Lovely Health care is going to remain unchanged because of abortion

[Egnever]

Yay for idiotic wedge isues used over and over and over to ensure no meaningfull legislation is passed. Cant wait for the amendment in the senate that bans gays from marriage that should finish this silly health care debate once and for all.

[dflprincess]

1. Perhaps if they have to start over they will come up with meaningful

legislation, rather than expecting most of us to remain captives of the insurance companies.

[FiveGoodMen]

5. +1

[Egnever]

10. When do you think they will start over?

This has consumed the greater part of this first year of Obamas presidency. There are many other issues waiting to be addressed the budget, wall street regulation, Gay rights, climate change, energy policy....the list goes on. Will you be screaming how none of that is being addressed cause we returned to health care. Or will the reality be that congress decides they cant get it done considering they cant even get this bill passed and move on to the other things on their agenda.

You pretend like these bill just appeared and went up for a vote. These bills are the result of people fighting over what was acceptable till they got something that had a chance of passing. If you think what is going to be acceptable the next time around is going to be a vast improvement the next go around I don't think you have a realistic grasp of the legislative process.

[dflprincess]

18. They can't mutli task?

And coming up with something that is "acceptable" (to whom - they contributors?) doesn't mean that they came up with something good.

I wouldn't have been happy with this bill, but I wouldn't have been as disgusted if they'd kept the amendment that allowed the states to work on their own programs but when that was removed they also took out the last glimmer of hope for true reform to begin somewhere in the country.

All this bill does is reeforce the status quo and we remain stuck with the same lousy system we were told would be reformed.

[Egnever]

25. Well I dont know can they?

Are they multitasking now?

And contrary to you i think this is a very good bill on many fronts. I think the personaly think the stupac amendment is entirely unesecary but I wasnt on the floor counting the votes so I dont know for sure.

[prolesunited]

19. And more likely

Dems will lose the majority in 2010 for their inaction and health care reform will be put on the back burner for 13 years. That's what happened after Clinton's attempt failed and look where that got us.

[dflprincess]

22. A crappy bill puts them at risk as well

as does the faux credit card reform they passed, the continuation of the policy of endless war and the refusal to prosecute war criminals (to name a few thngs). They can't win without independents and the left and they're in danger of losing both.

Calling a bill "reform" doesn't make it so.

[lumberjack_jeff]

28. Wait, that's a quote from Eugene Debs, isn't it?

We've been pushing for a do-over for 100 years.

This bill is as good at it will EVER get.

[napi21]

2. You're being too pessimistic! I have no idea what the language is going

to be, but I do believe there will be an acceptable bill come out of Committee & think the President will have a passed bill to sign by the end of the year.

[Deja Q]

3. Now it makes more sense as to why change has to take place slowly...

[Cleita]

4. So who introduced the wedge issue and could bring up the gay marriage issue?

The usual culprits, the God wing of the Republican Party. We need to send the IRS after all the churches now and inform them, that the next time they violate the Constitutional provision for the separation of church and state by meddling in politics, that they lose their tax free status.

[PeaceNikki]

8. And the "trojan donkeys" the DFLA.

[Egnever]

11. I agree with that whole heartedly.

Its long past time to stop religion from meddling in our politics.

[dflprincess]

20. There reports on DU last night that Pelosi consulted with

Catholic Bishops on the abortion amendment. If that is true, we can't fault only the Republicans for forcing their religion on the rest of us.

[Cleita]

27. Do you know any Catholic Bishops?

They most definitely are as right wing fascist as you can get. The Church hierarchy is modeled on the Roman Empire type of government without the Legions and is not a democratic institution by any means. Even though they might claim they vote as Democrats individually, they don't follow the principles of democracy except maybe for social programs like feeding and clothing the poor, never mind that they also insist women have as many children as "god gives them".

Also FYI, Catholicism never had much interest in how women controlled their reproduction until the middle of the nineteenth century when the Pope condemned all forms of birth control including abortion. This is where the problems began.

[Motown_Johnny]

6. I doubt it will come to that..

since the pre existing condition clause will keep anyone from being turned down for a policy.. and you can purchase "riders" to cover abortions, the impact on women who choose to have one should be minimal.


Our challenge is to make the impact even smaller. To help Planned Parenthood (or some other entity) create an insurance co-op which will make the coverage as inexpensive as possible.

[Egnever]

15. My hope is you are right

[cali]

7. Your post is deeply and disgustingly sick and clueless.

And your utter contempt for women coudn't be clearer.

[Egnever]

12. yawn

Your total outrage is duley noted.

[PeaceNikki]

9. It's not going to kill the bill and it's not an "idiotic wedge issue".

[Egnever]

13. Really?

Arent you calling for the bill not to be passed if its left in? Arent others calling for it not to be passed if its taken out? Who do you think is going to win that fight? My bet is the Nays.

WTF is it if it isnt a wedge issue?

[PeaceNikki]

14. Where have I called for it not to be passed?

Ever... anywhere?

G'head... show me where.


It may be "wedge", but you foolishly and ignorantly and offensively added "idiotic".

[Egnever]

16. The fact that we continue to be played by it

is idiotic

[PeaceNikki]

17. Yes, those fuckers in the DFLA who threatened to torpedo it ought to be hung out to dry.

No shit.

It doesn't make the issue "idiotic". It makes THEM idiotic.

[Egnever]

23. Oh so only the other side is idiotic

Got it.

[PeaceNikki]

26. Do you know who the DFLA even is?

[dflprincess]

21. It becomes more than a "wedge issue" if the approval of the Bishops' Conference

was sought before it was brought to the floor. I don't really want the Catholic Church writing legislation in this country. If I wanted to listen to the Bishops, I wouldn't have lapsed.

[Egnever]

24. Cant argue with that.