House passes for-profit insurance corporation welfare plan

[Triana]

requiring taxpayers (even if unemployed-especially if unemployed) to pay up to thousands of dollars each year to for-profit corprat insurance companies or be FINED via taxes for not doing so. And abortion, birth control or most reproductive health services (except pregnancy even if forced) are not covered? And NO 'public option' (a STRONG public option - one that actually COMPETES with said for-profit insurance corps).

Is there something I'm missing here? And this is GOOD? How?


Pfft!

DO YOU MEAN they WASTED ALL THIS TIME f*cking around in the past 6-8 months FOR THIS?

WHY BOTHER?

This is NOT "health care reform" - this is NOT even "health insurance" reform. It's YET ANOTHER GOVERNMENT-SPONSORED CORPRAT GIVEAWAY hidden behind a pretense of "reform". BULLSHIT.

[ProleNoMore]

1. The DLC Dems Are Proud, Very Proud Tonight!

eom

[Triana]

5. The DLC "Dems" need to be politically decapitated. n/t

[ProleNoMore]

8. Agreed!

eom

[ProSense]

2. These people beg to differ

Barbara Lee Releases Statement On Passage of Health Care for America Act

Washington D.C. – Rep. Barbara Lee (D-CA) released the following statement today after the House of Representatives approved H.R. 3962, the Affordable Health Care for America Act:

“Today’s historic vote is one step forward in our quest to provide health care to all Americans.

“While there is still much work to do, I applaud President Obama, Democratic Leadership and the Chairmen of the Tri-Committees for their efforts to bring us to this point.

“I also want to thank in the Tri-Caucus, Progressives Caucus and particularly the 42 members of the Congressional Black Caucus. Together we have led the fight for a strong public option, which is included in the health care bill that the House approved today.

“When others were pronouncing health reform dying—and the public option dead and buried—we kept on fighting! And we will keep fighting until a final health care bill is on the president’s desk that includes not only a strong public option, but provisions to achieve health equity, eliminate health disparities and to limit the rate of increase for those with private plans.

“We have and will continue to champion issues such as the need for support for patients with end stage renal disease, for children’s mental health, and dental care, workforce pipeline issues, and expansion of community health centers.

“These provisions and others attack the many causes of health disparities, and we fought to get them in. Under the leadership of Congresswoman Donna M. Christensen, we have also championed expansion of the Office of Minority Health because we need a comprehensive way to address minority health across agencies.

“Finally, because we know that 85 percent of Americans are in private insurance, under the leadership of Rep. Donna Edwards, we fought to have included cost containment provisions to keep premiums reasonable. We know that the American people want and deserve affordable health care. We also know that this bill is cost effective for our country, and for American families watching their budgets.

“This was a historic vote, but we must keep up the fight until we have a final bill on the president’s desk. Health care should not just be a privilege for a few; it should and must be a basic human right in the wealthiest and most powerful country in the world.”

CONGRESSMAN GRAYSON PROUDLY SUPPORTS AFFORDABLE HEALTH CARE FOR AMERICA ACT

November 7, 2009 9:18 PM (Washington, DC) – Congressman Alan Grayson voted tonight in favor of the Affordable Health Care for America Act. The bill (H.R. 3962) will deliver life, health, and peace of mind to the tens of millions of people in the United States who do not have health insurance.

Congressman Grayson said, “I promised from the start to vote for any bill that saves money and saves lives. This bill does both. This bill will help save the lives of the nearly 45,000 Americans who die every year because they do not have health insurance,” Congressman Grayson said.

Congressman Grayson never wavered in his support of health care reform. Leading up to the vote, he personally spoke with hundreds of constituents, to listen to their concerns and answer their questions. Since August, he has held three health care town halls, a health care telephone town hall meeting, and dozens of other open meetings; consulted with the members of his Health Care Advisory Board; and considered the overwhelming number of calls and emails from constituents.

Congressman Grayson said, “A lot of people say they love America. To them I say, ‘it’s not enough to love what’s in America. You cannot just love the Appalachian Mountains, the Mohave Desert, or the Gulf Coast. You need to love Americans as well. And loving people means taking care of them, sheltering the homeless, feeding the hungry, and healing the sick.’”

The Affordable Health Care for America Act received broad support from hundreds of important and influential organizations including the AARP, American Medical Association, American Academy of Pediatrics, U.S. Women’s Chamber of Commerce, and Voto Latino.

Conyers: House Health Care Bill Will Save Lives While Fight for Single Payer Continues

WASHINGTON D.C. — Congressman John Conyers, Jr (D-MI) issued the following statement today applauding the passage of H.R. 3962, the Affordable Health Care for America Act.

“Today, I joined my Democratic colleagues in support of the Affordable Healthcare for America Act. While the bill is far from perfect, I supported it because it will expand access to health insurance to 96 percent of Americans, end discrimination based on pre-existing conditions, help our seniors by closing the prescription drug benefit donut hole, and increase competition and choice with a public insurance option.”

In the near term, these reforms will improve and save American lives while we continue to fight for single payer health care at the state and national levels. I will vote for this bill because the cost of inaction is too high. Each year, 44,000 people die because they do not have access to insurance. Without reform, this number will rise, Americans will be at greater risk of losing their coverage, and our business community will continue to fall behind international competitors as their future profits are drained by burdensome health care costs.

Grijalva explained a couple of the highlights he says are in the bill. He told us there's no pre-existing condition denial, meaning if a person has a pre-existing condition they can't be denied services. He also said this bill will extend benefits to millions of American's who don't otherwise have an opportunity to receive health care coverage.

Representative Grijalva said, "It's not as strong as many of us wanted it, but it does provide for private insurances a competitive competition that will keep costs lower and make some of the premiums we see and some of the costs that we see from private insurance carriers are going to have to reduce their costs to compete with this public option."

link

Sellouts?

[Davis_X_Machina]

6. Not *real* democrats....

...not a one of them has ever been mayor of Cleveland.

[Raineyb]

25. Haven't you learned to stop listening to the crowing after a bill's been passed.

It's not like they're going to tell you that you're about to get screwed.

[Triana]

28. BINGO! "It's not like they're going to tell you that you're about to get screwed."

Thank you.

[ProSense]

32. People don't vote for bills just to crow. They vote for them so that they pass.

Crowing is optional.

[Raineyb]

36. No they vote for bills so they can say they did something.

Whether or not what they did actually benefits you is another story altogether.

That they insist on crowing about it means they think you're stupid.

[Triana]

40. Exactly. It's called a "pretense" - or a "plug nickel". Toss a crumb to the masses

to shut enough of them up, then pat ourselves on the back for it.

[autorank]

59. They're not even giving us crumbs.

They've created a new concept in law - refuse to participate and we'll put you in jail.

Privatized Debtors Prisons - You could put the people who go bankrupt thanks to the act passed
with DINO support and those who refuse to buy insurance in one place. Easier to keep track of them.
The prison business would be a good one since, once they have a record, these customers will come
back again and again.

[Triana]

26. If health care was REALLY a "basic human right" - it would NOT be a for-profit enterprise

If health care was a "basic human right" - EVEN WOMEN would be entitled to it - but they apparently are NOT - which means that either:

1. women are STILL not considered HUMAN and/or;
2. health care is NOT considered a basic human right in the U.S.

And like it or NOT, in U.S. of A$$ - it's both #1 and #2.

Politicians can say all the pretty words they want. WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO BRASS TACKS - what this bill IS and what it DOES - and what it is NOT and DOES NOT DO is the same - all pretty pretentious political rhetoric aside.

[ProSense]

30. Is continuing to watch people die a basic human right? n/t

[Triana]

43. Quite apparently, it is. If you're a woman or can't afford NOT to die...

...I guess it is.

[bluestateguy]

3. Then why did the insurance cos oppose the bill?

If AHIP likes the bill so much, as you say, they could have saved us all a lot more trouble by just endorsing and supporting the bill.

But they didn't do that, did they?

[Jkid]

24. That is a good question

I really don't know...

[Horse with no Name]

60. Theater for the masses.

Pure unadulterated theater.

[GreenPartyVoter]

61. +1

[slipslidingaway]

They ran commercials in support of HC, they wanted the mandates and...

then worked behind the scenes to water down the PO.

[Triana]

44. they wanted the $$$$$$ and NO competition

which is what they got.

[slipslidingaway]

54. Exactly, many of the ads for HC reform were funded by the corporations...

the idea that they fought for no reform is misguided IMO.

[truedelphi]

4. I am rec number six.

Have a feeling the pom pom squad wil bring your topic DOWN soon.

[Desertrose]

13. Yeah, and I was rec #5.

Magically dropping numbers. wow.

[Libertas1776]

7. K&R

[emulatorloo]

9. "I have Crohn's disease recently diagnosed"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6957598

I have Crohn's diesease recently diagnosed, only my doctor has been careful to only list Iletitis (sp) so as not to create paperwork to mark me as a pre-existing condition candidate...as a result, it is hard to get the pain meds I need sometimes

this bill will help me and not stigmatize me

[truedelphi]

10. BTW, they are people who share this sentiment over at this topic.

You are not the only one.


http://tinyurl.com/yjx4rlc

[BeHereNow]

11. K&R However, debate and discussions are NOT allowed.

Some "democracy" we have when we can not examine or discuss what
has REALLY transpired...

BHN

[emulatorloo]

12. "My wife has multiple sclerosis."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6957579

"My wife has multiple sclerosis."

If this bill becomes law, she will never be denied coverage due to her "pre-existing condition."

That's pretty God damned important, so I'm celebrating tonight.

Sorry.

[earth mom]

17. So screw everyone else, eh?!

:thumbsdown:

[emulatorloo]

21. I think you need to read it again n/t

[earth mom]

29. No, I saw that thread already and I think it's selfish and short sighted.

I don't want anyone to be sick and go without care, but at the same time I don't think we should all be held up at gunpoint to get health care.

Which is what is happening now-highway robbery.

[emulatorloo]

39. If youve dealt with the current healthcare system, there's lots of good things in

this bill.

Hell no it is not perfect.

By the "highway robbery" reference I assume you are referring to mandate thing. Let me suggest that the Republicans are exaggerating the onerousness of that. They have been known to exaggerate and blow things out of proportion. I have seen DUers link to an article talking about how horrible it is, and the source of the article is a Republican who claimed the stimulus was giving money to ACORN!

[truedelphi]

57. No the Republicans are not blowing up the awfulness of the mandates.

It was the Republican Ronald Reagan who finally ended welfare for millions of women like myself by saying, let's have the Daddies of the kids pay, instead of the state. Until then, I was at the behest of the Democratic welfare agencies, that penalized me every time I made $ 5. After Reagan's initative to make the working spouse pay child support, I was able to get child support, regardless of what state I lived in. And if he didn't pay, the Feds garnished his income refunds, once to the tune of $ 6,200 bucks. Also, I could work and I never had to answer to any social agency as to howmuch Imade. No more penalties (And threats of jail time) for not reporting five bucks.

The mandates mean that the working poor who make a nudge too much to be subsidized will be paying for insurance they cannot use.

For instance, a person making $ 24,000 a year must come up with $ 2K a year for premiums. Not a lot if they live somewhere off the grid, like a rural county. Or if they live at home.

But if they are living and working in a major metropolis, they are already not making enough to get by. Now they have to find $ 2K more, and get this - if they need a treatment, procedure, opoeration, then they must have the first $ 2,000 in hard cash to obtain that procedure. (Deductible that is required of them.) So unless they have good credit and can borrow the money they will forgo the treatment.

In effect the working class will once again be subsidizing the insurers and those affluent enough to use their insurance to have treatments.

[bvar22]

56. And all it cost was...

...a $900,000,000,000.00 gift of Public Money to the For Profit Health Insurance Industry (minus of course the "Thin Sliver" that will go to the not so Public Option0, and a MANDATE for every single American to BUY a shoddy product from a Sociopathic Industry.

What a DEAL!

BTW: If you think that the for Profits haven't already bought "loopholes" around "regulation", there is a bridge in Alaska thats For Sale.

[earth mom]

14. We all just got screwed over BIG TIME & people here on DU are stupid enough to cheer about it!

Un FUCKING believable!!! :wtf:

[BeHereNow]

18. A watermark, if you will... n/t

BHN

[Triana]

31. I ain't cheering - I'm LIVID

And I agree with you. Un FUCKING believable!! :wtf:

[provis99]

15. everyone supporting this awful bill on DU should be forced to memorize Sec. 509.

the Joint Committee on Taxation admitted that failure to pay the tax penalty imposed on those who don't buy health insurance could be subject to $250,000 in fines and five years incarceration in prison. The Chief of Staff for the Committee, Thomas Barthold, confirmed this.

[earth mom]

20. Isn't that the kind of crap the founding fathers wanted NOT to happen in this country?

Sounds like debtors prison to me! :grr:

[Jamastiene]

51. Well, if they put those of us who cannot afford it into prison,

they'll HAVE to give us health care then. I guess there is a *somewhat* bright side then. :(

[Hawkeye-X]

22. Then it needs to be POINTED out and asked to be STRIPPED out

along with the Stupak-Pitts amendment in conference.

I DONT FUCKING CARE IF THE PRO LIFERS WHINE ABOUT IT. THEY ARE NOT THE MAJORITY!

FUCK YOU AND YOUR PROLIFERS

[Jamastiene]

48. Well, for poor people like me, they are not going to be able to get blood

from a turnip...I'll never be able to pay the $250k, but I sure can use the free* health care in prison. So, that's a potential of five years of health care coverage . I'm sure I'll learn enough in the poky to get to stay longer and continue to get health care free of charge*.

Gee, their punishment for not buying the forced insurance could potentially end up giving someone health care...in prison. They have to take care of the prisoners. I have a feeling a civil disobedience movement is going to start now.


*Well, it's not really free, but supporters of this insurance company corporate welfare bill don't seem to mind paying to keep dangerous thugs like me off the streets what with me poverty and all.

[Hawkeye-X]

16. You can thank the Blue Dogs, Rahm Emanuel and the DLC

More reason to fire this asshole and put in a true progressive CoS.

It's time for progressives to step up to the plate and primary their asses out. I'm willing to spend money on true progressives for 2010. DNC and DLC will receive ZERO money from me this election season.

[Triana]

35. Rahm Emmanuel and his corprat insurance co-loving BROTHER, the Blue Dicks

and the DLC. I'VE HAD IT with the lot of them. The DNC supports too many of them and therefore won't be getting $ from me anymore either. I'll write them letters and return them in THEIR POSTAGE PAID envelopes telling them I had to give all my money to THE INSURANCE COMPANIES under the new "health care reform" laws and therefore I don't have any to give them.

[sandnsea]

19. None of that is true.

It's understandable you'd be upset.

An unemployed individual would likely qualify for free medicaid.

Anybody who isn't covered by an employer can choose the public option. I can't figure anybody would want to pay for their own coverage rather than let their employer pay. The public option negotiates rates, which isn't that much different than using Medicare +5%.

After they get the insurance exchange going, employers can choose the exchange. Once a person is in the exchange, they can stay in it even if a new employer has different insurance.

Birth control, reproductive care, and abortion in cases of rape and incest or emergency, are all covered.

[Turborama]

38. Also, would I be right in thinking that these "taxes for not doing so"....

...would be like paying National Insurance in the UK, which does have a National Health Service?

[sandnsea]

45. I wish it would

But that would be socialism and we can't have that. :sarcasm: It's just a tax and you get nothing for it.

Maybe eventually the people paying the tax will wake up and say "wait a minute, why can't I get health care if I'm paying a tax for it!". And then we'll have single payer.

[autorank]

58. When will the public option be available? How many will be covered? n/t

[emulatorloo]

23. "I *do* have pre-existing conditions and just about have exhausted COBRA. I am really hoping this

I am really hoping this passes and I don't die or bankrupt the family before I can get coverage."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6953096&mesg_id=6953173

[Name removed]

27. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Divine Discontent]

33. there's plenty to be upset about with this, I've OP'd that before, but as Rep Grayson said

"I promised from the start to vote for any bill that saves money and saves lives. This bill does both. This bill will help save the lives of the nearly 45,000 Americans who die every year because they do not have health insurance. A lot of people say they love America. To them I say, ‘it’s not enough to love what’s in America. You cannot just love the Appalachian Mountains, the Mohave Desert, or the Gulf Coast. You need to love Americans as well. And loving people means taking care of them, sheltering the homeless, feeding the hungry, and healing the sick.’”


So, the corporations were against this, and a great congressman was for it, it's not perfect,but even though it's certainly NOT Universal Healthcare or even a Single Payer insurance plan, it's got a lot of things in it that are helpful. I am most concerned about the penalty for not having paid for insurance - that will be, shall we say, interesting.

[emulatorloo]

41. nice post, you will get lost in all the noise though n/t

[Divine Discontent]

62. thanks for the comp. everyone reads my every word here, don't worry. lol

[flvegan]

34. I'm shocked. SHOCKED I tell you.

I wish that the govt medical plan would cover spine implants for our "democrats" on the hill.

[leftstreet]

37. Democratic party spinelessness is a pre-existing condition n/t

[emilyg]

42. Not only pre-existing but also chronic.

[Jamastiene]

52. The fact that they can function at all without spines

astounds me. Scientists should be studying this phenomenon. It's un-freaking-believable that they can be that spineless and still exist.

[PHIMG]

46. Leadership is walking the party into a buzzsaw

We better be ready to turn on a dime and do Medicare For All. It's the only thing that will be able to set this right.

[regnaD kciN]

47. Another ignorant rant, I see...

requiring taxpayers (even if unemployed-especially if unemployed) to pay up to thousands of dollars each year to for-profit corprat insurance companies or be FINED via taxes for not doing so.

I'm going to say this reeeeeeeal slooooooow, so you might understand it: IF YOU ARE UNEMPLOYED AND HAVE NO INCOME, YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY FOR INSURANCE. YOU WILL BE COVERED BY MEDICAID. GOT IT?

The only way an "unemployed" person will be required "to pay up to thousands of dollars each year to for-profit corprat (sic) insurance companies or be FINED via taxes for not doing so" is if they are unemployed because they can afford to live off their millions in interest on investments. And, sorry, I'm not going to worry over their plight.

BULLSHIT.

I couldn't have described your post better myself.

[Jamastiene]

49. I'm not saying this because you are a fellow MJ fan.

I'm saying this because you are right.

K&R
Agreed. You nailed it.

[greennina]

50. We were sold-out(ntxt)

[Vidar]

53. Emmanuel & Pelosi have done their masters proud.

[juno jones]

55. I wanna see the numbers.

Where are the cutoffs for 'expanded'medicaid going to be. Are we going to be working with real numbers or the artificially low ones they've used for decades? How much will be be getting in subsidies? And most important: What kinds of means testing is going to imposed on the reciving of medicare or the subsidies?

This bill has 'unintended consequences' written all over it.