Dennis Kucinich is a real Progressive Democrat...not an Obama/DLC Democrat..

[Postman]

He said on Democracy Now this morning that it was the Obama Administration that stripped his amendment from the Healthcare Bill amending ERISA, which would have allowed states to create single-payer systems...

Kucinich acts in the interest of the people. The corporate democrats, republlicans and the Obama Adminstration act in the interest of the insurance companies....

http://www.democracynow.org/

[SammyWinstonJack]

1. K&R!

[ixion]

2. second that

:woohoo:

[SammyWinstonJack]

3. .

:hi:

[kctim]

4. And yet

Obama got enough votes to become President, while Kucinich couldn't even get enough votes to run for President.

[reggie the dog]

38. sadly because Obama is tall and cute compared to Kucinich

[azmouse]

49. Jealousy doesn't look good on you.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

70. Because most Dems tend to support status quo/DLC/corporate candidates unfortunately n/t

[kctim]

74. And that support means they accept that candidates 'agenda'

and reject the 'agenda' of the other.
Nothing against DK, but the majority of Americans do not see things as he does.

[clear eye]

76. Not likely.

More likely the idea that Kucinich "can't win" is beaten into their brains by the corporate media, making Dems afraid to vote for him in a primary. The public specifically does agree w/ Kucinich on single payer according to a number of polls asking about "Medicare for All".

Dems also know that if he were the Democratic Presidential candidate, the MSM would have their own campaign of taking phrases he says out of context in order to make him look bad, and try to outdo each other in how many times they called him some variation of crazy. Dems are not afraid of Kucinich; they are afraid of corporate press dirty tricks.

[tritsofme]

5. I would rather be an Obama Democrat than an utterly irrelevant UFO Democrat

any day of the week.

His opinion is no more useful than the Republicans he joined in the opposition.

[walldude]

11. Joined the opposition?

Did I miss something? He voted against a bad bill. As far as I know thousands of Dems called their reps demanding single payer or at the very least a strong public option. There wasn't one so DK voted the way his constituents demanded. Now he's the opposition? Looks to me like he's the only one fighting for what we asked for. While many are willing to settle he stood by his principles and voted for what the people demanded. When did that become a bad thing? Are you telling me it's better to be a spineless sap who compromises their position before they even get to the debate than a person who stands for what they believe in?

[Egnever]

14. Why is it a bad bill?

Cause Deniss said so?

[walldude]

47. It's a bad bill because by the time the senate is done with it

it will benefit insurance companies more than citizens. It's a bad bill because Democrats compromised their original position before they even drafted up the bill. THey took what everyone wanted off the table.

How to get what you want in a bill:

You put in everything you want and MORE to start with, then you compromise and come to a consensus somewhere in the middle. You don't pull single payer and a "robust" public option before you even start drafting the fucking bill. You don't compromise your position till you HAVE to.

[Egnever]

60. Ahh its a bad bill because you say the senate will ruin it.

So its not a bad bill now.

[Sebastian Doyle]

71. No, the house bill is shit. The senate bill is also shit.

If you add shit to shit, what will be the result?

It ain't a fucking hot fudge sundae.

[QC]

15. But yer eether win us er agin us!

Hmmm, where have we heard that one before?

[tritsofme]

18. Be my guest and stand with minority Republicans

I tend to think that President Obama provides a better path.

[QC]

20. Just like Obama stands firmly with Dick Cheney when it comes to Afghanistan, eh?

Surely you are not so stupid as to really believe this juvenile bullshit you are posting all over the place.

[Forkboy]

26. I wouldn't be so sure of that.

[QC]

32. Just trying to be charitable. n/t

[walldude]

48. LMAO.. standing up for single payer is standing with Republicans?

Minority Republicans? :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[rudy23]

12. Oh, is that one now on the list? nt

[timtom]

77. It's the old "UFO/woo woo" meme.

So to the point....not.

Really, the whole discussion isn't really about Obama or Kucinich.
It's about Obama's handlers. Obama's just a pretty face to a corporate consortium.

Kucinich seems to be doing this on his own. With an aggressive strategy to marginalize him by the msm.

[reggie the dog]

22. so you work with the bribed corporations to continue

running the world for, by and of the welathy elite and I will support people who want to run the world for the good of the common people.

[Forkboy]

24. You should replace the S in your nic with an E.

[NeedleCast]

6. Kucinich acts in the interest of purity

With Kucnich at the helm, nothing would ever get done.

[reggie the dog]

40. nothing is better than forcing poor people to buy private insurance

[prolesunited]

7. Did he change his position on abortion?

[Bolo Boffin]

17. I don't know about that, but he voted against the Stupak amendment.

So perhaps that answers your question or not.

[reggie the dog]

34. He has been pro choice since 2002

before he ever ran in the presedential primaries.

[Fire1]

8. I never liked the idea of states creating their single-payer

systems. In fact, it was a bad idea, imo. Not to say that I dislike Kucinich but I guess I'm not that progressive.

[harun]

16. It is a bad idea in and of itself, but the reason you let states do it is to get it

nationally. Which is what happened in Canada. One province did it, they saw the gates of hell didn't open, no demons came running out, and the rest adopted it.

[Fire1]

19. Ideologically, that may have worked but this "ain't" Canada.

Not by a long shot.

[Individualist]

9. K&R

"The Democratic Leadership Council's agenda is indistinguishable from the Republican Neoconservative agenda," - Dennis Kucinich

[HamdenRice]

10. Kucinich is a delusional (UFO, Ron Paul) serial issuer of press releases and little more

[rudy23]

13. I'm onto you guys. nt

[reggie the dog]

29. If he is delusional why is he so loved for having stood up to

keep the electric company in cleveland public? He lost an election just after he lost the city money in the short term but in the long term the people saw they had lower electric prices and he is loved for that. If he were delusional how would he keep being reelected? Where the hell has the Democratic party fallen to if liberals are called delusional?

[HamdenRice]

52. Keeps getting elected? Not in state primaries.

He's polls around 4%.

[timtom]

78. He's woo woo, isn't he?

So, you like our troop commitments in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan?
You wouldn't want single-payer universal health CARE (not insurance)?
You like the Patriot Acts? Military Commissions Act?

That's okay. You're in sync with much of America. Not terribly original, but definitely in sync.

[berni_mccoy]

21. Dennis Lieberman is siding with Repubs on important issues.

[rudy23]

27. It's Obama who's siding with Repubs, then equating progressives with teabaggers.

Which is worse? At least Dennis is acting FOR his friends on the left, and not using "my friends on the left" in a manner that equates them with the town hall protesters on the right.

[RaleighNCDUer]

31. So two people voting against a bad bill for opposite reasons makes

them exactly alike.

Uh huh.

[NorthCarolina]

23. It is becoming increasingly clear that Democratic Undeground dot Com

has been infiltrated by the opposition to the point that it is no longer even close to "Democratic" in the responses. Oh, and to those infiltrators that continue to inject the "What about Kucinich's Pro Life Past", you might want to rethink continually repeating that meme as it serves only to blow your "cover".

[azmouse]

41. It was infiltrated by anti-Obama people even more so.

And still nothing is done about that.

So maybe we could say that NO Democrat should be above criticism... even stDennis.

[alarimer]

66. Bullshit.

You equate ANY criticism of Obama as being anti-Obama.

Well based on his performance so far, I AM against him: for sucking up to corporations, for not acting on his many promises (most of which he appears to actually be breaking), for continuing the Bush secrecy policies (which render him no better than Bush and maybe worse since we all expected better).

No I am a true progressive and want progressives in office, even if it means suffering some losses in the meantime. At this point, I will not vote in the next election. I certainly will not be voting for Obama if he continues on this path.

And this "Health Insurance" bill is nothing but a giveaway to corporations and will set back real reform for years, perhaps forever. A true single-payer system is the only thing that will work. This bill as currently constructed will almost certainly make things worse.

[NorthCarolina]

73. I hope that you WILL get out and vote

for true Progressives in the primaries. The blame for a POS health care bill that is little more than a sellout to the insurance companies is because of conservative blue dogs and DLC in the Democratic Party. We need them voted out and replaced with Progressives at every opportunity in order to restore the Democratic Party to it's roots as the only advocate for the people.

[alarimer]

62. It is becoming as lockstep as any Republican site.

Same Bush bullshit whenever Obama is criticized (which he richly deserves as a milquetoast, centrist corporate shill and serial promise-breaker): "You're either with us or against". Well color me against, then, if you must.

[OnceUponTimeOnTheNet]

25. Light bulb moment here, Thank You! rec.

[quiller4]

28. I am grateful the Kucinich Amendment was stripped. I don't care who I have to thank for that.

[reggie the dog]

42. Oh no! How could you let individual states

actually have health care like there is in France or Denmark or Finland......

[HughMoran]

30. .

.

[ProleNoMore]

33. Proof Positive That The Obama Administration Is Against Progressive HCR

eom

[prolesunited]

54. He NEVER campaigned as a progressive

and didn't advocate single payer in the first place. If you think he broke any promises, you're wrong. He's doing exactly what he said he would do.

[nachosgrande]

56. Bingo!

I'm not sure what people expected of Obama. He ran slightly left of center and his main selling points were that he would bring transparency to government and that he would work like mad to bring Americans (and Democrats & Repubs) together to work on those issues that unite us. He was the "coalition builder." I've never held out hope for a progressive agenda for Obama.

[Postman]

61. His "transparency" agenda is like trying to see through a brick wall.

Where was the transparency in cutting secret deals with insurance companies?

[stray cat]

35. If we had more like him we would have even less accomplished

but lots of talk

[Name removed]

36. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProleNoMore]

39. So We Have To Pledge A Oath of Fealty To Obama - Is That What You Are Implying?

eom

[geek tragedy]

44. No, just realize that the 1% does not get to dictate to the 99%

who is and who is not a 'real Democrat.'

You are a tiny fraction of the party.

[ProleNoMore]

45. And By Your Standards I Have No Voice - Is That Creeping Censorship I Detect?

eom

[geek tragedy]

46. You have a voice.

But, if you want to attack the 99% who does not share your extreme views, good luck.

[ProleNoMore]

50. I Believe That I Am The One Being Attacked - Tyranny Of The Majority

eom

[azmouse]

43. +1

[Zomby Woof]

37. So is Jim McDermott and dozens of others

Purity litmus tests based on this bill, and calls for party purges aside. McDermott (WA-7) has been advocating single payer for years and years. He did not suddenly sell his soul over his vote for this bill.

Way too much polarized b&w knee-jerking around here (as usual). Those who voted for the bill are not automatically DLC centrist corporate insurance company whores, nor are all who voted against it teabagging/blue dog/voices of the people.

[cali]

51. Kucinich is pretty much irrelevant. He has even less power and influence

than your average dem.

[TheKentuckian]

53. Dennis is overrated by both supporters and detractors

He's a politician that cultivates a certain type of follower is all. I don't get being up in arms about the guy either way. He spotlights important issues and gets them into the mainstream conversation sometimes, there is his beginning and end as far as actual purpose.

[NoPasaran]

55. Dennis Kucinich is a utopian crackpot

And his groupies are whiny children with zero understanding of politics.

[earth mom]

57. So Saint Obama stripped Kucinich's amendment from the bill, eh?

Why am I NOT surprised? :argh:

[Cha]

58. Gawd damn right he's a Saint.

[Lord Helmet]

59. If truth be told, DK has cast some shit votes over his career.

He was anti-choice for a while. He voted against the stimulus and now against healthcare ins. reform. If he is so disenchanted, why does he remain a democrat? I voted for DK in the primary but I'm not digging his actions now. Republicans get shit done because they know how to herd cats. Most of what I read here is divisive bullshit.

[dionysus]

64. his career is one big ego trip. speak truth to power and accomplish nothing.

at least it gets ya fans on political message boards.

[watercolors]

63. Maybe DK fans and followers should start thier own party!

So tired and bored with the man!

[SIMPLYB1980]

65. No doubt.

They could call it the Ineffective party.

[freddie mertz]

67. I like Dennis. But it is time to let this rest.

The president has come out in opposition to Stupak.

That is the real news of the day.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

68. LMAO. Nothing Real About Him. He Tells You What You Want To Hear And Gets NOTHING Done.

[LWolf]

69. Which is exactly why

he comes under fire from Obama/DLC Democrats.

Evidence that he's doing something right.

It was a good interview.

One small <snip>

AMY GOODMAN: Do you think it’s better than what we have now?

REP. DENNIS KUCINICH: No. Actually, it’s not, because it locks us into a for-profit system that the government subsidizes. It’s not going to save money in the long run. It’s not going to provide the kind of broad healthcare services the American people need. It’s going to limit the choices that people have over a longer period of time. And people will have to buy private insurance. I mean, what’s going on in this country? We’re told that the only choice we have is to buy private insurance, and with the robust public option being gone, it makes sure that there’s little competition with the insurance companies. This bill doesn’t effectively moderate what they can charge for premiums or co-pays or deductibles. It just says people have to have insurance. Well, insurance doesn’t necessarily equate to care, and care comes at a cost.

Link to the transcript:

http://www.democracynow.org/2009/11/9/house_passes_healthcare_bill_with_amendment

[Octafish]

72. Kucinich has always worked in the interest of We the People.

Others in government serve the interests of Money -- the corporations and those who own and control them.

[NYC_SKP]

75. I was hoping that Monday would be the last day of these FUCKING KUCINICH THREADS!!!

But I guess I was wrong.

Both men are good for America.

The framing of your subject line is naive.

"Obama/DLC Democrat"?

Yeah, right...

:donut: