Why do people keep posting that the PO would only be available to 2%

[Egnever]

When the truth is that the PO would be available to anyone eligible for the exchange. Admittedly the Exchange takes time to ramp up and is open to only individuals and employers with under 25 employees initially but that is scheduled to expand yearly with the second year including employers with 50 and the third employers with up to 100 with the goal of making it available to all employers going forward.

The 2% number was the CBO estimate of how many would chose the public option not how many it would be available to.

According to the statistics from the last census http://www.census.gov/econ/susb/ employers with less than 100 employees made up almost half of all employment in the US. So by year three of the exchange being open nearly half of those employed in the US would have the exchange/public option as an option.

No obviously not every employer is going to opt into the exchange so the number that would actually have the option by year three would likely be considerably less however that would not be because you were prevented from having it as an option by any design of the bill but because your employer chose not to opt in.

Stating that only 2% would be eligible is being extremely dishonest and is an attempt to minimize the actual impact of the house bill in my opinion.

Flame away.

[sudopod]

1. A combination of trendy cynicism and selection bias?

A case of hypogooglism?

[redqueen]

2. God knows... it's not like this hasn't been pointed out repeatedly.

The uninsured, the self-employed, and those who are temporarily uninsured would all be eligible in the first year.

It's depressing how many DUers will spread misinformation... downright infuriating when it's the RW kind.

[Ozymanithrax]

3. Because they didn't bother to check the facts and are looking for a ...

justification to oppose it.

[Egnever]

26. I am starting to think thats the real reason

[napi21]

4. I think it started with the CBO projection that initially only

those who have NO INS. would be able to buy into the PO. People heard that and deduced that it would only be 2% of the population.

[emulatorloo]

5. Thanks for posting. n/t

[Peacetrain]

6. Because they do not want to know the truth.. they have their own version and are quite content with

it.

[NYC_SKP]

7. I am employed, no insurance plan, earn over 50K. I understand that I may choose the public option.

If I understand this graphic correctly, I and others like me can choose private plans OR the unsubsidized public option.

I don't know how they arrive at the numbers who would choose the unsubsidized P.O., however.

[Egnever]

8. Nice chart!

needs to be shrunk down a little for formating on this board though. Thnx for posting it.

[sandnsea]

9. The public option would have to be eligible for subsidies

There is no possible way for it to work if it doesn't get the same subsidies as private insurance. I'm almost positive it does.

The part that is being fought is tax money beyond the premiums and subsidies. It can't have an endless funnel of tax money like Medicare and Medicaid.

[tekisui]

11. Great chart! That is very helpful.

[Scarsdale Vibe]

12. Chart should be 400% of fpl, not 300%. It's changed over the legislative process.

Also Medicaid expansion was changed to 150% of fpl, not 133%. Basically, the current bills are more generous than the chart shows.

[NYC_SKP]

19. Chart with Links are available at pinto's thread, please kick and rec it. Link:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6963675

Not many replies to it, sadly.

It's a great post...great chart.

:P

[Parker CA]

21. This is a great chart and should be its own OP. nt.

[NYC_SKP]

25. Hey, Parker CA. It's from an OP by DU moderator pinto. Please go kick his OP.

There are also good links and some discussion.

The graph was created in August, some of the figures have changed but links to the source include good discussion.

:hi:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6963675

[Aramchek]

10. Because some don't mind lying to push their agenda, sad but true

[robinlynne]

13. I believe you need to be off of any insurance for 6 months before you can apply

for the "option'. That removes all presently insured people. very convenient for the insurance companies. not convenient for americans. I have a small business. Am I willing to risk being off insurance all together to try to get into the option? scary. I looked that up specifically because I would jump into single-payer immediately. I pay 30% of my income into health insurance right now. I am over 50. healthy, but I know hat can happen. I was hit by a car once. seven years of surgeries, and no walking. 2 years off from work. So I would only be willing to give up that insurance when i really couldn't afford it any longer. (My family is actually giivng me the money, to be honest.) had I not had health insurance on the day I was hit, my entire family would be bankrupted.

[Cleita]

16. That sounds like a loophole that could work to extend it to more people

in the long run. Maybe COBRA coverage would plug the six month gap. I'm not passing any judgements until I see the actual plan with Obama's signature.

[robinlynne]

22. how so? I can't get cobra. I am self employed. I dont have payroll employees

who could get cobra either. we are all private contractors. the essence of small business.

[Egnever]

27. Then you should be able to opt into the private Exchange

As a business with less than 20 employees.

[robinlynne]

28. NO you cant. Unless you are completely uninsured for at least 6 months.

see the problem? Noone will be able to leave private insurance and move to public option. I'm sure I know who put that clause into the bill.It isn't really a public option, as in not available to the public. In addition, the price will be based on "the market price", instead of based on the medicare price. The market price here is twice that in the rest of the world, so it is really not going to change anything, with the exception of the very poor whose insurance with the private sector will be paid for by the public.

free clinics would have done more for much less money, I think. I think there should be a govt run free clinic placed next to every emergency room to care for all the people whoa re not emergencies but go to the emergency room. That would save billions of dollars which could be used to run the free clinics.....

[Egnever]

30. So how does any employer ever get into the Exchange

Your claim is rediculous. The 6 months rule is for individuals not employers.

And the bill provides for more funding for just the clinics you wish for. You really should read the bill instead of buying all the BS being shoveled at you.

[robinlynne]

32. I am an individual and an employer. that is why I read that portion of the bill.

I am just above poverty level, and not eligible for the public option. or the exchanges. they are NOT open to the public. If you have NO insurance and are at poverty level or below, and/or work for a msall business, and HAVE NO current insurance, you are eligible.

[Egnever]

34. well you are either an employer or you arent.

from the summary notice the term acceptable
http://edlabor.house.gov/documents/111/pdf/publications/AHCAA-SECBYSEC-102909.pdf

In year one, individuals not enrolled in other
acceptable coverage as well as small employers with 25 or fewer employees are allowed into the Exchange.

and from the actual bill again notice the term acceptable coverage.

ACCESS TO COVERAGE.—In accordance with this
12 section, all individuals are eligible to obtain coverage
13 through enrollment in an Exchange-participating health
14 benefits plan offered through the Health Insurance Ex15
change unless such individuals are enrolled in another
16 qualified health benefits plan or other acceptable coverage

And there is open enrolement every year where you would be able to dump your old coverage.

ENROLLMENT PERIODS.—
8 (A) OPEN ENROLLMENT PERIOD.—The
9 Commissioner shall establish an annual open
10 enrollment period during which an Exchange-el11
igible individual or employer may elect to enroll
12 in an Exchange-participating health benefits
13 plan for the following plan year and an enroll14
ment period for affordability credits under sub15
title C. Such periods shall be during September
16 through November of each year, or such other
17 time that would maximize timeliness of income
18 verification for purposes of such subtitle. The
19 open enrollment period shall not be less than 30
20 days.

some things regarding acceptable coverage.

(A) IN GENERAL.—The Commissioner
12 shall establish a grace period whereby, for plan
13 years beginning after the end of the 5-year pe14
riod beginning with Y1, an employment-based
15 health plan in operation as of the day before
16 the first day of Y1 must meet the same require17
ments as apply to a qualified health benefits
18 plan under section 201, including the essential
19 benefit package requirement under section 221.

And last but not least your income would only affect the level of subsidy not your eligability.

[robinlynne]

36. You must be without insurance to enroll!!!! for 6 months. that is what I said.

exactly. you cannot switch from private insurance to public option or to the exchange.

[Egnever]

39. where do you get that from the text? Just cause you keep saying it

Does not make it so. The 6 months is for the interim high risk pool once the exchange opens it is open to individuals and business under open enrolemnt just like any other insurance. You can not drop your employers coverage and join the exchange on your own but your employer (you) can enrol during open enrolement any time they chose. They dont have to kick the whole company off of insurance for 6 months.

You are not readingthe bill correctly.

[robinlynne]

33. An employer never gets into the exchange. unless they cut off all health care

first for a period of time. You cannot switch from private insurance to the exchange or the public option. That would be part of what is called a "robust' public option, which did not happen.

[Egnever]

35. completely false

there is open enrolement each year when your contract with your curent insurer is up.

[robinlynne]

37. You have to be without any insurance for 6 months to apply.

[Egnever]

38. Absolutely untrue

[liberalpragmatist]

29. No - that's for the temporary "high-risk pools"

... that will be available immediately but will be phased out once the exchange is in place.

[bigtree]

14. I think the current bill restricts the PO

. . . to small businesses buying coverage for their workers and people seeking policies in the individual market. That means that the majority of Americans who are offered insurance by their employers aren't allowed to participate. It's hard to see how such a limited plan provides the competition needed to keep prices down. The plan agreed to only requires 'negotiations' with the industry to control costs.

[Egnever]

18. right , but small business makes up almost 50% of all employment in the US

and the bill specifically states that the availability will continue to expand with the goal of making all business eligible going forward.

[robinlynne]

23. only IF you have not had any health insurance for at least 6 months.

not available to people who currently have insurance.

[Fire1]

15. K&R

[redqueen]

17. deleted

hehehe

[tandot]

20. Thanks, Egnever.

[TheKentuckian]

24. Since eventually virtually every company will either have the option of joining the exchange

or will be free to cut loose their coverage for cheap, I have no idea other than arguing that few individuals will be able to directly make the choice themselves. My guess is most people will be in the exchanges within 10-15 years save those employed by large corporations who are really who wants to preserve the employer based system anyway (and whose employess already enjoy decent coverage at an affordable price) will be in this system at which stsge they will be able to choose which plan there in fitts them best.

There is a legitimate individual choice concern but this seems like a system that will eventually put the majority of people into a unified pool.

[Bonobo]

31. Yup. Totally dishonest and without merit.

But it does serve to bolster their own sense of outrage, so it isn't a total waste.