Isn't it time to begin Impeachment and Criminal Proceedings?

[MessiahRp]

Andrew Jackson and Bill Clinton faced impeachment for far less and yet Democrats still haven't put impeachment on the table.

Every day this regime stays in office, they kill more soldiers and Iraqis with their ridiculous war policy, subvert the constitution and make the Presidency the role of a dictator, they work towards eliminating fairness in elections, they harm the environment by rewriting EPA reports, they loot the treasury of tax dollars for their contributor/benefactors, they alienate foreign powers and create enemies for generations to come and as a whole they flip the bird at the rule of law.

How the fuck is impeachment NOT on the table?

With the entire email scandal we're talking about the Presidential Records Law being broken. We already have Oath of Offices broken from other lies involving the war. You can make an easy case that the entire wiretapping fiasco is illegal and I don't doubt that something legally could be done about the way signing statements are being carried out.

The legal arguments are there! This isn't just a leg to stand on, this is an entire army of legs.

Not to mention the man is so ungodly unpopular, there will not be the backlash Republicans faced over the Clinton fiasco. Clinton was popular and most people did not believe he should be impeached over oral sex.

Let me point this out to Democrats who need a slap in the face.

THIS IS WORSE THAN ORAL SEX!

You might be aware of that but many of you seem too timid to act.

Also, this is NOT about retaliation. Had Bush not subverted law at every turn this wouldn't even be a discussion, no matter how much we hate his policies. He and his crew of criminals did this themselves.

My advice to Democrats is this:

Subpoena the emails all the way back to 2001. Find everything you can find. Find the 2004 Election Fraud info, find the Attorney Scandal stuff, find the memos about lying about this war, find all the wiretapping memos you can, find EVERYTHING.

And do it quickly.

America can ill afford anymore time with this man in charge. Our soldiers, our citizens, IRAQI citizens all deserve better.

No more off the table shit.

Once you get the emails the shit will hit the fan. Even Republicans won't carry water for this man anymore.

I haven't read them but I can't imagine a single person that doesn't believe that SEVERAL smoking guns will be found there.

Get the emails. Impeach Bush & Cheney. Begin criminal proceedings.

These men have broke the law numerous times and NOBODY, even the son of a rich oil-invested politician, is ABOVE the law.

-Rp

[rock]

1. Way past time

In fact, so far past time, that I don't think they going to do it.

[Demeter]

2. Nonetheless, It MUST Be Done

While I can understand that current Congressional leadership cringes at the cost, pain and waste of taking the appropriate actions in the short term, in the long term our country's integrity, survival and success DEPENDS UPON IMPEACHMENT, PROSECUTION, AND PUNISHMENT!

[lonestarnot]

11. Yes it MUST! a28.org

[liberal N proud]

3. I am tired of the Democratic leaders saying that it will hurt their chances in 08

[MessiahRp]

5. I agree

This is not the same as Bill Clinton. Americans clearly saw that the Clinton thing was personal vendetta and that oral sex was not a reason to impeach.

This is WAY different. There are multiple REAL crimes here and the more that are uncovered the more Bush's support goes in the toilet. The man is at 30% and there is no backlash when 70% of America is with you.

Rp

[cascadiance]

17. It will hurt them if they DON'T!

If they are perceived as doing nothing all of this time, and you get someone like Chuck Hagel suddenly stepping forward with about 20 Republicans taking the LEADERSHIP to coax the Democrats into impeachment to preserve their party, then the Democrats WILL lose the congress again and perhaps someone like Hagel the presidency! This sort of thing is already happening with the new Republican governor in Florida on election reform. Check Brad's Blog on this story...

http://www.bradblog.com/?p=4370

The same will happen with Democrats if they don't amp it up on putting impeachment back on the table and TAKE THE LEAD on doing so! That WILL give them more support in 2008!

[DearAbby]

20. I have been telling my friends and family

what if it were the GOP who make calls for impeachment? Imagine if you will, the GOP party see the writing on the wall. Their party is pretty much doomed, because they rubber stamped it...but...if they were the first to call for impeachment, WHEN everything comes out...The scope of the damage this administration has done, the Democrats will be seen enabling this administration, the GOP will become heroes, the party that saved America.



Get the lead out Dems, daylight is burning. This is deeper than the white house, tentacles of coruption in all throughout this government...If the GOP call for impeachment, much of it will be covered up, and it will business as usual, like the Iran Contra, the BCCI...on and on and on.

[Loge23]

4. The amazing disappearing scandals

Influence peddling - Abramoff
Iraq - Downing Street Memos
Energy - Cheney's secret cabal
9/11 - 'nuff said
CIA outing - Plame affair
Bill of Rights - "Patriot" Act
Elections - see 2000 & 2004
D.Attorney firings - more hearings this week
National information scandal - Don Imus more interesting

So many scandals, so little time.
Gotta go! The Larry Birkhead interview is about start!

[bluescribbler]

9. Don't forget

Cheney was still drawing a salary from Halliburton while serving as VP. Then they got a huge no-bid contract for Iraq? Can't be a coincidence.

[AndyA]

6. It is way past time for impeachment and criminal proceedings.

What we have going on right now is much worse than anything in our history. I can't remember a time when we've had a more corrupt administration in office. They lie, start wars without cause, bankrupt our treasury, out covert CIA agents, manipulate the judicial system, discriminate, spy on us, allow the worst terrorist attack on American soil due to their negligence, make policy that is for the benefit of their corporate friends and to the detriment of the American people.

They were AWOL from service, or got multiple deferments. They have destroyed evidence to cover up their misdeeds in office.

I can't imagine why impeachment is NOT on the table at this point, unless the Dem leaders are complicit in these illegal activities.

The Constitution does not give Congress the option of NOT impeaching for high crimes and misdemeanors, it REQUIRES it. Congress cannot just decide to not impeach because they don't want to. It's MANDATORY.

I only hope the investigations currently underway reveal evidence so disturbing, Congress has no choice but to proceed with impeachment. They have to be getting close.

[Thothmes]

7. Impeachment

Which article and section of the Constitution levies a mandatory requirement for impeachment. I could not find it in my copy of the Constitution.

[AndyA]

15. Constitution: "...shall be removed from office on Impeachment..."

The Constitution, Article II, Section 4:

The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors.

"Shall be" does not relate to "if Congress deems it so."

I'm sure there are some legal professionals who would argue against this, but the words "shall be removed from Office on Impeachment" don't leave much to be interpreted. The legal people I've talked to about this say the language seems pretty clear. If there were exceptions, they would be noted.

[uppityperson]

19. Odd, yesterday you posted about impeachment, yet quoted wrong article

you said article 3 when it is article 2.

[Jcrowley]

8. This is a constitutional issue

The Democrats, and 'pubs, have sworn an oath to protect the Constitution. Many have stated that they are aware of the fact that BushCo. has violated the Constitution. And it needn't even go this far in statements. It is only if there is reason to believe there were possibility of high crimes and misdemeanors that investigative procedures are to begin. It is the SWORN DUTY of these people to begin these hearings. It is the obligation of the officeholder to protect the Constitution. In not doing so they are not just shirking their duty they are violating their oath of office.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

On December 18, 2005, Conyers introduced a resolution (H. Res. 635) that would create a special House committee to investigate a variety of allegations against President Bush and possibly make a recommendation to the full House that the allegations merit impeachment. It was assigned to the House Committee on Rules, where the committee's chairman in the 109th Congress, Rep. David Dreier (R-Calif.), did not bring it up for a vote. <5> Many believed, however, that if the Democrats won control of the House in November 2006, Conyers, as likely chairman of the Judiciary Committee, would continue to pursue the matter.

The resolution would create a committee to investigate the following:

* Actions by the White House, National Security Council, Department of State, Department of Defense, and Central Intelligence Agency related to United Nations and Iraq Survey Group inspections of Iraq.
* Knowledge of Iraq's ability regarding and intentions toward, or lack of ability regarding or intentions toward, nuclear weapons capability.
* Knowledge regarding Iraq's possession of or attempted possession of, or regarding the lack of possession of or attempted possession of, chemical or biological weapons.
* Knowledge of Iraq's possession of aluminum tubes for conventional rocket programs or for nuclear weapons development.
* Knowledge regarding Iraq's intent, or lack of intent, toward acquiring yellowcake uranium from Niger.
* Knowledge of any involvement, or lack of involvement, by Iraq in the September 11, 2001 attacks against the United States.
* Knowledge of any connections or ties, or of any lack of connections or ties, between Iraq and al Qaeda.
* Knowledge of any meeting, or lack of any meeting, between Iraqi intelligence officials and Mohammed Atta (the lead hijacker on September 11, 2001) in Prague, Czechoslovakia.
* Preparations for detention, interrogation and treatment of detainees, or lack thereof, made in the planning stages of the Iraq conflict prior to March 19, 2003,
* Knowledge of abuses and mistreatment of detainees during the Iraq conflict after March 19, 2003,
* The investigation of abuses and mistreatment, or lack thereof, the results of these investigations, any sanctions or punishment of offenders, and any efforts to keep these reports either from supervisors, officials or the public,
* An examination of all prison facilities, including the High Value Detainee facility at Baghdad airport and secret prisons or "black sites" for detaining individuals outside the United States.
* The extent to which civilian, military, or intelligence officials expressly authorized, willingly ignored, or created an atmosphere that condoned the abuses and mistreatment that occurred at Abu Ghraib, Iraq.
* Knowledge on the part of any White House officials of the covert identity of Valerie Plame Wilson and any discussion or communication by such officials with members of the media about such identity, and any failure to enforce Executive Order 12958. <6>

<snip>

Following the Democratic victory in 2006, Conyers responded to Speaker-elect Pelosi's promise not to pursue impeachment. He stated, "I am in total agreement with her on this issue...Impeachment is off the table." <15> On December 4, 2006, Congresspedia contacted Conyers' office to confirm that the incoming-chairman had no intention of reintroducing his bill in the 110th Congress. A spokesperson confirmed that he did not.

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Efforts_to_initiate_the_impeachment_of_President_George_W._Bush

[bagrman]

10. Way way way past time.

[John Q. Citizen]

12. If we wait for someone else to do it, we might be waiting a long time. Get on down

to your Representitive and your Senator's constituent offices and ask them to Impeach.

Be polite yet firm.

Bring your kids, your friends your mother in law, whoever you can and tell them what you expect.

[CrispyQ]

13. It needs to be done & now. --nt

[porphyrian]

14. I'm also going with "way past."

It's not like it's been a secret that these fucking traitors are impeachable until now. So, giving Congress credit they may not deserve for doing nothing about it until now, they may have been waiting intentionally for something like this to force their hand.

[philly_bob]

16. Don't fire until you see the whites of their eyes. Timidity=Strategy.

Some scandal will eventually bring the disinterested public and small town editorial page writers to support impeachment. They're already against the Iraq war. There's momentum building. Then you impeach.

Although I am anxious for impeachment (to absolve America in the eyes of the world for the Bush administration excesses), I don't think we're there yet.

Soon, I hope. Maybe next week, maybe next month. We're all watching the same clock.

The US Attorney scandals look promising. You can't extend executive privilege to Republican National Committee emails. Bush corrupted the DOJ; in my neighboring NJ, the Bushie US attorney prosecuted 114 Democrats and 32 Republicans for corruption.

It's also promising that proof of election machine cheating will emerge. That's an entirely different procedure, I believe, more criminal than impeachment.

You want impeachment. I want impeachment. But if only 40% of American voters want it, we have to wait for another damaging revelation or two.

Just keep the investigations going! As the OP says.

Pelosi said it was "off the table." I suspect that doesn't mean impeachment is not on her mind.

Hoping we all come together when the House announces it's Time.

[KharmaTrain]

21. This Is A Slow Process

People here may forget, but it took nearly a year even for the Clinton impeachment train to get rolling. It took 18 months in Nixon's case...there has to be a process here...gathering the evidence, finding the crime, investigating the crime, presenting the indictment to the grand jury (in this case the Judiciary Committee) and then onto the House. The process is moving, but its racing against a clock of the '08 elections...or has been.

I have posted that I was against a rush to impeachment and I still am, but if the evidence continues to mount and this regime continues to disconnect from a majority of the people, it is our obligation to push forward and encourage Congressman Conyers to introduce articles and start the Judiciary Committee process rolling. The public's tolerance now with such a process is a lot higher than it was three or six months ago...but it still has to be done in the proper fashion.

Any attempts to go after this regime will always be framed as a "partisan" witchhunt. The key here is that the evidence has to show overwhelming criminality and the charges have to be based on crimes that Repugnicans can't easily dismiss. It's a drip, drip, drip situation as the USA scandal will take down Gonzo...the missing Emails could be the demise of Rove and that would leave Cheney and boooshie very exposed and the Judiciary committee loaded with tons of evidence to follow up on.

The question is how much time will this take.

[philly_bob]

22. Good point. When is too late?

With election in Nov. 2008...

Hmm. Army/McCarthy hearings started April 22. Clarence Thomas/Anita Hill hearings started October 11. Impeachment charges against Clinton filed December 19.

I'm no expert, but I would guess that charges have to be made before July 2007. In June, I will probably switch from the 'Hold off until you're sure' to the 'Impeach NOW' position.

Summer 2007 would be nice time for hearings. People on vacation will be home to watch the debates.

Meantime, keep investigating, righteous congress-folk!

[KharmaTrain]

23. Hell Of A Question

Let me toss in how times and the media have changed things here. Remember, Clinton was in an off-year election ('98) which was all but a yawner that year other than the Monica story. Also, remember, impeachment was a liability to the Repugnicans in '98...they lost seats.

Actually I feel that February is more a "drop dead" date as that's when the big primaries will be underway and the candidates and elections will dominate most of the "chattering class" and many of us political geeks. The way the '08 primary game is set, the campaign really will be the primaries and the two months preceeding Iowa and New Hampshire will be intense. In the meantime, expect the boosh regime to stonewall and obstruct...running to court or coming up with some other crisis or obstacle or distraction along the way.

My big thing is that there is criminality here that needs to be followed through on election or no election. Those who've committed them have to be brought to justice and I'm willing to take as long as possible to get the ultiamte justice on some, if not all of the crimes of the boooosh regime...and this ultimately will have to lead to the Hague.

Cheers...

:toast:

[4dsc]

18. I just emailed my congressman

I hope everyone else is doing the same today.. At least congress is working on a Friday which is a change for most of them..