We don't have any voice or choices

[blues90]

I am not politically savoy by any stretch .

What I do see is we are offered candidates based on what the reps want and who they will back and who are in the pockets of the corporations.

It is all an inside job. We are told to pick the lessor of two evils.

That is not choice.

We have politicians in office that have been there decades as a career and each election the stakes rise higher and higher how much one has to have to even be considered , that is not choice.

What will the next general election cost 3 billion? Isn't this becoming a bit extreme?

It's always the money with any issue , it starts there and it ends there. Or who has the most star quality along with the most backing.

People vote , we still have black box machines and we still have delegates deciding the final outcome so where is our choice in this really.

They have their hands on the health care and when this finally comes to some end what's next.

All I see is a deliberate action to erase all the wrongs, words and speeches selling a product for a better world and yet nothing really changes.

In a very real sense our laws and regulations are as twisted as the health insurance companies because they decide not you or me.

I really doubt any rep wants campaign re-finance from either party because that would ruin the party. They don't take issue or care about the means we are left with to vote because if they really did there would be no black box machines , the truth about war crimes would be dealt with . The wars would end and they would focus on the people of this country as each rep has promised to do when they are sworn in . Even that means nothing.

All the people are left with is to wonder and worry because the people are left out , we don't belong to the big club we are slaves to the big clubs.

It amazes me how people still insist on treating presidents and reps as stars . When was the last time this really made a difference?

[ProleNoMore]

1. Agreed, The Sham Of A Two Party Political System Is Self-Evident

eom

[Louisiana1976]

2. Right--the way the system is set up voting for a 3rd-party candidate is just like voting

for "None of the above."

[brentspeak]

3. There are good Democratic representatives and senators

But they're constantly outmaneuvered by the corporate Dems and the weak leadership -- weak leadership put in their positions because they are weak.

[blues90]

4. Not to dissagree .

I can't say I would call them weak , I would use the term bought off to promote the lobbies that support them . That's self interest.

[Electric Monk]

5. You are not politically a variety of cabbage? not politically a region of France?

not politically a ruling house of Sardinia? not politically an oil drilling company?

http://www.answers.com/savoy :rofl:

[stray cat]

6. We each have the same voice as anyone else who votes - and most disagree with your vote

thats a drawback to democracy

[Sebastian Doyle]

7. Ah, yes the old artificial DLC "this is a center right" country talking point.

Bullshit when From & Marshall first said it, and bullshit now.

The only thing "center-right" is the media. And that's just NBC. the rest of it is FAR right.

People with brains are left of center. People without brains probably would be, if they heard the fucking truth from somebody.

[blues90]

9. Do you care to expand on that ?

Do you know what my vote is and how does everyone have the same vote when if fact they vote only for who is offered up .

This is not an Obama pissing contest this is a direct question based on just how our voting system works.

Please do tell me where I'm wrong.

This is nothing new but really if people go out and vote and the delegates have the final say how does anyones vote count when the delegates decide in the end who wins each state and the popular vote is cancelled out due to this very process? Also tell me it has nothing to do with how much money backs each candidate and where it comes for does not influence the outcome.

If each personal vote counted and the elections were based on popular vote alone then yes the people voted.

Face the reality , if even the best candidate on earth ran if they do not the backing of corporations and lobby groups they are out of the picture.

[MadHound]

14. Yeah, trouble is that corporate money is outweighing all of our votes

Until we get corporate money out of government, votes and voters, we the people will always be left holding the very short end of the stick.

That's the real drawback to our current "democracy".

[UrbScotty]

8. Quit whining, and grab a mop.

I'm sick of all this bull that I see on DU almost every day.

I wonder who here on DU is actually doing much to change anything?

Thank goodness our President - who is more progressive and less 'evil' than some people will acknowledge - doesn't take that cynical view. If he did, we'd probably be in worse shape than we are now.

[blues90]

10. Cynical view , no it's a realistic view .

If you are sick of it then don't look. No one forced you . I offered my view if you don't like it well that's fine . It's hardly whining. I put it out there and it's your right to dissagree but insults do little good in any given situation.

If you want to make it personal then you have the wrong thread. That's pretty simple.

[blues90]

13. You are nothing more than a blind corporate shill

Bought and paid for buy the political machine and have not mind of your own with your stupid brainwashed talking points . Good luck with that .

[PretzelWarrior]

11. you sound like Ralph Nader in 2000.

I will take more "voices and choices" as long as they are conservative independent candidates or Constution party members or Libertarians in 2010.

[blues90]

12. That's not my view at all , I am a liberal .

All I am pointing out is how the process is done and the end result .

Do you actually think the people by and large pick the candidates or is it more rational thinking to know that the party politics offer them up based on who will be backed and by whom?

Based on this alone we would have never had GW or HW or Reagan. This stuff does not happen by accident . Even Clinton who I voted for did quite a few things that I was not thrilled about and look where that got us. These things still have a great affect on all of us now.

It is a gradual chipping away of the peoples vote which is over ridden by those inside the beltway that create the end result.