McChrystal is nuts.

[Are_grits_groceries]

Go All-In, Or Fold
In Afghanistan, Splitting the Difference May Be Obama's Most Dangerous Choice
<snip>
McChrystal's 66-page confidential assessment makes the case for a far more expansive counterinsurgency mission, one that would involve sending more troops and civilian reconstruction personnel to Kandahar and other key population centers to improve security, governance and economic opportunities for Afghans. Although the general never used the term in the assessment, his strategy amounts to a comprehensive nation-building endeavor.

He wants U.S. and NATO personnel to expand training programs for Afghan soldiers and policemen, reform the justice system, promote more effective local administration and ramp up reconstruction. If that occurs, he and other counterinsurgency experts contend, then Afghans who have sided with the Taliban out of fear or necessity will eventually switch sides and support the government. Building an effective state, in McChrystal's view, is the only way to defeat the insurgency.
<snip>

McChrystal's 66-page confidential assessment: http://media.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/documents/Assessment_Redacted_092109.pdf?sid=ST2009092003140

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/25/AR2009092502009.html

Does he honestly think that we can build an effective state in Afghanistan?
The only way to subdue the entire country would leave a lot of troops there until the end of time. There would be a lot of casualties, and it would tie up enormous amounts of resources.

We do need to be able to find a way to help Pakistan stabilize, and we possibly could help fight the Taliban from there.

I don't know what the answer is. However, I think McChrystal's plan is delusional, and just a holding action that will keep our forces occupied for a long time. It could just be a way to try to force Obama to make a hard choice now, and possibly oppose the military. That would open him up to criticism that would make calling him a socialist seem mild.

[Uben]

1. McCrystal is military

Of course he is gonna ask for expansion....it's what he does...it's ALL he does. That is his domain and I don't ever see him asking for withdrawal because that would mean he accepted defeat. So, he's not crazy, he is just doing what any good military officer would do...ask for more and take what you get.

[Democracyinkind]

2. Nah. A good military officer would assess the situation and mission and draw realistic conclusions.

Of course you have a point, he's a military man, he thinks in purely militaristic terms. But that's the problem. Afghanistan is not a problem that can be solved militarily, in fact, militaristic thinking is a big part of what has gotten into this mess (or created the mess after we arrived, whatever you prefer). So while I agree with what you're saying, I'd have to add that this isn't what any good military officer would do. A good military officer shouldn't hold on to unsuccessful concepts that are proven not to work just because it is the only perceived option. He might as well start a discussion about what really is needed in Afghanistan or he could point out that even half a million troops would not be able to fulfill the vague, lofty goals that underlie our current mission in Afghanistan. He could simply resign with a bang in the face of all of this. So there's many options, and a good military officer should and would consider all of them.

[Are_grits_groceries]

3. Okay.

His strategy is nuts.

[Mari333]

5. He's nuts too...you were right the first time

anyone who would involve themselves in a system thats that corrupt and ugly has to be insane.

[TheKentuckian]

4. He nuts because he wants to do counter-insurgency when the state has failed

and was ineffectual and limited in it's reach at peak.

500k to fight 28 million at our level of technological and training advantage is easily doable but even that draw dropping number is well short of being able to police these folks into cohesion, especially accounting for terrain, political history, and religion.

There isn't truly a government to protect and certainly not one the Americans are willing to empty our treasure and spill our blood to ensure. Anything beyond an anti-terror mission is a FAIL.

[old mark]

6. The British tried that in the 1800's and failed, the Soviets tried it

in the last few decades and failed - I really don't want to be next in line.

We tried this before in Vietnam - the Chinese, the Japanese and the French all failed before we did.
I used to hear things about "the lessons we learned in Vietnam", but I guess we forgot them already.


mark

[madokie]

8. You know the lesson that 'they' learned in Vietnam was

to keep it off our teevee screens for the sheeple back here to not see. Thats the only lesson the powers to be learned from that invasion and occupation

[rtassi]

11. 'They' also learned how to box in a President .. kill him ... then get away with it!

[prostomulgus]

7. Bottom line?

1. We need to pull the military out of all foreign bases & back to the US
2. Cut the military budget AT LEAST in half, maybe more.
3. Eliminate ALL of our nuclear weapons.
4. Use the peace dividend to help the millions of unemployed, poor, starving, and homeless people in this country for a change.

[laughingliberal]

9. In one respect he is correct

Any efforts there will fail if we do not improve the conditions for the people of the country. It is the mistake we made when we trained and armed the mujahideen in the 80's to fight our proxy war with the Soviets. Once the Soviets left the people were abandoned to the same hopeless economic conditions and the government collapsed to the mujahideen resistance which led to the conditions which brought the Taliban to power. Not saying we should pursue this strategy but I am saying he is correct in his assessment of what's needed. The question is whether or not the victory we would win there would be worth the expenditures.

[ixion]

10. they all are

in my opinion.

[AngryOldDem]

12. We learn nothing from history. AGAIN.

This is almost exactly like the truckload of bullshit the Joint Chiefs and McNamara sold LBJ.

[Oregone]

13. 600,000 troops == draft right?!?

There is no other way about it.

Look, do people really disagree with what this person is saying? I only disagree that the US can be *assured* of success with a massive escalation. But, at the current rate, the war will go no where. Does Obama think he has some magical alternative to "win" without actually committing a reasonable effort?

So...either piss or get off the pot. If you aren't willing to fight a war, end the war.