FAKE ELECTIONS WON’T BRING PEACE TO AFGHANISTAN

[Orwellian_Ghost]

FAKE ELECTIONS WON’T BRING PEACE TO AFGHANISTAN
August 17, 2009

This week’s presidential election in Afghanistan will be an elaborate piece of political theater designed to show increasingly uneasy Western voters that progress is being made in the war-torn nation after seven years of US-led occupation.

Most Afghans already believe they know who will win the vote: the candidate chosen by the United States and its NATO allies.

Voting will mostly be held in urban areas, under the guns of US and NATO troops. The countryside, ruled by Taliban, who are often local farmers moonlighting as fighters, is too dangerous for this electoral charade. Over half of Afghanistan is under Taliban influence by day, 75% at night.

The entire election and vote-counting election commission are financed and run by the US. So are leading candidates. Ten thousand Afghan mercenaries hired by the US will police the polls and intimidate voters. US-financed Afghan media are busy promoting Washington’s candidates.

...

http://ericmargolis.com/political_commentaries/fake-elections-wont-bring-peace-to-afghanistan_1.aspx

[lapfog_1]

1. I really don't think

that free, open, honest, and fair elections would bring Peace to Afghanistan.

I don't think anything will bring peace to Afghanistan, other than one "side" eliminating the other. And that won't happen.

[HamdenRice]

2. Author of OP article Eric Margolis: "DR RON PAUL HAS THE RIGHT CURE FOR AMERICA"

http://ericmargolis.com/political_commentaries/dr-ron-paul-has-the-right-cure-for-america.aspx

DR RON PAUL HAS THE RIGHT CURE FOR AMERICA

WASHINGTON July 06, 2009

Republican Congressman Ron Paul became a hero to many Americans last year when he ran for president against the political establishment. The 11-term Texas congressman is the most respected and admired American politician around the world after President Barack Obama.
Rep. Paul is a vocal critic of what he calls reckless deficit spending <HR comment -- read "liberal Keynesian spending">, `welfare’ for big finance, and America’s foreign wars. Paul’s voice has resonance: he sits on the powerful House Foreign Affairs Committee.

Dr Paul invited me to Washington to address his weekly luncheon held in his Capital Hill office about the intensifying wars in Afghanistan and Pakistan. A group of independent-minded Republican congressmen attended. Many of them were deeply concerned by what they see as the nation’s economic and strategic misdirection.
...
Paul’s clear, cool voice challenged all the government and media propaganda about Afghanistan and Iraq. Dr. Paul is also waging a determined battle against the runaway spending and soaring national debt being promoted by the Obama White House and Congressional Democrats. Deficit spending, warns Paul, is leading the US to ruin. <HR comment -- yeah damn you, Keynesian stimulus bill!>

Paul and his fellow libertarian Republicans advocate individual rights, strict adherence to the US Constitution, limited government, and free enterprise. <HR comment -- socialists for free enterprise! yeah!> They oppose American global domination, `nation-building,’ and all foreign wars not waged in the direct defense of American territory. In short, just what the early presidents of the United States urged.
...
Today’s Republican Party is no longer a place for a moderate, life-long New York Republican like myself ...

<end quote>

Great, credible source, Mr. socialist!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


On edit: Wiki says:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Margolis

Political views

Margolis identifies his politics as "Eisenhower Republican". Though his domestic political persuasion is moderately conservative (he is a staunch anti-communist and a supporter of capitalism)...

<end quote>

And Eric Margolis sheds tears for his comrade, South African puppet/ CIA pawn and arms recipient/ Angolan holocaust perpetrator Jonas Savimbi:

http://www.bigeye.com/030402.htm

JONAS SAVIMBI

Copyright: Eric S. Margolis, 2001

Mar 4, 2002

LOS ANGELES - I wouldn't call Jonas Savimbi a close friend, but after spending many days with him at war in the African bush, I developed a deep respect and strong liking for the Angolan guerilla leader.

Last week, Savimbi was killed in an ambush by government troops. Seeing pictures of his body riddled by 16 bullets filled me with sorrow, and reminded me once again how `freedom fighters,' when no longer useful, are discarded, or demonized and declared `terrorists.' .

I first met Savimbi in 1986 at Jamba, his base deep in the remote bush country of SE Angola. Savimbi had already been fighting the Angolan communists, and their Cuban, Russian, and East German allies, for a decade. The Marxist officers who overthrew Portugal's rightwing regime in 1974 handed over the crumbling Portugese Empire's colonies of to local communist insurgents, leaving non-communist liberation groups out in the cold.
...

UNITA was actively supported by South Africa and the CIA from its Kamina base in southern Congo. The fighting killed one million Angolans and displaced 2 million. I was with UNITA and its South African allies during numerous clashes with communist forces, including the battle of Mavinga where South Africa's superb G-5 155mm guns, designed by the brilliant Canadian Gerald Bull, shattered communist attacks, and terrifying, pointblank shootouts in the bush between South African armored cars and Cuban T-55 tanks.

President Ronald Reagan welcomed Savimbi to the White House in 1986, proclaiming him a `freedom fighter.' He was hailed as `America's best friend in Africa.' When liberals in Congress denied arms aid to UNITA because of its support from South Africa, CIA organized a secret supply and funding operation to sustain Savimbi, run by `expendable' agents led by the notorious Edwin Wilson, who was later buried alive in federal prison in order to hide the details of America's secret war in

<end quote>

Way to go Eric! In the bush with apartheid South Africa supported Savimbi and the apartheid army itself, fighting the dreaded "commies," like the Angolan army and Castro's expeditionary force, that helped usher in the end of South African control of southern Angola and all of Namibia, paving the way for the end of apartheid itself.

Dag, quoting someone like that is, well, Orwellian!

[HamdenRice]

3. CREDIBLE SOURCE PLEASE?

[Kid Dynamite]

4. What is Orwellian

is that you question the credibility of sources on the grounds that it is right wing while being a credible source for nothing but right wing propaganda yourself

[HamdenRice]

5. You only think it's right wing propoganda

Actually I take most of my economic insights from 3 people -- Paul Krugman, Joe Stiglitz and Amartya Sen. My views are almost exactly aligned with theirs.

If you want to call that a right wing view fine, but just because you call it so doesn't mean it is.

You are confusing a progressive technocratic view with a right wing view:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=6341560&mesg_id=6346911

None of the three of them were in the Congo fighting alongside apartheid South African troops -- that's for sure.

[blindpig]

11. If it's capitalists it's right wing. n/t

[HamdenRice]

12. So in your world, Krugman, Stiglitz and Sen are right wing economists?

And if you think they are, do you think Ron Paul is progressive, as the OPer suggests?

I think much of DU would like to know your opinion. It will help us rate your credibility.

[blindpig]

13. Krugman, Stiglitz, Sen, yes.

If you are trying to make capitalism work, however Keynesian, you are a kinder, gentler member of the same team. Because capitalism only works for the rich and their suck-ups.

Ron Paul is a filthy racist libertarian piece of shit.

And just who is 'us' and particularly who the fuck are you to rate anyone's credibility with your 3rd rate comedy act?

[HamdenRice]

14. So Krugman, Stiglitz and Sen are, in your book, right wing economists?

Okey dokey.

DU, are you seeing this?!

Now do you see why I think some of the Trotskyite mob are wingnuts?

[MoreLibThanU]

6. They'll have peace...

the moment we leave their country.

[cali]

16. wow. ignorance is bliss, I guess. I'm strongly for getting the fuck out of Afghanistan

but you have to be stupendously ignorant to believe that that would bring peace to that poor country. Educate yourself.

[ShortnFiery]

17. Ding! Ding! Ding!

We have a winner. Too bad very few Americans are seeing their loved ones coming home maimed or in a box. THEN we'd realize this is all for our beloved Military-Industrial Complex. Nothing more, nothing less.

God BLESS the Corporate United States of America.

The Generals KNOW who they're working for ... :evilgrin:

[HamdenRice]

7. Kick for an explanation of the bizarre source of the OP

[Orwellian_Ghost]

8. Hey Hammy

See you got a free time in-between counting the stock options. Smith-Barney or something?

Now which part of the article were you having a problem with?

Geez Hammy if you think these elections in Afghanistan are credible I've definitely got a cousin who could sell you some real estate.

Try to stick with the issues Hammie though I know that goes against the knee-jerk problem you're dealing with.

Now here's a conservative source that should set well with your conservatism:


Afghan election fraud is unearthed

By Ian Pannell
BBC News, Kabul


An investigation by the BBC has found evidence of fraud and corruption in Afghanistan's presidential election. Thousands of voting cards have been offered for sale and thousands of dollars have been offered in bribes to buy votes.

The Afghan Independent Election Commission that oversees the poll has also been accused of not doing enough to prevent abuses.

We were passed information that voting cards were being sold in the capital. An Afghan working for the BBC went undercover, posing as a potential buyer. He was offered 1,000 cards on the spot. Each one would cost about $10 (£6).

We were given some samples as proof of what was being offered. They are all authentic with the name, photo and home details of the voter on them.

Widespread abuses

The cards have been returned to the seller and no money changed hands. Others have also offered to sell us thousands of votes and some traders have even been arrested.

...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/8207315.stm

Puppet government reinstalled as children of the Empire applaud progress. News goo at 11.

[HamdenRice]

10. Ah yes, OG falls back on the arctic baby seal argument yet again!

only this time in the form of "stock options."

:rofl:

Please explain why you think that a guy who thinks Jonas Savimbi was a hero and who praises apartheid South Africa's war against socialist Angola, was a credible source in the first place?

Btw, stabilization elections are always full of irregularities, imperfections, incomplete voting, etc. That does not make them illegitimate. The South African Independent Electoral Commission of South Africa called the first post apartheid election a "shambles." The "right" outcome was only achieved by the National Party, the African National Congress and Democratic Party going behind closed doors and "negotating" the vote tallies. It had already been decided, and agreed by the ANC, that the ANC would not win more than 66% of the vote because it had been agreed that the ANC would not be able to change the constitution. When the ANC won more than 66%, they just changed the outcome by "trading" objections.

When outraged reporters confronted the Electoral Commission chairman, he said, referring to the entire stabilization effort and election, "come now, come now, you can't work in a brothel and remain chaste!"

Oh, yeah, since you have these strong opinions, you were going to tell my about your first hand experience observing or participating in post conflict stabilization efforts and elections, right?

[Mari333]

9. k/r

its just a farce, like all of our occupations are. bought and paid for.

[Name removed]

15. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[HamdenRice]

18. Another question: Are you a Ron Paul supporter?

The reason I mention it is that a lot of self described "leftists" on DU support Ron Paul or cite his theories -- especially about economic policy.

I notice that not only did the author of the article you approvingly cite in your OP support apartheid South Africa's murderous rampages in Angola, but he currently supports Ron Paul.

Do you support Ron Paul's views?

Many DUers have noted that the far left and far right tend to converge, especially on economic policy and in terms of certain paranoid fantasies they have about the Keynesian economic policies generally pursued by the Democratic Party.

[Orwellian_Ghost]

20. No Hammy

See you got that one wrong too. I was opposed to Ron Paul long before you probably even knew of his existence. Out in front on that one too I was pulling up not only old racist tracts from Ron Paul but opposing the wrecking ball ecnomic doctrine of his libertarian whacko culties which by the way have mush more in common in economic thinking with you nad your neo-liberal project hammie.

Now what's the next loyalty oath question hammie?

Remember Mitchell Palmer ham?

[Cid_B]

19. As someone who is witnessing them firsthand..

... the positions stated here are laughable at best.