Phony Jail Bait Politics

[babylonsister]

Not just supposed opponents, Mr. Crawford. This was the meme pushed here last night, despite no real facts to back it up.


http://blogs.cqpolitics.com/trailmix/2009/11/phony-jail-bait-politics.html

Phony Jail Bait Politics

By Craig Crawford | November 8, 2009 12:00 AM


Yet another myth is the foolish claim that we go to jail if we don't insure ourselves. Now that the House has passed the Democratic healthcare bill get ready for more baby talk from opponents. Like those arguments that requiring all Americans to get insurance will put them in jail. Sure, there's a tax penalty if you don't get insurance. Refuse to pay the penalty or risk imprisonment. But refusing to pay any tax risks jail, not just this one.

You can't get a driver's license without insurance. No one calls that fascist. C'mon people now, get your health insurance. If you can't afford it, the House bill provides options.

Scaring people into thinking that you go to jail if you don't get insurance is just another example of baby talk from the powers that be.

[izquierdista]

1. I'd agree with you, but........

The U.S. has more of its citizens in jail than any other country. Privatized prisons have the corporations salivating (if they have natural person rights, I'm sure they can salivate too) at the prospect of more "customers" using their "service". Is it any stretch to imagine that they would abuse "failure to buy health insurance" as they do other bullshit charges?

[babylonsister]

3. Seems federal financial help will be provided for those who

cannot afford it. I really don't see the gov't throwing people in jail if they are broke and can't afford this.

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/politics/story/78519.html

10 ways the House bill would change health care

By David Lightman | McClatchy Newspapers


WASHINGTON — These are some of the changes in the way health insurance would work in the United States if the House bill were to become law:

1. Creates a government-run plan, or "public option," to offer insurance coverage to compete with private sector insurance companies.

2. Sets up health insurance "exchanges," or marketplaces, where consumers can easily compare coverage and rates.

3. Requires nearly everyone to obtain health insurance coverage starting in 2013.

4. Requires health plans to allow young adults to remain on their parents' policies till their 27th birthday

5. Provides federal financial help for lower and middle income consumers so they can obtain coverage.

6. Bars insurers from denying or limiting coverage because of pre-existing conditions.

7. Bars insurers from imposing lifetime limits on coverage.

8. Expands Medicaid coverage to more people.

9. Imposes a 5.4 percent surcharge on adjusted gross incomes of more than $500,000 for individuals and $1 million for joint filers.

10. Imposes penalties on people and businesses who fail to comply with the new law.

[Uben]

2. On the bright side.....

...if you do go to jail, you get free health care!

[Lyric]

4. What the hell difference does it make?!

Whether the progression is

No insurance -----> Prison

or

No insurance -----> Tax penalty you can't afford to pay -----> Prison

What EXACTLY is the damned difference, other than semantics and dishonesty?

I'm sorry, but pretending that there's some ENORMOUS difference when the originating factor and the end result are EXACTLY THE SAME is just bullshit. If we're going to talk about it, then let's at least be honest about it.

[SammyWinstonJack]

5. +1 nt

[babylonsister]

6. See post #3. Or ignore it. Seems you'd rather be angry. nt

[Lyric]

9. Okay. I saw post #3. Now if you please,

see this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6959139

Then tell me that I just "want to be angry."

I'm not angry. I'm terrified.

[babylonsister]

12. Lyric, I can see why you're terrified.

I wish I had the answers but I don't even know if Congress has addressed your situation, or that of millions of others, gay or straight. If I read anything about unmarried couples with kids, I'll post it.

And thank you for your graciousness in your post.

[glinda]

8. there is no free lunch in any Country with Health Insurance

[bigtree]

7. there's a tax penalty

So, there IS a penalty. Why all the contortions here to make it look like we won't be penalized? Even with government help, I still can't afford to put much aside for health insurance. It appears his bill is ADDING to my expenses. If I can afford coverage (which I'm sure someone will claim I can), it looks like the language of the bill says the government will find a way (through my taxes, the most serious offense if I can't afford those) to penalize me.That seems wrong.

[ProSense]

10. This is a BS straw man. No one goes to jail.

People are fighting the bill because it only covers 96 percent of the population while pushing this BS jail claim. How many people are deciding to remain uninsured by choice? Everyone who has insurance wants it and want the cost brought down. Those who don't have want it at an affordable rate. There is no group fighting reform because they don't want coverage.

[bigtree]

11. you can't pay your higher taxes, you get penalized

Don't talk around that. Address it. Why do some folks here assume we can reasonably bear those costs without running afoul of the federal government (IRS)?

[TheWebHead]

13. search through HR3962 for "Internal Revenue"

there are plenty of IRS references in the bill. They are the one administering the collection of penalties for those who don't adhere to the mandate. And it's interesting if you look at the temporary high risk pool, there's some interesting limits on age variation (2:1) and maximum deductibles ($1500).. If this is the roadmap of the permanent mandated insurance plan, young people who have so called catastrophic coverage (ie. $3500+ deductibles) will get killed, especially when adding the removal of lifetime caps and pre-existing.

I'm guessing part of the mandate will have something like this because to balance things out, you can't have the old people buying Cadillac plans while the young purchase very low cost catastrophic plans that are available now. You need a relatively consistent set of plans to properly balance risk and avoid people purchasing the cheapest care only to upgrade it after diagnosis of a disease. That's why I'm a little suspicious of the idea of being able to keep the plan you have if you like it.

[babylonsister]

14. PolitiFact weighs in: barely true

http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2009/sep/29/patients-first/conservative-group-says-youll-be-imprisoned-not-ha/

"Health care mandate will require imprisonment and fines for Americans who can’t afford to purchase insurance or pay hefty government penalties."

Conservative group says you'll be imprisoned for not having health insurance