Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

We have no alternative to dumping a bottle of Chanel #5 into a full cat box

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 03:15 AM
Original message
We have no alternative to dumping a bottle of Chanel #5 into a full cat box
At least according to the cheerleaders for the Pelosi health care bill. You are all right of course, in insisting that there are some things in this bill that are worth having. I just don't get the insistence that these things absolutely have to be tied to the forced purchase of a garbage product from private insurance thieves. It is exactly like insisting that expensive perfume MUST be dumped into a pile of used kitty litter instead of being kept in its own bottle. Or that you absolutely have to eat a poison ivy salad just because it's dressed with expensive balsamic vinegar.

Why not try to save only what's worth saving instead? I've read the numbered highlights that Pelosi put out, and have the following suggestions. (I've noticed that neither Pelosi nor any of the people hyping this press release have said a single thing about mandates, nor about the public option being more expensive and available to only 10%. I’m sure they are hoping that no one notices.)

Put all the useful parts of Medicare reform into one separate bill.
Include with 6-8 the Dicks/Inslee bill (Cantwell in the Senate) changing reimbursement to end the penalty against states which provide better results with less money now.

6. ELIMINATES COST-SHARING FOR PREVENTIVE SERVICES IN MEDICARE—Eliminates co-payments for preventive services and exempts preventive services from deductibles under the Medicare program.

7. IMPROVES HELP FOR LOW-INCOME MEDICARE BENEFICIARIES—Improves the low-income protection programs in Medicare to assure more individuals are able to access this vital help.

8. PROVIDES NEW CONSUMER PROTECTIONS IN MEDICARE ADVANTAGE— Prohibits Medicare Advantage plans from charging enrollees higher cost-sharing for services in their private plan than what is charged in traditional Medicare.


1. BEGINS TO CLOSE THE MEDICARE PART D DONUT HOLE — Reduces the donut hole by $500 and institutes a 50% discount on brand-name drugs, effective January 1, 2010.

Throw the above on the burn pile and start over. This is an area where incrementalism is witless. Pass one piece of legislation abolishing the entire donut hole starting now. And negotiate bulk prices with pharmaceutical companies while you are at it.

2. IMMEDIATE HELP FOR THE UNINSURED UNTIL EXCHANGE IS AVAILABLE (INTERIM HIGH-RISK POOL) — Creates a temporary insurance program until the Exchange is available for individuals who have been uninsured for several months or have been denied a policy because of pre-existing conditions.

Burn pile. A useless overpriced abortion, given that it would probably be like what high risk pools at the state level are now. Just let high risk people into Medicare early like we do with disabled people. Put the subsidy money into Medicare to take care of the extra expense.

Private insurance consumer reform bill. Another separate bill with 3, 4, 5 and 10

3. BANS LIFETIME LIMITS ON COVERAGE—Prohibits health insurance companies from placing lifetime caps on coverage.

4. ENDS RESCISSIONS—Prohibits insurers from nullifying or rescinding a patient’s policy when they file a claim for benefits, except in the case of fraud.

5. INCREASE DEPENDENT AGE FOR POLICIES THROUGH AGE 26: Allows those through age 26 not otherwise covered to remain on their parents’ policies at their parents’ discretion

10. CONTINUITY FOR DISPLACED WORKERS—Allows Americans to keep their COBRA coverage until the Exchange is in place and they can access affordable coverage.


9. IMMEDIATE SUNSHINE ON PRICE GOUGING—Discourages excessive price increases by insurance companies through review and disclosure of insurance rate increases.

Burn pile-- useless tripe, not unlike Conyers' sternly worded letters to Rove et al chastising them for refusing to answer subpoenas. If we have to work through private insurance, just cut the crap and regulate what they can charge and what they must cover like every other civilized country with privately insured universal care does.

12. HELP FOR EARLY RETIREES—Creates a $10 billon fund to finance a temporary reinsurance program to help offset the costs of expensive health claims for employers that provide health benefits for retirees age 55-64.

Burn pile. Useless to retirees with no access to such benefits. Put the $10 billion into Medicare, and allow retirees in this age group to join, as Senator Rockefeller has already proposed. Direct benefits to retirees should trump benefits to employers.

Each of the following could be separate bills.

11. CREATES NEW, VOLUNTARY, PUBLIC LONG-TERM CARE INSURANCE PROGRAM—Creates a long-term care insurance program to be financed by voluntary payroll deductions to provide benefits to adults who become functionally disabled.

13. COMMUNITY HEALTH CENTERS—Increases funding for Community Health Centers to allow for a doubling of the number of patients seen by the centers over the next 5 years.

14. INCREASING NUMBER OF PRIMARY CARE DOCTORS — Provides new investment in training programs to increase the number of primary care doctors, nurses, and public health professionals.


A note to single payer advocates

There is a really big constituency of partisan Dems out there who desperately want any bill at all so that Obama and the Dems don't look foolish after all the health care uproar. As a result, they have thrown away all capacity for logical analysis. We MUST come up with some bills that could pass, benefit at least some, and not permanently entrench murderers and thieves in power over us. Please use the above as a starting point for laying out some possibilities. Let's start with contacting members of the Progressive Caucus. Not suggesting that we quit on the Kucinich or Weiner amendments; just that we think ahead more.

There are also a lot of microconstituencies like parents of uninsured 20-somethings, affluent people who are now uninsurable and could afford outrageous premiums, etc, that will benefit from one provision in the existing legislation. It is tactically stupid to insist that Chanel #5 is bad and that they don't really want it. Better to point out that they have more productive uses for it than pouring it all over a pile of steaming cat shit.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
aSpeckofDust Donating Member (292 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 03:20 AM
Response to Original message
1. We must protect our phoney baloney jobs, gentlemen! Harumph! harumph! n/t
:dunce:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WildClarySage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 03:25 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. I didn't get a "harrumph!" outta that guy.
Give the Governor a "Harrumph"!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Divine Discontent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 04:39 AM
Response to Reply #2
7. Harrumph!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
peekaloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #1
18. Welcome to DU!
*harumph*

:hi:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OffWithTheirHeads Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 03:56 AM
Response to Original message
3. Welcome to the third world, brought to you by the intrenched
interests of the top 2%. Your so called elected representatives don't give a shit about you! You don't pay them enough!
Hey, they would like your vote come election time but, lets face it, who ever can place the biggest media buy come election time wins!

You wonder why there is no news? The entire election process is dependent on corporate media advertising dollars. Since the corporate media is now totally owned by about six corporations, their only incentive is to stir up the shit and cause our "candidates" to spend more money! Pulling fake stories out of your ass and promoting them just means that someone will have to spend more money to refute them.

Works the same way in reverse! Mr. corporate parasite, I am thinking about introducing legislation that will reign in your abuses of the American people. How much campaign cash can I get from you to fold on this issue?

I'm sorry, after working my ass off for Obama and a Democratic majority and after listening to all the bullshit, and seeing the crap legislation we are being handed, I just don't believe anymore. I give Obama and the Democratic party the same faith I have in Halliburton to do the right thing. Fuck em.

The Dems can go to hell. They are owned by the same 2% as the Pubs. Voting is pointless. I'm on my own. What a country!
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 04:06 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Look. Dems have passed some good stuff this year
Repubs would drive us further and faster downhill. True, we need a lot more than good--we need bold and we aren't getting it. Think primary challenges, not giving up.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
OffWithTheirHeads Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 04:10 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Yeah, a primay challenge will do alota good against Di Fi?
Joe Lieberman in drag? Give e a break. Fuck em.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 04:28 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Part of the problem here is that the left dropped out of electoral politics in the 70s
As a result, we don't have a lot of people like Sanders and Kucinich coming out of the pipeline. The right wing did not, and here we are. Why cede more ground to them?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
kath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-02-09 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #3
25. +1
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Ruby the Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 04:55 AM
Response to Original message
8. Well done. Good points, all.
I don't disagree with anything you have stated.

K&R
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 05:04 AM
Response to Original message
9. not a glass half full type, are you?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 05:09 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Just suggesting that we keep the half that is useful
--and get rid of the rest. Explain why you have a problem with that.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 05:50 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. assuming there is a half that is useful... hell, now you have me sounding like you.
we are going to get what we get. whatever they give us.

you know that is true. i know that is true. what are we discussing here?

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 06:00 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. So if someone shoves a shit sandwich in your mouth--
--you have to chew and swallow?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 06:10 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. when those someones are my representitaves in the house and senate. do i have a choice?
i get being all pissed off and all because we elected these motherfuckers...

but they are our representatives.

why exactly are you pissed off about your shit sandwich? you voted for these cooks and servers, right?

right?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 06:28 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. Yes. Caught between a rock and a hard place
I'm supporting primary runs against incumbents when it makes tactical sense. Right now the Repukes want to abolish Medicare and kill sick people, and Dems just want to force us to give all our discretionary income to insurance thieves. The former is worse, and I think that in the OP I pointed out some ways in which we could salvage some of the legislation on the table.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 07:18 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. you go, girl!
i get that you are 20 years old or some such.

i was young once too and thought like you. fight the good fight. i hope you win this time.

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 04:52 PM
Response to Reply #16
19. I'm 63. I stayed out of electoral politics for my entire adult life
Trying to make up for lost time while I still have time.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
glitch Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #9
17. Half full of what? Or does that not matter?
PS There is no glass.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 06:06 PM
Response to Reply #17
20. There are useful things in the legislation
I have another post about how those things might be separated out of the dreck.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 05:11 AM
Response to Original message
11. Brand new definition of "purist"
"Someone who suggests that single payer advocates revise proposed legislation to be minimally harmful."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Laelth Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 06:24 PM
Response to Original message
21. Sane and reasonable. Thank you. n/t
:dem:

-Laelth
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
inna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 08:40 PM
Response to Original message
22. excellent post. KR.

(is this an original, or is there a link? just curious.)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Nov-01-09 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
23. Excellent post, eridani. This is a good synopsis of what we should be DEMANDING from
the Democrats in Congress.

They presented us with the menu for the banquet but the banquet isn't until December sometime. I'm thinking it's time to substitute a roast beef sandwich or tofuburger for that shit sandwich.

Rec.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-02-09 01:00 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. I think we need to target the Progressive Caucus with this, so they don't wuss out
I really do get Dems who are so desperate for anything to pass that they'll vote for this economic disaster. So let's give them an alternative which will help some, not cause overt harm, and enable them to say, "See, we did pass something. And it would have been more if not for the Repubs."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bertman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-02-09 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. They may be worried that it will be used against them in the mid-terms--as in,
"see, the Democrats can't get anything done even with a majority in both houses."

It's a sound byte world we live in. Nobody thinks anything can be explained in full sentences that require listening for more than two minutes. And comprehending.

I'm no political strategist, but I'm pretty sure that's what's driving the push.

What really bothers me about this is that they may feel like they can sit back for years and do nothing while this half-assed reform goes into effect. I think that's what the Big Insurance lobbyists are counting on.



Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
eridani Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-02-09 09:29 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. That's why I'm proposing that we demonstrate that they can have a partial win
The political push to do something is really strong, and we have to have specific positive proposals.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Thu Apr 18th 2024, 06:38 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Archives » General Discussion (1/22-2007 thru 12/14/2010) Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC