And Kucinich sucks compared to whom??? All those "White hats" that are representing us so well?

[Go2Peace]

Come on fellow DU'rs. Let's get a little real here.

We have a majority who have the capability to pass serious reform. Now, of course, it is not that simple. Personally, I am inclined to support this bill. But come on? We have a majority party and this is not what THE PEOPLE want.

Should we really be so doggone "appreciative"? Or should we be mad as hell that they compromised the will of the people to such a degree that we are fighting over scraps???

Don't get me wrong. I support democrats all over the alternative. But I want better, MUCH better, from them.

And Kucinich? I am terribly glad he is there. He plays an important role. He is certainly not a "bad guy"

[saltpoint]

1. His vote tonight was all ego.

Bad Dennis.

[earth mom]

3. Bullshit. Dennis did right by the people. You will realize that one day-the hard way-when

the insurance industry screws you over-which WILL happen, mark my words.

[ecstatic]

5. He voted with his buddy Ron Paul... not surprised nt

[Go2Peace]

17. You don't have a case for the loathing you place. The worst you can accuse him of is standing for

principle.

Amazing how the fact that the majority party totally watered down reform and acted as much to satisfy corporate power as the people. Now that doesn't get your ire at all. Just these people who actually want to fight for what the people actually want and deserve?

[ecstatic]

21. If K was principled, he wouldn't have wanted Ron Paul

as a running mate. That alone should let you know that Kucinich is unhinged. Ron Paul is REPUBLICAN who is against all government involvement in healthcare.

[Go2Peace]

36. Your repeated attempts to misrepresent Kucinich are failing

why can't you be more intellectually honest and just state you don't agree with his position. But comparing his positions to the freeper point of view is just plain a lie and discredits your posts on the subject

[ecstatic]

52. The facts are there to see for anyone willing to take off their blinders

There was a time (back in 2003) when Kucinich was my first choice for President.

[saltpoint]

6. I call DK on his vote. I see no one anywhere making an argument in

favor of insurance companies.

[flvegan]

4. You wouldn't know ego if it bit you in the ass.

It's the opposite, actually. He voted for us, even though he knew he'd catch shit for it.

[saltpoint]

7. If it bit me in the ass, flvegan, I'd make a point to inquire as to motive.

Turns out, I'm spoken for, but it would be kind of flattering just the same.

[flvegan]

9. No you wouldn't.

Because you'd have no idea what did indeed bite you in the ass.

Hence my post. You don't know shit about ego apparently, but feel free to spew.

[saltpoint]

11. Well gosh, you sure do seem steamed over it.

[flvegan]

15. I'm not steamed

but rather disappointed in someone that doesn't really get what ego is, but throws the term around to bash a good Dem.

[saltpoint]

18. I'm calling DK for not being a good Dem.

That's the hinge.

Have defended him numerous times on DU with vigor. Tonight I'd like to short-sheet his bed.

[flvegan]

23. "a good Dem"? What is that exactly?

Not marching in lockstep with the spineless and paid-for? Sorry, but that to me, IS a good Dem. It's the fucking definition of a good Dem.

[L0oniX]

47. DLC ass kissers?

[Go2Peace]

26. And you think the other dems that completely compromised and watered reform "real dems"?

[DemBones DemBones]

43. For standing on principle? Every Dem should follow the bad Dems?

Is that the American ideal?

(But I give you kudos for the nonviolent idea of short-sheeting his bed.)

[backwoodsbob]

45. so blank sheet approval of anything dems propose is dem?

count me out

[Individualist]

46. Damn the DLC

[sabrina 1]

12. Kucinich voted the right way, as he always does.

Even some of those who did vote for it did so reluctantly and only because they are hoping it will be improved in the Senate. I doubt it and they will be disappointed. The Democratic Party put Private Insurance before their constituents.

They better pay attention to polls that are coming out showing that the Dems who lost last week lost mainly because the base stayed home when candidates said they would not vote for the PO.

In NY Dist 23, the Dem who won an almost impossible race, although he is fairly Conservative, said he was for a PO.

Dennis will be proven right, as he has been on almost every vote he cast over the past eight years.

Just as Dorgan has been proven right regarding his vote, with only seven other Dems, against the repeal of the Glass Steagal Act.

[saltpoint]

13. His ego voted against the bill tonight.

[Go2Peace]

14. No, he took a stand and we still don't know all the details. You are jumping to conclusions

If this were actually not such a compromised legislation and if Kucinich were not so obviosly well intentioned you might be able to make that case. But you are flat out incorrect friend.

[saltpoint]

22. Oh, I've been wrong before. But I think I have this one right. Kucinich

knew well in advance of this evening's vote that he would oppose the measure.

He claims principled grounds for his opposition.

I assert it was ego.

[sabrina 1]

32. I don't care what part of him voted, I'm glad someone

voted against handing over billions more dollars to a corrupt industry and tried to fight for the people who elected him.

And please, show me a politician who doesn't have an ego. That's a pretty lame thing to say especially when speaking about elected officials.

What I am worried about now, are the people I know who will be forced to pay for something they cannot afford and who may end up in jail simply because they are poor.

Did you support the party when 12 Senators voted with Republicans against Habeas Corpus? Or when they voted to stop the people from exercising their right to sue the telecoms for spying on them? Did you support those who voted for Bush's nominees? Or his wars, that killed over million human beings?

Did you say that those Democrats voted with their 'egos' also? They voted with Republicans, always just enough of them to get Bush's agenda passed. Always with the excuse that they were in the minority, although that never made sense to me. I stuck with them, hoping that they would get some spine if they got a majority, but so far, all I hear again, are the same old excuses. 'We couldn't pass Single Payer without Republicans!' And yet, they passed this without Republicans. I don't like being lied to and enough people feel the same way that they may cause us to have a Republican Majority again after the next election.

Polls showed this week that on the Health Care issue, Obama's numbers are the lowest, 42%. That means that the base is leaving him over this.

[Go2Peace]

40. He provided a need contrast, and didn't threaten the bill like some want to claim

[adamuu]

44. exactly.

all ego
no practical purpose
more evidence that he is an unreliable partner

[sabrina 1]

48. So, you haven't bothered to read his reasons for his vote?

Just a knee-jerk 'he must be wrong because he didn't vote in lock step with his party for the corporations' response from you. Okay ~

[WeDidIt]

50. + 1,000,000,000,000

Nothing but ego and contempt for people who are really suffering.

[John Q. Citizen]

2. Dennis is one of the few Democrats left in the party. Most of the rest are Republicans with Ds

behind their name.

This bill is just another bill.

Rahm said the only criteria is that it pass. That's all it is is a political game.

It's not health care reform, it's political kabuki.

Get some perspective.

[Go2Peace]

8. 2 ...,1.. ,2 .,3....,4. ,3. ,5...,4. 5,4 , 5... LOL, funny to watch that rec unrec thing.

Well, I suppose that is kind of like a debate in a way ;)

[John Q. Citizen]

19. I hadn't recommended yet, i usually forget. But it's up to 18+ So rejoice!

[Go2Peace]

33. Wow, back from the dead! ;)

[Go2Peace]

16. Notice too, the types of attacks and names he is being called. Almost like freeperland.

So the worst thing people can accuse him of is standing on principle and fighting for universal healthcare?

[scheming daemons]

29. You realize, of course, that the freepers actually AGREE WITH DENNIS' VOTE don't you?

They're loving him tonight.

[John Q. Citizen]

31. Kind of like bush loves our sect of State and how Daschle loves the insurance industry?

You know, Obama's campaign co chair Daschle?

I'm glad that freeps have the ability to love. I never go there.

I know they are good at hating.

[Go2Peace]

34. red herring...

[HughMoran]

35. It's a simple "red herring" comment when proven that your agument is full of shit?

:rofl:

[Go2Peace]

38. No, red hering to attempt to slander a solid progressive as a "Republican"

Be intellectually honest will ya. People see through the name calling.

[Go2Peace]

10. Are people even reading before they unrec? I swear there have been 20 recs and 15 unrecs already

[G_j]

20. Dennis sticks to his word, that's why I trust him more than most anyone

if he says it's not a good bill, I believe him. I look to him for a reality check, because he stands by what he says, and walks his talk, and is well informed on health care issues. He is the insurance company's biggest nightmare.

He is usually right, so I'd pay heed to what he is saying, before attacking him.
Think about it folks.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

24. I think this is going to be another instance where the alleged "loony left"

will be proven right (as with Reaganomics, NAFTA, the IWR, financial deregulation, election fraud, etc.)

[G_j]

30. all great examples

I want someone I can believe, not a weather-vane.

[Go2Peace]

41. Kucinich has been immensly helpful in elevating the dialog, imagine what we would have gotten

without him and a few other fighting for universal care.

[BeHereNow]

25. Get serious, when is the last time...

You saw more than 2% of DU posters practice critical thinking?
Not lately.
"Thank you for the shit sandwich" is the latest newspeak.
facts?
Can't be bothered by those.
Sad, aint it?
Stockholm Syndrome perhaps?

BHN

[G_j]

28. so the guy whose been grilling the ins. CEOs, fighting tooth and nail for single payer

gets hateful derision and insults.
.To that, I'll just say a general "fuck you"

it's a shell game, oppose it and your with the Rs, regardless. Even if YOU are the one who has been fighting for the people, with little pity for the insurance companies.
His vote is a fucking red flag. But what the hell...
:shrug:

[WeDidIt]

51. He gets something else from me

a guaranteed donation to ANY primary opponent.

[Waiting For Everyman]

37. +1

[snot]

27. I trust Kucinich more than anyone else in Congress lately, except

I like Grayson a lot lately, too.

[Vidar]

39. K&R

[adamuu]

42. He just tells you what you want to hear

Not reality.

[sabrina 1]

49. I'm going to try again to find out what part of Kucinich's

explanation for his vote the anti-Kucinich crowd disagree with. So, I'm asking you, what in his explanation is it that is 'not reality'? You disagree with his vote, fine. But you say he is not living in 'reality' without explanation. That's not fine.

I've been asking this question since last night, but still have received no answer other than the usual talking points, from anyone who opposes his vote.