if I smoke?" And if people mind you go somewhere else for your fix. WITH A SMILE. When did smokers become such assholes?

[TicketyBoo]

108. I always hate it when someone asks

because I feel like a meanie for saying, "Yes, I mind." I have chronic bronchitis, and cigarette smoke makes me sick. You hate to give people your health history in order to beg off. At least I do.

[JoeyT]

121. Tell 'em you're allergic to smoke.

Seriously, it's why they ask. Most of us do realize how obnoxious the habit is and how bad it can be for other people.
I don't even ask, I just don't smoke anywhere near other people, even if they don't mind.

[K8-EEE]

135. That's if they are only pretending to ask

If you're really asking, ie, wanting to know the real answer, you'll accept a no or even an awkward silence or hesitation cheerfully and light up outside.

[TicketyBoo]

156. I'm afraid that

it's usually like asking "How are you?" (a courtesy which they expect to be returned with the courtesy of acceptance).

People don't really want to know how you are, and I fear that it's the same way about whether or not you care if they smoke.

[Arugula Latte]

186. A long time ago Steve Martin had a routine where he'd talk about this.

"If someone asks: 'Mind if I smoke'? I say 'No...Mind if I fart?'"

[recoveringrepublican]

240. Don't feel bad. I smoke (though I'm down to about 4/day!), and I never think people

are "meanies" when they mind if I smoke. I ask because I honestly don't want to bother you. Actually I don't even ask any more, I just get up and leave the area, smoke, and then return.

[Pied Piper]

26. I hear ya gray...

I'm still a closet smoker, but I don't smoke in any public venue. During my attempts to quit smoking, I have learned that it's just not cool to smoke when it might interfere with others' breathing. Even as a smoker myself, I find it offensive when someone is walking down the street, smoking. By reducing my own smoking to my own balcony, I have reduced my smoking by more than 75%. That was an easy step; if I can just conquer that last 25%...

Pied Piper

[alphafemale]

27. Question: How is it he can't get through a meeting without smoking? Does he work?

Nearly all work places now are going to require that you only smoke on breaks in some corner of the parking lot. You might get a break every 2.5 to 3 hrs. Probably much shorter than your meeting.

Does this person go to church?

A neighborhood meeting is generally shorter than church.

I bet he wouldn't expect to be able to stand right outside the door and let the smoke drift in during church.

[graywarrior]

30. Meeting was ONE hour.

I gotta go now. Wasted, dead time being sick. I hate this.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

29. The only thing worse would be if someone changed.....

....a baby's diaper on the seat right next to you!

Zing!

Years ago, my grandmother got a magazine from Phillip Morris. All it was were smokers bragging about how much they smoke. One guy writes a letter complaining they told him he couldn't smoke at an expensive steak house, so he got up, left, grabbed a hot dog from a vendor on the street outside and smoked and said it was a better meal than what he would have had at the other place. Some people are fucking addicted and delusional.

[gateley]

32. When I smoked and someone asked me to cease, I'd get all huffy because

in reality I was pretty ashamed and embarrassed to be a smoker, if that makes sense. Typical addict -- I was the victim -- it was all about ME.

Hope you don't have to deal with that again. I used to suffer from migraines (when I smoked! :7) and I understand how debilitating they can be.

[bigwillq]

33. Smokers need to be more considerate.

I am sorry this happened to you. I am an on-again, off-again smoker. I try and be respectful at all times.

I do feel, however, that smokers' rights have evaporated in recent years. Smoking is a legal product. I feel some of the penalties are too harsh, although I really like the smoking bans in bars and restaurants. If I want to smoke, I can just go outside.

[TicketyBoo]

109. We get people here who

stand in the doorway of businesses and smoke. You literally have to get them to move in order to get in or out the door, and, of course, you have to walk through a cloud of smoke. Often there are two or three people standing there, chatting with one another and smoking away, so the smoke is really concentrated. It's disgusting, really.

[Kalyke]

138. So do non-smokers.

Build us an indoor area with fans and double doors. Don't send us out in 10-below weather and wonder why we get sick.

It's less to do with the habit than having to stand outside in all the pollution from non-smokers' cars.

[bigwillq]

155. I would rather go outside

(I do all the time, even at home; even in winter) then stand in a smoke chamber.

[Odin2005]

34. Ugh, cigarette smoke triggers my autistic sensory overload. NOT FUN!!!

I agree with you, I DON'T WANT TO BE SUCKING IN OTHER'S SMOKE!!!

[The Straight Story]

35. When it comes to bars - do you think consenting adults should be able to smoke there?

No one forces you to go to a bar. Your body, your choice of where to drink.

[high density]

39. What about the effect of second hand smoke on the bar staff?

Do they deserve to be in a cloud of that particulate matter all night?

[The Straight Story]

42. Does anyone force them to work there? (nt)

[high density]

45. Does anybody force the smokers to go to the bar and smoke there?

[The Straight Story]

49. Your body, your choice - does that mean anything to anyone ??

I am not talking about smoking in hospitals, grocery stores, etc.

No one has to go to bars, ADULTS choose (key word choose) to go to such places.

And you would deny them that based on your morals because you think it is wrong? Like some think abortion is wrong.

Your body - your choice, except when fundies want to force their beliefs on our bodies.

[Dreamer Tatum]

50. Got that, everyone? Don't like cig smoke - you're akin to an anti-abortion fundie

[The Straight Story]

103. You purposely misread things? And you only THINK it is about smoking because it makes it easier for

you.

like when the RW calls abortion murder, it makes it easier for them to justify denying someone having one.

It is about CHOICE. Period.

Two adults cannot choose which BAR they want to go to because lw fundies don't believe they should have that choice.

Because YOU don't like it.

You don't believe in 'her body, her choice' because you want to control what others can or cannot do with their bodies.

[high density]

62. WTF about my body when it is around the unneeded toxic second-hand smoke?

A woman having an abortion doesn't affect me in the least. An ass next to me blowing smoke in my face does affect me. I've been on windy ferry rides where idiots have flicked ashes into my face. Zero consideration at all for others.

Don't force your belief of stinking like smoke on me. Thanks.

[TicketyBoo]

111. My mother-in-law

worked in a bar in her younger days and lived with a smoker (her second husband) for about 20 years. She never smoked in her life, but she has to go have her lungs scrubbed out every couple of years from the damage that was done from second-hand smoke.

I guess you think that nobody who doesn't smoke should work in a bar, so you can smoke there? That's just so wrong.

It's not just your body, your choice, when you smoke in public. You're affecting other people, too. Even if they're smokers, also, you're adding to their problem and they're adding to yours (if they are smoking in your presence, too).

[WhollyHeretic]

51. By that brilliant logic then we should get rid of any safety regulations at workplaces

Exposure to asbestos? Sure, no problem. No one is forcing them to work there.

I think we need to get rid of OSHA. Let's start a campaign!

[Bunny]

63. I've often thought that, too.

After all, ADULTS work in coal mines, steel mills, etc. They're CHOOSING to work there. They know the risks. Their body, their choice I guess. :eyes:

[high density]

64. Maybe we can get rid of ADA requirements too

Nobody is forcing handicapped people to go anywhere.

[Harry Monroe]

79. No, but that may be the only job they can get!!

They still shouldn't have to put up with the hazards of second hand smoke in order to pay the bills and rent!!

[K8-EEE]

87. Yes I've been "forced" to have jobs before

Like, it's the only job I could get and I needed it to live.

I don't think any workplace should be unnecessarily toxic.

[FunkyLeprechaun]

47. No

N/T

[taught_me_patience]

55. No.

Patrons have a right to a safe business environment free of noxious fumes that cause cancer.

[demmiblue]

56. Hello? She wasn't at a bar. Did you even read the OP?

[NCDem60]

58. Forget it. Nothing will do but the total .....

.... eradication of smokers. The DU brigade is in full freeper mode on this subject. As soon as it is accomplished they'll move on. Some will join in but some will not because they will find themselves a member of the next target grop. Signs point to overweight folks being the next. NC is already cutting state health insurance back to 70% max for the obese.

For the record I don't smoke, nor am I obese. I have a distinct distaste for witch hunts.

[sabrina 1]

75. Sad, isn't it?

I hope this country is never invaded, the entire population would probably pass out from, well, something seeing as how easily they get upset. Otoh, it might make them long for the days when they could go to a bar and join the suicidal alcoholics and smokers which would seem sort of harmless at that point. Everything is relative.

But it seems everyone has some kind of 'problem'. I remember a friend visiting from Europe said before he left. 'I really like the American people, but why do they all have so many 'problems'?

I think it's all the Dr. Phil type shows telling everyone they have a right to be angry and upset about something or other. Keeps people in a state of constant righteousness. But the question is, because it isn't just the anti-smoking crowd, there's a million anti-something groups, if everyone has a 'problem' with someone else, won't we run out of people to victimize and what we all do then to make ourselves feel superior?

[Harry Monroe]

81. I'm all for the eradication of tobacco!!

I've got a sister-in-law who is dying of lung cancer. She has been battling it for 4 long years and they have already removed one lung. Latest crisis was last week when she had blood clots in the lung and had to spend the week in the ICU. Doctors didn't give her much of a chance, but thank God she is home now albeit with brain damage now from all the radiation treatments she has had to receive (the cancer has metastasized 4 times to her brain and each time she had to receive radiation to shrink the tumors). She doesn't have that long to live. The ironic part?? She never smoked a day in her life, but her parents were both heavy smokers.

[superduperfarleft]

91. I smoke, and I agree with the OP.

It's my right to smoke, but it's not my right to be an inconsiderate dickhead and blow smoke all over someone who either doesn't want to smell it or gets sick because of it.

Sure seems like there's a lot of "libertarians" (as in, people who want to do whatever the fuck they want regardless of the impact it may have on others) on DU lately.

[TicketyBoo]

112. I had a friend

who told me to hold my breath if I didn't like her smoke.

I don't go to her house any more.

[misanthrope]

66. Bars don't have licenses for smoking but for alcohol sales...

...The primary purpose of the bar is a place for people to go and drink within the prescribed bounds of the law. You can smoke elsewhere besides a confined space that makes others inhale your second-hand smoke.

[varelse]

78. would YOU refuse to put out a cigarette

if you knew it was making someone very sick, or even just making them suffer? Would you go ahead and light one up in a closed area or near a doorway if you knew there were asthma victims in that room or a person who was allergic to tobacco smoke was standing nearby?

You know what? I think you'd consider other people first. I think you've made it pretty clear that you care about others - that you have a great deal of empathy for those who can't simply walk out of one job and move on to another one, for example. The jerk the OP is referring to is in a whole different league. One you're not a part of and never will be. Or at least, that's the impression I have from reading your posts.

The one I'm replying to being the obvious exception - I hope.

[Luminous Animal]

86. I don't. And I smoke.

[superduperfarleft]

90. You're the kind of smoker who makes all of us look bad.

I'm a smoker that realizes that not everyone wants to be subjected to my stinky, disgusting habit.

It's not your usual tripe about "choice," it's simple fucking consideration for others. I realize that libertarian fundies like you have trouble with that, though.

[Fire1]

36. I'm a smoker and totally agree with you. There's a time and

place for everything.

[NCDem60]

37. I love this stuff. Totally paranoid people when it comes to.....

....second hand smoke, sitting in a restaurant full of people, some of whom are quietly farting and in addition, not one of them ever thinks to inquire if the cook washed his hands after using the shitter. :}

[Dreamer Tatum]

38. So you relate smoking to farting and shitting

wow, what a sexy, suave, cool-assed habit.

Enjoy.

[NCDem60]

40. Sorry you once again have it all wrong. I relate....

...paranoia to humor. And although I don't think it is any of your business, I don't smoke.

[Gman2]

44. Race to the bottom, poopoo, you must be proud.

[Berry Cool]

48. Last thing I heard, nobody got a disease from breathing air that had been farted in

and it's the law that cooks have to wash their hands after using the shitter, so no one thinks to inquire as to whether the law is being followed.

Me? When I breathe in smoke, my heart immediately starts to race, aside from everything else. That tells me right there something isn't right.

I'm with those who think smoking sections in public places are the equivalent of peeing sections in a swimming pool.

Smokers can be courteous and smoke away from others. No huge skin off their butts, so to speak.

[jgraz]

57. You've clearly never met my younger brother

Last time he let one rip, I think I got radiation burns.

[NCDem60]

59. Ahhhh....humor. Thanks it been a rare commodity in these parts.

[TheCowsCameHome]

52. Paranoid? About breathing in their rotten exhaled smoke?

Yeah, I guess I'm paranoid if that's the new term for breathing poisoned air.

[NCDem60]

60. Yep. You fit the definition.

[liberalhistorian]

110. So if I try to protect my son from smoke that greatly

aggravates his respiratory issues, I'm being "paranoid?" I should consider his poor father and stepmother's rights to breathe smoke in his face, that they KNOW CAUSES HIM BREATHING PROBLEMS AND DON'T CARE, over his right not to wheeze and struggle for breath?

And the people who've gotten cancer or had respiratory or health issues aggravated by the PROVEN poison of secondhand smoke are all being "paranoid" and should just shut up and suck it up? UP. YOURS.

[LanternWaste]

130. Or when it comes to fictional...

"Totally paranoid people when it comes to....."

Or when it comes to the fictional Smoking Nazis, removing all choices from your body and your person.

As are most extreme, overly-dramatic examples, six of one and half a dozen of the other.

[unblock]

41. i'm also a migraineur and officially allergic to tobacco (tested and everything)

i can't tell you how many times that scenario has played out in my life.

personally, i think that now that there are non-smoke-generating ways of getting nicotine (gum, patch, electric) there's no excuse to continue to do something as obnoxious as smoking. i have no problem with other people taking nicotine if they want, but that doesn't mean they have to take it via smoke in public.

fortunately, smoking in public has become increasingly frowned upon, though that often means that many of those who STILL smoke in public have an attitude about it.

they can't help it. they're both addicted AND brainwashed.

[taught_me_patience]

43. K & R

Last night, a neighbor (condo) decided to smoke on his balcony at 11:30. Do smokers realize that when they smoke on their balcony, it drifts into neighboring apartments only 5 feet away? It is so damn inconsiderate. My wife woke from her sleep to cry out that it stunk like cigarettes before falling back asleep.

[pipi_k]

46. Sympathy for the migraine people...

I'm not allergic to cigarette smoke myself...although I do agree it stinks to high heaven (something I was in denial about when I smoked) but I do get really nasty headaches when I'm exposed to the smell of certain chemicals, paints and varnishes, etc.

So I understand how just the smell of cigarette smoke could cause very painful headaches.

:(

[HughMoran]

53. When I feel a migraine coming on, I take 3 ibuprofen and drink an expresso

...then I lay down for a while.

[jgraz]

54. Once your migraine kicks in, you should exercise your right to puke on his shoes.

Cig smoke does the same thing to me. Can't stand it. :puke:

[ThomCat]

61. That smoke is one of my triggers for migraines too.

:(

I'm sorry you went through this, and that it is ruining your day this way.

Assholes who think their whim trumps everyone else around them are such a drain on life.

:hug:

Please feel better soon.

[Raine]

67. Good for you!

:toast: :thumbsup: :hi: and you're not an "asshole" the insensitive rude jerk who acted like a spoiled brat is the asshole! x(

[liberalhistorian]

68. Smokers who don't care about how their filthy, disgusting

totally unhealthy habit affects others, especially those with health and respiratory difficulties/diseases, are the REAL assholes. Truly selfish and self-centered. And I'm a former smoker, so I can say that!!!!!!!!!

[Diane R]

69. I agree with you on this. Why do cigarette smokers think their rights should trump everyone elses?

[Skip Intro]

74. Your life would be better if you'd set the duck free. Karma and all. Just sayin...

:D

[noamnety]

76. It's a migraine trigger for me as well.

One day last year I thought I was going crazy, after school my classroom reeked of cigarettes and I couldn't figure out why. It was disgusting. I know it wasn't lingering smell from a jacket from one of my kids because I would have smelled it during my classes.

I finally tracked it down. Through my classroom door, through the hall, through another classroom, through their open door to the outside, an instructor was outside that door in a parking lot smoking.

It was making my room intolerable, and they were several rooms removed from me. I can understand why they didn't realize the current was sucking the smell into my room, I closed their door to the parking lot, no bad feelings. But there's no excuse for smoking right at a doorway - you can't pretend nonsmokers aren't being exposed to it or that they want to be exposed to it.

[femrap]

80. Whenever I smell smoke, I get

that immediate feeling of nausea. I hate sitting in traffic and the person in front of me doesn't want the smoke in his car so the cigarette is outside and the smoke blowing into mine.

Roll up your windows and smoke the damn thing.

[REP]

83. The car exhaust doesn't make you sick?

I can't stand it, especially diesel exhaust. Hello migraine!

[femrap]

132. Not car exhaust.

But diesel sure does. And especially school buses....their exhaust pipes are under the bus while most semis have theirs atop the cab.

Even as a kid, I couldn't ride the school bus. Made me so sick. Same with hair spray...my mom had to go outside if she sprayed her hair.

I don't get migraines....just extremely nauseated. I feel as if I'm a canary in the coal mine...that shit is hurting our environment and probably causing cancers.

[TheMadMonk]

84. I'm a smoker. I agree that the guy under discussion here is a dick.

However, if I'm smoking when you by your choice move into my smoke plume, expect an earful and a half if you then have the gall to complain.

I do my best to ensure that my smoke does not inconvenience others. I choose the downwind side of the bus stop or railway platform. I do resent ridiculous laws which demand that if I do smoke in certain locales I MUST fully expose myself to the elements because it was considered easier to apply a blanket ban to smoking in all covered public areas (no matter how open) than to enforce existing public nusiance laws.

I must admit that I am on occasion guilty of dropping my butts on the ground where anti-terrorism hysteria has resulted on the removal of bins and other disposal receptacles. However I smoke 100% biodegradable rollups and I always carefully completely break up the remains with my boot.

[krabigirl]

85. Strong perfume is a migraine inducer for me.

[OhioBlue]

94. me too - some perfumes are really bad

also some cleaning agents.

I still feel bad for getting so huffy with the janitor in our building one time - I had asked several times not to use the stuff they were using to clean the office, just to use water when wiping down dust... but he continued to use the chemical cleaning stuff .. and the headache started... but I was also preggo - which then led me to morning sickness.. and... hormonal.. which made me want to cry b/c they hated me b/c they were still using the cleaning agent... (illogical.. I know now) so i yelled at him....

Not my finest moment.....

I also had an episode over the smell of coffee.. for which I'm glad I wasn't fired.. lol

[diane in sf]

166. add those disgusting dryer sheets to the toxic list--the ingredients cause cancer

as well as stinking and inducing migraines

[handmade34]

88. rec

[PHIMG]

89. You should be able to sue. Seriously. n/t

[Jamastiene]

92. Note to self:

Close the damn door when smoking a cigarette around graywarrior. :wow:

Hope your headache goes away soon. :hug:

The tar in the smoke probably constricted your blood vessels. Maybe some deep warm breaths (warm moist air away from smoke) can put some oxygen in there and open them back up. I hate a migraine. I get them, but smoke isn't my trigger. Doing without caffeine is my biggest trigger, oddly enough.

[demigoddess]

114. that is caffeine withdrawal.

[Mira]

93. As a serious migraineur (outgrew it after 30 years of suffering) and also

a seriously committed former smoker (quit 5/5/98)
I am in support of your absolute rights to protect yourself from anyone who might trigger your headache.
He should be ashamed and apologetic.

You are in the right. Stop fuming and do what it takes to get better.
Some people are aggressive when they are caught being selfish and boorish, and that can't be helped, because it is the only way they can live with themselves, since they don't understand an apology does not diminish but augment them.

I hope you have a good night, anyway.

edited because I mis-typed something

[Zoeisright]

95. +1000

NOBODY has the right to pollute the air you breathe.

[SeattleGirl]

96. Apparently this guy doesn't fully understand the meaning of smoking

outside. That means all they way outside. Far as I know, there is no invisible smoke-blocking shield if one stands outside next to the door, and the door is open.

Guy is definitely a dumbshit, and very rude too, especially because you spoke to him in a calm manner.

Asshole.

Sorry you have a migraine. :hug:

[peace13]

97. Those who don't understand that smoke can make people ill on contact are ignorant.

I hear you. It's asthma for me and smoke exposure takes me 72 hours to get over. I am sorry that you were gassed!

[Brigid]

98. I'll rec.

I have heart disease. I have never smoked, but I certainly don't want to be exposed to secondhand smoke. Whether smokers like it or not, their habit places others at risk. They have to consider that when deciding when and where to smoke.

[MrMickeysMom]

99. You'll never get an argument from me...

I take care of people who suffer from smoking (second-hand or not)...

The Steve Martin, "No, do you mind if I FART?" response would have been a good one to the person, should they have asked... but they didn't.

[Indenturedebtor]

100. *** Lights up a virtual smoke ***

Anyone in this thread who doesn't ride a bike to work is a hypocrite.

Your filthy car exhaust is all over everything destroying the planet. It kicks up my allergies. It causes all kinds of cancer... and so on. I don't mind if you drive, just do it on another planet.

[frustrated_lefty]

125. Amen.

[Dreamer Tatum]

134. So car exhaust annoys your allergies, yet you smoke?

If that's what you're saying, your biggest problem isn't people who drive - it's you.

[frustrated_lefty]

139. It seems more likely he was simply pointing out the hypocrisy

of members of the overwrought, hand-wringing, anti-smoking brigade who happily drive about expelling pollutants into the air. If their feelings about the subject are so strong, why can they not be consistent in their beliefs and practice what they so zealously preach?

[Dreamer Tatum]

140. OK, then my problem is only with smokers who drive cars. Happy?

I don't think that narrows it down very much.

[Indenturedebtor]

233. Actually yes. Lots of car exhaust gives me a migraine

Smoking doesn't ;)

[dionysus]

152. i smoke myself but i wouldn't stand in an open doorway where it would blow inside

that's just common coutersy man.

[Indenturedebtor]

234. Either would I... that's pretty uncalled for. n/t

[jgraz]

246. Silly analogy. Nobody backs their car exhaust up to an open door.

On the other hand, I fully support your right to smoke in the middle of any busy highway you choose.

[Indenturedebtor]

253. High-five for ignoring the analogy and making a "witty" rejoinder

[MilesColtrane]

101. Sic the duck on him.

Of course that would mean you would have to free the duck first.

[1]

105. i'm with you. i smoke, but if i wanted to hear the proceedings i would put my smoke out and listen.

or walk away and smoke without bothering anyone. that would be my choice but never your problem.

[Divine Discontent]

106. I share your frustration - 1st time I go 'out' in days. I stand in the 7/11 talking to my fave girl

and there's people outside smoking --- after about 15 minutes of catching up with her, I leave and get in my car. I think, what the HECK is all over me but CIGARETTE ODOR. My shirt is caked with it! I get a headache that hurt a bit, very rare for me.

I know smokers like to smoke - but in their own homes or 20 feet away from open doors or something, and not where others are around you 20 feet or closer, because in traffic, it comes right into your window, and if you're trying to enjoy the beautiful weather - you're screwed and have to roll up your window. (And I don't have AC)


So, I concur. I think it's fine if people wanna smoke, but great respect should be given to those who don't smoke and don't want covered in it, ya know?

[demigoddess]

113. I get migraines too, it is the formaldehyde and ammonia in cigarettes

that causes them with me. Pipe tobacco doesn't bother me, I think, but there are so few pipe smokers. Mostly, I avoid cigarette smoke but the woman next door smokes on the outside of her house and it gets into my house. It comes in the windows in summer and into the garage all the time. Don't know how it gets there but it does. Smells up my car.

[graywarrior]

118. Good morning. I still have a migraine.

Fucking bastard.

[PVnRT]

120. Most cities have an ordinance stating you must be a certain distance from doors

So, no, you weren't trampling on his rights. Where I live, it's 30 feet from any door.

[ChoppinBroccoli]

122. Smokers Should Be Able To Smoke Wherever They Want, And I Should Be Able To Piss Wherever I Want

If I'm sitting at a bar having a few and feel the need to empty out the old bladder, why should I be forced to get up from my comfy stool and walk WAY OVER THERE to an end of the bar, AWAY FROM EVERYONE ELSE, be made to feel like an outcast, and have my rights trampled upon just because SOME people don't like to be around piss or to be pissed on directly? It's YOUR problem, not mine. If you don't want to go home with your clothes or hair smelling of piss, don't go to a bar!!! If you don't want to have your leg soaked with another human's urine, you have a choice not to go out. If you don't want me pissing into your drink while you're not looking, and running the risk of ingesting what comes out of MY body, you should stay home. Really, people should all cater to ME and what I want rather than the other way around. I like to piss wherever the urge strikes me. Just because 99% of the public has some problem with it, why do they have to victimize ME with their ridiculous anti-public-pissing laws? I heard the NAZIS had special rooms where you had to go to piss too!

What makes this little satire all the more hilarious is the fact that while smokers would all take great offense to being pissed on, it's actually about a billion times safer to get another person's piss, which is sterile, on you (or IN you) than toxic tobacco smoke.

So, hey, I'm all about compromise. Just like I'm willing to give Pro Life wackos their ban on abortion with some tit-for-tat compromises, I'm all for giving smokers the right to light up anywhere they please, just as long as they agree that if they smoke around me, I'm allowed to piss on them. Do we have a deal?

[redqueen]

124. LOL - great idea!

:D

[WilmywoodNCparalegal]

126. I hate the smell of smoke... I've had nosebleeds due to it and hell, my father's dying because of it

My parents were heavy smokers but they quit 15 years ago when my dad had a heart attack and a quintuple bypass at the tender age of 45.

Now, he has invasive bladder cancer, of which smoking is the primary cause. So, even by quitting, he is still dealing with the consequences of smoking.

Everytime someone in this office goes outside to smoke and comes back reeking, my nose starts itching and burning. On dry days, my nose will bleed.

This does not happen to me when I drive around or when people eat fatty meals. Smoking, whether we like it or not, affects other people, people who did not ask for the smoker to bring on him/her the stench.

I know that quitting is hard, but please, if you do smoke, quit.

[ChoppinBroccoli]

128. My Dad Used To Run 5 Miles Every Day, Smoked, And Had A Heart Attack At 41

He's had medical problems ever since. He's 66 now, and has all kinds of problems he has to deal with daily. He was in great shape, but smoked like a chimney.

When I was a kid, I used to get sick frequently (like once a month or so). After my Dad quit smoking, I got sick about once a year, and I still to this day only get sick once a year.

My Aunt (his sister), who never smoked in her life, now has emphysema because her parents smoked and her husband used to smoke.

And more important to me than all of those OBVIOUS health risks of second-hand smoke is the fact that if I am around smoke even a little bit, I feel like I'm suffocating. I can't get air. Even walking down the street behind someone who is smoking in the open air makes me gasp. I've even had problems with driving behind the car of a person who was smoking and blowing the smoke out the window. And God forbid I breathe some smoke when I'm fighting off a cold. That makes me insane.

Not to mention the fact that smokers in general are the most inconsiderate bastards on the face of the Earth. The next time you walk through a parking lot, look down and tell me the first thing you see on the ground. Try to take a road trip without seeing someone flick a cigarette out the window or tap the ashes out the window. The people who toss their cigarettes out car windows drive me nuts for one simple fact. Look down at your car radio. What does EVERY CAR have below that radio? And yet smokers still make their cigarette butts the world's problem. Even SMOKERS don't like to breathe smoke!!!

[Manifestor_of_Light]

242. Get a small ozone generator and take it to work.

They are great. Just do not breathe the ozone. It kills the odors fast!!

www.mold-kill.com

[dionysus]

131. smoking in front of an open door is assholish.

[Toasterlad]

143. You Would Know.

[dionysus]

150. wow, you're quite the prick. i'm trying to quit myself, but puffing away where the smoke blows

directly indoors is a fucking asshole move. it's a matter of common courtersy.

[graywarrior]

133. UPDATE: Here are the toxins in 2nd hand smoke from the CDC

a Report of the Surgeon General

Formaldehyde: Used to embalm dead bodies

Benzene: Found in gasoline

Polonium: Radioactive and very toxic

Vinyl Chloride: Used to make pipes

Carbon Monoxide: Found in car exhaust

Hydrogen Cyanide: Used in chemical weapons

Butane: Used in lighter fluid

Ammonia: Used in household cleaners

Toluene: Found in paint thinners

Cadmium: Used in making batteries

Lead: Once used in paint

Arsenic: Used in pesticides

Chromium: Used to make steel

Cancer causing chemicals are all extremely toxic
Toxic metals can cause cancer, can cause death, can damage the brain and kidneys
Poison gases can cause death, can affect heart & respiratory functions, can burn your throat, lungs, and eyes, and can cause unconsciousness.

There are now claims that second hand smoke contributes to crib death.

I consider 2nd hand cigarette smoke an assault.

[frustrated_lefty]

141. You've posted this same tired ass list before.

Is there something new to add? Or, is this to be a regular soap-box with minor variations in pontification surrounding the same pissy center?

[graywarrior]

187. who the fuck do you think you are?

Talk to me, go ahead. Big shot. I'll post this as many times as I want to. Don't read it, in fact don't read any of my pontificating, soap box pissy posts any more. You are a rude, rude piece of work, you know that? Stay the fuck away from me. YOU give me a migraine.


BTW:
a Report of the Surgeon General

Formaldehyde: Used to embalm dead bodies

Benzene: Found in gasoline

Polonium: Radioactive and very toxic

Vinyl Chloride: Used to make pipes

Carbon Monoxide: Found in car exhaust

Hydrogen Cyanide: Used in chemical weapons

Butane: Used in lighter fluid

Ammonia: Used in household cleaners

Toluene: Found in paint thinners

Cadmium: Used in making batteries

Lead: Once used in paint

Arsenic: Used in pesticides

Chromium: Used to make steel

Cancer causing chemicals are all extremely toxic
Toxic metals can cause cancer, can cause death, can damage the brain and kidneys
Poison gases can cause death, can affect heart & respiratory functions, can burn your throat, lungs, and eyes, and can cause unconsciousness.

There are now claims that second hand smoke contributes to crib death.

I consider 2nd hand cigarette smoke an assault.

[frustrated_lefty]

243. Your emotional tirades

and apparent inability to remain calm at the very notion that someone, somewhere might be having a cigarette is probably bad for your heart.

[graywarrior]

255. Your handle explains everything about you.

Buh bye. Say hola to IGNORE. LOL.

[Name removed]

142. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

145. I think its pretty obvious who the "fucktard" is here

and it isn't the original poster: it's you. How foul you are.

[Toasterlad]

147. Well, You Sure Told Me.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

153. yeah, I'm a real Nazi!

There's no fooling your razor-sharp mind, for sure...

[Capn Sunshine]

194. ......

[Octafish]

144. Proud to be K&R 52

I'd say the smoking-in-the-door man needs a hug, but he deserves a kick in the pants.

[Dreamer Tatum]

146. For the people equating smoking with car emissions, let me ask you

What are you, as smokers, personally doing to reduce your emissions of smoke?

Automobile engines are now many times more efficient than they were in the 70s, and spew vastly less
carbon monoxide into the environment than ever before.

Can you say the same? What R&D funds have you invested to reduce the level of toxins and abject stink you expose
to others when you light up?

I drive a ULEV Honda automobile. Can you please point me to the ULE Marlboros?

[Toasterlad]

148. Anti-Smoking Nazis Are the Best Advertisers For Cigarettes Ever.

They make the overwhelming argument that not smoking will turn you into a irritable, bitching, miserable, asshole.

I quit smoking over three years ago, and I'm ashamed to call myself a non-smoker, given the despicable, whiny, self-centered, self-satisfied nature of the TYPICAL non-smoker.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

151. Are You A Teabagger?

Comparing people who hate second hand smoke to Nazis is total f**king idiocy. Shame on you.

[dionysus]

154. teabagger, nah, just a blithering idiot.

[graywarrior]

188. Sounds like you're whining now.

Cry baby.

[Toasterlad]

198. True. But I'm a Whiner Without a Self-Induced Headache.

[graywarrior]

201. You're right, this thread has given me a headache.

[jgraz]

245. Ah, so having migraines is ... a choice?

Now where have I heard that before?

[Toasterlad]

247. Et Tu, Jgraz?

We've always been like brothers. Is this smoking thing going to drive us apart?

I'm simply suggesting that for SOME people, which may or may not include the OP, their extreme dislike of something may trigger an actual physical response, such as a migraine. I do not doubt migraines are real. I just don't believe they're ALWAYS caused by smoke.

[jgraz]

248. Hey, you gored my pet ox

I've had migraines since I was an infant and they're a fucking pain in the balls. Tobacco smoke is a huge trigger for me.

Don't worry, we're still on the same side. Unless you light up in my house. :P

[Toasterlad]

250. No Worries. Been "Clean" For Nearly Three Years.

I'll admit that I've never had a migraine, so I can't understand what it's like, or what can really trigger them. I DO sympathize with those who suffer from them, but it still bugs me when I see what I consider inappropriate responses to smoking. I tend to sympatize more with the smoker unless I'm convinced the smoker is entirely in the wrong.

[jgraz]

251. Ever had an ice cream headache?

Now imagine that lasting 36 hours. I think graywarrior had every right to politely ask the guy to move.

Both sides have inappropriate responses. I was at an outdoor cafe in SF and a smoker sat upwind from me. When the waitress brought his drink, I paid for it and asked him if he'd mind switching tables. He threw his lit cigarette at me and stalked off. (That wasn't you, was it? ;) )

[Toasterlad]

252. Actually, No...I've Never Had One.

To this day, I'm mystified by the "ice cream headache" phenomenon. I can eat ice cream fast or slow, makes no difference. And since I LOVE ice cream, I've had plenty of opportunities.

Like I said upthread, I'm a firm believer that smokers should be considerate of the airspace of non-smokers. And I definitely over-reacted to graywarrior's OP: if, indeed, he asked the smoker politely to move outside, and the smoker nastily refused, then the smoker was certainly at fault. As was the smoker who tossed his butt at you (which was NOT me - unfortunately, I've not yet been to San Francisco, although I'm dearly hoping to go at some point - even still, I'd NEVER have done a thing like that to anybody).

It's just that I've been involved in so many incidents when I was a smoker, when I was being as considerate as I could possibly be, and I'd STILL have people giving me dirty looks, making nasty remarks, and even demanding I put out my cigarette (never mind the fact that I was outdoors and my smoke wasn't going anywhere near them). It didn't help that both my mother and my sister quit smoking and became evangelical ex-smokers, who are by far the worst of the lot. Every time I saw either of them, I'd hear it for hours, and if the two of them were together: forget it.

So, to recap: while I agree that smokers must be considerate and that there are, in fact, rude-ass smokers out there, I still think that the majority of the rudeness around this issue is coming from the non-smokers. Just read the responses on this thread: all the vile things that people are saying. Most of these people talk about smokers as if they're less than human. They say it's an addiction or a disease, but they'd have far more sympathy for a heroin addict or a leper than they do for any filthy smoker.

[BakedAtAMileHigh]

157. dupe

dupe self delete

[Doremus]

158. If you're equally allergic to fireplaces and barbeques, I'm behind you 100%.

You'll forgive my skepticism. I've seen far too many people start hacking their lungs out when they thought I was smoking a cigarette and it was just a smokeless e-cig.

The mind can do amazing things.

[Dreamer Tatum]

160. My wife can't be near a fireplace burning anything at all

no wood, no fake logs, no nothing. Provokes the same response as a cigarette.

[Doremus]

161. That's right.

I mean, from a combustion standpoint.

Smoke is smoke is smoke, whether from a cig or a barbeque pit. It's all the same.

[Dreamer Tatum]

162. In general, yes, though some smoke has nastier things in it

My wife gets migraines from cig smoke, but she merely cannot tolerate smoke from wood burning. The end result is more or less the same, but something in cig smoke makes her sick.

At some level, though, smoke is smoke.

[Doremus]

167. Uh, no. Cigarette smoke is identical in chemical composition to smoke from a wood fire.

If she's getting migraines with one and not the other, it's all in her head, pun intended.

[Dreamer Tatum]

168. I'll go ahead and doubt that.

A burning, chemically-treated leaf is going to have different chemistry than a burning piece of wood.

[Doremus]

171. No it doesn't.

I won't bother with links because I smell a closed mind.

You're smart enough to know where to find the information anyway.

Suffice to say that you're wrong and pretending that you aren't won't change the fact.

[WhollyHeretic]

174. So wood has nicotine?

Wow... ya learn something new every day :crazy:

[Dreamer Tatum]

176. No need to get snippy. I just doubt that. I might look it up

and if I'm wrong, I'll admit I'm wrong.

[Arugula Latte]

169. No it is not identical.

Cigarettes have all sorts of additives that plain old wood does not.

It most certainly is not identical, and that is why it smells different than smoke from a wood fire.

[Doremus]

172. Wrong. nt

[Arugula Latte]

175. Do you not understand the concept of "toxic smoke"?

You know, when there is a fire and certain things containing chemicals burn and it is far more dangerous to firefighters and other nearby breathers than regular wood smoke? Well, cigarettes contain dangerous chemicals.

DUH.

[Doremus]

197. And when the moon gets too close to the sun it starts burning and the toxic smoke

that falls to Earth smells like green cheese.

Then the man in the moon gets an asthma attack and a migraine.

I swear it's true.

[Arugula Latte]

203. OMG you are a piece of work!

:rofl:

:hi:

[Doremus]

229. Wha'???

I mean, really, if you're gonna make up a story make it a good one, right?

;)

:hi:

[joeybee12]

173. I didn't realize all wood had tar and nicotene in it!

Wow!

[Arugula Latte]

181. Shhh! Logic and facts will just confuse her!

:hi:

[joeybee12]

184. Hee-hee!

:hi:

[Doremus]

189. Define "tar"

For your second assignment, look up how to spell "nicotene."

Then maybe we can have a conversation.

[joeybee12]

205. OMG!!! A misspelling...that changes everything!

Sheesh, is that the best you got?

[Doremus]

230. Shhh.

Don't talk until you look up those pesky tars.

Go forth and learn, then we'll converse, k?

[Capn Sunshine]

204. Chemicals in Cigarette smoke not in wood smoke:

Cigarette Chemicals (in Tobacco Smoke)

Benzene (petrol additive)
A colourless cyclic hydrocarbon obtained from coal and petroleum, used as a solvent in fuel and in chemical manufacture - and contained in cigarette smoke. It is a known carcinogen and is associated with leukaemia.

Formaldehyde (embalming fluid)
A colourless liquid, highly poisonous, used to preserve dead bodies - also found in cigarette smoke. Known to cause cancer, respiratory, skin and gastrointestinal problems.

Ammonia (toilet cleaner)
Used as a flavouring, frees nicotine from tobacco turning it into a gas, found in dry cleaning fluids.

Acetone (nail polish remover)
Fragrant volatile liquid ketone, used as a solvent, for example, nail polish remover - found in cigarette smoke.

Tar
Particulate matter drawn into lungs when you inhale on a lighted cigarette. Once inhaled, smoke condenses and about 70 per cent of the tar in the smoke is deposited in the smoker's lungs.

Nicotine (insecticide/addictive drug)
One of the most addictive substances known to man, a powerful and fast-acting medical and non-medical poison. This is the chemical which causes addiction.

Carbon Monoxide (CO) (car exhaust fumes)
An odourless, tasteless and poisonous gas, rapidly fatal in large amounts - it's the same gas that comes out of car exhausts and is the main gas in cigarette smoke, formed when the cigarette is lit. Others you may recognize are :

Arsenic (rat poison), Hydrogen Cyanide (gas chamber poison)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
River in Egypt ---D Nile

[joeybee12]

208. Oh I know that!

I was responding to someone who seems to think smoke from plain ole wood and cigarettes are exactly the same!

[Capn Sunshine]

224. I was helping you

I guess I forgot and posted the reply to you instead of them

[Doremus]

235. Wrong.

What’s in Wood Smoke?

Wood smoke contains over 100 different chemicals and compounds, including
dioxin, as well as lead, cadmium and arsenic.

Below is a partial list:
*+carbon monoxide, methane, VOCs (C2-C7),
*aldehydes, +formaldehyde, *+acrolein, +pro-
pionaldehyde, butyl aldehyde, +acetaldehyde,
furfural, substituted furans, +benzene, +alkyl
benzenes, +toluene, acetic acid, formic acid,
*nitrogen oxides (NO, NO2), *sulfur dioxide,
+methyl chloride, +naphthalene, +substituted
naphthalenes, oxygenated monoaromatics,
guaiacol (and derivatives), *+phenol (and
derivatives), syringol (and derivatives), +cat-
echol (and derivatives), *+particulate organic
carbon, oxygenated polycyclic aromatic
hydrocarbons, +PAHs: fluorene, phenanthrene,
+anthracene, methylanthracenes, +fluoran-
thene, *+pyrene, +benzo(a)anthracene, +chry-
sene, +benzofluoranthenes, *+benzo(e)pyrene,
*+benzo(a)pyrene, *perylene, +ideno(1,2,3-
cd)pyrene, *benz(ghi)perylene, *coro-
nene, +dibenzo(a,h)pyrene, retene,
dibenz(a,h)anthracene, trace elements: Na, Mg,
Al, Si, S, Cl, K, Ca, Ti, V, +Cr, +Mn, Fe, +Ni,
Cu, Zn, Br, +Pb; particulate elemental carbon,
normal alkanes (C24-C30), cyclic di-and triter-
penoids, dehydroabietic acid, isopimaric acid,
lupenone, friedelin, +chlorinated dioxins

* Indicates a chemical also found in cigarette smoke
+Indicates a chemical that is classified as toxic by U.S. Law

Breathing in wood smoke is comparable to inhaling second-hand cigarette smoke.

Many of the pollutants are similar to those produced by burning tobacco. The EPA
estimates that wood smoke is 12 times more carcinogenic than equal amounts of tobacco
smoke and attacks our body cells up to 40 times longer than tobacco smoke.

A single fireplace operating for an hour and burning 10 pounds of wood during that time
will generate 4,300 times more carcinogenic polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons than 30 ciga-
rettes.

http://burningissues.org/pdfs/WoodSmBroharris.pdf


Simple matter of chemistry. Particulate matter (aka tar) and carbon monoxide is present in wood smoke in greater amounts than cigarette smoke because most wood fires are larger than your typical cigarette.

Little if any nicotine in wood smoke but that isn't a carcinogen.

Bottom line, people who say they're allergic to cigarette smoke but have no problem with fireplaces, bonfires, etc. are full of it.

[Bjorn Against]

241. If the chemical composition is the same then why do people even smoke cigarettes?

If all smoke is the same as you seem to claim it is then it seems that smoking dried up leaves from your lawn would satisfy a person's cravings the same way that smoking a cigarette would and it would cost far less. If all smoke was really the same as you claim it is then it shouldn't matter what you smoke, everything will have the same effect on your body right? People could save a lot of money if you would just advise them that smoking oak tree leaves is exactly the same thing as smoking cigarettes.

[Dreamer Tatum]

180. If all smoke is completely identical, why does mesquite smoke smell different from oak?

[Bjorn Against]

239. If smoke is smoke...

Does that mean that inhaling the smoke from a campfire will have the same effect on me as inhaling the smoke from a joint? If so I am going to have to plan a camping trip for the weekend.

[Tx4obama]

220. You're right...

I was standing outside a building once holding a cigarette that was NOT lit talking to someone (no one was smoking) and two women walked by me coughing and waving their hands all around!

The whole situation has gotten out of control!!!

[joeybee12]

163. What he has is NOT a right, it's an addiction...

...if he can't go for a few hours without smoking, he's an addict. Nicotene is the most addictive substance around. I'm dying for a soda right now, but guess what, I can wait. Addicts can't.

[cynatnite]

177. Standing outside the door generally does violate a no smoking zone...

from what I understand. He was in the wrong and he knows it from the way I read it. Otherwise, he wouldn't have been stomping around like a 2-year-old.

[Darth_Kitten]

178. I think you are pretty special...........

Tell those rude smokers to go @#$#$@# themselves. ;)

[Capn Sunshine]

183. He was taking out his frustrations on you

when smokers get nervous this blood imbalance happens. It embarassing and a weakness to end all weaknesses. They actually get irrational, and whiney. If you dare cross them when they are in this state, woe be unto you.

For the next time, remember to state that due to your own predisposition to migraines you can't accomodate their weakness and addiction.

[graywarrior]

190. I should have set up a boxing ring.

[Capn Sunshine]

193. this is a case where duct tape would have come in handy

if not for his mouth, his hands.

[graywarrior]

202. So so true.

[dugaresa]

191. the older i get my asthma gets triggered more easily, so I hear ya

i don't go to bars where there is smoking and i only go to smoke free restaurants.

even some scented candles will set me off, so i have asked friends to put out their nice candles because i am feeling suffocated but they do it for me cuz they are civilized.

[graywarrior]

192. I'm still suffering with a headache today.

Didn't sleep well last night and feeling like shit today. And reading some of the temper tantrums here makes it so much better...lol.

[alfredo]

195. Why should you make allowances for drug addicts?

[graywarrior]

200. I try to be tolerant to addicts.

I was one, once. But what addicts and alcoholics (recovering one, here) don't realize is how they destroy the people around them. Cigarette smoking is dangerous to the smoker and the people around them. And their defensive attitudes about it obviously affects the people near them as you can see by this thread.

[alfredo]

206. I was an addict too. I went cold turkey in 1973 and haven't looked back.

[graywarrior]

207. Congratulations.

It's a difficult thing to face and accept. Denial is a killer.

[alfredo]

212. I was a three pack a day addict. I was a mess.

[graywarrior]

214. Same here.

I used to sit at my computer at Mass General Hospital smoking Marlboro's, one after another and drinking either Tab or coffee. I was up to 3 1/2 packs a day by the time I finally quit.

[alfredo]

221. I got a real bad chest cold, so I figured I was really miserable anyway, so

I quit.

[Bonobo]

199. So he was outside?

If so, I think you were not sufficiently tolerant.

Flame me if you want, but it is my opinion.

I am an ex-smoker and quit for good finally 4 years ago. Thank goodness.

Yes, it smells terrible, etc. I agree.

But tolerance for others is an important ingredient in society that I think there is not enough of in this country.

[graywarrior]

209. He was in the door way, standing on the threshold with the door open.

Sure, he was blowing the smoke out the door, but it was back drafting into the room.

[Bonobo]

211. And when you told him that it was blowing in...

Did he know that you had this migraine-trigger thing?

Or did he just think you were being intolerant.

The reason I ask is, that from his perspective, he was making efforts to make sure it wasn't bothering anyone and if it was just a normal case of you "not liking the smell" (as opposed to a health issue), I can see why he might first get annoyed that despite his efforts (which you may not have appreciated), he was being asked to be even further isolated.

I did not write this well... but do you know what I mean?

[graywarrior]

213. Yes, I told him I get headaches from the smoke.

Lat night, the smoke bothered me more than usual, probably because the room was packed with about 150 people.

[Bonobo]

215. Well, if you told him politely, I think he was an asshole to not be more careful.

I hope you feel better soon.

Migraine headaches are so debilitating.

[graywarrior]

216. I am very careful when I ask someone to stop smoking in my presence

I try to consider their feelings first. Some get so easily offended, as you can see.

[Tx4obama]

218. What does the amount of ppl there have anything to do with it? n/t

[graywarrior]

223. Tight quarters.

No space for the room to vent.

[Tx4obama]

217. Come on ... a two day migrane from a tiny bit of smoke ???

And you are on the computer?
I get migraines VERY BAD ONES and there is no way I can be on the computer during them.
I have to be in a dark room with no noise and can barely lift my head off the pillow.

I do not believe you got a two day migraine from someone that wasn't even standing right next to you.

You probably need to see a doctor and he will give you a VERY LONG LIST of all the things that trigger headaches.

Smoke? LOL. I think it is all in your mind.

STOP TREATING US SMOKERS AS IF WE ARE CRIMINALS!

[Dreamer Tatum]

219. A Smoker Has Spoken. Case Closed.

:eyes:

[graywarrior]

222. You do not know the degree of migraine I suffer from.

You are making a generalization. I don't have to confess to YOU or anyone else how severe or mild my symptoms are. FACT: Smoke gives me headaches that shuts me down for a day or two.

And as long as you bring up CRIMINALS, I may as well say I consider second hand smoke assault and battery.

Bet that causes a few heads to explode.

[Tx4obama]

225. Considering that you posted your OP about 24 hrs ago

and have made multiple comments on this thread you must not have 'shut down'.

If you truly think that second hand smoke is equivalent to assault and battery then that is NUTS.

It's people like YOU that are the reason American's rights to use a LEGAL product are being taken away.

I hope the government takes away the right of something you enjoy one of these days!

[graywarrior]

226. Keeping track of me just like a good stalker would do.

It's people like YOU who assault people like me who can't tolerate people who smoke in my presence.


SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A HEALTH HAZARD. GET USED TO IT!

[Tx4obama]

227. LOL.

I have never assaulted anyone in my life and I am NOT stalking you.

The date and time is listed on each OP and each comment on each thread - it's public knowledge.

And I think you have spoken the some truth finally when you said up above: "....people like me who can't tolerate people who smoke in my presence" -- it appears this all has to do with your LACK of tolerance for PEOPLE/smokers.

Ciao!

[graywarrior]

228. .

[ecstatic]

231. Whenever I start to get a headache, I take a caffeine pill

or anything with caffeine. I hate to do it, but it works.

[amborin]

236. 2nd hand smoke is very bad for your health! I hate it!

a new neighbor several houses to our right smokes at night on their back patio

we have no a/c and always leave our windows open at night, in summer and even in fall and spring

well the smoke wafts over and I wake up smelling it!

Horrible! It gives me a headache and also revs me up so I can't get back to sleep.

[graywarrior]

237. Exactly what I'm talking about.

It's invasive.

[Naturyl]

254. Great post

It added a lot to my enjoyment of a satisfying Doral.

[LooseWilly]

256. Erhhhmmmm...

Haha