What DU Understands that Obama fails to

[unhappycamper]

President Obama was elected to reverse the previous 12 years of Republican tyranny.

We elected him to get us out of Iraq.

At least 50% of the United States wants him to get us out of Afghanistan.

Pretty much every liberal and progressive wants to end warantless wiretapping.

Many liberals and progressives want him to settle the torture question. ( And I don't mean sweep it under the rug. )

Many liberals and progressives want him to roll back the 'unitary executive'.

And most of us want a single-payer Health Care Plan.

I'm not seeing a whole bunch of progress on anything; are you?

[Kahuna]

1. What Prez understands that DU does not, the monumental change

that "progressives" have been yammering for won't happen overnight. Because of the progressive revolt of 2000, when may voted for nader, enabling a bush victory, the agenda they claimed was so important has been set back for many years to come. Change is incremental. Americans are too brainwashed to accept the changes that progressives want, even if it is good for them.

on edit: Remember that this is a country that selected bushco TWICE.

[tblue]

17. Bush was not elected, even once.

Change may very well have to happen incrementally, but you have to demand everything you want just to get a little of what you want. The gov't/industrial complex is so skewed against the masses, we have to tack hard left just to get to the center.

[Kahuna]

19. Whatever. He was the president for 8 years, and the majority of Americans

didn't mind one bit. THAT was my point. (as if you didn't know) :eyes:

[kenfrequed]

26. Well

Don't let the facts get in the way of whatever your 'point' was.

And don't miss out on an opportunity to castigate the left.

[Kahuna]

29. And you don't miss out on an opportunity to castigate a Democratic

president. If I feel that the "left" is responsible for far to few Dems being elected president, I will castigate until the freakin cows come home. I tire of the whiny histrionics. Please! They get real stale after a couple of decades.

[kenfrequed]

63. BS

Really you are full of it.

A: I don't go after Obama that much. I save my scorn for bluecross blueshield dogs.

B: You have no idea what my average postage is like, whereas you are utterly revealing with the usual Nader-baiting nonsense.

C: You fully admit to hating on the left. For the thousandth time this is not 'Democratic Nabobs' 'BlueDogWuvvers' or a DLC dating site. It's Democratic Underground for crissakes. Get a clue.

[lonestarnot]

93. Welp, I won't check a post count, but

:rofl:

[Greyhound]

33. So, because we've become so ignorant and apathetic that we accepted a coup,

we should just lie back and accept "the way it is"?

[noiretextatique]

41. basically...yes. the coup was not this "incremental change" the poster refers to

republicons pushed their agenda, democrats "negotiate" their agenda away. and some people still demand of allegiance to them, and our votes, even as the "change" is pretty much more of the SOS.

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

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[Greyhound]

51. Ass, moran, STFU, and poutrage...

you're not even trying...
:rofl:

[Name removed]

54. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Greyhound]

59. OMG, it's all Nader's fault, too...

:rofl:

Oh please, tell us more...
:rofl:

[sabrina 1]

96. Nader is a very powerful man

didn't you know? He controls elections. He has more power than the Democratic Party, all by himself! When Nader is around, the Democrats are helpless! :sarcasm:

[kenfrequed]

61. Nobody bitched more than you?

Really?

Are you sure about that?

I followed Greg Palast's work as early as I could and watched with rage as the Supreme Court selected our president and I would never make such a bombastic pile hyperbole laden claim.

[conscious evolution]

44. You should look up DU's

original mission statemant.

[Spryboy]

53. Actually...

I'd say a MAJORITY of Americans minded. A lot.

[Kahuna]

55. Really? Proof? nt

[kenfrequed]

62. Well

As a sample I would submit Bush driving quickly up to his inaugeration and away from booing crowds that tossed eggs and what not.

[barbtries]

25. he was elected once

as governor of texas

[Echo In Light]

28. The *only* official office that thug ever held

[Kahuna]

46. You did even read my post? I said "selected," not, "elected."

Icehole!

[barbtries]

65. sorry i didn't read your edit.

no need for name calling.

[barbtries]

66. i wasn't responding to your post

don't you read?!

[Kahuna]

50. You gave him one more election that I did. I said he was selected,

because he was.

[niyad]

92. there is some doubt about that, as well. incumbent gov ann richards was polling at 60% on election

day, and lost? looks like 2000 isn't the first election georgie stole.

[barbtries]

95. wow i never knew that

can't say that i doubt it though.

[Soylent Brice]

100. yes, but remember Rove got Bush "elected" as gov also, and

Rove was even hired by GHWB in 1980 to run his presidential campaign...

soooo... that whole "elected governor" thing is debatable as well.

[Kahuna]

48. I never said he was, elected. Why don't you learn how to read.

Sheesh.

[DailyGrind51]

76. Yet, unelected, he mamaged to force through more of his agenda than our elected President!

Tax cuts for the rich in time of war, Patriot Act, pre-emptive war in Iraq, torture and rendition, invasion of privacy, etc.

[Greyhound]

32. "Monumental change" only happens quickly, in large steps, because

people are resistant to change.

"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win."

[noiretextatique]

39. none of this is true

bush and reagan did not change incrementally...they rammed their agenda through, with the help of some democrats. the supreme court appointed bush president, the last piece of the republican coup of 2000.
a majority of americans want a public option.

[Kahuna]

49. They were able to RAM, because America was used to republican rule.

Sorry if facts offend you. :eyes: THAT is my point. Until so called progressives can will stop "punishing" the few and far in between Dem presidents we do elect, America will continue to fall for the repuke bullshit again and again because we, as Dems, destroy our own.

[redqueen]

57. It really helps speed things up when the $$$$$men agree with your agenda.

Funny how that works.

[snot]

69. Bush effected monumental changes at a pace so rapid we're still figuring them out.

[PVnRT]

70. Never mind alllllllllll those registered Democrats who voted for Bush in Florida

Or the Supreme Court, or anything else that happened in 2000. Keep jumping on that idiotic myth about how it's all the "elitist liberals" fault. That way you can justify the party's continuing rightward movement easier.

[tomp]

84. but those were centrist votes....that's okay. nt

[tomp]

85. self delete. nt

[tomp]

86. self delete. nt

[glitch]

87. What if those votes were stolen? Forget Nader, the ELEPHANT in the room is CORPORATE ELECTION counts

Election results counted by corporations is still a massive problem in our election systems, along with campaign finance.

[sendero]

77. God knows...

... it took Bush YEARS to do the damage he did. :sarcasm:

Obama has set the tone. The only way anything is going to change is if he suddenly sees the error of his ways. I'm not holding my breath.

[tomp]

83. blaming obama on nader. how enlightened!

progressives not falling in line with mainstream (read:corporate) democrats...THAT'S the problem. those damn progressive...get them out of the way and let the the nice centrist adults take care of everything. how...insane!

of course americans are brainwashed. obama is playing into that for his own purposes. every one of his actions SHOULD BE anti-brainwashing. but he's too busy ramping up afghanistan (oops, more brainwahsing, i.e., war is inevitable, and we're the good guys).

and and for the record..."yammering". insult much? you'll get far with that approach.

[FSogol]

2. Waaaaaa, Obama is not fixing EVERYTHING FAST ENOUGH for me. Waaaaaaa

President Obama was elected to reverse the previous 12 years of Republican tyranny and he has to do it in under 10 months, right? :crazy:

[Kahuna]

4. This crap comes from the same people who voted for nader, which caused..

all the things outlined in the OP. :crazy:

[noiretextatique]

42. voting for nader did not cause anything

rigging the election in florida (and elsewhere), and a treasonous supreme court was the cause of 8 years of that asshole. why do you hate participatory democracy? or do you just hate it when people you think should vote for your team don't? why do you continue to blame legal behavior (voting for whomever you choose) when there was so much illegality in the election of 2000 perpetrated by the republicons?

[PVnRT]

71. NADER NADER NADER

Weird, I kind of agree with the OP, and I didn't vote for Nader or Kucinich.

[theoldman]

8. Make that 28 years of Republican control.

[Deep13]

15. In one year we will have a new Congress.

A POTUS's greatest successes usually come at the beginning of his presidency.

[tblue]

21. Yep. The moon is in the 7th house. And Jupiter's aligned with Mars.

The time is now. On the other hand, maybe what we're witnessing is Obama's actual agenda. Maybe he's not holding back anything. Maybe this is it.

[geek tragedy]

3. Obama got more votes from Republicans than from DU'ers.

No particular constituency owns his presidency.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

5. Not much progress but the art of sloganeering and excuse making has improved.

But, it's beginning to wear thin in the face of reality.

[maglatinavi]

6. Obama

I was a Hillary person ... ... :nopity: :nopity: :nopity:

[Kahuna]

7. If you don't go there I promise...

not to mention who it was who mucked up the healthcare issue in the first place. :boring:

[FiveGoodMen]

34. Hillary campaigned on things like the health care purchase mandate...

She played the race card...

She preferred McCain/Palin to a Dem...

She basically TOLD us she would be as bad as Obama has turned out to be.

[sendero]

78. Ain't that the truth..

.. no matter how bad Obama is Clinton would have been worse. And McCain a disaster.

[SammyWinstonJack]

40. .

[Connie_Corleone]

9. Obama's plan to get out of Iraq is on track and is actually ahead of schedule.

I don't think anyone expected him to have all the troops withdrawn in 9 months. If they did, they were living in fantasy land.

No one knows what Obama will do in Afghanistan except we're not getting out. But then again, he never campaigned on withdrawing from Afghanistan.

People want him to roll back unitary executive, YET they want him to use it to end DADT (a federal law). Make up your mind.

Obama never campaigned on single-payer.

Torture and warrantless wiretapping are legitimate issues.

[frazzled]

11. I think you forgot only one thing

Torture has been settled: it has been banned. (Please don't give me cases of possible rendition ... the question is one of scope, judicial oversight, and options: Clinton did it, too, but very judiciously; the point is: we do not torture to "get information.").

Otherwise, your list is pretty much what I was planning to write.

I think the OP's argument, however, is more than just misinterpreting what Obama ran on, or even what he has accomplished or not. Being "for" single payer in the abstract is far different from being cognizant of what is achievable legislatively. Refusing to acknowledge the intricacies of legislative give and take is naive and hopelessly idealistic. By the same token, to think the Afghanistan question has an easy solution is, well, not to think at all really.

Lastly, I think there are a lot of presumptions about what "DU" as a whole thinks: it runs the gamut from idealistic to cretin, and everything in between.

[Connie_Corleone]

13. I was going to write that torture was banned.

But I figured the OP was talking about prosecutions of Bush and Cheney regarding torture.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

91. it may have been banned but it still goes on

Jeremy Scahill: “Little Known Military Thug Squad Still Brutalizing Prisoners at Gitmo Under Obama”

Jeremy Scahill reports the Obama administration is continuing to use a notorious military police unit at Guantanamo that regularly brutalizes unarmed prisoners, including gang-beating them, breaking their bones, gouging their eyes and dousing them with chemicals. This force, officially known as the Immediate Reaction Force, has been labeled the “Extreme Repression Force” by Guantanamo prisoners, and human rights lawyers call their actions illegal.


http://www.democracynow.org/2009/5/19/jeremy_scahill_little_known_military_thug

[spiritual_gunfighter]

90. The only problem with the OP is assuming that Obama

was liberal/progressive in the first place, he wasn't and isn't. Too bad.

edited for spelling.

[Writer]

10. I think Obama wishes that we would stop fighting and refighting the ideological battles...

of the 1960's and focus instead on fixing problems.

[Skidmore]

12. I wonder if you hold the lawmakers in Congress to as high a standard

or criticism as you do this man? I hold him least responsible because everyone from you on up the food chain cannot find a reason to pitch in and help.

[unhappycamper]

16. I am not a fan of my congress critters.

They are the enablers; Obama's the front man.

[Name removed]

88. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[elocs]

14. I still believe Obama should simply cede decision making to a DU panel.

Then we would know Nirvana and all would be perfect.

[SIMPLYB1980]

18. LOL!

:spray: :rofl:

[barbtries]

27. he doesn't even need a DU panel

he could just defer to ME. :hippie:

[QC]

79. As opposed to letting a panel of Goldman Sachs boys run everything....

[blondeatlast]

81. DUzy. And yup, we all surely could fix the world--and we'd all get ponies, too.

:thumbsup:

[cbdo2007]

20. Well....*some* of us want a single-payer Health Care Plan.

Not "Most" of us.

[fascisthunter]

22. agree (nt)

[bvar22]

23. Not just DU.

Here is what The Majority of Americans (Democrats and Republicans) want from their government:

In recent polls (2005) by the Pew Research Group, the Opinion Research Corporation, the Wall Street Journal, and CBS News, the American majority has made clear how it feels. Look at how the majority feels about some of the issues that you'd think would be gospel to a real Democratic Party:

1. 65 percent (of ALL Americans, Democrats AND Republicans) say the government should guarantee health insurance for everyone -- even if it means raising taxes.

2. 86 percent favor raising the minimum wage (including 79 percent of selfdescribed "social conservatives").

3. 60 percent favor repealing either all of Bush's tax cuts or at least those cuts that went to the rich.

4. 66 percent would reduce the deficit not by cutting domestic spending but by reducing Pentagon spending or raising taxes.

5. 77 percent believe the country should do "whatever it takes" to protect the environment.

6. 87 percent think big oil corporations are gouging consumers, and 80 percent (including 76 percent of Republicans) would support a windfall profits tax on the oil giants if the revenues went for more research on alternative fuels.

7. 69 percent agree that corporate offshoring of jobs is bad for the U.S. economy (78 percent of "disaffected" voters think this), and only 22% believe offshoring is good because "it keeps costs down."

http://alternet.org/story/29788/

8. Over 63% oppose the War on the Iraqi People.

9. 92% of ALL Americans support TRANSPARENT, VERIFIABLE elections!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x446445

[HipChick]

24. I worked on a major goverment project...

It was to do systems conversions and upgrade...it was projected to take 1yr..it took 4yrs...because of just how big and cumbersome the government ACTUALLY is...we will see change, but you are kidding yourself if you think it will be in 10 months..

[FiveGoodMen]

35. Timing is NOT the issue

Obama is pulling in the wrong direction.

The longer he does that, the WORSE it will get.

[Kahuna]

38. You know what direction he's pulling, how? Are you or anyone you know

a part of his inner circle? You need to stop listening to the pundits who need to justify their existence by making stuff up.

[jgraz]

67. Y'know, there are these things called "newspapers" and "web sites"

All you need to know is in the public record. Unless you're one of those who believes that Obama has some secret plan to do exactly the opposite of what he's indicating he's going to do.

[jgraz]

68. In truth, timing is a big part of the issue.

With his electoral mandate, the inauguration and the economic crisis, Obama had a golden opportunity to establish himself as a real agent of change. He squandered that opportunity and now the window is closed. Unless something else big happens, get used to nibbling around the edges.

[FiveGoodMen]

97. When you put it that way, I agree. (Sadly)

[Stinky The Clown]

30. Puppies

Lots of puppy pictures.

And pom poms.

Lots of cheerleaders with pom poms.

[Greyhound]

31. Of how about that he was elected to lead for four years, not campaign for

another four year campaign.

After the speeches and the rubber chicken dinners, the job needs doing.

[Union Yes]

36. I voted for BO with hopes he would be a pro-union fighter for the little person. Dems have wasted..

more political capital then I've ever seen a party in power waste in my fucking lifetime.

[SIMPLYB1980]

37. More than the republicans wasted after 9:11?

I think not.

[Greyhound]

60. You're kidding, right? They transformed the world in months after 9/11. n/t

[PVnRT]

72. They wasted nothing, thanks to the Good Democrats Who Do No Wrong

who went along with everything they wanted.

[noiretextatique]

43. +1

[Autumn]

47. Not yet

so we will wait and see.

[Greyhound]

52. Oops accidental unrec.

:blush:

[PretzelWarrior]

56. so assuming your screen name was during Bush era...

we can assume you're just an unhappy camper regardless of what happens.

[treestar]

58. He didn't realize there was a deadline

And that you were appointed to determine it.

You're determined to be unhappy, that's all.

[branders seine]

64. change is off the table

and has been for 364 days now.

[western mass]

73. Obama's role is to block change. Seriously...

you didn't realize this when he filled the positions of power in his admin with RW corporate tools like Rahm Emmanuel and Geitner?

Obama is corporate america's insurance policy to make sure that nothing "terrible" happens in between Republican administrations.

[natrat]

74. obama and company are complete and utter frauds aligned with bad people

sadly things are going to get really bad when they crash the dollar and our way of life and standard of living is swept out from beneath us. We will be very poor soon. Creepy times.

[Cha]

99. No they're not.

[DailyGrind51]

75. Although you will have detractors in rose-colored glasses, I am not in their number, thank you!

[PuraVidaDreamin]

80. Thanks UHC!

:pals: :hug:

[Xenotime]

82. Nope.

[dionysus]

89. anyone who thinks obama could fix decades worth of problems in one year has to be a blithering idiot

:shrug:

[lonestarnot]

94. Some

movement would be nice, even a bm.

[Cha]

98. I'm a member of DU and I understand what the President

understands..that he is building a strong foundation to make the changes last.

President Obama has actually been working and not just sitting around complaining about what hasn't been done fast enough.


Cross posted from GDP..

"Appointed a Special Envoy for Middle East peace

Order the closing of Guantanamo Bay

Prohibit use of torture

Obama Orders Secret Prisons and Detention Camps Closed

Obama Sets Bold New Principles for U.S. Energy, Climate Policies

Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act of 2009

American Recovery and Reinvestment Act

The Edward M. Kennedy Serve America Act

Omnibus Public Lands Management Act

Special Inspector General for the Troubled Asset Relief Program Act of 2009

Fraud Enforcement and Recovery Act of 2009 or FERA (PDF)

Helping Families Save Their Homes Act of 2009

Enhanced Partnership with Pakistan Act of 2009 (Kerry-Lugar includes funding for Obama's global poverty initiative)

Ryan White HIV/AIDS Treatment Extension Act of 2009

End of 22-Year Discriminatory Travel Ban

Veterans Health Care Budget Reform and Transparency Act

Stopping Conflict-related Sexual Violence Against Women and Children

The UN, Women & Girls

New policy steps towards Cuba

Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty with Russia

Strategy to address the international nuclear threat

For the Media: "30+ Reasons Obama deserves the Nobel Peace Prize"

Russia on Nobel Peace Prize: Obama thawing 'second cold war'

World Reaction to Obama Winning the Nobel

Turkey, Armenia sign historic accord

Why the Stimulus Worked

Green jobs for real people: The story behind the recovery numbers

Obama's Plan: Financial Regulatory Reform: A New Foundation (PDF)


Requiring Strong Supervision And Appropriate Regulation Of All Financial Firms (pdf)


Strengthening Regulation Of Core Markets And Market Infrastructure (pdf)


Strengthening Consumer Protection (pdf)


Providing The Government With Tools To Effectively Manage Failing Institutions (pdf)


Improving International Regulatory Standards And Cooperation (pdf)


House Panel Moves Derivatives Toward Obama’s Proposal

FACTBOX: Major U.S. financial regulation reform proposals

Obama says Senate bill on tax havens would stop abuses

Statement by President Barack Obama on House and Senate Introducing Legislation to Crack Down on Overseas Tax Havens

Obama to chair historic U.N. council nuclear meeting

G20 to Become Forum for Global Economic Cooperation

Next comes Obama's budget, health care reform and more."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8730317