“When a white guy shoots up a post office, they call that going postal. But when a Muslim does it...

[WilliamPitt]

...they call it jihad."

Muslims at Fort Voice Outrage and Ask Questions
By MICHAEL MOSS
Published: November 6, 2009

KILLEEN, Tex. — Leaders of the vibrant Muslim community here expressed outrage on Friday at the shooting rampage being laid to one of their members, Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan, who had become a regular attendee of prayers at the local mosque. But some of the men who had befriended Major Hasan at the mosque said the military should examine the policies that might have caused him to snap.

“When a white guy shoots up a post office, they call that going postal,” said Victor Benjamin II, 30, a former member of the Army. “But when a Muslim does it, they call it jihad. Ultimately it was Brother Nidal’s doing, but the command should be held accountable,” Mr. Benjamin said. “G.I.’s are like any equipment in the Army. When it breaks, those who were in charge of keeping it fit should be held responsible for it.”

The mosque, the Islamic Community of Greater Killeen, sits off Highway 195, near Fort Hood. Major Hasan began attending prayers about two months ago. The mosque has about 75 families who have lived peacefully with their Christian neighbors. “After 9/11, nothing happened here,” said Ajsaf Khan, who owns three convenience stores with his brother, Abdul Khan. “We are very cooperative.”

A mosque leader, Dr. Manzoor Farooqi, a pediatrician, when asked if he feared retribution for the shootings, said he hoped good relations would prevail. Major Hasan was one of about 10 men from Fort Hood who attended prayers in their uniforms, Dr. Farooqi said, and he was shocked to see the major’s face on television identified as that of the gunman. “He is an educated man. A psychiatrist,” he said. “I can’t believe he would do such a stupid thing.”

“I have no words to explain what happened yesterday,” Dr. Farooqi said at Friday afternoon prayers, in which about 40 men were led by the mosque’s imam, Syed Ahmed Ali. “Let’s have a moment of silence to bless those who lost their life."

“The Islamic community strongly condemns this cowardly attack, which was particularly heinous in that it was directed at the all-volunteer army that protects our nation,” Dr. Farooqi said.

More: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/07/us/07muslim.html?_r=1&hp

[aikoaiko]

1. Well, that reaction might come from the shooter shouting "Allahu Akbar!" as he killed people.

I'm just saying.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091106/ap_on_re_us/us_fort_hood_shooting

[intheflow]

2. Sure, and Timothy McVeigh wore a t-shirt that said "Don't Tread On Me."

These are both homegrown American boys. Just sayin'.

[patrice]

4. And he likely had personal connections to the "Christian" Identity movement. nt

[JVS]

20. In the wake of his crime, I don't remember it being called going postal. I do remember a lot of...

news stories about wingnut militias though.

[PurityOfEssence]

28. Don't Tread on Me has NO religious subtext

It's a rural New England slogan against British rule dating from before the American Revolution.

Saying "God is Great" in the form of a specific religion's exhortation is entirely different.

Why does this even need to be pointed out?

[jonnyblitz]

34. Tim McVeigh was also an agnostic NOT a christian of any sort.

People never believe me when i correct them on that. Somebody the other day was going from thread to thread calling him a Catholic.

[PurityOfEssence]

50. McVeigh asked for and received last rites from a Catholic Priest

Here's Wikipedia on the subject, although that's obviously a very flawed source.

Throughout his childhood, he and his father were Roman Catholics and often attended daily Mass. In a recorded interview with Time magazine<14> McVeigh professed his belief in "a God", although he said he had "sort of lost touch with" Catholicism and "I never really picked it up, however I do maintain core beliefs." The Guardian reported that McVeigh wrote a letter to them claiming to be an agnostic.<15> McVeigh at one time said that he believed the universe was guided by natural law, energized by some universal higher power that showed each person right from wrong if they paid attention to what was going on inside them. He had also said, "Science is my religion."<16>

His statements on the fact were very contradictory, and he REQUESTED AND RECEIVED LAST RIGHTS FROM A CATHOLIC PRIEST WHEN HE WAS EXECUTED.

Having said that, the attack was NOT religiously motivated, which is the point that I and others are making. He was an anti-government libertarian nutjob, and it was an attack against the Federal Government.

Still, do NOT pin this on the non-religious. His statements, although vague, are pretty consistent with a belief in a supreme being.

[spoony]

51. "Science is my religion"

It's interesting that you don't want McVeigh pinned "on the non-religious" but your entire post is so insistent on him being essentially religious.

[PurityOfEssence]

61. His act was one against government; Hasan's seems to have been in defense of Islam

There's little if any religious component to McVeigh's action, whereas Hasan's seems to have a HUGE religious component, well beyond the point at which one would characterize it as a religious act.

The desire to peg McVeigh as a non-believer is one used by those who like to be defenders of religion. His statements varied, but he stated a belief more often than not, and even when distancing himself from Christianity, said that he saw a higher power guiding things.

The tenor of your complaint seems to be that I'm partisan to the degree that I gloss over inconvenient facts. Note that I didn't bring up his religious beliefs, and pointed out that his use of the old Vermont flag phrase had no religious component. Still, to trot him out as an example of murderous non-believers is a mischaracterization at best, and a deliberate attempt to vilify non-religious people at worst.

To be clear: I see no religious component to his crimes, although a vague belief in an afterlife certainly absolves oneself of murder, since it's not really ending a "life".

[intheflow]

78. Extremism is extremism.

Is it somehow less onerous to blow up a building full of people because of misplaced patriotism than it is to shoot a bunch of people because of misunderstood religious identity? I'm saying that neither being patriotic nor religious excuses violent extremist actions. Why does this even need to be pointed out?

[aikoaiko]

74. I thought it was the "tree of liberty" quote but either way McVeigh put all whole

militia/patriot groups under the spotlight for a long time.

The parallel seems the same to me.

[intheflow]

77. You're right.

It was the tree of liberty quote. My bad.

[Raine]

80. yeah and he got executed

just saying.

[WinkyDink]

81. Just sayin' what? Both were terrorists. Neither "just snapped".

[Love Bug]

3. Oh, come on. You know the minute they announced his name he was

going to become the new poster child for Muslim TerrorismTM. That was going to happen no matter what he yelled.

How about the guy who shot up his former workplace in Orlando yesterday? Is his religion (whatever it is) being blamed for it?

Hasan is ultimately responsible for what he did, no matter the reason.

[C_Lawyer09]

32. I blame the individual

I assign the same amount of blame to anybody whom would perpetrate acts of violence on innocent people regardless of religion

[ZombieHorde]

47. "You know the minute they announced his name he was going to become..."

This does not mean he was not motivated by his religion.

"How about the guy who shot up his former workplace in Orlando yesterday? Is his religion (whatever it is) being blamed for it?"

Was he yelling religious slogans during the shooting?

[AntiFascist]

71. According to his family...

Hassan had been harassed and even experienced hate crimes ever since 9-11. This seems like a much deeper problem which caused him to become isolated from the Army, even if he had immersed himself in his religion as a result.

[WilliamPitt]

5. "He said officials had not confirmed Hasan made the comment."

[spanone]

7. that is the truth, but the media has printed and reprinted it as truth.

no confirmation needed for our fair and balanced media

[G_j]

9. and it obviously worked

it now gets passed on as the truth..

[spanone]

12. mr karl rove perfected that tactic...say it enough, it becomes 'truth'

[Sebastian Doyle]

16. Just the fact that they said he was dead for 6 hours, when he wasn't

is proof of the whore media's uselessness. Whatever happened to "don't run a story until it's been verified by three independent sources". Or did I just remember that from some movie, and nobody actually in the pre-corporatized media actually said it?

[aikoaiko]

56. Its true that official have not confirmed that, but that isn't a denial either.

I should have been more circumspect in my first response to you. I was ready to accept this as a school/work place shooting rampage not that much different from mass school or work shootings, but when I read that he was Praising God I took that to mean he was religiously motivated.

Perhaps it wasn't religious motivated, but given the reports one can hardly be blamed for thinking it is possible.

[Bonobo]

6. Others report that he said: "I ain't fucking going! I ain't fucking going!" nt

[Barack_America]

15. But that sounds like "Allahu Akbar" when an "Arab" says it.

I'm sure.

:eyes:

[Bonobo]

18. Yes, indeed. LOL. nt

[CoffinEd]

37. You beat me to it!

n/t.

[rury]

46. It makes me angry that American Muslims

have to be worried about "backlash" because of this incident.
Was the average white American worried about blowback or backlash in the wake of Tim McVeigh's act of domestic terror?

[C_Lawyer09]

63. Tattoo checks for a decade

I can tell you that while a SGT at Fort Bragg I had good non hating Soldiers that were subject to random tat checks all the time and routine interviews. An example being a lightning bolt and cloud as part of a tat based on Norse mythology. I was always missing this troop to various inquiries. No it isn't just Muslims that suffer group backlash when some nut case or jackass commits a hate crime, murder, etc.

[jmm]

65. For every tattoo check I can find dozens of stories like these-

A NATION CHALLENGED: CHOICE OF WORDS; In a Military Town, Osama's Place Cafe Is Tasting Tolerance

.....

Since declarations by American leaders that this month's terrorist attacks were probably planned by Osama bin Laden, some customers have urged Mr. Mustafa to change his restaurant's name. He seems uncertain how to respond.

''I'm not going to do it,'' he said defiantly at one point. ''When Timothy McVeigh did that terrorism in Oklahoma, nobody who owned a place called Timothy's changed the name. So why should I?''

Later, however, one of Mr. Mustafa's waitresses, Tina Jeter, said several people she knows had urged her to quit.

She has heard others curse the restaurant's owner and suggest that he might have been connected to the attacks. A few, Ms. Jeter said, have even told her they would like to bomb Osama's Place.

Mr. Mustafa, a Muslim, looked surprised and hurt. ''You never told me that,'' he said.

''I didn't want to get you upset or hurt your feelings,'' Ms. Jeter replied.
.....

Boston reflects on Charles Stuart case
.....
But in the interim, young men in Boston’s African American community were subject to a massive manhunt.

Dickerson: “The young people were disrespected, very much so. They were strip-searched out in the public and whatnot.”

Mission Hill resident Betty Commerford remembers standing with other women when police pulled up and accosted some young African American boys.

Betty: “They frisked those boys and they told them to drop their pants, in front of us.”

Keith: “I remember coming from the movie with my wife and kids and getting pulled over and having been held for a half an hour while they checked my plates and it was just a mess. It was total chaos.”
.....

Being questioned or mistreated due to a Norse tattoo isn't nearly as common as people and communities being treated differently because a suspect in a crime may have dark skin or a Muslim name.

[HughMoran]

8. What did McVeigh & others say? "Death to N&*^(^(*^"?

Seriously, the last word a person says before they kill themselves often involves their religious beliefs. You wouldn't say the same if a Christian said "Praise God" just before going on a rampage, would you? Of course not.

[aikoaiko]

55. If a Christian starting praising God before killing people, yes I would think religious beliefs were

a part of the shooters motivation.

[malaise]

19. Well since the person who claimed that his daughter

heard Hasan say that refused to be seen on TV or even give his name, I took that with a grain of salt, particularly after all I saw was a pair of hands showing a wedding ring (still trying to figure out the message there). Third person reports from persons who won't identify themselves aren't often taken seriously.

Others heard him saying 'I am not fucking going' (to Afghanistan) before he opened fire.

[Hansel]

48. Which makes far more sense than "Allahu Akbar".

Since we know he did not want to go and had been doing everything in his power not to and was completely tormented by the idea of going. Seems like that was pretty high on his lists of the things on his mind.

[SoCalDem]

49. and postal wackos don't holler "Do NOT fold, spindle or mutilate" as they fire their guns

The Hasan case is a special one.. with many layers.

The main issue is that the military just kept passing up every opportunity they had, to boot this guy OUT. They knew for YEARS, that he was not a "fit", but a pissing contest was more important.. they HAD to make him honor his "obligation" to the military.

He told them in words and deeds, that he wanted OUT..They should have made him repay the money it cost to educate him, and then remove him from the military. They chose to let his resentment fester, and now a bunch of people are dead and injured.

[bertman]

54. This may go back to the "they'll take any warm body" policy that is being used now to

fill the ranks, SoCalDem. They had a functioning military officer, who wasn't stellar but still was doing his job. That happens in lots of civilian employment situations but it's now being highlighted as tragically short-sighted. Judging from what I have read so far, it seems that Maj. Hasan had become very combative (if that's the right word) about his beliefs in the last few months. Maybe that was because he had received orders for deployment.

There were a lot of other possible scenarios that COULD have happened but did not: he could have refused to be deployed and waited for a courts-martial and a dishonorable dischare; he could have deserted; he could have gotten a lawyer and gone public with his dissent; he could have accepted his deployment but continued to express his opposition without resorting to violence.

I suppose that one element of this will be to determine how actively Maj. Hasan pushed his desire to be allowed to get out. There are lots of instances where troops get depressed or begin to express their dissatisfaction with the military and their desire to "get out" but it comes to naught after some time passes. Maybe his superiors thought he was not sincere so they didn't process the paperwork, or maybe it got shuffled around in the bureaucracy.

[truth2power]

82. You are exactly correct, SoCal. I posted on another thread

that the blame should be placed on those who insisted he be deployed, and I was ridiculed for it.

[slackmaster]

10. I don't use either of those terms. I prefer one coined by science fiction writer John Brunner

In his classic novel Stand On Zanzibar, people who suddenly snap and kill a bunch of innocents are called "muckers", i.e. they run amok.

As in real life, in the book muckers are rarely caught alive.

Shooting up a gun-free safety zone is a suicide mission. Once some good people with guns show up, the mucker is almost always killed if he hasn't already killed himself.

[patrice]

14. Stand On Zanzibar = One of THE eye-openers in my life.

I should re-read it and The Sheep Look Up and an earlier, more poetic work, Traveler in Black.

There are a couple of others from that period that contributed to Brunner's effect on me:
Dahlgren by Samuel Delaney & Giles Goat Boy by John Barth.

[slackmaster]

33. I strongly recommend any and every book by Philip K. Dick

[patrice]

45. Thanks for the tip. I will follow up.

[proteus_lives]

58. Great author!

Sci-Fi Legend.

[Bucky]

11. Weren't a lot of the 19 9/11 hijackers well educated? Weren't they also emotionally distraught?

How are they any different from McVeigh or the Fort Hood gunman? Or John Brown, a terrorist whose political views any sane person would agree with. Terrorism comes out of mental illness. It takes a wide variety of disguises, but ultimately bringing violence down on innocent bystanders comes from a sick, sick mind. That makes it no less evil, but it's still the act of a somehow unhinged, de-socialized mind.

[Hansel]

52. Which is the point that most Americans miss.

There are very few monsters in this world. There are some, but very few. People usually have backgrounds and experiences that lead up to carrying out these horrific and disgusting acts. Usually it happens when they see no other out.

The 19 hijackers saw America treading on and destroying their land, culture and religion, and by some accounts, felt emasculated to do anything about it.

The guy in Orlando would probably have not taken the action he did yesterday had he found another equivalent job.

The guy who killed Dr. Tiller would have probably not done what he did if he hadn't had some experience in his life that triggered his anger about abortion. My brother is anti-abortion because his daughter aborted twins. He carries the signs in front of clinics. He could have cared less prior to this. I wonder what Rhodes experience was. What woman he couldn't control.

This behavior usually has something to do with feeling out of control and powerless to change the circumstances around you. And the 19 hijackers are no different. The common thread is NOT that they are all justified in their feelings, because justification has nothing to do with it. It is that they think they are and accepting that fact is the key to preventing these violent outbursts.

Think of how much different Al Qaeda would have been dealt with if someone with enough smarts and common sense had been in the WH to deal with it. If the Pentagon had sought the advice of profilers and Middle East experts in current, historical and cultural affairs. Many more American soldiers would be alive and uninjured, we would have at least 1/2 trillion dollars more in treasure, and we would not be giving more people some kind of self-justification for destroying their perceived enemies in further disgusting acts of violence.

I have always thought that 9/11 was overblown as far as the threat from Al Qaeda and that it should have been dealt with by boosting the numbers in the FBI significantly and in greater funding of Interpol. If we needed special ops after the situation was assessed, then so be it. They hit a gnat with an anvil and it has cost everyone dearly.

Unfortunately, American is more likely than not to learn the wrong lesson from this.

[backscatter712]

13. Exactly. This isn't a politically organized attack. It is a mentally unhinged person going postal.

Of course, freepers won't be persuaded of this fact.

[PurityOfEssence]

36. You're leaping to conclusions; I contend that it highlights an evil within that religion

To clarify: I have a problem with MOST major religions, and much of that stems from the belief in inherent superiority, supernatural fantasy and the justification to act as the long arm of the lord.

Islam is particularly dangerous with its built-in proselytizing and handy scripture that can easily be interpreted to justify broad slashing havoc to bring the infidels to heel. The very nature of that particular religion is one of domination and forcing one literally to one's knees to constantly remind one of one's slavish inferiority to the will of the big whatever.

Christianity is plenty bad itself, but the deep intolerance promoted by Islam bleeds through all the sweet, wonderful window-dressing that's slathered about.

The true indictment is against the religion itself, in that it promotes and nurtures this kind of selfish violence. A corollary is that religion grants its adherents "special" status, and justifies its proclamations with no proof beyond the ubiquitous "because it is" fatuousness.

Molly-coddling dangerous mindsets is going to get us no place, and dismissing those who request that adherents of religion don't deserve a blank check for assholish behavior is misplaced "tolerance". People should be held accountable for their bigotries and wacky, supernatural superstitions, and the systems themselves need to be called into question for their clannish and domineering ugliness.

[951-Riverside]

17. If you think "jihad" is offensive surely you must think "going postal" is equally offensive

Both terms are offensive to a religion and a profession.

[C_Lawyer09]

39. Offensive

Speaking of, sure have seen a lot of anti-military diatribe/generalizations on this blog today, specific and otherwise. The opinion that the Army should have somehow predicted this abhorent and senseless murder is ridiculous. Many whom haven't served that contribute to this blog would be amazed to find out how much mandatory training (sensitivity, consideration of others, sexual harassment, rules of engagement, suicide prevention)we attend monthly, quarterly, and annually.

[Hansel]

57. Well since they were well aware of his behavior, yes they should

have known he might be a problem.

They were investigating him for making posts that were sympathetic with suicide bombers. He did a power point presentation in a class on this subject unrelated to the topic on hand. He had stated several times that he did not want to be deployed to kill other Muslims and offered to pay for his school in order to avoid it. He complained about being harassed because he was a Muslim.

If they couldn't pick up on any of those obvious warnings then they deserve the criticism. And I'm sure that the brass may actually have enough brass to realize and accept this because you can be guaranteed there will be changes.

Pointing out flaws about how this was handled is not anti-military. It's pointing out flaws. The Army is not immune from being wrong and screwing up. I'm sure that most people in the military are strong and mature enough to take a little criticism when it is deserved.

The training courses are a joke and are used to cover their butts because they don't want to take the more effective and hard steps needed to deal with these problems. That means investigating individuals involved in behavior that is addressed by these courses and taking action against them. People who are screaming out that they are losing it need to be dealt with individually, not in a training course. For the most part the training courses are a waste of time. Give most people a handbook of dos and don'ts they can usually figure out what to do and not do.

Edit to add: A great deal of this fall in the lap of the Bush administration for abuses of the military and those who serve in it by over-stretching the military and not providing the resources they need. So it is not all their fault alone or even most of their fault. But they do need to take some blame.

[TwilightGardener]

21. It's dishonest to ignore religion as a role in any violence where

there's strong evidence of it as a factor. But in the end, as long as it's not organized religious violence that can be detected and prevented, it doesn't matter that much--the result is the same, whether one kills for God, or hatred of a certain group, or hatred of the government, or for no good reason at all.

[bridgit]

22. "a white guy" once proclaimed "Sic Semper Tyrannis" too, but they didn't call it jihad back then...

They called it Civil War

[PurityOfEssence]

40. That, too, has NO religious component

"Thus always to Tyrants" is radical populism with NO religious component.

[bridgit]

44. People can be "religious" about buying a certain brand of breakfast cereal too

I am in no position to offer cover for a murderous, highly-violent, potentially/religiously charged act that may yet be proven more clearly either way. If you're setting up a template within which Maj Nidal is to be seen as someone bringing "radical populism with NO religious component" to the US in the course of declaring her a tyrant - I am not there yet

[PurityOfEssence]

62. Your original reply was to disavow a religious component by using a dissimilar incident

Frankly, I'm seriously perplexed by your last response, so let's see where this is all going and where it's been.

Somehow, you have an issue with people calling this a Jihadi act and blaming religion in some way. To justify this, you use John Wilkes Booth's murderous words as a parallel, stating that nobody saw anything religious there. Booth's words have NOTHING to do with religion, the supernatural, fantasy, or an organized belief system; he was saying that Lincoln was a tyrant who got what he deserved. That's it, period. You're simply making a skew comparison.

Hasan seems to have yelled "Allah Akbar" during his shooting spree, and had stated that the United States was on a ill-concealed war against Islam. Whether he was pissed at the Army for disciplining him, simply didn't want to go to a combat zone, was a zealot of the first order and didn't want to participate in something against his religion or some combination of these things and others, RELIGION WAS A HUGE COMPONENT. It wasn't even the slightest justification in Booth's bombast.

Yeah, I'll call it Jihadi; the guy yelled the Muslim call of "God is Great" as he went on a killing spree against people of an institution he felt was at war with his religion. Big damned difference.

[David Zephyr]

72. Clearly this guy was harrassed for being a Muslim. So your point is valid, POE.

Religion was a huge component. His religion was mocked in, let's face it, a part of the country that is not particularly friendly to Muslims, and it apparently took a toll and had a blowback.

This is a tragic story all the way around.

Just think, if Bush had never lied to take us into Iraq, this probably wouldn't have happened, but the genie is out of the bottle now.

Glad to see you posting.

[bridgit]

76. Understood, though your post above: "That, too, has NO religious component"

"too", which I took to mean 'also', where my sense is that it rather does have bearing. The cross-ref to Booth is a way to key on zealotry as a corrosive element, along with any religious-esque behaviors associated with it, from the end zones of the NFL to flying planes into towers it is not me that disavows a process leading to a more holistic understanding

"issue", well, if that is where the point of the dagger is then my 'issue' is that, and as I'd C&P'd for the OP, the "white guy" tag, seemed a quick effort to pull the eye from what may well be; if not is. Sorry for any confusion, but my further sense is that we are in closer agreement than may seem. In that as all this data comes forward; the various battle cries and calls to action of others are viewed first from a base-line for what they are already understood to be, though that, of course, is only my opinion

If you're amending the "too"/'also' component then I am able to agree and support your ref as to Maj Nidal's act being: Jihadi

[lonestarnot]

23. Killing for no good reason is killing, doesn't matter what it's called. Nutjobs will be nutjobs.

and on edit, in my opinion, there is never a good reason.

[JVS]

24. While I do not suspect his community of encouraging his actions, I also think that it is not...

unreasonable to suspect that a man born of Palestinian immigrants (a group which often leaves their home country in very unhappy circumstances) and who has spent the last 9 years in a military that has been waging war against Afghanistan, Iraq, and is perceived by many as being hostile to the Muslim world along with Hasan's personal experiences of being taunted for his ethnicity within the army, might have been provoked him into reconsidering his allegiances in life and taking action. Especially within the context of having the increased stress of being deployed to these conflicts which he may disagreed with.

[stray cat]

25. Motivation? 9-11 wasn't performed by pilots going postal

I don't know what Dr. Hasan's motivation was nor do DUers. However, the good doctor planned it well to go after those who apparently had not fired him from a job. You can call him crazy but I see no evidence yet of insanity.

[treestar]

26. So true. And the community of white men do not become associated

with it and somehow responsible for it. They are not accused of secretly supported it or not doing enough to control one of their number. It's just a lone nut in that case.

[C_Lawyer09]

64. Ruby Ridge

Randy Weaver lost a wife and child to a raid/standoff gone wrong. There are plenty of indignities and tragedies to go around, all colors, all religions.

[stray cat]

27. Then why is oklahoma city considered terrorism - McVeigh was white

maybe he was insane for years and we should have felt sorry for him? However, I don't notice many DUers claiming poor Timothy was just misunderstood and stressed out - and he had actually served overseas right?

[LostInAnomie]

29. If the shoe fits...

If the motives behind his murder spree are religious and the actions taken are similar to those of jihadists, then it is an apt description.

This whole "If a white man did it..." argument I've seen on here and elsewhere is disingenuous bullshit.

[emilyg]

30. Agree 100%.

[twitomy]

70. I agree

Political correctness run amok. Cant even call a spade a spade.

[C_Lawyer09]

31. History of the term

"Going postal" was a term coined by the reaction of some postal workers to psychotropic drugs that were prescribed, a few times with tragic circumstances. Having said that, I've heard the phrase applied to many of different backgrounds and races whom have done crazy inexplicable things.

[KT2000]

35. I am betting it was a

brain disorder, such as a tumor.

[slackmaster]

38. Or a new version of PTSD caused by his pending deployment overseas

Pre-Traumatic Stress Disorder.

[C_Lawyer09]

42. Thank you

A thousand times thank you for the mention of this phantom PTSD that lurked within this field grade officer whom got a terrific education at tax payer expense and then turned on the same people he is charged to lead. I can't understand this wellspring of empathy and misplaced blame.

[slackmaster]

43. If the guy was a Christian of western European ancestry, people on this forum would be calling...

...for drawing and quartering.

[spoony]

53. The traffic rushing to this site

to condemn all of Christianity would probably shut DU down for a week.

[proteus_lives]

59. Yep.

They don't to admit it but DU can be just as two-faced about religion as FR.

[twitomy]

75. You aint shittin...

This place is very hostile to religion, especially Christianity. Islam not so much.
Fact is, not all Muslims are terrorists, but most terrorists are Muslims.
Islam needs to have its "Reformation" in the worst way.

[David Zephyr]

69. Sticking up for Jesus, again. He's very proud of you, I'm sure.

;)

[KT2000]

73. Someone who talked to him

recently said that he was incoherent - per CNN.
The shooter in the Texas clock tower did have a tumor. I do not have sympathy for him but it is something that should be looked into because this is beyond logic and reason.

FYI: Congress declared the 90s the Decade of the Brain because Office of Technology Assessment reported the many new ways the human brain is under assault from exogenous sources. They proposed areas of research. Reagan came into office and that was that.

[SmileyRose]

41. Oh come on.

When "Christian" white guy David Koresh or Timothy McVeigh blew up everything from here to there the consensus was clearly that they were religion extremist nutjob terrorists. The only difference is that Christian doesn't have a code word like "jihad". They have phrases of several words but not one single lighting rod of a word.

Sarah Palin, RushHannity, Dick Armey, and assorted other religious nutjobs are being called on their various words asking for fellow nutjobs to take up arms against the libruls. To claim America in general lets christian nutjobs off the hook is disingenuous at best.

Though I will agree whites in general get a lot more leeway.

[Bette Noir]

67. Sure they do. "Crusade."

[The Straight Story]

68. And if someone used that word, would we just let it go here and ask people not to jump on it?

They would leap on it within seconds.

[proteus_lives]

60. Don't make excuses, denounce him!

That's what they should all be doing.

[XemaSab]

66. White people can be Muslim

n/t

[havocmom]

79. Mr. Benjamin has a couple of very valid points

“When a white guy shoots up a post office, they call that going postal,” said Victor Benjamin II, 30, a former member of the Army. “But when a Muslim does it, they call it jihad. Ultimately it was Brother Nidal’s doing, but the command should be held accountable,” Mr. Benjamin said. “G.I.’s are like any equipment in the Army. When it breaks, those who were in charge of keeping it fit should be held responsible for it.”